Meta "And Then Suddenly..." [1.1.5] Patch Discussion

[BLG File]

Jump-Squads in the parameters are not the same as in-game because they go through some speed modifiers. If you compare 1.1.4 and 1.1.5 you see that Charizard has 6 in both. But he still has 7.

whoops my b

 

[DemonRin]

I knew people locally who, when I'd say I was sure a new patch was coming, insisted there wouldn't be a new Patch and that the one that came with Bayo and Corrin was it, SO glad they were proven wrong!

Looking at it initially, Cloud, Corin and Bayonetta all have been nerfed to some degree. I do hope we find out more than Witch Time was Nerfed on Bayo, but I'll take what I can get.

Zelda, Charizard, and Ganon buffs are surprising and awesome tbh.... sad about the ZSS Nerfs tho.... here's hoping Rosalina gets Nerfed too.

Something that I noticed, it is now impossible to do a walk-off dair with bayonetta on FD and live.

Someone in the actual patchnotes thread brought this up and said it was apparently still possible to do, but you have to be much faster with your inputs.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Something has been bugging me. The SmashWiki states that Samus has her air speed increased to 1.03, but I don't see anything on the patch notes that mention this.

 

[Furret]

Something that I noticed, it is now impossible to do a walk-off dair with bayonetta on FD and live.

Bayonetta
Dair Total Frames F42 -> F47

You can still do walk-off dair and recover with upB -> DJ -> upB but the window is tighter.

from the official patch thread

Also, can someone check if jigglypuff's up tilt is any faster? or any changes at all really. I don't know where to check what charcters can have possibly been changed

no changes recorded to puff
pages 2-3 are great for finding who got changes

 

[Luig]

Someone in the actual patchnotes thread brought this up and said it was apparently still possible to do, but you have to be much faster with your inputs.

I was only testing it with up b.
It seems that you can jump before you die, but you can't up b. huh.

 

[Furret]

Something has been bugging me. The SmashWiki states that Samus has her air speed increased to 1.03, but I don't see anything on the patch notes that mention this.

this is confirmed, it just hasn't hit official notes yet

 

[WinterWonter]

from the official patch thread

no changes recorded to puff
pages 2-3 are great for finding who got changes

thank you very much. kinda sad the bad characters don't get good patches, but oh well.

 

[DemonRin]

thank you very much. kinda sad the bad characters don't get good patches, but oh well.

Well, hey now, Samus, Zelda, Ganon, and Charizard all appear to have gotten buffs this time around. Not sure yet if they're enough to bump them up significantly in tiers and what have you, but Samus for example got EXTENSIVELY changed from the patch notes.

 

[WinterWonter]

Well, hey now, Samus, Zelda, Ganon, and Charizard all appear to have gotten buffs this time around. Not sure yet if they're enough to bump them up significantly in tiers and what have you, but Samus for example got EXTENSIVELY changed from the patch notes.

sorry, meant to say one of my favorite bad characters

not that i don't like the others of course

 

[Furret]

thank you very much. kinda sad the bad characters don't get good patches, but oh well.

oh no bad characters get patches for them, maybe not in ways that could make them relevant, but
doesn't get any patches

 

[Bubba]

Well, hey now, Samus, Zelda, Ganon, and Charizard all appear to have gotten buffs this time around. Not sure yet if they're enough to bump them up significantly in tiers and what have you, but Samus for example got EXTENSIVELY changed from the patch notes.

Are we still figuring out what else changed for Samus? Last I saw there were a lot of unknowns.

Edit: just checked official. Negate my ignorance.

 

[DemonRin]

Yeah, pretty sure nothing's "Final" yet, but Samus seems to have a ton of changes, almost all for the better in her entry so far.

My fingers are crossed SO HARD that Mario doesn't get any significant Nerfs...

 

[Bubba]

Yeah, pretty sure nothing's "Final" yet, but Samus seems to have a ton of changes, almost all for the better in her entry so far.

My fingers are crossed SO HARD that Mario doesn't get any significant Nerfs...

Surprised I haven't heard any news on Rosa. Or maybe I'm being ignorant again.

 

[DemonRin]

Nah, lol, no ignorance at all. I see nothing on Rosa either, which is surprising since she's top of the pack going into this patch.

Maybe people are just being extra safe to make sure they get the patch notes right before reporting? Either way, here's no hoping Rosa gets some well-needed nerfs.

 

[Gawain]

Checked Roy and Falcons IASAs in side by side comparisons. Pretty positive there are no changes at all to these two, but at the very least IASA and landing lags are the same for these two.

Only thing I didn't really check was Roys side B. It seemed the same at a glance so I doubt there is any difference.

 

[DemonRin]

Checked Roy and Falcons IASAs in side by side comparisons. Pretty positive there are no changes at all to these two, but at the very least IASA and landing lags are the same for these two.

Hey, it's not my primary main but, I'll take no changes to two of my secondary mains! :D :D :D

 

[Easzy]

Dont know if its true but I think the autocancel window of Rosas fair is a bit bigger now so its easier to LL fair. Can someone test this? Also it feels like her FF Speed increased a little bit but I could be mistaken.

 

[Deleted member 269706]

Heard rumors that Witch Twist's hitboxes got smaller, was wondering if there is any confirmation on this? (I'm aware of the damage nerfs).

 

[Capt. Tin]

What would be nice would be a patch that balancing the entire cast.

Of course that's super hopeful thinking.

 

[Luig]

What would be nice would be a patch that balancing the entire cast.

Of course that's super hopeful thinking.

That would be a lot to do in one patch.

 

[White_Pointer]

It's been confirmed by @Saykrd and @Bowserboy3 that Samus' fsmash hitbox has actually not been fixed. It still whiffs at point blank range:

https://twitter.com/saykrd/status/710114094884495360?s=09

So what the official patch note thread says about it not whiffing anymore is incorrect. Despite what ESAM claims, fsmash is still jank. The hitbox may have changed somehow, but they didn't actually fix it.

 

[DemonRin]

That would be a lot to do in one patch.

Lol yeah. I wonder, if we list out EVERY character that has been changed in every patch, has everyone been changed to some extent? Barring global physics changes like how DI got modified, is there a single character in the roster who has been there since Launch whose code is 100% exactly like it was then?

 

[Deleted member 269706]

Lol yeah. I wonder, if we list out EVERY character that has been changed in every patch, has everyone been changed to some extent? Barring global physics changes like how DI got modified, is there a single character in the roster who has been there since Launch whose code is 100% exactly like it was then?

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe Mario remains untouched.

 

[ARGHETH]

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe Mario remains untouched.

Nope. Utlit got changed in 1.0.4 from 6.3% --> 5.5%.
EDIT: According to the wiki, except for a glitch removal, Jigglypuff hasn't been touched at all.

 

[DemonRin]

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe Mario remains untouched.

Nah, I'm a Mario Main so I've had my eyes pretty well glued to him and he's had a few changes. I remember the one I hated the most was his UAir was nerfed at one point. I had a friend cheer at that because it hurt my strategy lol.

 

[Fruitalicious]

dedede wasnt buffed... rip.

 

[c-gomez007]

I might be the only one to notice, but I think Bowser's Up Throw's knockback was decreased. Up Throw to Up Air seems easier to connect at 100%+ in 1.1.5 from 1.1.4. Could somebody check that for me and see if I'm right?

 

[Cat8752]

Anyone know if ZSS can still up air up air up b kill combo?

 

[Luig]

Sakurai must have thought jiggs was fine where it was in Brawl,so decided to give it no buffs in Sm4sh whatsoever throughout the patches.

Anyone know if ZSS can still up air up air up b kill combo?

With rage, you may be able to get the pop out kill....

 

[DemonRin]

Yeah, my sister mains ZSS so this isn't gonna be good for her lol

 

[S_B]

I might be the only one to notice, but I think Bowser's Up Throw's knockback was decreased. Up Throw to Up Air seems easier to connect at 100%+ in 1.1.5 from 1.1.4. Could somebody check that for me and see if I'm right?

It was unchanged.

Also, I've no reason to believe that 1.1.5 will be the last patch, either.

They patch characters in bunches. This time around, Zard, Zelda, Gdorf, Samus and Kirby were the big winners. I suspect a future patch will buff D3, JP, DH, and a few others as well as nerf Rosa and probably Sonic.

Sheik, ZSS, Sonic and Rosa all had the 1 weight unit reduction "kiss of death" in 1.1.4. Sheik and ZSS got theirs. I suspect Sonic and Rosa are still to come (both of whom are considered S tier in Japan).

 

[Luig]

Meta knight's uair combo was nerfed, but uair is a bit more versatile now.

@NMEtyrant @Abadango_MK https://t.co/FHT1Wn7kfu

— doitchris_ (@doitchris_) March 16, 2016

 

[S_B]

Meta knight's uair combo was nerfed, but uair is a bit more versatile now.

@NMEtyrant @Abadango_MK https://t.co/FHT1Wn7kfu

— doitchris_ (@doitchris_) March 16, 2016

Dammit...

Out of the frying pan, into the fire.

But can that be smash DIed?

 

[Luig]

Dammit...

Out of the frying pan, into the fire.

But can that be smash DIed?

It looked like he was trying to. But there was only one uair, and the sdi change didn't happen to dair.

 

[Eureka]

Meta knight's uair combo was nerfed, but uair is a bit more versatile now.

@NMEtyrant @Abadango_MK https://t.co/FHT1Wn7kfu

— doitchris_ (@doitchris_) March 16, 2016

Unfortunately you can very easily DI out of that by holding away.

 

[GerudoKong]

No buffs for doc, but the fact that this patch happened at all at least leaves me hope for next time.

 

[S_B]

Unfortunately you can very easily DI out of that by holding away.

I'd say it's quite fortunate.

MK wasn't designed as a character that was supposed to have cheese kill confirms, he was designed to be an edgeguarding powerhouse with a so-so neutral.

The edgeguarding game of SSB4 is so underdeveloped because of the way ledgeguarding mechanics work, but if you look objectively at MK's toolkit, it's obvious that this is a character that was designed to prevent people from making it back to the stage.

 

[Eureka]

I'd say it's quite fortunate.

MK wasn't designed as a character that was supposed to have cheese kill confirms, he was designed to be an edgeguarding powerhouse with a so-so neutral.

The edgeguarding game of SSB4 is so underdeveloped because of the way ledgeguarding mechanics work, but if you look objectively at MK's toolkit, it's obvious that this is a character that was designed to prevent people from making it back to the stage.

While that may be true, at the same MK is completely neutered at a high level of play at this point, I just feel bad for all the Meta Knight mains. Even if he can edgeguard well, so many characters either don't care or are really hard to edgeguard that his weaknesses are going to be even more problematic. I mean, taking people off the top like that was his thing, and now he doesn't really have anything to compete against the top-tiers. They could have at least gave him something to compensate losing what his whole gameplan revolved around.

 

[momochuu]

Meta knight's uair combo was nerfed, but uair is a bit more versatile now.

@NMEtyrant @Abadango_MK https://t.co/FHT1Wn7kfu

— doitchris_ (@doitchris_) March 16, 2016

Please stop posting this combo. It doesn't work. That's like the third time its popped up here since yesterday.

 

[sedrf]

the post was from hours ago