Social 7th Heaven - Cloud Social Thread

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

May I ask what AC is supposed to mean? Lo-Jump may hinder a fighter's ground jumps, but it's a small price for that extra attack power. The penalties are much worse with the Air Pushover and Imperfect Shield bonus effects; the former weakens your aerial attacks, while the latter prevents you from doing perfect shielding.

Auto Cancel I guess.

 

[GHNeko]

May I ask what AC is supposed to mean? Lo-Jump may hinder a fighter's ground jumps, but it's a small price for that extra attack power. The penalties are much worse with the Air Pushover and Imperfect Shield bonus effects; the former weakens your aerial attacks, while the latter prevents you from doing perfect shielding.

AC = Autocancel.

There are frame windows on the end of aerials (and sometimes the beginning) where if you land during said frame windows, you'll have (basically) no landing lag.

So for example, with Uair on Cloud; if you land any time after frame 26 of Uair, you wont suffer the typical 15 frames of landing lag.

This is important because ACs let cloud do combos/strings/juggles that otherwise wouldnt be possible or as potent.

 

[Tino]

hello my boys.

i like cloud. i like people who play cloud. this is good.

Sup, mane.

I like people who likes people playing Cloud.

ClouDeDeDe



Buddy cop show, pls.

Cloudalina ftw

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

AC = Autocancel.

There are frame windows on the end of aerials (and sometimes the beginning) where if you land during said frame windows, you'll have (basically) no landing lag.

So for example, with Uair on Cloud; if you land any time after frame 26 of Uair, you wont suffer the typical 15 frames of landing lag.

This is important because ACs let cloud do combos/strings/juggles that otherwise wouldnt be possible or as potent.

Increased damage dealt or combo potential. I guess it depends on what you're going for when customizing a fighter.

ClouDeDeDe



Buddy cop show, pls.

Amusingly, some of my offline matches consisted of two Clouds and two Dededes.

Cloudalina ftw

What do these four characters all have in common?

 

[Deleted member]

Increased damage dealt or combo potential. I guess it depends on what you're going for when customizing a fighter.



Amusingly, some of my offline matches consisted of two Clouds and two Dededes.

What do these four characters all have in common?

They're all cute and blonde.

 

[jordanm43444]

They are all blonde ****

 

[Bobert]

Increased damage dealt or combo potential. I guess it depends on what you're going for when customizing a fighter.



Amusingly, some of my offline matches consisted of two Clouds and two Dededes.

What do these four characters all have in common?

They're all blonde girls?

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

They're all blonde girls?

You're right about them sharing the same hair color. I'm assuming that you were being sarcastic with that girl statement.

 

[Bobert]

You're right about them sharing the same hair color. I'm assuming that you were being sarcastic with that girl statement.

What do you mean?

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

What do you mean?

I had to ask...

 

[CrimsonRick117]

What do you mean?

This ****ing killed me just now lmao.

 

[-m0]

Ok real talk. Bayonetta is going to be a nightmare for us

I don't see it lol. Her neutral is bad, she can't kill us (although I've yet to see one of these 0-death combos people are talking about, so maybe I don't know her true power) so we can take advantage of rage and kill her with dsmash really well. She also basically dies to a nair and dies even harder if we steal her jump with it. We're also fast enough to punish dtilt Bullet Arts and I feel like we can wall her out with bair and nair well. On the other hand, we're tall enough to get hit with Bullet Climax while standing (but not dashing) and we're more vulnerable to her combos while we're in Limit.

 

[CrimsonRick117]

Ok real talk. Bayonetta is going to be a nightmare for us

Not really. From the Bayonetta's I've faced online ( and there were some decent ones ) I didn't have much trouble dealing with her as Cloud. Most of her moves are unsafe on block and her strong point is in her combo's which a majority of them with proper DI can be avoided. Bayonetta's for the most part try to catch you messing up so they can punish you with her combo's or try to time witch time and take advantage of that ( Sadly been a victim of witch time down smash spike ). But Cloud In my opinion has more of the advantage against Bayo, I'm still learning the character because she is interesting and her combos require some precision and again some of them can be DI out of so it's a learning process.

 

[Julesimanerd]

Hey, I know ive been gone for a while, but like do you guys ever get bullied or mocked by people in your scene for playing a character? Ive had it pretty rough with cloud since he came out because of people in my area.

I'm a Cloud and Sonic main, so all the time haha

 

[SonicvMario]

What do these four characters all have in common?

They all have something red on them , they have blue eyes , they're blonde and they're girls

 

[Tino]

What do these four characters all have in common?

They're all blonde and have blue eyes.

What do you mean?

i'm disappointed they didn't add that one as his third alt.

 

[GHNeko]

I'm not. Crossdressing Cloud gets waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too much attention lol.

That part of the game was like maybe 10 mins long and was done for a very specific reason that has no impact on the character/story overall.

 

[tibs7]

Hey guys do any of you know frame adv. on shield for clouds aerials?

 

[Chalice]

Hey guys do any of you know frame adv. on shield for clouds aerials?

I'm no frame expert but I know for a fact that they are all positive on shield (Except Dair) no matter what as long as you space them.

 

[tibs7]

its ok thanks i found adv on shield
with shield drop
bair is +2
fair is 0
uair +1
dair -13

OoS just - 7 more frames

 

[GHNeko]

its ok thanks i found adv on shield
with shield drop
bair is +2
fair is 0
uair +1
dair -13

OoS just - 7 more frames

where'd you get this info?

 

[Smooth Criminal]

http://smashboards.com/threads/clouds-frame-data-1-1-3.426026/

This, too

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1h5peQlvrlAc2g3kLTllpSkggN6MfpLfZIiBdGv6xOFk/htmlview?pli=1#

Smooth Criminal

 

[GHNeko]

Ahh. Sweet. I can add this data to my bible.

 

[CrimsonRick117]

**** with all this new info you guys are stockpiling me with so much **** to practice and try out when I get around to playing later. Welp time to listen to some heavy metal and bang my head against a wall.... I mean play video games....same thing right? Right?

 

[GHNeko]

I'd rather bang uair's against the wall imo.

 

[CrimsonRick117]

I'd rather bang uair's against the wall imo.

Too main stream, but bair's is something new... excuse me while I go swing my broom at the wall in a similar manner to that of clouds bair animation....

 

[Iron Maw]

Blade Beam beats out Corrin's Side B. As soon as they use it just throw it out there lol They kick they get hit. Only option is to jump out but majority of the time they will get hit.

Limit side B and Dash Attack (if your close enough) can punish the kick too. Maybe even Fsmash. Corrrin's neutral B is also beaten by our neutral B. Not only does DFS clank with the normal version the Limit version can go right through DFS and wreck her. DFS seems to clank with also every other projectile in the game, so she isn't going to be winning any wars here. In fact suspect that zoners like Samus and Megaman etc will have good match ups against Corrin since they can camp her easily thanks to that, her bad mobility and mostly laggy attacks. Don't get me wrong DFS is a decent is a move, but it's been a tad overrated as of late. It's ultimately limited setups which aren't consistent since Corrin's aforementioned speed holds her back from taking full advantage of stun at all times unlike say ZSS. So in end like 90% our matches Corrin will be forced to approach us which is really difficult for her to do.

That said... Corrin's range still has to be respected a bit especially in the air where everything except Nair beats our aerials. So don't challenge too much there and get too greedy with out Uair strings since she get out of them with Dair. If anything it's better to let her use it since we can punish her landing. Basically keep her grounded where she isn't too good and don't fall for her weak DFS>DFB (Dragon Fang Bite) shenanigans by dropping shield early. Counter Surge is probably only thing have worry about in CQC and you can just mixup some grabs like m0- said or even just fire another Limit BB. Overall be mindful of her range and play patient and she shouldn't too much of an issue.

 

[GHNeko]

Fair gives Corrin so much trouble lol.

For those that dont know, Corrin extends his hurtbox on side b. So when he's latched into the ground, the black area of the dragon spear limb thing towards the middle is hittable. Dtilt goes under it though.

But yeah Fair is super good in this MU.

 

[GHNeko]

its electric! boogie woogie woogie!


edit:

electric boogaloo 2: scuttlebug returns

 

[-m0]

Limit side B and Dash Attack (if your close enough) can punish the kick too. Maybe even Fsmash. Corrrin's neutral B is also beaten by our neutral B. Not only does DFS clank with the normal version the Limit version can go right through DFS and wreck her. DFS seems to clank with also every other projectile in the game, so she isn't going to be winning any wars here. In fact suspect that zoners like Samus and Megaman etc will have good match ups against Corrin since they can camp her easily thanks to that, her bad mobility and mostly laggy attacks. Don't get me wrong DFS is a decent is a move, but it's been a tad overrated as of late. It's ultimately limited setups which aren't consistent since Corrin's aforementioned speed holds her back from taking full advantage of stun at all times unlike say ZSS. So in end like 90% our matches Corrin will be forced to approach us which is really difficult for her to do.

That said... Corrin's range still has to be respected a bit especially in the air where everything except Nair beats our aerials. So don't challenge too much there and get too greedy with out Uair strings since she get out of them with Dair. If anything it's better to let her use it since we can punish her landing. Basically keep her grounded where she isn't too good and don't fall for her weak DFS>DFB (Dragon Fang Bite) shenanigans by dropping shield early. Counter Surge is probably only thing have worry about in CQC and you can just mixup some grabs like m0- said or even just fire another Limit BB. Overall be mindful of her range and play patient and she shouldn't too much of an issue.

I'm honestly surprised nobody's having a problem with bair. It seems like a great move, low landing lag, auto-spaces itself, kills, it does it all lol. I haven't had any horrible trouble with it, but... Also, something we should consider is Corn's extreme kill power. Nearly everything kills, and when we're juggling it'll be really stressful because we can straight up die to a countered uair while juggling. If we constantly stay in Limit, the threat of Finishing Touch should keep the counters down a little. Nair and fsmash also have range that challenge ours, but they're hard to space with because their hitboxes are so thin. So we can apparently go wild with... fair? GHNeko why does fair specifically give Corrin trouble? I kinda stopped using fair for spacing because i just thought nair was so much better... how do you use it?

Mario & Sonic Guy If you can't FH AC dair with that set, it's not worth. FH AC dair is love, FH AC dair is life

 

[Iron Maw]

Fair gives Corrin so much trouble lol.

For those that dont know, Corrin extends his hurtbox on side b. So when he's latched into the ground, the black area of the dragon spear limb thing towards the middle is hittable. Dtilt goes under it though.

But yeah Fair is super good in this MU.

I see... thanks for the tip.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Mario & Sonic Guy If you can't FH AC dair with that set, it's not worth. FH AC dair is love, FH AC dair is life

Last I've checked, NTSC-U Wii U games play 60 frames per second, so 15 frames of ending lag would equal a quarter of a second. Not too detrimental, but since Lo-Jump does weaken your ground jumps, you would have to use up your mid-air jump if you're looking to use higher altitude aerials.

Still, Lo-Jump does make it easier to utilize aerials at lower altitudes, but you do have to keep track of their startup lag so that you don't end up whiffing the hitbox frames.

 

[-m0]

Last I've checked, NTSC-U Wii U games play 60 frames per second, so 15 frames of ending lag would equal a quarter of a second. Not too detrimental, but since Lo-Jump does weaken your ground jumps, you would have to use up your mid-air jump if you're looking to use higher altitude aerials.

Still, Lo-Jump does make it easier to utilize aerials at lower altitudes, but you do have to keep track of their startup lag so that you don't end up whiffing the hitbox frames.

I'm not sure what you mean with the 15 frames... dair's landlag is 26. Even so, sour AC dair is one of Cloud's best combo starters, and it's pretty safe as well. It true combos into fair meteor, Cross Slash, and even into a well timed Finishing Touch for a kill. I'd NEVER give up FH AC dair lol.

 

[Krysco]

Greeting to all who use water vapor! Not funny Gonna see about hanging out here since Cloud is one of the characters I might main or secondary when I start going to tournaments next year with Wolf not coming back. Never played FFVII and never beat IV or VI. Apparently there's a remake coming out for VII? Might get it though I have a hard time sticking to long RPGs.

On the Smash side of things, I tend to charge Limit asap for the better speed, lower jumps and recovery. And for those curious, here's the list of characters I'm debating on maining/secondarying: /

TL;DR I'm gonna start hanging here since I might main/second Cloud when I start going to tournaments next year so greetings!

 

[-m0]

Greeting to all who use water vapor! Not funny Gonna see about hanging out here since Cloud is one of the characters I might main or secondary when I start going to tournaments next year with Wolf not coming back. Never played FFVII and never beat IV or VI. Apparently there's a remake coming out for VII? Might get it though I have a hard time sticking to long RPGs.

On the Smash side of things, I tend to charge Limit asap for the better speed, lower jumps and recovery. And for those curious, here's the list of characters I'm debating on maining/secondarying: /

TL;DR I'm gonna start hanging here since I might main/second Cloud when I start going to tournaments next year so greetings!

If you're always in Limit, your neutral game suffers because you lose CS as platform pressure, upb OOS and upb in general, and you lose neutral b as well. I tend to save Limit for when I feel i'll need it, whether recovery, damage, or killpower. It's the worst feeling to uselessly burn Limit for recovery when you could have easily made it normally.

 

[Krysco]

If you're always in Limit, your neutral game suffers because you lose CS as platform pressure, upb OOS and upb in general, and you lose neutral b as well. I tend to save Limit for when I feel i'll need it, whether recovery, damage, or killpower. It's the worst feeling to uselessly burn Limit for recovery when you could have easily made it normally.

True. I know there's times and places for Limit. Probably some mus where it's better to try and have it as much as possible and other times it's better to just get it as it comes. Got much to learn when it comes to Cloud but he's fun and isn't difficult to play.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I'm not sure what you mean with the 15 frames... dair's landlag is 26. Even so, sour AC dair is one of Cloud's best combo starters, and it's pretty safe as well. It true combos into fair meteor, Cross Slash, and even into a well timed Finishing Touch for a kill. I'd NEVER give up FH AC dair lol.

Whatever works for you. I'm not too concerned about Lo-Jump's weakened ground jumps bonus effect, but I guess it can work both ways if you're trying to save your mid-air jump.

 

[-m0]

Whatever works for you. I'm not too concerned about Lo-Jump's weakened ground jumps bonus effect, but I guess it can work both ways if you're trying to save your mid-air jump.

I'm sorry, I don't understand what you're saying :/ What I'm saying is that the weakened ground jumps will remove the critical autocancel windows on a lot of Cloud's aerials. You most likely won't be able to full jump fair (and have it autocancel), imo the only way to use fair in neutral. You probably won't be able to get two nairs out in a full hop either, removing a lot of mixup potential. You probably won't be able to full hop autocancel the great neutral tool and combo starter that is sourspot dair. You may not even be able to autocancel nair in a short hop either, removing another option (a niche one but still another lost option) This is what I'm trying to say, that it doesn't seem worth at all. My set for every char was autoheal, double jump boost, and something random, and then I took 76% from an uncharged Falco fsmash and I sold all my equipment lol.

 

[GHNeko]

GHNeko why does fair specifically give Corrin trouble? I kinda stopped using fair for spacing because i just thought nair was so much better... how do you use it?

Corrin's poor run speed make it hard for him to punish spaced aerials. His long range attacks also have start up and are all that great for punishing.

SO like he cant do much against well spaced fairs and retreating fairs. On top of that it does a lot of damage and has the right coverage to deal with corrin's options.

Corrin attacks all just kinda "go straight forward" aside from Up B.

On top of that his side b, when stuck into the ground has an extended hurtbox so you can actually HIT his limb that's in the ground.

the part that I've circled in black is the part of side b that is actually hittable.

because of fair's disjoint it deals with latching aspect of side b and the kicking part of side b while covering the front of cloud a bit better than nair while also doing more damage.

So yeah; I like fair vs corrin a lot.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I'm sorry, I don't understand what you're saying :/ What I'm saying is that the weakened ground jumps will remove the critical autocancel windows on a lot of Cloud's aerials. You most likely won't be able to full jump fair (and have it autocancel), imo the only way to use fair in neutral. You probably won't be able to get two nairs out in a full hop either, removing a lot of mixup potential. You probably won't be able to full hop autocancel the great neutral tool and combo starter that is sourspot dair. You may not even be able to autocancel nair in a short hop either, removing another option (a niche one but still another lost option) This is what I'm trying to say, that it doesn't seem worth at all. My set for every char was autoheal, double jump boost, and something random, and then I took 76% from an uncharged Falco fsmash and I sold all my equipment lol.

I'm pretty much a casual player, so this kind of information is only really valid in the competitive scene. Overall, my main focus was more on packing a big punch, instead of combo potential.