A Luigi Q&A discussion

[hippiedude92]

Lol stop stealing everything I was going to say Spark :[

Since Sparked just covered it, I'll just fill in some points.

The match is all about Luigi's offense vs Olimar's defense.

What ever you do, don't get grabbed. He has insane grab range, it does more damage depending on pikimin color, and it leads to devastating combos. I would start the SH fireball/tornado approach because it keeps pikimin off you. Keep a lookout on your % because you may think your winning, but when you actually do notice, you'll be at a high %. Aim for getting Oli offstage he has a crap tether recovery so by all means grab the ledge. So keep it a offensive air game, dont have it anywhere near the ground, your attacks in the air **** his.

 

[lindonmichael]

My friend plays Snake and R.O.B. For Snake he spams A, Ftilt and Usmash. R.O.B. combos me into oblivion with his smashes and tilts. Any help?

 

[hippiedude92]

My friend plays Snake and R.O.B. For Snake he spams A, Ftilt and Usmash. R.O.B. combos me into oblivion with his smashes and tilts. Any help?

WOW. Funny how I was just playing a ROB a few minutes ago. Nice competitive matchs though <3. Alright so, I'll start Rob since I just played him, the Snake is in matchupdiscussion so check there first.

For this matchup it's about Luigi's offense vs ROB's offense.

You'll want to keep it moderately aggressive, in this matchup because you don't want Rob have space to snipe you with a lazer and gyro. If your getting tilted too much on the ground, it means your either 1) rushing too much 2) lacking shieldgrabs/powershields 3) <--both

You'll want to approach Rob with a SH fireball to a tornado since it rushs through him and keeps him moving. You'll want a Dair to Nair combo and upairs to combo him. Also Rob wasn't really much of a combo person. Hes more of a hardcore hitter and sniper. You can break his combos with a Nair. Aggressive is your friend, don't let up, don't let him have space, dont let him snipe. Also, if your going face to face in the air, try not to get hit I forgot which hit, Nair (?) because it's hits like 45 degree angle.

To kill Rob, is not that hard really, if hes offstage, you have him there, keep throwing fireballs/Bairs until he uses up alot of his gas, if hes at a high % for Bair stage spike as it 100% ko varying on the %.

Also if RoB is directly below you, dont try to do Dair or falling Nair plz -__-. You'll get upsmashd to heaven. Keep it air game, if your going on the defense ( which I dont think you should really do considering Rob 's better at camping) throw retreating aerials (fairs/Bairs) lots of fireballs and look for this openings.

As for snake look at the matchup discussion. You have to be moderately careful on what's hes doing. If hes running that means hes going to do a snake dash (boost smash with mortar slide w/e) you can just throw a fireball at him and it'll be cancelled. Also if he spams upsmash as pressure, if your going above him, you can break the mortar with a Nair. Again air game is your friend, Snake controls the field, once get passed by the nades,nikitas, c4s landmines, and the tilts, and you got him in the air offstage too, the battle is yours.

Quick tidbit, fireballs > nades (sets them off) / nikias ( cancels it) / land mine ( cancels it )

 

[popsofctown]

okay, small question. If i break a dude's shield, and he's at 35%, what should i do? Shoryuken won't kill, just decay. I could full charge upsmash, fsmash, or downsmash, but which one do i need the least, and which will do the most damage?

 

[PrinceMarthX]

Shoryuken is still best. 25% damage and you it's better to decay that than your smashes.

Or you might want to use a fully charged green missile. It does 26% damage and if it misfires, depending on how close you are to the edge, it might KO them.

 

[SparkEd]

...How the **** did that guy let you break his shield?

>:/

 

[hippiedude92]

A Shoryuken is a waste. Depending who your fighting, you'll want to get them in a combo. A Dair to Nair to Utilt/Upsmash, is better. I'm just lazy to see if it does more damage then a shoryuken or fully charged fsmash.

 

[hippiedude92]

Bumpp too >_> People have questions up and goin' they belong here guyz >.>

and sorry for double posting >.>

 

[Faithkeeper]

Does an un-tilted fsmash have more range than an up-tilted fsmash? I noticed Virtual Void doesn't up-tilt his fsmashes over 50% of the time in the vids i've seen and I guessed this may be why. (If it's true... that's why I asked)

 

[PrinceMarthX]

Does an un-tilted fsmash have more range than an up-tilted fsmash? I noticed Virtual Void doesn't up-tilt his fsmashes over 50% of the time in the vids i've seen and I guessed this may be why. (If it's true... that's why I asked)

Yes. Tilting the smash up or down reduces its range a bit.

 

[hippiedude92]

Bah. Bumped I hate seeing so many threads when they can all be asked here

 

[Rabert]

Is a Shoryuken luigi's uppercut of ping?

And is a falling tornado worth doing as an attack on a grounded enemy?

 

[hippiedude92]

Is a Shoryuken luigi's uppercut of ping?

And is a falling tornado worth doing as an attack on a grounded enemy?

I dont understand what you mean by upper cut ping. If your talking about how a grounded shoryuken has a that ping sound which is stronger while a aerial shoryuken doesnt have a ping and is weaker.

And no a falling tornado isn't worth doing because of how slow you fall. Your better off doing a fastfall Nair.

 

[Rabert]

I'm still really bad at edgeguarding. Any suggestions past "stand far enough away so your fireballs just reach the ledge"? I feel like I'm wasting an opportunity.

 

[elheber]

Get on Final D and practice running and Fast Fall grabbing the ledges. Just go back and forth. Once you've got that down, start Quick Ledgehogging. The Ledgegrab is a great neutral position for Luigi to edguard as it gives Luigi instance access to a bAir WoP to anyone above and below him, and lots of other options.

If you're good at recovering (if not, you should practice), go after them. You'll make mistakes often and fall to your death, but that's just learning. You'll get great at catching people after their second jump, drastically gimping their recovery.

I guess the best tip I can give you is: Don't be affraid to drop off the stage to punish them. Luigi has amazing recoveries and can outlast most other characters off-stage.

EDIT: The Luigi Cyclone is great landing move if you're landing beside them or near the edge of the stage. It can help you get away from trouble fast, or it can suprise them if they're charging an attack (like Lucario's Aura Sphere or DK's Giant Punch).

 

[Delvro]

^Wait a minute, you say the Luigi Cyclone is good if you're landing near the edge? I never thought of that, but I'll try it out.

Recently, I've been having a horrible time with Lucario. I get punished most of the time I approach (shield grabs, side B, and the like). I try and SH Bair him and AI away but his range usually gets me anyway.

Fireballs don't seem to work too well, either, against his Aura Spheres.

I actually have a lot of trouble against shield-grabbers. I know the key is spacing, but I don't know how to keep enough space between me and an opponent to prevent a shield-grab afterwards.

 

[elheber]

Yeah, landing in a Cyclone and quickly moving to the center of the stage can keep you out of danger fast and interrupt their attacks.

Get used to following up a Short Hopped Aerial with a Cyclone on your way down to cope with Shield Grabbers. But since your best attacks against Lucario involve you getting in real close, you'll have to use Spot Dodging more than anything else since almost all of his attacks can be Spotdodged and punished.

 

[Delvro]

Thanks a bunch, I appreciate the help!

 

[hippiedude92]

I'm still really bad at edgeguarding. Any suggestions past "stand far enough away so your fireballs just reach the ledge"? I feel like I'm wasting an opportunity.

In my exprenice, you have loads of oppunity when your edgeguarding. I'm usually aggressive offstage (varies to char to char). Well you can always SH fireballs and be ready when it hits, because that hitstun is a perfect setup for a Fsmash or into anything. Bair WoP/Bair stage spikes is where you want KO's. Upair walls are nice too. Fairs for the strings are decent. If your crazy like me ( I highly don't recommend these things), do a zap jump (look at loucan's thread if you dunno what it is), go for a charged green missle and hope it hits =]

Get on Final D and practice running and Fast Fall grabbing the ledges. Just go back and forth. Once you've got that down, start Quick Ledgehogging. The Ledgegrab is a great neutral position for Luigi to edguard as it gives Luigi instance access to a bAir WoP to anyone above and below him, and lots of other options.

If you're good at recovering (if not, you should practice), go after them. You'll make mistakes often and fall to your death, but that's just learning. You'll get great at catching people after their second jump, drastically gimping their recovery.

I guess the best tip I can give you is: Don't be affraid to drop off the stage to punish them. Luigi has amazing recoveries and can outlast most other characters off-stage.

EDIT: The Luigi Cyclone is great landing move if you're landing beside them or near the edge of the stage. It can help you get away from trouble fast, or it can suprise them if they're charging an attack (like Lucario's Aura Sphere or DK's Giant Punch).

Lulz Elh should know how aggressive I am offstage/on the edge.

^Wait a minute, you say the Luigi Cyclone is good if you're landing near the edge? I never thought of that, but I'll try it out.

Recently, I've been having a horrible time with Lucario. I get punished most of the time I approach (shield grabs, side B, and the like). I try and SH Bair him and AI away but his range usually gets me anyway.

Fireballs don't seem to work too well, either, against his Aura Spheres.

I actually have a lot of trouble against shield-grabbers. I know the key is spacing, but I don't know how to keep enough space between me and an opponent to prevent a shield-grab afterwards.

Shield grabbers are a pain in the arse espically Lucario. I highly advise you to fastfall most of your aerials and SHs. Lucario's grab range "is deceptive" or meaning just around above average. To make matters worst FP at lower %s hurt Luigi. I advise you on using spaced Ftilts, Bairs and if your doing a Dair>Nair combo on his face, do it fast cause you will get shield grabbed alot. Lucario and Luigi is a pretty much 50-50 matchup (somewhere there iirc), and lucario iirc has overall better range cause of his lingering hitboxes. So yeah better spacer = winner.

If you wanna improve your spacing, try hitting the tip of your attacks meaning tip of his foot etc. Like Bair and Ftilt. Also try using C-sticks, and control stick DI-ing away at the same time (ex: Bair > C-stick and control stick opposite direction).

On the ledge, do a ledgedrop, do a fair/dair for the fakeout and go for a fast luigi tornado. Works alot for me.

As for AS'es, fireballs cancel out baby AS's. His fully charged AS'es **** just about everything. Best way is to not let him charged his fricken hyper beam Aura sphere that are like hax0rz lolz.

I hope i helped~

 

[Col. Stauffenberg]

*Pokes head in* Lucci's grab is about the only thing he doesn't have deceptive range on lol. It's actually pretty short. He does, however, have rather good traction, which helps with shield grabbing. Like the hippie dude up there said, just space yourself more carefully.

 

[elheber]

Here's a question concerning Stale Move Negation:

Does each full Luigi Cyclone refresh 6 moves in the Stale Move Queue, or just 1? In other words, if my fSmash is a stale move, will hitting the opponent with the Cyclone twice completely refresh my fSmash?

 

[hippiedude92]

Nah it doesn't it counts as one whole move.

 

[kigbariom]

i was looking on how to perfect my dair spike, and i was wondering if you could help me out. that would really be helpful for low damage KO's.

 

[CR4SH]

The only way I've found to make it anywhere near reliable, is to go into vs mode with a lv 3 cpu and Dair the hell out of them. Dair them all the time, every chance you get, try to spike all of them. If you're not in spike position use the chance to learn the tip of the hitbox, right outside of his front toe. Once you're completely confident with the toebox, it's just a matter of positioning it lower.

Once you can do it on a computer, then you have to learn to do it on a human lol. The difference being, of course, unpredictability.

It's still difficult though. The only place I've learned to spike anywhere near reliably is out of a dthrow.

 

[hippiedude92]

i was looking on how to perfect my dair spike, and i was wondering if you could help me out. that would really be helpful for low damage KO's.

It's kinda hard** perfecting it really. You have to be fast, and accurate about it. But I've noticed that I've landed it when I did FFledgedrops whenever their below you though. The hitbox is so small tho, around in the first few frames, where he twirls his arms.

Look for wigi's new combo vid it should have it there.

 

[CR4SH]

On top of it all, it's luigi's best option off stage IMO. Its one of only 2 aerials luigi has with any horizontal knockback. On top of that, you can spike with it if you get the hitbox right. It's like, I can't think of a good analogy so I'll use a corny one, shooting for the stars and landing on the moon.

 

[kigbariom]

It's kinda perfecting it really. You have to be fast, and accurate about it. But I've noticed that I've landed it when I did FFledgedrops whenever their below you though. The hitbox is so small tho, around in the first few frames, where he twirls his arms.

Look for wigi's new combo vid it should have it there.

Thanks, I've tried it out and I know that it will take a long time to get down but thanks for the tips.

 

[Ganks7er]

Hey, I'm starting of switching mains from Lucas to Luigi and thought I'd drop in here to ask for some tips. Basically if anyone can list the basics that'd be good, and also, Tips for versing:
-Snake
-Meta Knight
-Ike
-Link
-Marth

Thanks a heap in advance.
Ganks7er
P.S. Noob Question: How do you do the UThrow from the Grab and whatnot, I can only seem to attack from a Grab and let go after like 5 attacks.

 

[CR4SH]

Hey, I'm starting of switching mains from Lucas to Luigi and thought I'd drop in here to ask for some tips. Basically if anyone can list the basics that'd be good, and also, Tips for versing:
-Snake
-Meta Knight
-Ike
-Link
-Marth

Thanks a heap in advance.
Ganks7er
P.S. Noob Question: How do you do the UThrow from the Grab and whatnot, I can only seem to attack from a Grab and let go after like 5 attacks.

For snake, use his grenades against him. Tornado in, then behind him. The front of snake is death...DEATH! The best option you have against him is the fact that you can gimp the hell out of his cypher. Get him off stage and knock him around some.

Meta? Do believe in miracles? Better off, do you have a secondary?

Ike, spam fireballs to make him do something. When he does, dodge and punish. Fairly easy matchup IMO. Shoryuken destroys ike.

Link, do everything you can do to get him off stage. Nair and tornado deal well with the projectiles. Fthrow, dair, bair ftilt, anything horizontal to get him off the stage, then dair bair tornado **** him when he's off the stage.

Marth, play defense. Play a spacing game. Any time he's closing, stop his momentum with a fireball. You want to be one of two places. Inside of fireball range and outside of sword range, or right up in his face. You really have to be patient for this guy.

As for throws. Grab, then tilt your control stick in the direction you want to throw. A pummels.

 

[ALiAsVee]

Hey, I'm starting of switching mains from Lucas to Luigi and thought I'd drop in here to ask for some tips. Basically if anyone can list the basics that'd be good, and also, Tips for versing:
-Snake
-Meta Knight
-Ike
-Link
-Marth

Thanks a heap in advance.
Ganks7er
P.S. Noob Question: How do you do the UThrow from the Grab and whatnot, I can only seem to attack from a Grab and let go after like 5 attacks.

Besides all that was said, be prepared, Luigi is a lot harder to use than Lucas (in terms of being good with him).

 

[hippiedude92]

Hey, I'm starting of switching mains from Lucas to Luigi and thought I'd drop in here to ask for some tips. Basically if anyone can list the basics that'd be good, and also, Tips for versing:
-Snake
-Meta Knight
-Ike
-Link
-Marth

Thanks a heap in advance.
Ganks7er
P.S. Noob Question: How do you do the UThrow from the Grab and whatnot, I can only seem to attack from a Grab and let go after like 5 attacks.

Preferably I'd use Lucas for all but meh.

Snake = It's a solid matchup from here. Luigi has the tools to win it but it matters of defensive/patience. 45:55 imo from here.

MK = just as much hard time as lucas I'm sorry =/

Ike= He does pretty well from here. Luigi's at 60:40 advantage just watching out for jab combos and silly fsmashs and spaced attacks

Link = so easy as hell

MArth= Tricky because he give luigi a hard time because of his hitboxs but dies early. 40:60 disadvantage.

 

[Ganks7er]

Thanks hippiedude and cr4sh.
So you recommend I should stay as Lucas? Or do you have any other suggestions, coz I know that theres another good character out there that I can learn

 

[Rabert]

Luigi was the first character I became "good" with. He has excellent air game, and I work well with his smashes. His dash attack and grab game aren't my favorite, but for just having fun I do tend to use them. I suggest getting comfortable with his neutral air (simply A in the air), down smash, and practice recovering! Everything from there is just preference/practice.

I got a question though, I tend to use Luigi's Usmash to kill.. is this wise? Or am I missing out on a better move?

My style is hopping and Nair into forward airs, falling tornadoes, and fireballing whenever. Then running up and Usmash.. generally, I don't spam this, but it's how I'm most comfortable. Any suggestions?

 

[elheber]

Rabert, you like me, are missing out on the Up-tilted fSmash. To be honest, I get more uSmash (Hyphen Smash) KOs than other Luigi's that I've played get fSmash KOs (with the exception of hippiedude92 who fingerbangs us all). But generally speaking, if you're getting most of your KOs with one specific move, then you're probably missing out on the wealth of other KO options that Luigi has.

The more damage the enemy has, the better your KO options get; starting with the risky Fire Jump Punch and moving down to reliable and quick nAirs. The uSmash is a great tool, but you should have Luigi's entire spectrum in your bag of tricks.

 

[Rabert]

I also kill with his fair (feet out), and down smash. I guess my question was more or less, is uSmash actually a good kill move, or could I be killing faster/more reliably with another move.

I don't just do the same thing over and over, that get's predictable and the moves stale. I'm saying a pattern I've noticed is my kills come from usmash.

 

[elheber]

Yes you can be KOing faster and more reliably with other moves. Start KOing with:
Up Special (Fire Jump Punch)
Forward Smash (tilted upward by holding up after charging)
Up Smash (if you charge it while running it's called a Hyphen Smash)
Neutral Air (you have to hit them just as you press the button to be powerful)
Forward Special (Green Missile; 1/8 chance for a powerful Missfire is pretty good)
Backward Throw
Backward Air (when they're recovering off-stage, turn around and jump backward towards them)

It's time you mix up his KO moves and start chasing them off-stage.

 

[ALiAsVee]

Yes you can be KOing faster and more reliably with other moves. Start KOing with:
Up Special (Fire Jump Punch)
Forward Smash (tilted upward by holding up after charging)
Up Smash (if you charge it while running it's called a Hyphen Smash)
Neutral Air (you have to hit them just as you press the button to be powerful)
Forward Special (Green Missile; 1/8 chance for a powerful Missfire is pretty good)
Backward Throw
Backward Air (when they're recovering off-stage, turn around and jump backward towards them)

It's time you mix up his KO moves and start chasing them off-stage.

I'm not too keen to the idea of KOing with the torpedo, I think its too risky, but some Luigis misfire all the time so i geuss it works for them. (I haven't had a misfire in two weeks, playing for like an hour a day lol).

I can never kill with bair since I use it too much, but i've played your luigi, so bair is an option for you since you don't use it as much as I do.

 

[Rabert]

I always used his Dthrow! Never knew back was powerful, definitely going to use that, thanks!

 

[hippiedude92]

Yes you can be KOing faster and more reliably with other moves. Start KOing with:
Up Special (Fire Jump Punch)
Forward Smash (tilted upward by holding up after charging)
Up Smash (if you charge it while running it's called a Hyphen Smash)
Neutral Air (you have to hit them just as you press the button to be powerful)
Forward Special (Green Missile; 1/8 chance for a powerful Missfire is pretty good)
Backward Throw
Backward Air (when they're recovering off-stage, turn around and jump backward towards them)

It's time you mix up his KO moves and start chasing them off-stage.

What? Green missle as a main ko move? That's uncalled for and unsafe. It's better off just hoping for a misfire when recovering.

Luigi's main KO moves should be Up angled Fsmashs, shoryukens, Nairs/Bairs. Reliably to rack up damage but ko abit later, upsmashs/dsmashs, Bairs/Dairs, Bthrow at fresh kills around 100%s

Dont kill with Fair. Its too weak and short ranged. its better for stringing attacks together.

 

[elheber]

Yep, Missfired Green Missile as a KO move. Uncharged GM are good combo finishers, and the chance of a Missfire is a nice sweetener. Opponents generally have a hard time timing a perfect shield or spot dodge when they do see an uncharged GM coming.

Now I wouldn't recommend it against strong characters like Ike or DK, but against weaker characters like Jiggs or Pit, it's a viable option.