100 lucas tricks (25% complete!)

[ChrisTheCom]

A'ight, how 'bout dis. Using the statues in Castle Siege/Capsules in Brinstar to extend the duration of nair/down smash/up smash, etc. I do this pretty often...

I use this as well, simply because it completely ruins the timing of someone trying to punish. Also works on the pillars in Luigi's mansion, on Skyworld, maybe others. It might work on Green Greens for the first hitbox, I think I saw someone post a video on the boards where they bair-ed through the blocks that covered the middle holes, forming a gap, whilst spiking someone down, and the hitbox stayed out much longer.

 

[Levitas]

Neon, I'm adding that, partially because I use it too, but mostly because it's really funny when people think the attacks done a full second before it is and run into it.

 

[ToxiCrow]

APC- yeah pretty much lol

Levitas-how about Nair picks up bananas and other items thrown at you??
and to add to Neon's post: this also works on the pillars at Luigi's Mansion

 

[SilverSpark]

Yay, thanks for making a Tricks thread

(even though I'm not a Lucas-main)

 

[c3gill]

APC- yeah pretty much lol

Levitas-how about Nair picks up bananas and other items thrown at you??
and to add to Neon's post: this also works on the pillars at Luigi's Mansion

good idea to add, that using neutral air will pick up any item that is throw at you...

anyone ever tired to FH nair and then immediatly item (zap) jump? that could be another use, especially if diddy is throwing nannerz at you offstage while trying to recover.....

 

[HailCrest]

Well, his PKT2 has two killing hitboxes, the first and the last, and both launch the opponent depending on their location relative to Lucas. If you hit the opponent with the last hitbox while the opponent is under you, will that make a spike?

 

[Levitas]

No, it won't. Also, I'm fairly certain that the strong hits of PKT2 have a constant launch angle, rather than one affected by their position relative to you.

Welcome to smashboards ^_^

 

[HailCrest]

For PKT2, I prefer to make this shape with the thunder (beware: my ASCII drawings suck)


/------\
/............\
|.............|
|............/
|.........../
o-----
|
^


o
| is Lucas.
^


Basically you let it rest and go straight up for a split second then make the tightest loop possible. That more often than not, hits lucas on the head and blasts him where you want to go. For me it's simpler than the ? shape you have up there.

 

[prOAPC]

lagless pk thunder 2: aim your pkt just a little above the stage, and when you land, you get no lag
jump cancel to throw items, run and jump+A at the same time, you get no lag throwing the item, similar to a glide toss

 

[Levitas]

Hailcrest, while it's probably easier to do, it takes longer to execute, and time wasted is damage taken.

APC, I'll include that, but it's terrible that you have to put yourself in helpless for a number of frames in order to cancel the lag on PKT2. It was like that with melee ness, too, which ensured that he'd get hit if he didn't go to the edge, and the nature of PKT2 made him likely to get edgehogged.

 

[xoxokev]

Here's one Levitas... B-reverse PsiM when you need to tether but you're facing the wrong way

 

[Levitas]

I'll update this right now.

Anyone know how lucas can deal with this?

 

[Irsic]

I don't think that just stands for recovering, Levitas. If you were to shoot yourself horizontally along with the stage, but you were shooting yourself slightly above it, you'll land with no lag.

 

[c3gill]

I'll update this right now.

Anyone know how lucas can deal with this?

loop PK Thunder. PK Freeze could work also.

also- jumping down there is dangerous, but you could always jump offstage, pk fire in the direction of the stage (hit MK- the explosion should damage him, even if the initial bolt doesnt), jump back on stage.

i dunno if its big enough, but if you space it right you might be able to get a hit with D-Smash.

and as it is smashville, a small level- you could always suicide that and try to surprise him by going under the stage and PKT2 recovering up to the moving platform. of course, any decent MK is going to gimp your face off.....

I like looping PKT. and for the record, as Lucas we should just chill when someone decides to do that. We have decent abilities to shut down bad approaches, and we have decent projectiles to make ****ers who like to stall approach us. so start launching PK Freezes and PK Thunders!

 

[Levitas]

The problem is that PKT leaves us with a bunch of lag. MK can just roll up and hit us if we're pressuring him below stage level, and he can wait it out if we use PKT safely.

Freeze has similar issues, moreso that it's dangerous on startup, but I would bet it's our best option from a distance.

DON'T let MK get you to higher damage in a match. He's kind of an *******.

 

[xoxokev]

...dash dance a little, try to bait him into coming up, then PIVOT GRAB! duh

And yes, Irsic is probably correct. If Lucas' PKT2 ending has the same properties as Ness... then Lucas should land with no lag

 

[c3gill]

The problem is that PKT leaves us with a bunch of lag. MK can just roll up and hit us if we're pressuring him below stage level, and he can wait it out if we use PKT safely.

Freeze has similar issues, moreso that it's dangerous on startup, but I would bet it's our best option from a distance.

Stand on the opposite side of the stage/ middle of the stage, skim PK Thunder along the stage, and Loop the projectile so that he is (hopefully) knocked into the stage, and bounces off. I know its kind of an ideal, but if you can pull it off you should be able to get to the edge before MK. Even if MK decides to come and attack you while you are playing around with PKT, you can just run it into the ground- MK is much faster on the ground than in the air, and if we are skimming the projectile along the ground properly he isnt going to have a choice but to attack by air.

I guess thats what I should have said, thats what I was thinking

regardless, we really dont have any options other than to

a) PK Thunder and hope to hit him
b) PK Freeze and hope to hit him
c) Call him names and insult him mercilessly for using MK AND planking.

 

[Levitas]

The whole point is that he's not coming up. Good luck baiting him into a pivot grab, lol.

I guarantee that it's much easier to evade or attack PKT than to hit MK with it.

PK freeze has a low success rate and a low cycle frequency.

My point in bringing this video here is to make you guys really understand what happens in a competitive environment.

Scotu won that set because he was patient enough to make something like that work. I don't see anything preventing that kind of play from becoming the norm.

 

[xoxokev]

the other MK should have just planked the other side haha

 

[Levitas]

He did for a short period of time in game 1.

 

[Irsic]

Falling nair (not AC)

Sometimes falling into your opponent with nair is your best option (for an aerial), for as long as you at least 2-3 hits of nair in, it rises the opponent off the ground enough to where you can start a jab, even if you don't AC the nair. Generally not punished, and shield pokes.

 

[prOAPC]

Levitas, about not AC nair, you said use nair a little late after a short hop, well, you can use nair as soon as you sh, but then fast fall the attack just before the move ends

Late PK Fire
SH or FH and use PK Fire as late as you can, that way the PK Fire bolt will travel as low as a grounded PK Fire, that way, you can hit even G&W in his duck position, and you get less lag upon landing

 

[Levitas]

I'll add that. As far as the late PK fire, I'm gonna count frames before I'm certain that it has less lag.

 

[lil cj]

I think i got one

Fair wall of pain:
Like Kirby and Jiggs, Lucas has a wall of pain move too
While off stage constantly hit your opponent with fair til you KO them off the side
You can get some early % KOs this way
If your opponent isnt KO'd and if they have a bad recovery they wont be able to make it back to the stage.

This thread should be stickied eventually
It will be a while til we get to 100
and before then this thread might die
So it should be a sticky

 

[Levitas]

I doubt it'll die, but you might see it as a sticky before it gets to 100.

I think I'll add edgeguarding strats including the one you suggested as well as the mechanics of telegraphing to the list.

 

[ToxiCrow]

CJ just reminded me-
cant we Wall of Pain with the sourspots of Bair too??

and another one : Nair can stage spike

 

[lil cj]

CJ just reminded me-
cant we Wall of Pain with the sourspots of Bair too??

and another one : Nair can stage spike

Yea I could see bair being a wall of pain too

Nice one...I forgot about nair stage spiking

Edit: I was thinking about a potential trick
We all know about G&W's bucket breaking right?

It stops momentum and prevents him from dieing at incredibly high %s
Well I would imagine Lucas might be able to do the same thing with psi magnet(following a nair of course like G&W)
Psi magnet already also stops momentum and comes out just as fast as G&W's bucket
and I would imagine Fox could probably do the same thing with his shine
Can someone test this...I'll also try it out

Which leads me to another idea...maybe Lucas might have similar techniques with his psi magnet that Fox has with his shine??
I dont know any Fox shine AT's but I know they exist lol

 

[ToxiCrow]

PsiM is a backwards shine.
Shine inflicts damage as soon as it appears (in melee). PSIm inflicts damage as soon as it ends.

About Bucket Braking with lucas, short answer is no.
Long answer: Game+Watch's bucket stops all momentum, but PSIm doesnt because when u use nair, you'll still be moving (but slower). if u use PSIm, you'll boost the speed in the direction you're going towards.
now if you're coming towards the stage or falling, then PSIm will slow you down

 

[lil cj]

Interesting
I had no idea about the physics of psi magnet

 

[Levitas]

lol, I feel the need to clarify something that people seem to be misunderstanding. WoP refers to a zoning technique where you weave towards and away from your opponent using aerials to cover yourself. Marth does this in brawl with fair, Jiggs does this in melee with bair.

Jiggs can also do a bair bair bair... combo to KO off the side, just as ROB can fair fair fair fair and we can fair fair fair or bair bair or bair dair.

 

[Neon Ness]

Interesting
I had no idea about the physics of psi magnet

Aww, how could you forget Magnet Pull, cj? If PSI Magnet stopped all momentum we wouldn't be able to do it.

Also, zair should be listed under fear tactics. Professional fear tactics.

 

[prOAPC]

i've never tried it before, but i have that feel that makes me think that you can invert or stop or modify knockback momentum with Lucas' wierd physics
(to the Lucas general discussion thread! really, this should go there)

 

[ToxiCrow]

to the general discussion thread!

 

[HailCrest]

I've been wondering whether Lucas can brake Fire Jump Punch with magnet.

Anyway, is it possible to spike a character right as they jump from the ledge? Like, they're about to get up but got hit by lucas' spiking hitbox before they could do anything, and die.

 

[Levitas]

Hailcrest, could you explain what you mean by brake fire jump punch? If you mean use the zap jump to stop momentum, I really doubt it.

As far as spiking people as they jump from the edge, as long as they aren't invincible, this is possible. However, if they're doing it right, they are invincible. So the answer is pretty much yes, if they're bad.

 

[soccerdude7200]

#10
-What can you use a floorblast for if you're standing on the ground??

 

[Irsic]

Spiking people immediately as they jump from the ledge is pretty god**** hard to time, but Lucas' spike can do it.

I do it in my combo video! :D

#10
-What can you use a floorblast for if you're standing on the ground??

Floorblasting puts you on the ground, giving you only 4 options (get up attack, get up, roll left, roll right)

You misinterpreted what he was said.

 

[c3gill]

Floorblasting puts you on the ground, giving you only 4 options (get up attack, get up, roll left, roll right)

You misinterpreted what he was said.

additionally, if you have a tendency to use PKT a lot, floorblasting is a great way to mix your game up and surprise your opponent. (mindgames)

practice it a lot though, as if you hit Lucas incorrectly you can still go flying at some crazy angle.

 

[ToxiCrow]

I've been wondering whether Lucas can brake Fire Jump Punch with magnet.

Hailcrest, could you explain what you mean by brake fire jump punch? If you mean use the zap jump to stop momentum, I really doubt it.

i think he means can u slow down your momentum with PSIm after getting hit with Luigi's UP B.

the answer is NO. PSIm increases knockback.
If you're falling or jumping in a certain direction, only then can PSIm stop your momentum.

 

[lil cj]

Well it looks like Lucas cant psi magnet break
What was i thinking lol

Toxicrow didnt you say a while back you had some secret Lucas technique?
Can you share it with us

Edit:
Looks like the Link boards are trying to be like us lol
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=226871