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[Yobolight]

Is it ever a good idea to use Kirby's neutral B?

How do you rock cancel with Kirby?

Why do I see some Yoshis use the egg lay? What is the strategic purpose of it? I have been experimenting with it and I just don't get it.

Does Luigis down B have higher knockback at the end? (It seems like the move has more knockback at times.)

 

[M!nt]

Is it ever a good idea to use Kirby's neutral B?

Perhaps. You can do MATTS suck up technique. by swallowing them by the edge and spitting them under dreamland. You can also spit your opponent out at your enemies.

How do you rock cancel with Kirby?

not really worth learning, there's usually something better to use than downb.

Why do I see some Yoshis use the egg lay? What is the strategic purpose of it? I have been experimenting with it and I just don't get it.

It's not useful unless the person your playing cant mash good. If they cant you can sometimes neutral b them off the stage.

Does Luigis down B have higher knockback at the end? (It seems like the move has more knockback at times.)

Yeah I think so

 

[ballin4life]

yes

ledge cancel

because it has good range

yes

 

[asianaussie]

swallowing with kirby's neutral B pops the opponent right above you, if they don't jump immediately just you can usually get a free u-tilt...don't go out of your way to do this, it's very punishable

yoshi neutral B has good range and is a fun surprise move

 

[The Star King]

Copying is good vs Mario/Samus and maybe Fox/Falcon/DK/Link in some situations, and only I know about it. Also Kirby's neutral B pwns as a Yoshi edgeguard

Yoshi's neutral B is for range. One important thing is that it beats Kirby's utilt. It can also cover like most of Ness's approach options safely. Other things.

 

[kys]

For practicing, I would get short hopping and z-canceling down. Training mode here, obviously.

Then go online, ask for games and tell people you're new and want to learn. While you're getting *****, try to look at what you're doing and what the opponent is doing by thinking actively. Give it hmmm a month? and you'll be ****** your friends.

You should get them to come play too. After you have your satisfaction, of course.

 

[meowmeowrainbowkitty]

A few random questions:
DI in practice mode, in any time slower than 1/1...would it be possible to DI better than real-time because you have a longer window to input directions?

and kind of going along with the Kirby thing... has there been anyone notable who HAS sucked up powers as a strategy? (and I realize that like a good 1/2 of the powers aren't really viable vs just having the neutral B to do what MATTS! does)

 

[Izuhu]

Yes, what your talking about is similar to how a TAS (Tool Assisted Super-Play) work. So if you were to slow the game, DI will be much easier. Because your basically stressing the time frame to input a direction you want to DI in.

Not that I know of, but I find this funny because back then I wanted to be the first person to use Kirby's abilities as a personal playstyle, but I then I was like nah....I wanted a challenge, so I mained Yoshi. :3

 

[The Star King]

ME... I don't play Kirby much though

 

[Frogles]

and kind of going along with the Kirby thing... has there been anyone notable who HAS sucked up powers as a strategy? (and I realize that like a good 1/2 of the powers aren't really viable vs just having the neutral B to do what MATTS! does)

i go out of my way to suck *****es up every time i pick kirby. now if i only picked him more than once every year >___>

also i'd argue that most of the powers are pretty useful. the only two that really suck are pk fire and tongue.

 

[M!nt]

Laser kirby is so fun

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

A few random questions:
DI in practice mode, in any time slower than 1/1...would it be possible to DI better than real-time because you have a longer window to input directions?

and kind of going along with the Kirby thing... has there been anyone notable who HAS sucked up powers as a strategy? (and I realize that like a good 1/2 of the powers aren't really viable vs just having the neutral B to do what MATTS! does)

Decided to have some fun.

Kirby Copy Tier List
Top: various really good reasons, combo potential, can help recovery
0. Fox McCloud: Best projectile by far. Kirby can double laser off a short hop. Think about it. Lasers combo into f-smash.
2. Captain Falcon: Recovery tool, Kirby can u-tilt into falcon punch at 50 percent (as in Kirby has a 5 u-tilt into falcon punch guaranteed kill at 0 [YEAHHH])
3. Donkey Kong: Can U-tilt into giant punch but due to it's slower speed, it is a bit harder to use. Can be used to turn Kirby around to make recovery and b-air use tricky. Really short range in comparison to normal giant punch.

High: good spacing tools and/or good projectles
4. Jigglypuff: Pound leads to b-airs and other aerials, u-tilt to pound to other combos works well.
5. Link: Boomerang combos quite easily into n-airs u-tilt into boomerang for some strange combo potential.
6. Mario: Fireballs are useful for additionalshield pressure. short hop fireballs lead to b-air and potential u-tilt/d-air pressure.

Mid: Spacing tools, otherwise useless
7. Samus Aran: Too Slow, can't combo into Samus using u-tilt at KO percents (at least i think,) can with a n-air or a f-air at some random percents (maybe a b-air also.) Shield stun of a full charge doesn't help too much

Spoiler

(as Kirby is going to shield break anyway )

8. Pikachu: Slowish projectile, not combo friendly, can be a spacing move at best.
9. Luigi: Almost useless spacing tool, fireball at least is better than having nothing.

Paradox:
0B011. Kirby

Bottom:

Spoiler

Somehow game designers made something worse than Kirby's inhale. The world does not know how.

11.Ness: Too slow to use, can be punished on shield.
-0XB. Yoshi: a shorter range version of Kirby with less damage and no useful knockback or setups.

 

[asianaussie]

kirby can triple laser off a short hop
samus ball's biggest draw is really the threat, you're basically saying 'dont do stupid things in the air nearby because ill blast you'

man, imagine if pk fire cancelled lag upon landing

Spoiler

it'd still suck cuz trajectories

 

[The Star King]

Ness/Yoshi/Kirby/Luigi > Pikachu

Actually you didn't seem to consider the set MU at all and evaluated the moves in a vacuum and IDK why I'm replying seriously to a Koro post

 

[M!nt]

koro's numbering system gives me migraine.

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

koro's numbering system gives me migraine.

Someone got it it seems.

Ness/Yoshi/Kirby/Luigi > Pikachu

Actually you didn't seem to consider the set MU at all and evaluated the moves in a vacuum and IDK why I'm replying seriously to a Koro post

I might understand Ness an Luigi..but Yoshi/Kirby?

 

[asianaussie]

Ness/Yoshi/Kirby/Luigi > Pikachu

Actually you didn't seem to consider the set MU at all and evaluated the moves in a vacuum and IDK why I'm replying seriously to a Koro post

lrn2FFA noob

oh god kirby w/lasers in FFA

 

[ballin4life]

Ness/Yoshi/Kirby/Luigi > Pikachu

Actually you didn't seem to consider the set MU at all and evaluated the moves in a vacuum and IDK why I'm replying seriously to a Koro post

wat, i thought he talked about how utilt -> b works on falcon and DK but not samus

 

[The Star King]

OK that's true and what I said wasn't fair, sorry. I'm just trying to comprehend Pikachu's not being worse than useless (worse because normal swallow is more useful).

 

[M!nt]

pikachu's projectile isn't THAT bad, still think yoshi's is the worst

 

[The Star King]

Pikachu's has no conceivable use as far as I know. Yoshi's can be used to beat his DJC armor, like for edgeguarding. Although Swallow does that too... but Yoshi's comes out a lot quicker. Go behind them and face the stage so you lay them behind you, maybe, if they suck at mashing out.

 

[Yobolight]

Can I get a list of grab ranges from longest to shortest?

As in if the two characters were facing each other and walking forward while grabbing whose would grab first.

 

[prisonchild]

if i remember correctly the lowest port # (port 1) would grab first. unless, of course, one grab was out of range. and i don't know the exact numbers but samus has the biggest and link second.

 

[Izuhu]

Idk,besides the obvious top 3 long rangers, but I found the hitboxes though. Credit goes to fireblaster. The link to Samus's hitbox seems to be broken, but I linked it anyways :\

http://img844.imageshack.us/img844/8684/falcongrab.gif
http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/4885/dkgrab.gif
http://img828.imageshack.us/img828/7897/foxgrab.gif
http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/3475/jigglygrab.gif
http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/4057/kirbygrab.gif
http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/6393/linkgrab.gif
http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/8116/luigigrab.gif
http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/7808/mariograb.gif
http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/2483/nessgrab.gif
http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/1248/pikagrab.gif
http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/705/samusgrab.gif
http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/6030/yoshigrab.gif

 

[Battlecow]

samus, link, yoshi, DK [other characters] fox

 

[M!nt]

Pikachu's has no conceivable use as far as I know. Yoshi's can be used to beat his DJC armor, like for edgeguarding. Although Swallow does that too... but Yoshi's comes out a lot quicker. Go behind them and face the stage so you lay them behind you, maybe, if they suck at mashing out.

actually even if you're not good at mashing you can still usually steer your way toward the stage as long as you don't fastfall. Pika's can be used to edgeguard and catch people off guard since its not expected. I know there's always something better to use, but just saying its not useless.

 

[ballin4life]

actually even if you're not good at mashing you can still usually steer your way toward the stage as long as you don't fastfall. Pika's can be used to edgeguard and catch people off guard since its not expected. I know there's always something better to use, but just saying its not useless.

so basically it's so bad that people won't expect it. i guess jiggs's sing is like that too.

 

[ciaza]

the one use i've found for it is using it on recovery sending it up the hyrule wall. only works if the camera angle is perfect and they can't see it climbing the wall though lol

 

[Yobolight]

samus, link, yoshi, DK [other characters] fox

Fox's grab range is confirmed to be shorter?

 

[Battlecow]

yeah, he has the shortest in the game

 

[prisonchild]

it's disjointed too right? what an awful grab, even if it is quick.

 

[The Star King]

You sure Battlecow? Ness's definitely feels like the shortest...

 

[Yobolight]

You sure Battlecow? Ness's definitely feels like the shortest...

This is really something that should have been figured out by now, considering that we there is frame data gifs.

 

[Battlecow]

I'm working off of past smashboards statements. I recall at least a couple of times when someone semi-respectable said "fox has the shortest grab in the game," or something to that effect.

This is really easy to test and I feel kind of bad about conversing in ignorance when I could do some testing and bathe you all in the light of truth

but I'm too busy writing papers about how EarlWolf's "Assmilk" is a commentary on the journey of Enkidu and, by extension, a discussion on the nature and formation of civilization.

 

[The Star King]

Based on personal experience I'm fairly certain Ness's is shorter. Fox's isn't even that short, it just has a dumb blind spot. Also I don't remember anyone saying that, and I would remember (but seriously)

 

[Timotheus]

Can't find the funny japanese tier list anymore

 

[WOTG]

Idk,besides the obvious top 3 long rangers, but I found the hitboxes though. Credit goes to fireblaster. The link to Samus's hitbox seems to be broken, but I linked it anyways :\

http://img844.imageshack.us/img844/8684/falcongrab.gif
http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/4885/dkgrab.gif
http://img828.imageshack.us/img828/7897/foxgrab.gif
http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/3475/jigglygrab.gif
http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/4057/kirbygrab.gif
http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/6393/linkgrab.gif
http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/8116/luigigrab.gif
http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/7808/mariograb.gif
http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/2483/nessgrab.gif
http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/1248/pikagrab.gif
http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/705/samusgrab.gif
http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/6030/yoshigrab.gif

According to this, Ness has the shortest grab

 

[Hiphiphooray]

So, I'm trying to get my adapter from http://www.raphnet-tech.com/ to be recognized by my computer. I plugged it into a bunch of different ports, and then finally I got it to try to install the driver, which it failed to install. On the site it says no PC drivers are necessary, but I can't find it under control panel game controllers to calibrate. What's up? Sorry if this has already been posted.

 

[Battlecow]

That's very strange. It's always been pretty plug n' play for me.

Sorry about the fox thing. Maybe whoever originally said that meant that he had the smallest hitbox...? My bad for spreading disinformation

 

[The Star King]

I don't it's smallest either though, judging by what I see from the gifs. Puff's looks smallest maybe. But yeah it's all good. You actually apologize when you spread wrong information, unlike aa