Q&A Ask about Pikachu! Hosted by Axe and N64! feat. dkuo!

[knightpraetor]

when is pikachu's quick attack to the ledge from center stage worth doing? I feel like if a fox/falco drops below stage and firefoxes you always have time to wd to the ledge and then nair anyway. Does this move really have a purpose?

 

[N64]

It's useful when you don't have time to do what you just mentioned. Say you and the spacey traded hits, so he got knocked offstage and you got hit to the other side of the stage. You won't have time to get to the ledge normally before he can firefox there. Or say you hit him offstage but he doesn't end up below the ledge, so overB is a recovery option for him. You can get there first with upB from the stage, where positioning for a wavedash back ledgehog would take too long.

Basically, it's faster than a wavedash back ledgehog when you're not close to the ledge, and sometimes that second or so is really important.

 

[soju]

Thoughts on the Samus matchup, I haven't played against a decent samus in a long time(like 3 years) and lost to one today.
My floaty matchups are actually quite butt now with my super long hiatus. I'm going to be in the hyperbolic time chamber for a bit with A Rookie and his new crew so hopefully I can get a lot of my skill back, I'll be sure to record and put videos up.

 

[JemTheScrub101]

Can I have some general tips for the Doc / Mario Matchups? Thanks

 

[Kuralesache]

been practicing qa to ledge from the stage, and I noticed that on yoshi's, the slopes on the side of the stage actually causea grounded quick-attack to angle slightly downwards... causing me to end up lower than I'm used to a lot of the time, and making the 2nd angle a little bit harder.

do pikachus that use qa to ledge do anything to adjust for this when you play on yoshi's? I've found that I can eliminate the problem by using a tighter angle, or jumping before I qa, but those are both easier to mess up so I'm not sure that I want to be doing them on every stage, but I'm also not eager to practice a technique differently for a single stage. any thoughts appreciated!

 

[Kuralesache]

@ soju I hail from the wonderful land of Michigan, and I have some experience against duck and all his wannabes, though not at any high level. in my games, I generally have trouble getting through samus's projectiles, but once I'm close up, it's really easy to mess her up. she can abuse crouch-cancel and OOS, but if you space your nairs right or just grab her, there's not much else. pikachu has an easier time edgeguarding her than a lot of other characters do, and you can punish her pretty hard for messing up. she doesn't have any safe yolo options really, like falco dair or jigglypuff bair or marth dtilt or whatever, so if you get her in a bad spot you can punish almost everything she does

 

[N64]

I always jump just before QA to the edge from stage. It makes letting go of down less tight at the end (and is still about as fast). It also avoids the yoshis story issue you're encountering.

 

[Simmons]

Any tips for how to deal with fox/falco (particularly laser, and shine) pressure?

Also tips for how to deal with edgeguarding as pika?

 

[Phez_]

Any tips for how to deal with fox/falco (particularly laser, and shine) pressure?

If I'm on a platform I love sheild drop Uair or sheild drop double jump Nair/Uair, and Uair OoS is probably your best option when grounded. Be sure to mix it up with some rolls, UpSmashes OoS etc. so you're not predictable, because a whiffed Uair can be punished pretty hard

 

[Simmons]

If I'm on a platform I love sheild drop Uair or sheild drop double jump Nair/Uair, and Uair OoS is probably your best option when grounded. Be sure to mix it up with some rolls, UpSmashes OoS etc. so you're not predictable, because a whiffed Uair can be punished pretty hard

Thanks dude, I'll start practicing that now.

 

[Phez_]

consistent, effective sheild drops definately seperate the Pika Mains from the people who play Pikachu in friendlies, MMs etc.
( imo anyway )

 

[Simmons]

Oh by the way, is it possible to tail spike fox/falco out of (or during) their side b?

 

[Phez_]

Yes but it is a kinda difficult to setup and the timing can be tricky

 

[N64]

Dealing with Falco laser is generally trying to stay on a different horizontal plane than Falco (and repositioning when he jumps). This is most useful when you're trying to get in on Falco, as he wants to reposition so laser is a threat, and this can put him in a spot where he's less prepared to deal with you coming in (especially with the commitment to lasering while you jump in or run under him). You want your engagements with him to be at angles, he covers straight across too well, and is pretty good at covering directly below him (hello dair), and above him (fast/high jump).

Dealing with shine is often just not being next to Falco when he's in control of his character. Gotta play really tight there. As Phez mentioned, shielddrops are pretty useful on platforms. Otherwise, roll away is often your best option unfortunately. Rising uair oos can also be ok if they aren't super tight with their pressure, but it's reliant on them messing up, so keep that in mind. Best best option is to not be in that situation in the first place. Get in on Falco, do your damage/combo/pressure/etc., then get out.

 

[Wreck_94]

Another option that I take in the Falco matchup is seeing how consistent they are with SH lasers. If you notice that they can't hit them low and that the lasers run a little high, Pika can crouch under them. I use this to space Dtilt against Falco.

 

[Phez_]

Does anyone know how fast you can use Pikas jab?

 

[Simmons]

Does anyone know how fast you can use Pikas jab?

I believe I read somewhere that it lasts 21 frames, but can be interrupted starting on frame 5 by another jab.

 

[Dinowulf]

hey guys. i wanted to ask a question for the pikachu players. What role can other characters give to Pikachu in a doubles environment and vice versa.

 

[Simmons]

hey guys. i wanted to ask a question for the pikachu players. What role can other characters give to Pikachu in a doubles environment and vice versa.

From what I've seen, he is good at gimping, but that's a given with pikachu. Also the first hitbox of his uair does little to help spacies recover, but you should test it out.

I'm by no means a good player, but that's just my 2 cents.

 

[The Jets]

Teams is so fun I've been starting to play it a lot more. Obviously pikachu has strengths like gimps, upsmash, crazy recovery and lots of edgeguarding tools. He can also be so squirrelly and is good at playing his baiting game which can lead to good positions in which you can capitalize.

I could see him as an aggressor if the support can get pika out of trouble. Pika is definitely a good support too because he can have sick punishes and edgeguards.

I can wait to see Axe and Kage at Apex it'll be dope

 

[N64]

Pikachu needs someone who can do damage. Pika is fairly versatile in what he can do otherwise, but he doesn't do damage very quickly or consistently. He's very mobile, allowing him to quickly come to his ally's aid or capitalize on strong hits from his ally with a chase into edgeguard. His gimping ability is valuable. His usmash is a strong KO move that can be somewhat easier to land in the chaos of teams. But, none of his tools really do that much damage, so getting opponents to high enough percent where usmash kills or edgeguards are consistent is tough.

 

[Dinowulf]

Pikachu needs someone who can do damage. Pika is fairly versatile in what he can do otherwise, but he doesn't do damage very quickly or consistently. He's very mobile, allowing him to quickly come to his ally's aid or capitalize on strong hits from his ally with a chase into edgeguard. His gimping ability is valuable. His usmash is a strong KO move that can be somewhat easier to land in the chaos of teams. But, none of his tools really do that much damage, so getting opponents to high enough percent where usmash kills or edgeguards are consistent is tough.

From what i've been reading hearing Ganon is a really good character to team up with cause of his damage potential. in your honest opinion @ N64 Do you think Yoshi & Pikachu is a bad team? I've haven't had any resources to get this team better. Me and my partner has just been developing synergy with each other and can combo really well now.

 

[N64]

Seems like a legitimate team to me. As long as your Pikachu partner is playing well off your setups (and you're letting him do his thing) then it could work well. I think I've mentioned this before, but Axe or Vman would have much more information on the specific team. If you want my outlook on it, you just need to focus on being the heavy hitter most of the time (especially against low % chars that can crouchcancel pikachu's stuff easily), and otherwise do normalish teams stuff of making sure your partner doesn't get 2v1'd, that you're fighting the opponent you would prefer to fight (or Pikachu would least prefer to fight) most of the time, protecting the edge for him when he's recovering (though this often isn't as big of an issue because of Pika's stellar recovery), etc.

 

[The Jets]

Quick question. Pikachu's weak hit nair normally combos better than strong hit. How do you get weak hit? Is it the length of time the move remains out of certain locations that hit softer?

If it is length of time does that mean there is a gradual weakening or is it either hard hit or soft hit with no inbetween?

 

[Phez_]

Quick question. Pikachu's weak hit nair normally combos better than strong hit. How do you get weak hit? Is it the length of time the move remains out of certain locations that hit softer?

If it is length of time does that mean there is a gradual weakening or is it either hard hit or soft hit with no inbetween?

Im pretty sure the length of time it is left out weakens nair and there is no weak or strong area. I also think that it gradually weakens (after just testing it) but I cant be sure

After more testing it seems Nairs damage output stays fairly consistent no matter how long it is left out (other than staling) but the knockback gets lowered heavily the longer it is out. (Note: these are just my observations after a bit of testing and could very easily be wrong)

 

[oukd]

any insight on pika marth team? im probably gonna go fox in doubles this weekend but i was playing with the idea of going pika here and there. the only time i think id prefer marth pika is if the other team is strictly specialized at 2v1'ing spacies or something

anything specific would be sweet

also hi boards its been a while happy new years

 

[The Jets]

Axe and Tai teamed at a recent Arizona tournament, pretty sure it was Forte 2. As far as experience, I've only teamed with a doc and a fox before, but Marth get punish hard but is also pretty susceptible to boo boos in teams so you'd probably have to help him out a lot.

 

[GaIe]

So I played on stream at a Swedish tournament this week and would like to get some feedback from you guys.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNNAGF8RyTE

I would like to point out that there was a slight lag on the screen we were playing on, but it just made me wiff some minor stuff.
All dash attacks are running usmash wiffs btw And sorry for 4 dsmashes in a row at the start lol.

Also......the commentators aren't serious for shiz. Sorry for the Swedish.

 

[Kuralesache]

There are a bunch of things, but there's one in particular that I noticed that is really easy to work on, and also happens to be a bad habit of my own that I remember having to get over.

A lot of the time you combo your upairs into more upairs instead of more damaging moves, or even kill moves. This happens quite a few times during game 2. You do a good job at 0:32, in game 1, where you combo the upair into an upsmash (it would have been better if you fast-fell to get to the ground though) but most of the time you just use your 2nd jump to uair, and then fox DIs away and you have no followup. Here's a few times where it happens, and in each case nair would have probably been the best option instead of the 2nd upair: 3:54, 6:07, 7:24, 7:38. The last one is a little different, because you actually could have comboed even after the 2nd upair by landing on the platform and then charging an upsmash, but it's a similar problem.

There are some other things that I noticed, but I really gotta go to sleep so I can be ready for my trip to apex tomorrow! Hype . I might come back and add some more thoughts later.

 

[GaIe]

Thank you for pointing stuff out! I am also aware of my bad habits with uair. I have actually become better at it so it's an issue I had been addressing for a while. I usually aim for a combo into usmash on platform after the second uair but I guess it's a pretty risky move since its not guaranteed. I have become better at realising this and nair/bair after the first one, but yes, need to practise it more.

 

[Phez_]

Ok, I've got a ton of small specific tips;


I think you should work on incorporating shield drops into your platform movement / punish game
e.g - 1:09 you had a perfect oppurtunity to punish the Fsmash with a shield drop Uair and it couldve lead to perhaps a stock if you could get him offstage after the Uair
also at 6:12 you couldve punished the wiffed fair (you get the idea)

also at about 1:30 it was most likely a better option to bthrow fox offstage for a gimp rather than Uthrow (especially on FoD as the platforms can mess with chaingrabs unless its fd mode)

the edgeguard at 3:05 was great but you missed the sweet spot giving fox the ledge for free. youre edgeguarding other than that was pretty solid

I noticed a few times you missed some JC grabs during chaingrabs (0:36, 4:50)
this makes them a lot harder, practice the timing and it will be easier to chaingrab

imo you rolled too much, and i think wavedashing OoS was better in a some situations
e.g at 4:20 andrew waited for the roll and you got punished

ledge sweet spotting is essential Pika-tech, and you missed it in quite a few crucial times (7:44, 1:04, 3:05) it just needs practice

(2:42, 2:51) Bair is a bad approach option, id suggest leaving it for combo finishers if Nair is stale or something.

to sum up;
shield drops
focus on gimps
practice JC grabs
practice UpB sweet spot
try other things OoS (wavedashes, Up smashes)
less Bair

excuse the wall of text
Hope this Helps

 

[GaIe]

Thanks! That was a really nice analysis, I am glad you watched it all

You are right, I need to practice alot of pika-tech. I usually hit all the upB sweet spots but in tense moments it seems like I miss it, so I will practise it more (Pika-techs take so long to implement).

Shield Drops and WDOoS is something I only just recently have begun practising. I figured those are a bit more advanced and situational techs, so I focused alot more on fundamentals rather than ATs. From now on, I will start practising it more.

My bairs were all unintentional or misinputs xD
I also kept using fair alot, were nair would've been more useful.

I like trying to go for gimps, but I tend to be more defensive in tournaments, also this time, I wanted to try the forward tilt -> Dair edgeguard to see how it would work.

And lastly, I always go for Dash canceled grabs, for some reason though, I failed like half of them in this match. Blame it on laggy setup

Thanks for all the pro tips! I will start practising right away!

P.S. My reply looks like a huge excuse, but no, I have taken everything to heart

 

[Phez_]

Axe vs Javi at Forte 2

So, Javi started light-shielding Axe's cross-up Nairs, making them no longer cross-up. This means he can easily punish them (like at 1:18) And I've been thinking of ways to counter/punish light-shielding, even though basically no-one is doing it 'yet'.
(note: I haven't tested any of these)

1. Tomahawk.
I have a feeling that (if they are light-shielding) they will be focusing so much on light-shielding (rather than just shielding) that landing a Tomahawk or just running up and grabbing them may be easier than usual

2. Nair 'normally'
If you Nair and hit the front the front of their light-shield they will bounce too far back to punish (except for maybe Marth's grab or something)

3. D-tilt
Run up, D-Tilt and they will be pushed away (No punish )

any other ideas? I have a feeling this could eventually be the counter to Pika's cross-up Nair, so we should figure out our own counter to their counter. ( just in case )

 

[Spyro]

Wow that set between Axe and Silencewolf was crazy. I haven't really been following smash for a long time but wow, I really want to into now after watching Apex

 

[Kuralesache]

I'm at apex now, it's pretty hype
Hoping to get some friendlies with axe tomorrow.

Phez, that's actually really interesting. I feel like there must be some next level swag pika can do. fair to grab or something, with the extended shieldstun. I dunno, just first thing that popped into my head, but should be interesting to figure out

 

[Phez_]

Yeah maybe both hits of Dair to grab or something, idk

We may need Axe or N64's help with this one

 

[Comet7]

if pika's nair is the same as pichu's in terms of shield stun (i think it is) you could probably do a really late nair and try for a grab.

 

[Simmons]

Anyone know what to do when Falco starts doing pillar combos? It seems whenever he starts them, he can just keep going until I'm around 80% and then I'll doublejump out of it only to be juggled by nairs and bairs.

 

[Phez_]

Im not sure what the optimal strategy is, but i DI / SDI away and spam Uair (frame 3 with decent priority) as fast as possible because it can interrupt alot of his normal combos and put you in a good position (if it hits or it trades.) Works for me

 

[Simmons]

Im not sure what the optimal strategy is, but i DI / SDI away and spam Uair (frame 3 with decent priority) as fast as possible because it can interrupt alot of his normal combos and put you in a good position (if it hits or it trades.) Works for me

Thanks! :D