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First of all, ABK. Second of all, we were talking about offstage, where the goal is to avoid getting carried off the side, rather than the top.
Opps. Thanks for the catch. I not sure exactly about offstage, but I think RHS's and BSD's videos cover that.
http://kuroganehammer.com/Smash4/Bayonetta
That is somewhat true if Bayonetta cant kill at the right percent from a combo or an edgeguard it can be hard to land a kill unless you get lucky forward throw witch doesn't kill until over 150% with proper di and a random back air
I think it's just because of a weird property of multihitting command dashes (a command dash being a move that moves you, but during which you have no control over your movement - think Mario or ZSS up-B). See, the game uses the attacker's X position to determine how to read an attack's angle when you get hit. For most moves, even ones you can move during, your coordinates track with your character the way they normally would, which is what allows reverse hits to happen. A good example of this would be Mario's nair, shown here: https://struz.github.io/smash-move-viewer/#/v1/mario/AttackAirN
What was that supposed to tell me lol. I know her frame data and I already conceded the point that her startup is pretty high.
The_Bookworm
pointed out...but even then, the reason for that is due to a combination of bad frame data and poor grounded mobility that her hitbox size can’t fully make up for.
maybe I should have been more specific her special moves all have a lot of endlag and her ariels all have a lot of landing lag especially her down air which makes her down air not safe to use and her smash attacks all have like 40 frames of endlag which makes them not safe on shield and the landing lag on her specials if she fails a combo and her hitboxes are big but her lag on moves is really bad her only safe move in netural is arguably neutral airWhat was that supposed to tell me lol. I know her frame data and I already conceded the point that her startup is pretty high.
However, you can’t look at it in a vacuum. It’s the same reason why swordies have worse frame data than brawlers: it compensates for their range.
Bayo’s range and absurd hitboxes more than compensate for her startup to the point where it’s not really a pivotal “weakness”. The only area where it actually hurts her is on the ground like
Congratulations, you could not be more wrong. 3 of her aerials have less than 13 frames of landing lag, all save Dair have less than 15. Her landing lag compares only slightly unfavorably to ****ing Zero Suit.
my bad you are right but all my other points still stand
Only picked up Sheik a couple of months ago, so I'll agree with your opinion out of my comparative lack of experience. My Sheik is still not even close to being as good as my Cloud. Anyways, I was mostly talking about Mac on FD but the combo you mentioned above is one of my favorites as Sheik. I didn't really want to use it on Mac because Up-B and Up-Smash are scary and Cloud is better in the Mac matchup. Too bad Sheik's best stage and Cloud's worst stage are Mac's best stage by far.This.
What Sheik is good at is pressuring characters that are forced to come back from a horizontal in order to safely recover() or others with some sort of gross flaw in their Up B that makes them susceptible to dying off random stray hits(
She's pretty horrible at harassing characters offstage and outright killing them unless there's some specific tech to do so (like infinite BF clipping DK/Corrin's heads during their Up B).
Also, about
The matchup was hard until the Sheiks realized our normal optimized combos kill even without a solid finisher. Those standard 45 degree angle Back Air and Forward Air scenarios that are normally used to pressure most of the cast will outright kill Mac as well. So if at any point he gets touched by the wrong side of an aerial, he's at risk of dying. Even when saving his jump. Sour fair > Sour fair > Sweet fair > Sweet fair, for example, true combos and kills Mac around the early 20-30s.
Saddest part is that nowadays most of her combos occur so fluidly that Mac cannot Up B out of them because there's no gap to attack out of hitstun.
Pretty sucky situation for the character.
Shortly after the patch there was argument for it being roughly even but nowadays it is nowhere near that.
friendly reminder luma up air base knockback is 110.
wow i didn't know it was that much
That's pretty dumb for one move.
Have to admit, Vinnie is doing pretty good this season, even if has not gone to many majors overall. His performance at Glitch 4 confirms it for me. As for Captain L, I legitimately wonder what characters does he think his Jigglypuff can deal with, or is it just for fun.Port Priority 3 (208 Entrants) (C tier)
1st: Dabuz
2nd: ANTi
3rd: 6WX
4th: Mr. E
5th: SilentRain
5th: JaKaL
7th: Vinnie
7th: Pokepen
9th: Shinkou
9th: Konga
9th: Pyreeze
9th: Captain L
13th: John Numbers
13th: Juice
13th: Snickeldorf
13th: Big D
Except he doesn't main the character, and there is absolutely no reason to do so.
no reason to do what
It's not characters, it's players (except maybe Ness). Most people don't know the Puff MU because why would they. Take his set vs ESAM. As well as L's been performing lately, ESAM is inarguably the better Pikachu, and he knows the ditto inside and out. So instead of fighting him in a matchup he was good at, he went Puff, guessing that ESAM doesn't have experience in the MU, and it almost worked. Like ESAM said something to the effect of "he would've won had he rested me 2% later game 4" in his Flatiron 3 (or 4, I cant remember which it was and I'm too lazy to look it up) recap.
Secondaries count for the PGR.
Mmhmm, Captain L's Jiggs is no slouch either, it's always a surprise to see him bring it out.
Captain L actually defeated ESAM in the ditto once before, but other than that you are right.
That's just your opinion, man.
Err. I meant at high level of play for a player of his caliber, I meant to say.
I think it's less about people overexaggerting his Puff's success as much as it is about people being surprised at Puff getting significant results at all, much less potentially being on the PGR. Not that Puff has has absolutely zero representation outside of Captian L (CrazieCuban, anyone?), but Puff has almost zero representation. And that's on top of the fact that Puff has long been considered the worst character in the game, with good reason. So, the existence of any significant Puff results at all, on top of the potential for Puff to appear on the PGR, is bound to catch people by surprise.
Lets see his PGR'ed results:
it's also noteworthy that he beat Mr R and Mkleo once each as well, and I forget if he got a reset on ESAM or not.
That is true that he did beat those two. If only that was on a A tier event though, but I doubt he beat could Leo again after what he did to him on GF set 2.
it is a possibility but who knows
I'm suprised no one has talked about Vinnie's SDI, he only lost a total of 3 stocks to ladder combos out of the 8 games he played vs Zack and Mistake at Glitch 4. And from the friendlies I played with him last week he's just a fundamentally amazing player overall.
Same goes for combos off the side boundary. And once Bayos learn how stupidly powerful Dair spiking is off stage we're in for a rough time. Bayo's meta has room to grow.
Except that her dair has quite a bit of cooldown, and if she is too close to the bottom blastzone she may end up SD'ing, stupid recovery or not.
d-air is only useful very specific situations its not a safe move to use any time you want
Damn you quick to defend Bayo
Naw, that's just a mixup. And it's been known for a while, it doesn't really add any new variable to mario's standard combo game except the threat of bair. (Which would not have killed) Hell, if Eon witch twisted instead of Air Dodged, he could've killed Wizzy.
Nah Bayo dumb as ****, but it gets exhausting seeing comments like "Bayo's will evolve to become unstoppable" with the perception that all other players are sitting still waiting to die.
*Zenyou
