"Air-Cancels" confirmed.

[GamerGuy09]

(https://twitter.com/MikeMcWhertor/status/345288893953884160)

Not sure if Air-Cancels mean Air-Dodges or L-Canceling. What do you think?

 

[Revven]

I think he means air dodges...

 

[DakotaBonez]

What does Sakurai mean "at this point" I guess he's actually seriously debating the air dodging system. I'm cool with brawl dodges, it's just some other mechanics in brawl that bug me a bit, which so far seem to have been noted and adjusted.

How do people keep finding this obscure smash news?

 

[Cassio]

Im pretttttty sure he means momentum canceling. I have nothing to base that off but intuition, lol, but it makes sense.

 

[Hello.]

"Multiple air cancels" definitely sounds like the Brawl air dodge. Indeed, he must be rethinking how airdodging works.

 

[Uffe]

I don't mind the Brawl air-dodging. If they change it back to the Melee air-dodge, then I suspect that wavedashing will return.

 

[DefenseTech]

Im hoping for one air dodge (melee style) that is NOT directional (brawl style)

 

[JOE!]

I don't mind the Brawl air-dodging. If they change it back to the Melee air-dodge, then I suspect that wavedashing will return.

If it's directional then there will be WD

 

[relaxedexcorcist]

His next tweet says he meant to say air dodges not air cancels. Either way it seems like he still considering changing it.

 

[Big-Cat]

What does Sakurai mean "at this point" I guess he's actually seriously debating the air dodging system. I'm cool with brawl dodges, it's just some other mechanics in brawl that bug me a bit, which so far seem to have been noted and adjusted.

How do people keep finding this obscure smash news?

It also shows that Sakurai is still experimenting with things, to see where they go. I wouldn't be surprised if they change the system every so often to see which one is the best.

 

[Mithost]

Air dodges tend to cancel combos and you know how translations work

 

[The World Warrior]

I didn't mind Brawl air-dodges either but it would be interesting to see Melee air-dodging return. Wavedashing would no doubt return.

 

[Machiavelli.CF]

I believe he means brawl air dodges, because you can use them multiple times. In contrast to disabling air dodges.

 

[Zenokidz]

It'd be nice to see how wavedashing would play a part in this next smash. But I personally wouldn't mind it either way honestly.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

If it's directional then there will be WD

Why do you make that assumption exactly?

It might be that the directional airdodge simply wouldn't land cancel, lol

 

[Kokichi]

I can't find the original Japanese tweet. I'd like to read it and see exactly what it says - anyone got the link?

 

[killazys]

I can't find the original Japanese tweet. I'd like to read it and see exactly what it says - anyone got the link?

I too am interested in the Japanese source..

 

[Ometa]

Air-Dodges no doubt

I too am interested in the Japanese source..

I second this

 

[JOE!]

Why do you make that assumption exactly?

It might be that the directional airdodge simply wouldn't land cancel, lol

Because WD was a consequence of being able to AD diagonally into the ground?

 

[smashbrolink]

If it's directional then there will be WD

Unless they purposely design it so that air-dodging into the ground at an angle does not carry over the momentum into a slide.
The system could easily be designed to do that, as well as designed so that an air dodge cannot be executed before a player is in the air.[which, IMO, would be a sensible move, since being able to Air Dodge without truly becoming airborne makes 0 sense in the first place.XD]

 

[EdreesesPieces]

I'm fine with Brawl's air dodging system, just needs a lot more lag after each air dodge. A lot more.

 

[BSP]

They also need to be normalized across the board.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

Because WD was a consequence of being able to AD diagonally into the ground?

What if you could DAD but didn't land? What if your character hovered over the ground until the animation was over? There are a dozen ways DAD could not result in wavedashing lol

 

[MasterOfKnees]

It also shows that Sakurai is still experimenting with things, to see where they go. I wouldn't be surprised if they change the system every so often to see which one is the best.

Judging from how different Brawl's demo was from the final product no doubt he is trying out different things.

I personally don't mind if it's either the Melee or Brawl air dodge, or maybe just something new. As long as you never go into freefall (aka can't do up-B) after doing it.

 

[[Corn]]

I personally prefer the brawl airdodge one, but make it have a larger cooldown.

 

[Psychoace]

melee special shield pls.

 

[Mr.Jackpot]

Unless they purposely design it so that air-dodging into the ground at an angle does not carry over the momentum into a slide.
The system could easily be designed to do that, as well as designed so that an air dodge cannot be executed before a player is in the air.[which, IMO, would be a sensible move, since being able to Air Dodge without truly becoming airborne makes 0 sense in the first place.XD]

Wavedash executions are done right when you get off the air, just like an instant aerial.

I honestly don't care about as much about wavedashing as I do about preserving horizontal momentum from ground to air and air to ground, it's how real life works and honestly not bringing back THAT wouldn't make any sense.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Wonder if it would be too hard to have both... I still want to Melee Air Dodge with R, and Brawl Air Dodge with L.

 

[Psychoace]

That would be some intense mind games.

 

[[Corn]]

Wavedash executions are done right when you get off the air, just like an instant aerial.

I honestly don't care about as much about wavedashing as I do about preserving horizontal momentum from ground to air and air to ground, it's how real life works and honestly not bringing back THAT wouldn't make any sense.

Lol at bringing up real life in smash.

 

[EpixAura]

I really want Melee air dodge, just because of wavedashing. I wouldn't mind the slide mechanic of it being toned down for characters like Luigi and ICs, but wavedash mindgames are just too fun. Brawl airdodge is just too strong of a defensive option in a lot of situations. I think the overall pace of the game should be at least moderately quick.

Still, it IS Sakurai talking. Even he probably doesn't know what he means.

 

[[Corn]]

Never was a fan of wavedashing really. Unless they normalized the distance traveled or something it will always benefit some characters over others.

 

[UMR | donmk]

I can't find the original Japanese tweet. I'd like to read it and see exactly what it says - anyone got the link?

I'm not sure a Japanese source necessarily exists. The information came from the below article.

http://www.polygon.com/2013/6/14/4429220/super-smash-bros-for-wii-u-nintendo-3ds-removes-tripping

Apparently polygon interviewed Sakurai, so there was probably a translator at the interview.

 

[_R@bid_]

If Sakurai's still deciding on the air dodge system....
Then someone needs to send him this.

I've pondered this idea as an alternative for airdodges a few times, and had quite a lot of thoughts on it, including the prospect of it being multi-directional, taking a jump, and so forth, pretty much everything in the OP. Some more food for thought though:

-Air dashes are partially effected by your character's current momentum. Atempting to immediately jump then air dash sideways, for example, results in a dash with the following trajectory:

This would apply to all dashes and all momentum, and is a feature very common to games that include an air dash. A bonus feature of this mechanic is that it allows wavelands and smooth movement, without unforeseen applications.

-On a per-character basis, air dashes are of different lengths, and may include invincibility or other such traits. Bowser, for example, might get a short super armor dash.

-On a per-character basis, air dashes can be acted-out-of at different times. Characters like Metaknight, for example, might do a barrel roll glide that goes a fairly far distance, but is very slow to act out of.

-Also on a per-character basis, the number of air dashes that can be used before landing or grabbing the ledge, as well as the prospect of it removing their double jump, varies. In addition, some characters might get their airdash back upon being hit, typically ones that are otherwise small and/or grouped with a poor recovery, as with Bowser.

-Pressing the airdash input with no direction results in an air dodge akin to Brawl's, has no effect on the number of jumps one can use, but does deplete one of their uses of an airdash.

 

[Mr.Jackpot]

Lol at bringing up real life in smash.

Never was a fan of wavedashing really. Unless they normalized the distance traveled or something it will always benefit some characters over others.

Not that I need Smash to be super realistic or anything but since we have things like gravity and traction it would make sense to undo the downgrade Brawl did to the physics engine.

And of course wavedashing will benefit more characters than others, just like spotdodging, or running and jumping. Wavedashing doesn't need to be normalized, it's based off of traction and it's a pretty good counterbalance to shield slide distance.

 

[[Corn]]

Not that I need Smash to be super realistic or anything but since we have things like gravity and traction it would make sense to undo the downgrade Brawl did to the physics engine.

And of course wavedashing will benefit more characters than others, just like spotdodging, or running and jumping. Wavedashing doesn't need to be normalized, it's based off of traction and it's a pretty good counterbalance to shield slide distance.

To the first, noone cares about realism at all in a smash game, like at all.

To the second, we will just have to see. From the videos shown it clearly looks like it has a Brawl float quality with slightly higher hitstun and multiple air dodges.
Knowing a bit how they think, I would assumed that they added more lag to each airdodge to allow for more disadvantage whilst being juggled for the more serious players while at the same time allowing for multiple ones to be used so you arent completely helpless if you dont have any good counters to being in the air.

 

[Kink-Link5]

I wonder what in sakurai's mind thought hitstun-canceling was a lucrative prospect.

 

[[Corn]]

I wonder what in sakurai's mind thought hitstun-canceling was a lucrative prospect.

You had tripping. Stop wondering.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Nah see, I can see why Tripping was included; it was one of several deterants against running: Buffed walk speed and startup velocity, no running jumps, no shield during initial dash, no dash canceling, super open movement, tripping. All of which can be "justified" as Sakurai saying "don't dash, it's only there to make you lose."

It doesn't make it anything resembling an okay decision, though, and doesn't make hitstun canceling make any more sense.

 

[Terrazi Terrajin]