Official 4BR Tier List V4 - Competitive Insight & Analysis

[Ordeaux26]

now we have MKLeo vs Dabuz witch will definitely be interesting

 

[Iridium]

MkLeo 3-1 Dabuz , making for Dabuz's FIFTH loss to a Cloud in the span of about three weeks. He needs to do something about this matchup.

 

[Ordeaux26]

MkLeo 3-1 Dabuz , making for Dabuz's FIFTH loss to a Cloud in the span of about three weeks. He needs to do something about this matchup.

I have an idea for what do pick up a new character like Pikachu

 

[The_Bookworm]

I have an idea for what do pick up a new character like Pikachu

I think Diddy would work better. lol

 

[Ordeaux26]

I think Diddy would work better. lol

why Pikachu is cloud's worst matchup

 

[Iridium]

Light 3-1 Elegant , not getting reverse 3-0'd this time. Game 3 was crazy from Elegant though.

 

[extrasensory]

remember when ppl used to make separate threads for tournament discussion so all the newbies who joined in the last 6 months who have no insight whatsoever could spam results posts there instead of here? good times

 

[MERPIS]

why Pikachu is cloud's worst matchup

That would actually be sheik. Cloud outranges pikachu to literal hell and back and Sheik has the range to keep cloud in check, also needles to keep limit camping away.

 

[The_Bookworm]

why Pikachu is cloud's worst matchup

No. It is either even or slightly in Cloud's favor (leaning towards to latter), but there are better options against Cloud.

 

[Ordeaux26]

remember when ppl used to make separate threads for tournament discussion so all the newbies who joined in the last 6 months who have no insight whatsoever could spam results posts there instead of here? good times

the tournament discussions where suppose to be for the supermajors and why does it matter this is meant to be the thread for discussion for smash 4

That would actually be sheik. Cloud outranges pikachu to literal hell and back and Sheik has the range to keep cloud in check, also needles to keep limit camping away.

fair point but Pikachu does have things as well like the ability to gimp cloud with no effort and his small size

No. It is either even or slightly in Cloud's favor (leaning towards to latter), but there are better options against Cloud.

perhaps but who knows

 

[MERPIS]

fair point but Pikachu does have things as well like the ability to gimp cloud with no effort and his small size

Yes...But so does Kirby and Puff
Also a better option against cloud imo is meta knight

 

[Ordeaux26]

Yes...But so does Kirby and Puff
Also a better option against cloud imo is meta knight

fair point

And also Void beat Salem 3-0 crazy set

 

[JustCallMeJon]

VoiD 3-2 Salem! VoiD is in GF!

 

[Iridium]

VoiD 3-2 Salem to make grand finals and avoid a reverse 3-0! Seeing him win would make my day. A Sheik might finally win a major!

 

[MERPIS]

VoiD is in GF!

That's rare

 

[Iridium]

MkLeo 3-0 Light in a somewhat dominant 3-0 to get his runback against Salem.

 

[Prince Koopa Jr]

If void wins this will be an amazing feat for sheik mains.

 

[JustCallMeJon]

That's rare

You tell me, the closest for VoiD to win a major was DreamHack Atlanta (S Tier) where he was placed 2nd after losing to Salem. This might be a GF rematch..

 

[Iridium]

You tell me, the closest for VoiD to win a major was DreamHack Atlanta (S Tier) where he was placed 2nd after losing to Salem. This might be a GF rematch..

Looks like you are right, as Salem beat Leo again, this time 3-1.

 

[WiFi]

I've been super inactive, so, what's up everybody? Also, the reason to pick up Diddy over Pika against Cloud is because Diddy is easier to play as and to counter-pick against. Diddy-Cloud is super-even.

Edit: I'm liking this new update to Smashboards. It looks so clean now.

 

[JustCallMeJon]

VOID 3-1 SALEM AT SMASH N SPLASH 3!! THIS IS HIS FIRST MAJOR TOURNAMENT WIN IN A WHILE AND SHEIK'S FIRST MAJOR SINCE ZERO'S. FANTASTIC MOMENT FOR SHEIK META!!

 

[The_Bookworm]

Smash'N'Splash 4 (527 Entrants) (A tier)

1st: VoiD
2nd: Salem
3rd: MKLeo
4th: Light
5th: Elegant
5th: Dabuz
7th: Rags
7th: Shoyo James
9th: Cosmos
9th: Tyroy
9th: komorikiri
9th: Mr. R
13th: Ally
13th: Ned
13th: Captain L
13th: Panda Bair
17th: Blacktwins
17th: SDX
17th: Ralphie
17th: MIstake
17th: DarkShad
17th: Raito
17th: Miloni
17th: Zaki
25th: Captain Zack
25th: The Great Gonzales
25th: NameLess
25th: 8BitMan
25th: Mekos
25th: PowPow
25th: Wisdom
25th: Ozone

Notable Players out Earlier:
33rd: Gackt
33rd: John Numbers
33rd: Zoan
33rd: yeti
33rd: JJRockets
49th: Chag
49th: Maister
49th: Biddy
49th: Komota
65th: Skillager
65th: ATATA
65th: BestNess (DQ'ed to Losers)
97th: pu55yk1ng
129th: cagt
449th: Ryo (DQ'ed)
513th: Nairo (DQ'ed)
513th: Tweek (DQ'ed)
513th: justy (DQ'ed)
513th: Scot! (DQ'ed)
513th: Wonderbread (DQ'ed)


Smash'N'Splash 4 Doubles:

1st: Ally Mistake
2nd: Cosmos VoiD
3rd: komorikiri MKLeo
4th: Darkshad Light
5th: Captain Zack Salem
5th: tyroy Mr. R
7th: FroZn BestNess
7th: Miloni BooBear
9th: Captain L Elegant
9th: Mekos 8BitMan
9th: Komota Crispy
9th: Fons Marshall


Everyone sunk into the void of the bottom of the sea. That is how VoiD wins the tournament and is Sheik's first victory at a major ever since the 1.1.5.




DreamHack Austin 2018 (316 Entrants) (C tier)

1st: Larry Lurr
2nd: ESAM
3rd: ANTi
4th: MVD
5th: Samsora
5th: Konga
7th: Lima
7th: Light the Lantern
9th: falln
9th: SaSSy
9th: DJ Flipflop (Notably defeated Lima)
9th: Crump


This site layout looks clean!

 

[Iridium]

Smash'N'Splash 4 (527 Entrants) (A tier)

1st: VoiD
2nd: Salem
3rd: MKLeo
4th: Light
5th: Elegant
5th: Dabuz
7th: Rags
7th: Shoyo James
9th: Cosmos
9th: Tyroy
9th: komorikiri
9th: Mr. R
13th: Ally
13th: Ned
13th: Captain L
13th: Panda Bair
17th: Blacktwins
17th: SDX
17th: Ralphie
17th: MIstake
17th: DarkShad
17th: Raito
17th: Miloni
17th: Zaki
25th: Captain Zack
25th: The Great Gonzales
25th: NameLess
25th: 8BitMan
25th: Mekos
25th: PowPow
25th: Wisdom
25th: Ozone

Notable Players out Earlier:
33rd: Gackt
33rd: John Numbers
33rd: Zoan
33rd: yeti
33rd: JJRockets
49th: Chag
49th: Maister
49th: Biddy
49th: Komota
65th: Skillager
65th: ATATA
65th: BestNess (DQ'ed to Losers)
97th: pu55yk1ng
129th: cagt
449th: Ryo (DQ'ed)
513th: Nairo (DQ'ed)
513th: Tweek (DQ'ed)
513th: justy (DQ'ed)
513th: Scot! (DQ'ed)
513th: Wonderbread (DQ'ed)


Smash'N'Splash 4 Doubles:

1st: Ally Mistake
2nd: Cosmos VoiD
3rd: komorikiri MKLeo
4th: Darkshad Light
5th: Captain Zack Salem
5th: tyroy Mr. R
7th: FroZn BestNess
7th: Miloni BooBear
9th: Captain L Elegant
9th: Mekos 8BitMan
9th: Komota Crispy
9th: Fons Marshall


Everyone sunk into the void of the bottom of the sea. That is how VoiD wins the tournament and is Sheik first victory at a major ever since the 1.1.5.




DreamHack Austin 2018 (316 Entrants) (C tier)

1st: Larry Lurr
2nd: ESAM
3rd: ANTi
4th: MVD
5th: Samsora
5th: Konga
7th: Lima
7th: Light the Lantern
9th: falln
9th: SaSSy
9th: DJ Flipflop (Notably defeated Lima)
9th: Crump


This site layout looks clean!

SoCal has had a pretty good weekend, with two of their best players taking a tourney. VoiD has easily become one of my current top 5 players to watch with his performance.

 

[MERPIS]

Smash'N'Splash 4 (527 Entrants) (A tier)

1st: VoiD
2nd: Salem
3rd: MKLeo
4th: Light
5th: Elegant
5th: Dabuz
7th: Rags
7th: Shoyo James
9th: Cosmos
9th: Tyroy
9th: komorikiri
9th: Mr. R
13th: Ally
13th: Ned
13th: Captain L
13th: Panda Bair
17th: Blacktwins
17th: SDX
17th: Ralphie
17th: MIstake
17th: DarkShad
17th: Raito
17th: Miloni
17th: Zaki
25th: Captain Zack
25th: The Great Gonzales
25th: NameLess
25th: 8BitMan
25th: Mekos
25th: PowPow
25th: Wisdom
25th: Ozone

Notable Players out Earlier:
33rd: Gackt
33rd: John Numbers
33rd: Zoan
33rd: yeti
33rd: JJRockets
49th: Chag
49th: Maister
49th: Biddy
49th: Komota
65th: Skillager
65th: ATATA
65th: BestNess (DQ'ed to Losers)
97th: pu55yk1ng
129th: cagt
449th: Ryo (DQ'ed)
513th: Nairo (DQ'ed)
513th: Tweek (DQ'ed)
513th: justy (DQ'ed)
513th: Scot! (DQ'ed)
513th: Wonderbread (DQ'ed)


Smash'N'Splash 4 Doubles:

1st: Ally Mistake
2nd: Cosmos VoiD
3rd: komorikiri MKLeo
4th: Darkshad Light
5th: Captain Zack Salem
5th: tyroy Mr. R
7th: FroZn BestNess
7th: Miloni BooBear
9th: Captain L Elegant
9th: Mekos 8BitMan
9th: Komota Crispy
9th: Fons Marshall


Everyone sunk into the void of the bottom of the sea. That is how VoiD wins the tournament and is Sheik first victory at a major ever since the 1.1.5.




DreamHack Austin 2018 (316 Entrants) (C tier)

1st: Larry Lurr
2nd: ESAM
3rd: ANTi
4th: MVD
5th: Samsora
5th: Konga
7th: Lima
7th: Light the Lantern
9th: falln
9th: SaSSy
9th: DJ Flipflop (Notably defeated Lima)
9th: Crump


This site layout looks clean!

It's smogon forums but for smash
Meanwhile, VILLAGER IN THE TOP 16 AGAIN AAAAAAAAAA

 

[The_Bookworm]

I am a bit confused on something. Why didn't NAKAT participate in SSB4 singles (or doubles)?

He was at the event, and even won Brawl Singles, but he didn't go to any of the SSB4 brackets.

 

[Lord Dio]

whoah, hello new layout, this feels awkward
good to be back online I guess?

Good weekend for socal

 

[Yonder]

Smash'N'Splash 4 (527 Entrants) (A tier)

1st: VoiD
2nd: Salem
3rd: MKLeo
4th: Light
5th: Elegant
5th: Dabuz
7th: Rags
7th: Shoyo James
9th: Cosmos
9th: Tyroy
9th: komorikiri
9th: Mr. R
13th: Ally
13th: Ned
13th: Captain L
13th: Panda Bair
17th: Blacktwins
17th: SDX
17th: Ralphie
17th: MIstake
17th: DarkShad
17th: Raito
17th: Miloni
17th: Zaki
25th: Captain Zack
25th: The Great Gonzales
25th: NameLess
25th: 8BitMan
25th: Mekos
25th: PowPow
25th: Wisdom
25th: Ozone

Notable Players out Earlier:
33rd: Gackt
33rd: John Numbers
33rd: Zoan
33rd: yeti
33rd: JJRockets
49th: Chag
49th: Maister
49th: Biddy
49th: Komota
65th: Skillager
65th: ATATA
65th: BestNess (DQ'ed to Losers)
97th: pu55yk1ng
129th: cagt
449th: Ryo (DQ'ed)
513th: Nairo (DQ'ed)
513th: Tweek (DQ'ed)
513th: justy (DQ'ed)
513th: Scot! (DQ'ed)
513th: Wonderbread (DQ'ed)


Smash'N'Splash 4 Doubles:

1st: Ally Mistake
2nd: Cosmos VoiD
3rd: komorikiri MKLeo
4th: Darkshad Light
5th: Captain Zack Salem
5th: tyroy Mr. R
7th: FroZn BestNess
7th: Miloni BooBear
9th: Captain L Elegant
9th: Mekos 8BitMan
9th: Komota Crispy
9th: Fons Marshall


Everyone sunk into the void of the bottom of the sea. That is how VoiD wins the tournament and is Sheik's first victory at a major ever since the 1.1.5.




DreamHack Austin 2018 (316 Entrants) (C tier)

1st: Larry Lurr
2nd: ESAM
3rd: ANTi
4th: MVD
5th: Samsora
5th: Konga
7th: Lima
7th: Light the Lantern
9th: falln
9th: SaSSy
9th: DJ Flipflop (Notably defeated Lima)
9th: Crump


This site layout looks clean!

Thought I'd mention Elegant vs Rags in top 8 was probably the single fastest match in smash 4 history top 8. Elegant put Rags in a bodybag. This tournament in general was actually quite fun to watch. Void winning a major was great too, after all this time.

This was my first time hearing Zero commentate too for a tournament and he was super fun. Great commentator,giving lots of knowledge on the game that other commentators usually lack and just really hyping up everything in general. I think he's my new favorite commentator (Him and EE). Please have him commentate more. It really added to the hype of the tournament in general.

Kind of weird seeing how absent ZSS was from placing anywhere in SmashNSplash. Of course, that was cause noNairo...but still.

Edit: I just saw Robin next to Mistake's name as a secondary. Do my eyes deceive me? I didn't see Robin at all, but I'm gonna assume he used her to screw around in pools or something. Still...neat.

 

[The_Bookworm]

Edit: I just saw Robin next to Mistake's name as a secondary. Do my eyes deceive me? I didn't see Robin at all, but I'm gonna assume he used her to screw around in pools or something. Still...neat.

Well that is what the Smashwiki said that Mistake was also using. They also said that Darkshad also used Cloud, Captain L also used Jigglypuff, and Mekos also used Ness. I am not really sure, but I put that in thinking that Mistake also used Robin in a last ditch effort to avoid an early end to his run, which ended up happening anyways.

 

[|RK|]

Well that is what the Smashwiki said that Mistake was also using. They also said that Darkshad also used Cloud, Captain L also used Jigglypuff, and Mekos also used Ness. I am not really sure, but I put that in thinking that Mistake also used Robin in a last ditch effort to avoid an early end to his run, which ended up happening anyways.

Probably dubs

 

[The_Bookworm]

Probably dubs

They put in a separate result table for doubles (like always), soooo.... no.

 

[|RK|]

They put in a separate result table for doubles (like always), soooo.... no.

Ah, I see. Possibly pools then. *shrug*

 

[ぱみゅ]

Mistake DID use Robin during pools. There was a tweet confirming so, but idr who posted it.

 

[Lord Dio]

Mistake used robin in pools and from what I heard L tried puff against Mr R

 

[The_Bookworm]

There are three C tiers coming this weekend. One is them was already given much earlier: Saints Gaming Live 2018.

Saints Gaming Live 2018 (47 Attendees) (Canada) (C tier)

PGR'ed Players
Larry Lurr
Marss
ANTi
Samsora

Notable Players
Captain L
Blacktwins
Deathorse


However, they introduced two other C tier events coming this weekend.


ALPHA II (Tristate) (C tier)

Attendees not yet published


Super Smash Fight Club 2 (Texas) (C tier)

Attendees not yet published



I am going to check later this week to see if the two new events published their attendees, so stay tuned.

 

[Iridium]

I do wonder how Zaki will do at CEO 2018 and Hyrule Saga after his performance at Smash'N'Splash 4. If he gets actual PGR wins, I will not know how to feel about King Dedede. Also, Hyrule Saga will begin in 19 days! I can't wait to see T again!

 

[Prince Koopa Jr]

Zaki might show us some more impressive things with Dedede at Hyrule saga, 17th is a great placement for a Dedede.

 

[The_Bookworm]

Zaki might show us some more impressive things with Dedede at Hyrule saga, 17th is a great placement for a Dedede.

It is, but we will have to see if he can be consistent with it. The brackets in general were not my favorite in Smash'N'Splash, as certain players go off easier in brackets than others, with Zaki getting the good end of the stick. Then there was Gackt, who had to fight Salem and Ally, or BestNess, who had to fight Rags in order to reach top 64 without getting eliminated. Although Elegant did get 5th in the tournament, the only PGR'ed player he beat was Tyroy.

At Hyrule Saga, there are a large amount of players who main a LoZ character, with all of them beating Dedede outright (except for maybe TLink and Ganondorf, but those two matchups are even at best).

 

[Browny]

I'm just gonna put this here

https://smashboards.com/threads/bef...-was-never-as-bad-as-many-people-said.455070/

Dabuz's commentary at SnS was mind-numbingly awful when it came to Mewtwo but to be fair on him, he only repeated the same minsinformation that everyone else repeats.

Everyone thinks that Mewtwo's buffs were so dramatic, possibly the most buffed character in the entire game, that it dragged him from bottom to top tier. That really is a naive viewpoint because it completely disregards all of the buffs given to all of the other characters. When you consider that tier lists are a comparison, you must compare Mewtwos buffs to the buffs given to characters around him. The fact that he shot so high up the tier list, while many other stayed stagnant despite getting just as many potent buffs and in some cases exceeding those that Mewtwo was given (Ike is the best example) proves one thing; Mewtwo was always good, people just never bothered to try.

 

[The_Bookworm]

I'm just gonna put this here

https://smashboards.com/threads/bef...-was-never-as-bad-as-many-people-said.455070/

Dabuz's commentary at SnS was mind-numbingly awful when it came to Mewtwo but to be fair on him, he only repeated the same minsinformation that everyone else repeats.

Everyone thinks that Mewtwo's buffs were so dramatic, possibly the most buffed character in the entire game, that it dragged him from bottom to top tier. That really is a naive viewpoint because it completely disregards all of the buffs given to all of the other characters. When you consider that tier lists are a comparison, you must compare Mewtwos buffs to the buffs given to characters around him. The fact that he shot so high up the tier list, while many other stayed stagnant despite getting just as many potent buffs and in some cases exceeding those that Mewtwo was given (Ike is the best example) proves one thing; Mewtwo was always good, people just never bothered to try.

No. Granted that some people thought Mewtwo so was underrated before the buffs, but his strengths didn't stack up to his weaknesses before the buffs. He was designed to be a glass cannon, but his strengths didn't make up for his frality.

After the buffs, Mewtwo's offense was highly increased further, making him act like a proper glass cannon like Fox, and his results drastically improved thanks to that. Most other characters who receive such a number of buffs, though it ends up helping them in the long run, but it doesn't properly compensate/ doesn't fully address their weaknesses. Falco and Ganondorf is the best examples of this.

Btw, Mewtwo was low tier, not bottom tier, before the buffs.

 

[The_Bookworm]

Deleted comment.
Sorry for the double post. Stupid mobile.