Guide Zelda Social: But also the FE Heroes Internet Cafe

[SBphiloz4]

GORLS YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW ACCOMPLISHED I FEEL. First time I won a winner's set. Because this is my second tourney. XD

And no, I won't go full ****** and switch to Diddy.

 

[spiderfreak1011]

Past first round in the 34 man online tourney. Lucky for me, it was a ROB.

And as I said earlier, I can beat him no problem, for some reason. c:

ROB is easily my most hated match up of this game. I find him incredibly hard to approach/attack with anyone because of his safe options(freaking Side B and Down Smash are annoying and Side Special can REFLECT PROJECTILES) and weird projectile (you can't even grab the Gyro top without getting hit, come on), and incredibly powerful Aerials, aswell as him using Laser out of nowhere IMO. He feels like the bane of my existence in this game. I have yet to try to fight him with Ness or Lucario, as they generally seem to be my best characters for match ups like this.

 

[Lavani]

I'm trying that now. He still seems to hesitate right before doing the SS, and at times I'm not certain whether I did it successfully or not.

The Platform Cancel SS isn't tooo hard, but it takes some practice, and I still haven't gotten it down consistently yet.

Uh...hm. The SS won't interrupt your dash/run if you do running SS correctly, it's a seamless transition. Example. If you do it wrong he should just skid then walk.

@ Lavani

Wtf you're missing Shulk. He becomes really amazing with customs but he's actually not that amazing with customs because he doesn't benefit much from his meh SIDE B AND UP B customs. HI

I thought Shulks just got a better counter out of it

I mean, Power Vision is nuts but it doesn't really change the character

Well, the best custom moves and who benefits the most can very different things.

Who benefits the most from customs in terms of improvement relative to their position w/o customs:

Best custom moves:Super Speed, Exploding Balloon Trip, Timber Counter, Storm Punch, Jumbo Hoops, Lightweight, Snaring Aura Sphere, Dense Charge Shot, Enriched SunSal, Chain Judge, etc.

You get what I mean?

Yeah, though for best custom moves I would definitely have Luma Warp and Shooting Star Bit listed. Even if Rosalina doesn't comparatively get better in a customs environment, those two customs are ****ing nuts.

I'm also still bleh about saying Miis get better with customs on because they have access to everything with customs OFF anyway, western rulesets are so dumb.

What's Chain Judge do for G&W over default?

I figured Palutena's was the worst. Sure it has that range, but it can't KO well at all, or do that much damage, so i find it kind of useless, lol.

Anyway, i'll keep those in mind, i didn't figure i could use them like that though, definitely interested. I'll keep it in mind when im fighting my friends online. : 3

Ike's and Palutena's counters are actually pretty similar, except Palutena's does more damage (actually does more damage than every counter except sweetspot Vision) and starts a bit faster iirc.

I typed up a comparison table for counters over on the Palutena board yesterday:

Character | Counter Frames | Invincible | Base Damage | Damage Multiplier | KBG | BKB
Palutena | 10-31f | 10-16f | 10% | x1.3 | 75, 65 | 40, 20
Ike | 09-35f | 09-16f | 09% | x1.2 | 74 | 48
Greninja | 08-29f | 08-18f | 14%, 13%, or 11% | No scaling | 100, 72 | 62, 50
Marth/Lucina | 03-16f | No invuln | 08% | x1.2 | 60 | 90
Little Mac | 04-20f | No invuln | 10% | x1.3 | 50 | 90
Lucario | 05-40f |No invuln | 11% | No scaling | 108 | 60
Shulk | 07-??f | No invuln | 13%, 10% or 7% | x1.3 | 94, 84, 84 | 70

 

[FullMoon]

Greninja's Shifting Shuriken custom is pretty great too. A projectile with trascedent priority that combos into pretty much anything Greninja wants at kill %, particularly Up-Smash.

 

[Ffamran]

Spi-Reserved-rst


Tbh I don't get why people default to the nickname "BJ" for me. I mean this is EZ retort bait, but is it really that hard to type all of my username? LOL

Of course the only person who'd come here that I've ever mentioned that preference was @kyokoro_pamuyo so I didn't expect any of you to type my full username.

Late reply, but people call me Ffam or Fam which sounds kind of ghetto, especially considering the stereotype about Falco mains.

 

[spiderfreak1011]

Late reply, but people call me Ffam or Fam which sounds kind of ghetto, especially considering the stereotype about Falco mains.

Well then, what would you preferably be called then? Just Ffamran?

 

[Cenizas]

Yeah, though for best custom moves I would definitely have Luma Warp and Shooting Star Bit listed. Even if Rosalina doesn't comparatively get better in a customs environment, those two customs are ****ing nuts.

I'm also still bleh about saying Miis get better with customs on because they have access to everything with customs OFF anyway, western rulesets are so dumb.

What's Chain Judge do for G&W over default?:

Chain Judge is more reliable in damage racking, 9 only kills slightly later, and most notably, you don't hurt yourself when you draw 1.

I don't really know much about Rosa's customs, so I'll take your word for it. Got any good videos of them in action though?

 

[Fernosaur]

GORLS YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW ACCOMPLISHED I FEEL. First time I won a winner's set. Because this is my second tourney. XD

And no, I won't go full ****** and switch to Diddy.

Who are you using?

 

[SBphiloz4]

If customs were legalized, Zelda wouldn't be the worst character in the game anymore. :^)

Who are you using?

Of course our queen. :^)

 

[Cenizas]

If customs were legalized, Zelda wouldn't be the worst character in the game anymore. :^)

We'll only get better when Mewtwo comes out.

 

[Lavani]

I don't really know much about Rosa's customs, so I'll take your word for it. Got any good videos of them in action though?

Eh, I'd have to dig back to 3DS tournaments to find stuff, and even then it would only really show off Shooting Star Bit (Luma Warp wasn't looked into as much until later).

Luma Warp combos into any of Luma's attacks, including its smashes. Ftilt>Luma Warp>fsmash is a kill combo around 50% iirc. Luma Warp>dair will just instantly kill anyone that gets hit by it offstage too.

Shooting Star Bit is basically a 4~5% Brawl Falco laser.

 

[FullMoon]

Huh, so Substitute has the most invincible frames and the counter frames are tied with Palutena and is less only than Ike's and Lucario's (and probably Shulk as well)?

It always felt to me that Substitute had very few activation frames, I thought it was the worst in that regard actually.

 

[spiderfreak1011]

We'll only get better when Mewtwo comes out.

Are you implying Mewtwo is going to retake his position as bottom of the tier list again? @__________________@ /sarcasm.

 

[Lavani]

oh

those counter/invuln frames on Ike are actually for Ike's downB 3 LOL whoops

Ike should be 9-35f counter and 9-16f invuln

 

[Ffamran]

Well then, what would you preferably be called then? Just Ffamran?

Call me...

Ffamran's fine, but in many cases people just quote or tag me, so whatever. Hell, I've been called Daffy Duck and Duck Dodgers before. I guess I go by many names.

 

[FullMoon]

It's funny that before Substitute was considered pretty much useless and now I feel it's probably only behind Shulk's in usefulness. It kills very early, can be used as a escape measure and hell, it can even be used to either counter a potential gimp or as a recovery tool. It's funny how underrated it was at first.

 

[Marie Antoinette]

Playing rollglory really early in the morning on weekdays gets you some REALLY interesting people. Also I just checked my 1v1 rollglory stats, and it's back at 80% which means im doing some right!!!

EDIT: @ Lavani both pits and falcon have been giving my rosaluma a tough time. Pits especially feel like a chore because I can never tell whether they're good or not-- the less flashier, the more dangerous. You got any tips for these MUs?

 

[Soul.]

how many frames does Pika Thunder have

 

[Lavani]

It's funny that before Substitute was considered pretty much useless and now I feel it's probably only behind Shulk's in usefulness. It kills very early, can be used as a escape measure and hell, it can even be used to either counter a potential gimp or as a recovery tool. It's funny how underrated it was at first.

Well, to be fair it's still pretty slow to actually attack. I agree though, despite all the hate it got early on it's easily one of my favorite counters.

 

[Furret]

Colors is the best Sonic game. I like it more than Generations just for how much variety the wisps bring to the gameplay. Also it's probably the only time ever my favorite stage was the water one. Though Starlight Carnival is such eye candy.

Also hi guys, I'm back from spending 70% of the afternoon in bed

sonic 2 is the best sonic game, you're playing a sanic game. get it right

Yeah you should ditch the Sonic fanbase & become a Leffen fangirl like me :3

send me, that profile pic now pls

Shield. His grab is terrible, his throws are terrible, shield beats all his threatening options. Be wary of your shield health around dair and downB, but Yoshi generally struggles to do meaningful things against shields...and if he starts whiffing his terrible grab he's going to get punished hard.

basic tips, probably not helpful but oh well I tried

the feet though, not actually a counter argument I just like yoshi's dair

 

[Mocha]

It's funny that before Substitute was considered pretty much useless and now I feel it's probably only behind Shulk's in usefulness. It kills very early, can be used as a escape measure and hell, it can even be used to either counter a potential gimp or as a recovery tool. It's funny how underrated it was at first.

I have a love/hate thing with Substitute. At times, I'll see the move come out, and yet I get hit anyway, or I miss them. And by "missing them" I don't mean in the sense that I tried to Substitute on like, a dash attack.

Moves with repeating hits, such as Charizard's Upsmash is annoying. I'll see my pop out, but then I get hit by the remaining hits of the move.

 

[NekoJubei]

Dr Mario haves great customs too,Soaring Cyclone is ridiculously good xP and is mashable
youtu.be/2mKPOT82uEQ

 

[evmaxy54]

send me, that profile pic now pls

Got it from here:
https://twitter.com/SOJ_PMDT/status/563140375419035649

Also:

Spoiler: quite large pic inside

 

[Furret]

Dr Mario haves great customs too,Soaring Cyclone is ridiculously good xP and is mashable

fixed it
edit: nvm
edit 2: got it

 

[spiderfreak1011]

[quote="Ffamran, post: 18549446, member: 262610"]Call me...

Ffamran's fine, but in many cases people just quote or tag me, so whatever. Hell, I've been called Daffy Duck and Duck Dodgers before. I guess I go by many names.[/quote]
Lol, nice pic. What anime's it from? : P

And ok then, Doc, i'll keep that in mind. : 3

It's funny that before Substitute was considered pretty much useless and now I feel it's probably only behind Shulk's in usefulness. It kills very early, can be used as a escape measure and hell, it can even be used to either counter a potential gimp or as a recovery tool. It's funny how underrated it was at first.

Lol, sounds like Diddy Kong before everyone began realizing he was one of the current High tier characters..

 

[FullMoon]

I have a love/hate thing with Substitute. At times, I'll see the move come out, and yet I get hit anyway, or I miss them. And by "missing them" I don't mean in the sense that I tried to Substitute on like, a dash attack.

Moves with repeating hits, such as Charizard's Upsmash is annoying. I'll see my pop out, but then I get hit by the remaining hits of the move.

I'm pretty sure I've used Substitute to punish Charizard's Up-Smash when it tried to catch my landing before, but yeah, they should've made so that Greninja is invincible during the first few frames of the attack so he couldn't be hit out of it.

Well, to be fair it's still pretty slow to actually attack. I agree though, despite all the hate it got early on it's easily one of my favorite counters.

It's slow but against character with moves with very little end lag such as Sheik, I guess Substitute could be used to get away and get some breathing room. It's my favorite counter as well, because it's a very unique counter in execution and is very versatile as well.

One day I'm going to catch someone trying to edgeguard me with a backwards Substitute and KO them for their arrogance, it shall be glorious even if it has a high chance of failure.

 

[Mocha]

I'm pretty sure I've used Substitute to punish Charizard's Up-Smash when it tried to catch my landing before, but yeah, they should've made so that Greninja is invincible during the first few frames of the attack so he couldn't be hit out of it.



It's slow but against character with moves with very little end lag such as Sheik, I guess Substitute could be used to get away and get some breathing room. It's my favorite counter as well, because it's a very unique counter in execution and is very versatile as well.

One day I'm going to catch someone trying to edgeguard me with a backwards Substitute and KO them for their arrogance, it shall be glorious even if it has a high chance of failure.

Maybe I got hit because I angled it down. Will try aiming it up or to the sides next time if I'm feeling bold.

Btw any one here feel like practicing advance techniques on wifail lag? Maybe someone can point me to the right direction on what I'm doing wrong on some of these :I

 

[Ffamran]

Lol, nice pic. What anime's it from? : P

And ok then, Doc, i'll keep that in mind. : 3

Danshi Koukousei no Nichijou or Daily Lives of High School Boys in English. It's hilarious; they even have a skit about Dragon Quest.

 

[Cenizas]

Doesn't Greninja have a counter that shieldbreaks?

 

[Lavani]

Doesn't Greninja have a counter that shieldbreaks?

jesus christ I didn't even know about this

learning greninja secrets from the zelda social

 

[FullMoon]

Doesn't Greninja have a counter that shieldbreaks?

That must be the painfully slow Substitute custom. It might shieldbreak, but honestly I think it would be very easy to just move out of the way, the only way I can see for anyone to get hit by it is if they trigger the counter with Rest.

 

[NekoJubei]

Imagine if pikachu had a custom up b that does three quick attacks but don't have much range oooooh...too bad it doesn't :<
Also Zelda and Villager make a pretty good team ;D Villager can set up it's tree while Zelda does din's fires and stuff hell,if you have time let the villager cut the tree near Zelda so that she can deflect it and let the villager pocket the tree and we all know that a pocketed Tree is a KO

I really wanna try out Zelda in doubles xD my secondary is Zelda but I don't have a partner :/

 

[Ffamran]

jesus christ I didn't even know about this

learning greninja secrets from the zelda social

More like learning about everyone's secrets from the Zelda Social. Let's see, we talked about Falco, Ike, Zelda, Greninja, Kirby?, Shulk, Dr. Mario, Triple D, Palutena, and others I'm probably missing. The Zelda Social is like an underground lab. Now all we need is some sick underground beats.

 

[Furret]

More like learning about everyone's secrets from the Zelda Social. Let's see, we talked about Falco, Ike, Zelda, Greninja, Kirby?, Shulk, Dr. Mario, Triple D, Palutena, and others I'm probably missing. The Zelda Social is like an underground lab. Now all we need is some sick underground beats.

gib mi some pit tech then

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

Imagine if pikachu had a custom up b that does three quick attacks but don't have much range oooooh...too bad it doesn't :<
Also Zelda and Villager make a pretty good team ;D Villager can set up it's tree while Zelda does din's fires and stuff hell,if you have time let the villager cut the tree near Zelda so that she can deflect it and let the villager pocket the tree and we all know that a pocketed Tree is a KO

I really wanna try out Zelda in doubles xD my secondary is Zelda but I don't have a partner :/

NekoJubei, please do not double post. Just use the "Edit" button to edit your previous post. Next time will result in a warning so please keep that in mind.

And to keep on topic...

Hello Zelda mains. Any raids lately?

 

[Ffamran]

gib mi some pit tech then

Didn't Lavani show us that Upperdash/Electroshock slide thing a while back?

 

[Lavani]

That must be the painfully slow Substitute custom. It might shieldbreak, but honestly I think it would be very easy to just move out of the way, the only way I can see for anyone to get hit by it is if they trigger the counter with Rest.

That and it's laggy as hell after the fact too. Can't combo off it, I think Greninja might even have frame disadvantage on hit if he doesn't kill with it.

I didn't realize how much bonus shield damage it had though, it does more damage to shields than DK's sideB.

 

[S.F.L.R_9]

Chain Judge is more reliable in damage racking, 9 only kills slightly later, and most notably, you don't hurt yourself when you draw 1.

I don't really know much about Rosa's customs, so I'll take your word for it. Got any good videos of them in action though?

Lavani already said the stuff about her insane Luma warp combos and 5% Falco lasers, but I can talk about up b and down b:
Launch Star Plus (up b 2) really has no use, her recovery already goes insanely far and the angle is better than extra distance/quicker recovery. Launch Star Attack (up b 3) is..i'm not sure. She might be able to do her famous uair strings and finish it off with LSA to do a ZSS kind of thing. Catch & Release (down b 2) is used in matchups where your opponent has no projectile or item. The difference between it and Guardian Luma (down b 3) is that the hitbox for C&R is on Rosalina, whereas for GL it's on Luma.

 

[WolfieXVII ❂]

Doesn't Greninja have a counter that shieldbreaks?

Funny story
I have this custom Mac that has max strength equipment (200 is the highest number) and he has a shield breaker custom. The custom goes through the shield ;;
One fully charged super armored USmash does 54%. I know, I'm a monster

 

[NekoJubei]

NekoJubei, please do not double post. Just use the "Edit" button to edit your previous post. Next time will result in a warning so please keep that in mind.

And to keep on topic...

Hello Zelda mains. Any raids lately?

Sorry haha I write alot ill keep in mind next time xP
Well so far with my Zelda I already know how to Love Boost and Love Jump now I'm trying to learn to Farore's Wind Ledge cancel on ALL stages just to know the location where to although Is not that simple for me :/