A Breath of fresh air - Link Smash Switch speculation thread

[Idon]

The FE characters can do it. I would think ganondorf could,

Well the FE guys need some sorta Teleport staff user in the sidelines and doesn't Ganondorf usually travel everywhere by his horse outside of his weird ass Phantom Ganondorf times?

 

[Substitution]

So I was curious about something that I'm not sure was brought up here, but may be useful.

So now that Link's Bombs being remote controlled rather than on a timer, I'm wondering if they could be feasible for edgeguarding, and possibly a way to set up off-ledge combos? And more importantly, would there be a way to set up bombs while keeping momentum?

I say this because now that bombs are remote, now they have the luxury of being able to blow up whenever, rather than hoping the time collides with them hitting the ledge. Again this is all hypothetical I could be talking out of my ass, but if it ends up working it could be worth keeping in mind.

 

[zeldasmash]

I think Link's bombs will force the opponent to air dodge, leaving them open for an attack or to screw up a recovery due to the lag of the dodge. If they don't dodge, they will eat the explosion. They can still catch the bomb, but the air dodge will still leave them vulnerable to an attack. This bomb will also make using Up B's incredibly risky as they can risk blowing it up while recovering and likely get them killed (depending on where the bomb launches them).

Also, is Link's dair spike still in the game? I haven't seen it in the games where Link is present in.

 

[Iridium]

I think Link's bombs will force the opponent to air dodge, leaving them open for an attack or to screw up a recovery due to the lag of the dodge. If they don't dodge, they will eat the explosion. They can still catch the bomb, but the air dodge will still leave them vulnerable to an attack. This bomb will also make using Up B's incredibly risky as they can risk blowing it up while recovering and likely get them killed (depending on where the bomb launches them).

Also, is Link's dair spike still in the game? I haven't seen it in the games where Link is present in.

Yes, his spike still exists! Many Links have stated it is still possible, but I unfortunately have not seen it happen yet.

 

[zeldasmash]

In theory, Link is looking like one of the deadliest edge-guarders in Ultimate. The bombs alone give him coverage not a lot of characters have and it basically forces the opponent to make a choice: Air dodge the bomb and risk eating a dair or die from lag or get hit by the explosion and die from it. Then there's the double arrows which are a dangerous edge-guarding tool due to increase in knockback and damage. Also, Link doesn't have to completely worry going deep into edge-guarding because of bomb recovery. Link is looking pretty good on the edge-guarding department.

 

[emefcue]

Yes, his spike still exists! Many Links have stated it is still possible, but I unfortunately have not seen it happen yet.

yes can comfirm the down air spikes still. i was able to get it against mario on battlefield.

i just realized something. if you knock someone off stage, the best thing would be to charge a arrow to force an airdodge or jump, or low recovery. if they airdodge it could be death real quick. if they jump we can counter with an aerial like nair or fair. same if they recover low. even before an arrow charge, we can pull a bomb, charge arrow, force low recovery or jump or airdodge, then throw bomb off and detonate to gimp. we can even z drop bomb at ledge and after charged arrow is shot and that effectively covers all options if they make it to the ledge.

 

[Flon]

Something I noticed which I suppose is quite disappointing is that Link doesn't appear to be capable of punishing an opponent for throwing Remote Bomb via the detonation, even if he's frame perfect. By frame 12 the item will be completely out of range, at least for a smash throw.

And since the detonation animation lasts for almost another 30 frames after that, it basically allows an opponent to close in just a little further. It just doesn't seem worth it.

Still, I'm sure it'll certainly have a lot of additional uses. I do wish the detonation animation was a bit shorter, though.

 

[Idon]

Something I noticed which I suppose is quite disappointing is that Link doesn't appear to be capable of punishing an opponent for throwing Remote Bomb via the detonation, even if he's frame perfect. By frame 12 the item will be completely out of range, at least for a smash throw.

And since the detonation animation lasts for almost another 30 frames after that, it basically allows an opponent to close in just a little further. It just doesn't seem worth it.

Still, I'm sure it'll certainly have a lot of additional uses. I do wish the detonation animation was a bit shorter, though.

Well that's entirely disappointing.
So the bomb's useless outside of setup shenanigans... great...

But hey, at least the Master Sword's longer or something. Maybe this Link is meant to be more swordy sword and less throwy throw.

 

[Deleted member]

Loving the champion's tunic, and remote bombs added to Link he looks great, and will be, a great character.

 

[Batu]

Hey this is just a demo maybe we get more buffs in the incoming game.

 

[Fortress]

The boards can't handle Link's speed, so here's a plain text link instead of a preview.

https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-12-2018/bi6r8d.gif

 

[Iridium]

The boards can't handle Link's speed, so here's a plain text link instead of a preview.

https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-12-2018/bi6r8d.gif

B-air seems to have very little landing lag. Not bad, I say. This is good coupled with his better jumpsquat. Can't say much for run speed, but he definitely is not slower than either or especially . I would imagine air speed is better, but I cannot say much for it either.

 

[Nu~]

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Holy ****

 

[Nintykid]

I'd like to point out that Link beat two Marths, Snake and a Bayo ^^^

 

[Tri Knight]

It's way too early to tell how good he actually is but overall from my perspective he looks like he may be much better than Smash4 Link.

 

[Ryu_Ken]

Otakuni's Link is one of the best ones we've seen so far. At least as of the demo. Wish the footage was in 60fps, though...
Also, it's kinda insane that his remote bomb can reliably be used as an edgeguard tool and a kill move offstage. Before, we only had the bow, which could easily be air dodged without penalty.

 

[jwillenn]

Otakuni (Link) highlight from Japan Expo

 

[emefcue]

anyone else not impressed by this? ive been seeing it everyone and it seems very basic. thought process: "jabs, oh hes near bomb *detonates*, now hes flying towards me *back airs*. the best thing is him anticipating his double jump and goes for forward air.. nothing special here. also he did an up b after jab 2 after the edgeuard attempt with the bomb. looks like a smash 4 habit. also throwing bomb underneath and proceeding to neutral air fast fall. also a smash 4 habit that doesn't really work now since his bomb doesn't explode on impact with ground. i also was doing this out of habit from smash 4. if only i had record my last game against marth -__- i had the people in demo line popping off

 

[Fortress]

anyone else not impressed by this? ive been seeing it everyone and it seems very basic. thought process: "jabs, oh hes near bomb *detonates*, now hes flying towards me *back airs*. the best thing is him anticipating his double jump and goes for forward air.. nothing special here. also he did an up b after jab 2 after the edgeuard attempt with the bomb. looks like a smash 4 habit. also throwing bomb underneath and proceeding to neutral air fast fall. also a smash 4 habit that doesn't really work now since his bomb doesn't explode on impact with ground. i also was doing this out of habit from smash 4. if only i had record my last game against marth -__- i had the people in demo line popping off

Considering it's day -1, and nobody's had a considerable amount of time with the demo, I'd say that it's not a big surprise that people aren't doing anything revolutionary. Game's not even out yet.

 

[DJ3DS]

Honestly I was pleasantly surprised by watching the gameplay.

I'm not going to be a Link main (Sorry, ROB all the way) but I've always enjoyed using Link as a secondary. I'm going to use either him or Young Link and was leaning towards YL for the tether but the remote bombs here look really, really fun.

 

[Deleted member]

Dang Link doing some damage, a good sign, for him can't wait too see him in action more.

 

[smashingDoug]

I will miss the gale boomerang I liked it

 

[FooltheFlames]

Otakuni's Link is one of the best ones we've seen so far. At least as of the demo. Wish the footage was in 60fps, though...
Also, it's kinda insane that his remote bomb can reliably be used as an edgeguard tool and a kill move offstage. Before, we only had the bow, which could easily be air dodged without penalty.

I've been saying this for some time about Otakuni myself. His matches got me really hyped for Link in this game!

 

[Deleted member]

The gale boomerang was cool. But I don't mind the regular one returned too.

 

[Batu]

The gale boomerang was cool. But I don't mind the regular one returned too.

I was cool with the gale... But the regular one is definitely a buff! So much combos can be get from it and many more things.

 

[Blade of Evil's Bane]

Here's a pretty good analysis of Link changes in Ultimate :

The side by side comparisons between 4 and Ultimate are particularly helpful imo.

 

[JohnKnight416]

The gale boomerang was cool. But I don't mind the regular one returned too.

I much rather prefer having the regular boomerang over the gale boomerang since the windbox on the Gale Boomerang did more harm than good for Link in Smash 4. Sure you can pull off some amazing gimps with the windbox of the Gale Boomerang as well as a few creative setups. But lets be honest, that rarely happens when you're playing competitive smash and that most of the time the Gale Boomerang's windbox ends up putting Link in really bad situations, especially when the opponent tries to use it against him.

 

[JohnKnight416]

I hope that they fix the issues with Link's grounded spin attack from ssb4 such as losing it's hitbox whenever the opponent shields it which results in the Spin Attack passing right through the opponent without inflicting any damage to them, and as well as the issue where Link gets pushed off the ledge whenever he performs the grounded Spin Attack at the ledge and his opponent shields it, which results in Link performing a midair Spin Attack that doesn't cover any height and eventually leads him to free falling to his death.

 

[smashingDoug]

He should be able to walk cling or climb

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

Is it just me? Or is Link losing like all his matches among top players?

I know the game is not finalized. I know the meta has not been developed. I know that many of the top players are not Link mains. There are many factors that can contribute to what I'm seeing, but it still concerns me greatly. Are his options really that terrible now? He really sucks at zoning.

 

[LaughingLefou]

Is it just me? Or is Link losing like all his matches among top players?

I know the game is not finalized. I know the meta has not been developed. I know that many of the top players are not Link mains. There are many factors that can contribute to what I'm seeing, but it still concerns me greatly. Are his options really that terrible now? He really sucks at zoning.

I knew it!!

Sakurai hated Link all along!! (Why else has he always been low-mid to low tier?)

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

I honestly believe that Sakurai/Nintendo has always felt that Link has enough popularity/star-power to the point that making him overly good would just make the world sick of him.

 

[Deleted member]

Really? shoot oh well.

Would not worry though there are great Link players sure we'll see him win more matches.

 

[meleebrawler]

I honestly believe that Sakurai/Nintendo has always felt that Link has enough popularity/star-power to the point that making him overly good would just make the world sick of him.

Tell that to Mario.

In all seriousness we have three Links and I have a hard time seeing none of them be good. There's the floaty zoner that has been historically solid, the "classic" with added mobility and better combos because of it, and the heavy hitter that can control the stage to better land said hits.

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

Tell that to Mario.

In all seriousness we have three Links and I have a hard time seeing none of them be good. There's the floaty zoner that has been historically solid, the "classic" with added mobility and better combos because of it, and the heavy hitter that can control the stage to better land said hits.

But Link rarely shows up on the competitive radar. Smash 4 has T from Japan, and that's about it. He just suuuuuux all the time! WHY SAKURAI? T_T

 

[meleebrawler]

But Link rarely shows up on the competitive radar. Smash 4 has T from Japan, and that's about it. He just suuuuuux all the time! WHY SAKURAI? T_T

...I'm surprised you're a mod with this attitude, if this isn't well-rehearsed acting.

I don't care how good a character is competitively, just make them not physically painful to play like Melee's bottom tiers. Besides, for every character that rises others fall. And if everything was theoretically perfectly balanced, your character would only get marginally increased representation if anything with how many characters there are now.

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

...I'm surprised you're a mod with this attitude, if this isn't well-rehearsed acting.

I don't care how good a character is competitively, just make them not physically painful to play like Melee's bottom tiers. Besides, for every character that rises others fall. And if everything was theoretically perfectly balanced, your character would only get marginally increased representation if anything with how many characters there are now.

Wat? What attitude? The Links objectively suck in the competitive circle. I'm always hoping it will change with each new title, but it doesn't pan out. I'm only speculating that the developers purposely gimp his design. Regardless, I play him competitively. I'm a committed fanboy. He still sux.

 

[meleebrawler]

Wat? What attitude? The Links objectively suck in the competitive circle. I'm always hoping it will change with each new title, but it doesn't pan out. I'm only speculating that the developers purposely gimp his design. Regardless, I play him competitively. I'm a committed fanboy. He still sux.

Well, accusing the devs of having an agenda against your character is a symptom of entitlement. Also having your cake and eating it too is a privilege.

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

It's honestly possible the devs don't even know what his competitive viability is. Link is a non-competitor in Melee, yet the devs felt the need to nerf his grounded up-B in the PAL release. They often balance for mid and low level play just as they did with Little Mac early on in Smash 4's existence.

 

[Tri Knight]

I'm with BuzzSaw. From what I've seen, Link's ground game is almost identical to Smash4, which was slightly on the poor side. He's got good range on his sword swipes like hes always had, but his attack speed may still suffer badly against shields. His run speed seems to have increased and the new jump speed will surely help him vs rushdown characters but it may not be enough.

What IS interesting is his ledge defense. Those bombs are absolutely god tier against a high percent enemy who is offstage. I'm wondering if you can set a bomb near the ledge and explode it as someone recovers to the ledge since the blast range is quite large.

On another note, Young Link seems to play the most similarly to Pre-Ultimate Link as he seems to be exactly like he was in Melee. Idk if hes a heavy weight like Link though.