A Pit Strategy Guide Final Version (Almost completly redone)

[Rhyfelwyr]

A simple update adding Pit to the character section. It's worth reading even if you don't regularly fight a Pit user. There are insights into our own weaknesses.

As I'm sure you know, it is very possible on a lot of stages to go UNDER the stage. Usually this is just a cheap parlor trick, but it can be useful against certain kinds of tactics as a recovery method. Pikachu's lightning spam on the edge can make it hard to approach. If you have enough momentum, though, you can glide under the stage and to the other side for safety before Pikachu can get across.

More than anything else, though, setting it up as a tactic that you use is a good mind-game. The opponent now has to decide if you are going to:
A) Shoot arrows to cover your recovery.
B) Glide in and attack (Glide attack or glide-cancelled Nair, for example.)
C) Glide under the stage and recover on the other side.

For a slow character, the last one means that if they want to cover the other side, they can't stand right by the edge or ledge guard. However, I should point out that gliding under the stage should only be used if you have enough speed coming in, like from a high and long-distance recovery. Otherwise, the other player has plenty of time to see what you're doing, run across and punish/ledgegaurd you. Using Up-B for this recovery is also bad, it's simply too slow for mot practical purposes.

Ah, thanks for reminding me of this tactic. It's worth a mention.

i love how you categorized each section into books haha
n__n
good job on the guide

Thank you!

 

[Alou]

Very nice guide! Lots of great stuff, some I was already naturally doing other stuff helped me a ton. Thank you

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

Happy to be of service!

This update contains Metaknight. He's not as scary as once thought.

 

[Codi]

***** plz. This guide sux. I was king before but when i started following ur ****ing guide it ****ed my ***** azz up. who ever wrote the guide is a ***et ***** that needs to get a life.

 

[Undrdog]

Yeah, my guess is that someone who can't even form a coherent sentence probably isn't very good at much of anything. I suggest learning how to communicate before trying something as complex as trying to follow a guide. This is a very informative guide and if you've failed to follow it it's your problem. Don't fault the creator of the guide when there are five plus pages of positive feedback because odds are, you're the one who's having the problem, not the other posters.

 

[Admiral Pit]

I would report him to the Admins but...

Skipping the ignorent post, facing another Pit was challenging. One thing i never did was face a MK with Pit yet, and this should help me just in case i do comfront a MK with Pit.

But I'll tell you who's Scary... Lucas! That accursed U-Smash of his, i swear is annoying and gives almost all of my characters serious problems, especially MK and Zelda. And Pit may need help on this one since the Magnet can absorb Pit's Arrows. Ness will have to go afterwards. And since I face Lucas and Ness players anyways, this would be beneficial to me a lot.

 

[Undrdog]

If you can get Lucas off the edge though he should lose his stock. He's really that easy to edgegaurd.

 

[Admiral Pit]

Well, its that time now. My other mains have comfronted another character and I'm not pleased. And that character is King Dedede! He knows how to chaingrab, he gets me with the Fsmash (sometimes), and im losing my pride!
Im sure Pit needs to know how to handle Dedede quickly without getting in contact with those strong attacks. And yes, I know that Gordo (dedede's spikey thing) can be reflected.
I need to hold my own vs the heavyweights basically, and I must learn quickly.

 

[Undrdog]

Pit has a very easy time against King Dedede. I'm curious if Bower can Fortress out of King Dedede's chaingrab. His Up-B was very fast in Melee and I haven't gotten an chance to mess around with it in Brawl yet.

Anyway yeah, I'm not sure what to say when fighting King Dedede. He's very easy to take down with Pit it's not funny. The Angel Rings are amazing against him. Use the AR from above and he gets stuck for quite awhile. Even when he gets out the only attack he can get off before your AR finishes is the FTilt. His AAA will make him reach into your blades again before the attack can hit you. Other slower moves either give you enough time to escape, or pushes him away as it finishes so that even if you can't move yet, odds are he's been pushed out of th way.

I could go on forever about nerfing King Dedede with Pit. I'll leave on this note of advice. Focus your attacks at his head. The only thing he can do is preform fast attacks as though swatting at a gnat when fighting a fast Pit. He has trouble hitting near his face quickly.

OH! And PowerShield EVERYTHING he does. It's slow and easy to see coming AND his attacks have a slow cool-down time.

 

[Admiral Pit]

I will see what i can do against this Dedede. Maybe it is because im aggressive and i need to be more casual. Im afraid of using Angel Ring due to Dedede's Fsmash. But i will take your word.
And yes, Bowser can Fortress outta Dedede's chaingrab.

 

[Undrdog]

That's good to know. Yet another reason not to ban stages with walk-off edges. ^_^

But honestly, you have to train yourself to know when to stop tapping the B button during the AR. Otherwise you will get nailed by the Fsmash.

 

[sagemoon]

Pit has a very easy time against King Dedede. I'm curious if Bower can Fortress out of King Dedede's chaingrab. His Up-B was very fast in Melee and I haven't gotten an chance to mess around with it in Brawl yet.

Anyway yeah, I'm not sure what to say when fighting King Dedede. He's very easy to take down with Pit it's not funny. The Angel Rings are amazing against him. Use the AR from above and he gets stuck for quite awhile. Even when he gets out the only attack he can get off before your AR finishes is the FTilt. His AAA will make him reach into your blades again before the attack can hit you. Other slower moves either give you enough time to escape, or pushes him away as it finishes so that even if you can't move yet, odds are he's been pushed out of th way.

I could go on forever about nerfing King Dedede with Pit. I'll leave on this note of advice. Focus your attacks at his head. The only thing he can do is preform fast attacks as though swatting at a gnat when fighting a fast Pit. He has trouble hitting near his face quickly.

OH! And PowerShield EVERYTHING he does. It's slow and easy to see coming AND his attacks have a slow cool-down time.

You havent played very many good DDDs have you? Its harder than you're giving it credit for. First off if you AR then he can jump over and bair you before you're done. Also if hes good with waddle dees than arrows become (not pointless) harder to use. Also out of shield he can reach you with down tilt. Down throw forward tilt will get you no matter what you do. That and DDDs grab range is so freaking big.

My advice in this matchup is to aproach with nair and try to go above his shield and land behind him so you dont get grabbed. theres no lag time upon landing if you do it right. Also on his recovery watch out for his waddle dees, That and try to hit him at the peak of hit b up. Use bair it has more knock back, its easier to land, and it does damage. fair wont kill DDD it will just make it easier for him to recover. Even if you bair him towards the stage its better than a fair at high percents IMO. Be carful in this matchup, if the DDD is smart than you can find yourself in a hole very fast.

 

[ChokE]

Hey Rhyfelwyr, I have a question on the meteorsmash(ftilt on the edge) you introduced a while ago. First I want to say i have few amazing moments because of it, but when i tried it on IKE, it didn't seem to work, acutally it did not hit him at all. i was wondering if it only work on some characters (one who don't have really long arms?)

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

You're correct. Against a character grabbing the ledge, it will only work if their arms can't reach above their own head.

Thanks for having my back UndrDog. I guess I can't please everyone.

Great discussion going on here. I can't wait to see what I can glean from it.

 

[Undrdog]

Sure thing Rhy.

As for Dedede I consider myself a decent Dedede player and I know how to play him well. However while I'm playing him I constantly find myself thinking to myself "There's no way my Pit could ever lose to this guy."

I'm not saying I'm right, but again if you get Dedede off his feet he's not going to be able to retake control of the match until his next stock. Dedede is an easy character to take control of regardless of who's using him at this point in Brawl's lifespan.

 

[lmnz]

Out of shield smashes are your friends. Metaknight's biggest weakness would have to be his lack of shield knockback in all his attacks. There's enough lag after most of his aerials, tilts, and smashes for you to punish him.

okay hoooold up i do not know how this works. iono if it's just socal but there are SO many MKs out there right now and i'm starting to feel that he's one of the characters that have a strong advantage against pit. his tilts at full range can be a pain and mixed with d-tilt spam(which can hit below the shield) and grabs can be harder to punish than be punished... i just dunno how to deal with his speed game since if you even TRY to arrow him he'll be in your face before you're done with your arrow animation. his aerial game is far more superior than pit's and his up+b can gimp pit off at VERY low %.

i'm thinking that playing a more grounded pit might be the answer since pit's d-smash has just about the same or a little more reach than MK's moves and it's probably the fastest starting smash. maybe d-smash = key to punishing MKs spaced aerial game and DI'd sh d-air to counter his ground game? ugh. i feel like just switching to another character against MK right now T.T

 

[tag yeah]

Great Guide! I think you should go into depth with lucas... I hate fighting him

 

[Admiral Pit]

The Angel Ring got me hammered by Dedede's Fsmash! Stupid range X-X Still, my aggressiveness helped me win. Unfortuntately, I cannot do arrow loops against such a powerful character.

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

okay hoooold up i do not know how this works. iono if it's just socal but there are SO many MKs out there right now and i'm starting to feel that he's one of the characters that have a strong advantage against pit. his tilts at full range can be a pain and mixed with d-tilt spam(which can hit below the shield) and grabs can be harder to punish than be punished... i just dunno how to deal with his speed game since if you even TRY to arrow him he'll be in your face before you're done with your arrow animation. his aerial game is far more superior than pit's and his up+b can gimp pit off at VERY low %.

i'm thinking that playing a more grounded pit might be the answer since pit's d-smash has just about the same or a little more reach than MK's moves and it's probably the fastest starting smash. maybe d-smash = key to punishing MKs spaced aerial game and DI'd sh d-air to counter his ground game? ugh. i feel like just switching to another character against MK right now T.T

I never said the fight was going to be easy. Only send out one arrow after knocking him away it you want to be safe. If you shield any of his short hop aerials, and he doesn't DI or space properly, you can F-smash him. His F-tilt and D-tilt can be blocked and D-smashed.

It's going to be a very defensive match, that will depend on your reaction skills to time smashes and sidestep grabs.

Great Guide! I think you should go into depth with lucas... I hate fighting him

I could try, but I'd really like to face a B-sticking Lucas, and I don't know any.

 

[FS Fantom]

What is Wing Renewal/Pivot?

Haven't heard those before.

Also, I just read that topic about the up-b parry; is this a viable technique? Would you just activate it as you get hit?

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

Go to this thread to find out about most of Pit's advanced techniques.
http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=155928

The up-B parry is useless. Powershielding and dodging are easier, safer, and give more options. The up-B defense is being looked into as a counter to chaingrabs.

 

[lmnz]

I never said the fight was going to be easy. Only send out one arrow after knocking him away it you want to be safe. If you shield any of his short hop aerials, and he doesn't DI or space properly, you can F-smash him. His F-tilt and D-tilt can be blocked and D-smashed.

It's going to be a very defensive match, that will depend on your reaction skills to time smashes and sidestep grabs.

okay so after reading everything and thinking about the MK match up i experimented everything today and this is what i got now...

i tried what i said earlier and being super defensive/grounded and playing as gay as possible which can actually get you wins vs MK and i mean gay without arrows(but shoot them far range just to have him come to you). the d-tilt and f-tilt at max range are too far for f-smash and d-smash but sh d-air is VERY safe out of shield against the tilts and almost always hits him. whenever he aerials, block his move and d-smash out of shield. it will always either clash with his landing move or hit him. try your best to air dodge his up+b when recovering so you don't get gimped and glide a lot less in this match up since gliding can be one of the easiest ways for him to get his up+b gimp on you.

yay for not having to give up on pit against MK =]

 

[teh_pwns_the]

ahh i have some experience vs lucas's

first off lucas's stick will **** you and your family so avoid it and he can hit you with it real quick when coming out of his shield. another insane lucas move in his down aerial however it normally has some momentum to it so either roll towards it and let it pass over you or just jump high and punish with a Fair or Nair

some lucas players can be PK happy. if you are charging and you hear him even mention anything about PK, angel ring. This will reflect possible PK fires or just damage him a bit if it happens to be thunder or frost.

mirror shield is a lucas destroyer. you can reflect PK frost with this which will serve as a block unless you are close to him, in which case you will actually freeze him instead. yes i know epic. mirror shield is great for gimping his up b when he attempts to recover with it. some lucas players have learned to speed PK thunder zap themselves so be aware and just employ those gamer reflexes. mirror shield can also be used instead of angel ring when you are charging, as it also will reflect his stick if timed right.

as to the arrow vs psi magnet problem. use you arrows anyways, but if he pulls up his psi magnet curve your arrow away or just shoot it straight up so that he doesnt heal from it. when you get lucas off the edge and he is trying to upB himself back into the game it can be fun to hit him with arrows and interrupt his PK thunder which will normally cause him to fall further and thus reduce his chances of recovering. If you are good enough with the arrows you can aim for his pk thunder itself which will cancel it and leave him without a recovery.

be extra careful when falling down as lucas's up smash can ko you when you only have 60 damage. luckily this up smash takes forever to get ready to use so if you can fall quickly enough and hit him with an aerial you are set, if not then glide away or drift so that he can not get set up beneath you. whatever you do do not try to Dair him, he will destroy you because even his up tilt will devestate. it is best to just avoid approacing lucas from above. also gliding gets gimped against lucas unless you are exceptional at it because his PK thunder will get you and you will lose lots of jumps, likewise you have to watch out when using your upB because of the PK thunder

dont spam angel ring lucas has a decent roll and can easily end up behind you and end up punishing you with any of his smashes

 

[lmnz]

ahh i have some experience vs lucas's

first off lucas's stick will **** you and your family so avoid it and he can hit you with it real quick when coming out of his shield. another insane lucas move in his down aerial however it normally has some momentum to it so either roll towards it and let it pass over you or just jump high and punish with a Fair or Nair

some lucas players can be PK happy. if you are charging and you hear him even mention anything about PK, angel ring. This will reflect possible PK fires or just damage him a bit if it happens to be thunder or frost.

mirror shield is a lucas destroyer. you can reflect PK frost with this which will serve as a block unless you are close to him, in which case you will actually freeze him instead. yes i know epic. mirror shield is great for gimping his up b when he attempts to recover with it. some lucas players have learned to speed PK thunder zap themselves so be aware and just employ those gamer reflexes. mirror shield can also be used instead of angel ring when you are charging, as it also will reflect his stick if timed right.

as to the arrow vs psi magnet problem. use you arrows anyways, but if he pulls up his psi magnet curve your arrow away or just shoot it straight up so that he doesnt heal from it. when you get lucas off the edge and he is trying to upB himself back into the game it can be fun to hit him with arrows and interrupt his PK thunder which will normally cause him to fall further and thus reduce his chances of recovering. If you are good enough with the arrows you can aim for his pk thunder itself which will cancel it and leave him without a recovery.

be extra careful when falling down as lucas's up smash can ko you when you only have 60 damage. luckily this up smash takes forever to get ready to use so if you can fall quickly enough and hit him with an aerial you are set, if not then glide away or drift so that he can not get set up beneath you. whatever you do do not try to Dair him, he will destroy you because even his up tilt will devestate. it is best to just avoid approacing lucas from above. also gliding gets gimped against lucas unless you are exceptional at it because his PK thunder will get you and you will lose lots of jumps, likewise you have to watch out when using your upB because of the PK thunder

dont spam angel ring lucas has a decent roll and can easily end up behind you and end up punishing you with any of his smashes

umm... i think in this match up. pit's mirror shield gimps lucas worse than edgehogging on tether recovery characters. and that's pretty much all you need vs lucas/ness lol.

 

[teh_pwns_the]

oh something i forgot to add, if you dont mirror shield his pk-thunder-self-zap, and you dont dodge it you will get taken for a good deal of damage, and will be sent flying

and something else, i enjoyed the guide, especially the wind section, looking forward to its completion

 

[teh_pwns_the]

haha yea cant stress enough how useful the shield is against lucas/ness players, but many advanced players have learned other techniques that take care of their jumps, jumps that may even rival pits

the rest though is nice to know if you are really having trouble with lucas players

 

[Admiral Pit]

Now im losing to Toon link spammers! D-smash, f-smash, and d-air, as well as some projectiles are what he spams, and Im losing to that!? That same player Spams Pika's Thunder jolt, D-smash and Thunder! I feel so weak now...
I hate fightin spammers and speed characters anyways. Maybe the noob just caught me on a bad day.

Advice on ripping apart such a toon link would be nice, because Pit does not need to get injured like this again... These medical supplies are expensive!

 

[CorruptFate]

Some thing you might want to include in the book of water is that when you hold the edge and tap away then jump you will jump with your back to the edge and can do a b air not to useful but it can be nice helps me in my games.

 

[Ryanarius]

Under the character specific section it'd be interesting if you included recommended counterpick and restrict maps. I always have the hardest time deciding counterpicks and generally go with just a neutral that I can fly under so it'd be interesting to see what other people think.

 

[m0nkey1sme]

As a pit main, i found that i had a very hard time aproaching, since his aerials and dash attacks can easily be shield grabbed, and spamming grab is a one way ticket to ultimate punishment. This guide did help though. I'll have to try some of this stuff out. My Pit used to be absolutely amazing but i have been very busy with school so my skills have decreased sadly

 

[m0nkey1sme]

Now im losing to Toon link spammers! D-smash, f-smash, and d-air, as well as some projectiles are what he spams, and Im losing to that!? That same player Spams Pika's Thunder jolt, D-smash and Thunder! I feel so weak now...
I hate fightin spammers and speed characters anyways. Maybe the noob just caught me on a bad day.

Advice on ripping apart such a toon link would be nice, because Pit does not need to get injured like this again... These medical supplies are expensive!

What I do on these Toon Link spammers is quite simple. If they spam dair than it becomes easy to predict. Just watch them closely when they are above you and time a roll. If you get it right you will dodge both the attack and the wind and create a perfect opening. For the smashes do the same. Dodge to create distance and put him on a charging offensive with some arrows. If they decide to play the camping projectile game, then use a mirror shield. Toon Link's projectiles are moderately slow and are easy to reflect. It becomes more difficult when they mix the projectiles in with physical attacks, but down-dodging and air dodging work well in certain situations.

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

Sorry I haven't been around for a while. I've been busy. I'll get to updating ASAP.

teh pwns the thanks for your impressions of fighting Lucas.

Some thing you might want to include in the book of water is that when you hold the edge and tap away then jump you will jump with your back to the edge and can do a b air not to useful but it can be nice helps me in my games.

Good to know, It shall be added.

Under the character specific section it'd be interesting if you included recommended counterpick and restrict maps. I always have the hardest time deciding counterpicks and generally go with just a neutral that I can fly under so it'd be interesting to see what other people think.

Eventually I'll get to adding a stage section, but for now you can check out the Pit stage discussion thread

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=157709

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

I'm leaning more and more towards making Ganondorf my main. He seems to fit my whole strategic, defensive style really well. Even if I do make him my main, Pit will still be my strong secondary, and I'll continue to always update this guide.

Because of my experience with Ganondorf now, I added him to Wind.

I'll be getting around to gathering all the great points people have been posting in this thread about fighting characters, I promise!

 

[teh_pwns_the]

hmm ganondorf? i dunno i always pictured him at bottom tier, but if he meshes well with your style then go for it, after all the player makes the character not the other way around

 

[Admiral Pit]

I'm going to need a Medic for what Olimar and Kirby did to me.

 

[Rhyfelwyr]

Since a thread was made already asking about this, I added what I said about Ike. Progress in Wind is going well. Almost 1/3 through the cast now!

 

[xS A M U R A Ix]

I like the format of this, I see someone else is a Musashi Miyamoto fan. Very good guide.

 

[Psymon]

Very nice guide. Well written and pics to accompany =D. Bravo man! Psy.

 

[superglucose]

I'm pretty nooby, I'm aware, but something I've seen work pretty well is Dthrow to Uair, short hopping at low percents and full hopping at some of the higher. Generally what I've been able to do (and see others do) is force my opponent to approach, once they approach, grab to a Dthrow to Uair, which pushes them away laterally. Then they have to approach again.

 

[Ryanarius]

dthrow to upair will hit your opponent if they haven't learned that air dodge beats everything. If they've figured this out they will simply air dodge the upair and as your dthrow is your least damaging throw its a bit of a waste. That said if you can predict that they are going to air dodge you can not throw out the upair and hit them with a bair or if you didn't even bother to jump you can hit them with an upsmash, uptilt or even another grab if you really want to mess with them.