Guide Zelda Social: But also the FE Heroes Internet Cafe

[Lavani]

Personally I think it's pretty disgusting when other people have opinions.

 

[Lorde]

the SF series is catered towards a competitive playerbase, though

smash is intended to be a party game and even sakurai has been known to ignore or even disparage the competitive playerbase (although he has gotten better with smash 4)

a large portion of the playerbase is super casual, not to mention how many players are children.

that difference in intended audience, casual majority, and competitive minority in smash is the root in many of the differences between the fanbase of smash and other "actual" fighting games

 

[TTTTTsd]

the SF series is catered towards a competitive playerbase, though

smash is intended to be a party game and even sakurai has been known to ignore or even disparage the competitive playerbase (although he has gotten better with smash 4)

a large portion of the playerbase is super casual, not to mention how many players are children.

that difference in intended audience, casual majority, and competitive minority in smash is the root in many of the differences between the fanbase of smash and other "actual" fighting games

I mean, we're on Smashboards though! The hub of the competitive stuff! Most of the people who freak out or get unreasonably testy about Top player opinions/tierlists are people in the competitive sections haha.

Dunno, it just happens and it confuses me. You'd think the input would be valued or considered more, y'know....

 

[Lorde]

I mean, we're on Smashboards though! The hub of the competitive stuff! Most of the people who freak out or get unreasonably testy about Top player opinions/tierlists are people in the competitive sections haha.

Dunno, it just happens and it confuses me. You'd think the input would be valued or considered more, y'know....

i still think that stems from the whole intended v. actual audience thing

smash is comparatively easier to pick up and play than games such as SF or MK. there aren't pages of lengthy character-specific combos for players to memorize, nor are there unique inputs for each character's special moves, etc. at the base, smash is inherently simpler than the traditional fighter.

i think that simplicity gives (some) smash players a sense of false entitlement. they might think, "smash is so simple, so i know everything about it. therefore, everything i say is correct," (which obviously isn't true). when a top player disagrees with their opinion, they get up in arms about it. the typical SF player probably realizes that the SF series is difficult to understand and play, so they would value the opinion of someone with great skilled at the game more than a typical smash player would a skill smasher.

idk just my 2¢

 

[TTTTTsd]

i still think that stems from the whole intended v. actual audience thing

smash is comparatively easier to pick up and play than games such as SF or MK. there aren't pages of lengthy character-specific combos for players to memorize, nor are there unique inputs for each character's special moves, etc. at the base, smash is inherently simpler than the traditional fighter.

i think that simplicity gives (some) smash players a sense of false entitlement. they might think, "smash is so simple, so i know everything about it. therefore, everything i say is correct," (which obviously isn't true). when a top player disagrees with their opinion, they get up in arms about it. the typical SF player probably realizes that the SF series is difficult to understand and play, so they would value the opinion of someone with great skill at the game more than a typical smash player would a skill smasher.

idk just my 2¢

Yeah, I can definitely see what you're saying. It def does happen and it's really unfortunate haha.

 

[Zolda]

sisT I love lorde

so glad your "one of us" now

lorde is cool but the one true love is Bette Midler

 

[Koiba]

press uair and win

he's basically rosalina with an invincible luma

K then brb picking Halberd

Don't go offstage

How to play Cloud? Do the same thing you would do with Zelda...

Suicide up-B.

K then brb crying

Nair, Uair, learn autocancel windows.

Limit camp literally every character. You can do this. Don't go offstage (duh).

Have fun playing a super viable character (even tho you play like 3 of those already =O)

If you want, next time we play I can whip out my Cloud and try and show through demonstration. I'm not the BEST example but it's a start.

The essential things that you should learn with Cloud are:
-Spacing with nair.
-Learn the auto cancel window for fair and dair and uair.
-Dtilt, utilt, and fast fall uair are all amazing combo starters.
-Don't spam his smashes; they aren't safe on shield.
-Don't be afraid to camp with Limit Break. Sometimes, it's the best thing to do.
-Don't force yourself to use a Limit Break when you have fully charged it. Play some mind games with it.
-You can cancel Limit Charge into any move if you press the special button.
-Cloud's recovery is pretty bad. Going off-stage can be risky.

Cloud is a character that can effectively get damage, but he is more of a glass cannon really while he isn't in Limit mode. He's still a very fun character nonetheless and he's pretty viable. We can fight some time to show you how to play as Cloud.
Also, these are good videos to watch:

Oh this helped a ton thank you~



I should play your Clouds sometime and learn~

 

[Rickster]

Found Abadango's tier list. A note that ORDER has NO RELEVANCE in this list.

Guess Cloud is actually OP but seeing that Zelda is not F tier I think we should BAN•ZELDA instead

Personally I don't think tier lists should go anywhere past D tier (maybe even C- with some more patches). Everyone has at least a little something going for them. But that's just me.

 

[Lorde]

Yeah, I can definitely see what you're saying. It def does happen and it's really unfortunate haha.

yeah, the general smash playerbase is just awful.

hew do you main in SF, gorl? Rose is my main bae, but I also like Elena and Chun-Li in USF4. Idk specifically what other SF games I've played, but I generally use Chun-Li.

also i'm really bad at SF

 

[TTTTTsd]

yeah, the general smash playerbase is just awful.

hew do you main in SF, gorl? Rose is my main bae, but I also like Elena and Chun-Li in USF4. Idk specifically what other SF games I've played, but I generally use Chun-Li.

also i'm really bad at SF

I play Super Turbo and I main Guile. SF4 is not a good game IMO (but I used to play Dan and grapplers). SF5 I have interest in Nash, Guile, and Urien.

 

[Macchiato]

lorde is cool but the one true love is Bette Midler

Bette Midler is kewl but no sisT is as cool as Melanie Martinez

 

[Deleted member]

Oh this helped a ton thank you~



I should play your Clouds sometime and learn~

Definitely! I would be glad to fight you some time!
Just hit me up and we'll do some Cloud dittos!

Found Abadango's tier list. A note that ORDER has NO RELEVANCE in this list.

Guess Cloud is actually OP but seeing that Zelda is not F tier I think we should BAN•ZELDA instead

This tier list is so weird...
I didn't think that he would consider Roy that low and Cloud that high, beating Sonic and Rosalina. I think Cloud is good, but not top tier.

 

[Lorde]

I play Super Turbo and I main Guile. SF4 is not a good game IMO (but I used to play Dan and grapplers). SF5 I have interest in Nash, Guile, and Urien.

SF4 is pretty lame, but the roster is fantastic.

SF5's roster is super disappointing imo. At this point, Chun-Li is the only character I care about, but I'll probably play Juri if the leak is real. I don't really care much for Ibuki, but iirc she was mildly interesting in USF4. F.A.N.G. is basically the worst thing ever, but he looks kinda funny to play. I might use him.

I just want Rose in the game.

 

[TTTTTsd]

SF4 is pretty lame, but the roster is fantastic.

SF5's roster is super disappointing imo. At this point, Chun-Li is the only character I care about, but I'll probably play Juri if the leak is real. I don't really care much for Ibuki, but iirc she was mildly interesting in USF4. F.A.N.G. is basically the worst thing ever, but he looks kinda funny to play. I might use him.

I just want Rose in the game.

Leak was confirmed real on Sony's Twitter IIRC, which is why I said Guile and Urien alongside Nash. I think 5's roster is the core of SF basically, esp. with Guile being in the game (as DLC but nonetheless)

 

[Lavani]

ok now that I'm a bit less busy and have time for more than a one-liner

Found Abadango's tier list. A note that ORDER has NO RELEVANCE in this list.

Guess Cloud is actually OP but seeing that Zelda is not F tier I think we should BAN•ZELDA instead

This gives quite a bit of insight to why he dropped Pac and Wario for MK and Rosa, lol

Ryu not being in A+ surprises me. I'm guessing it's because of his confirms being SDIable?

Can't see Shulk in the same tier as Ike and DK. Assuming this is a combination of buff optimism for the former and lack of Japanese representation for all three.

D tier feels like "I don't have much of an opinion on these characters, but they're worse than C tier and better than E tier so I'm lumping them all together for now" tier. I wonder what he sees in Jiggs to keep her out of Zelcina tier, though.

 

[Xys]

Zelda is bad.

I'm pretty sure Zelda is auto banned from what i have been hearing so how could she be bad?

 

[Lorde]

Bette Midler is kewl but no sisT is as cool as Melanie Martinez

if you want a woman with white and black hair, you could at least have chosen a relevant artist

Spoiler: large image

Leak was confirmed real on Sony's Twitter IIRC, which is why I said Guile and Urien alongside Nash. I think 5's roster is the core of SF basically, esp. with Guile being in the game (as DLC but nonetheless)

I don't keep up with the game (obviously), so I had no idea. That's pretty cool.

All the characters I like are irrelevant in the grand scheme of things, but it still makes me sad they didn't get in.

 

[Antonykun]

so gorls My borderlands 2 vita bundle came over today
mfw i got it and started playing

mfw i found out they never gave the vita version dlc after the psycho pack meaning no digistruct peak and no OP levels

 

[Ffamran]

Capcom seems to be pulling a Killer Instinct (Reboot) with Street Fighter V. Less characters means they can fine tune them more, but the problem is if say, SFV bombs, then their DLC plans are probably screwed. If it doesn't, then they can keep making "seasons" and if they make those packs cost not so much, like say 15 USD for each season, then they could keep profiting from the game as years go by since unlike in the past, fighting games, or games in general, aren't getting annual releases without being real special like CoD or risking a ton of quality like Assassin's Creed. It takes a toll on them, especially in a game that needs fine-tuning.

Spoiler: I like ranting. :p

Smash 4 could have gone this direction and I think it should have gone this direction. They could have released it at say 40 USD with only 25 characters max. 12 of course are the original 12 with the 10 being newcomers and 3 being guest stars, Mega Man, Pac-Man, and Sonic. Next season would be the Melee characters, then Brawl, then whatever random stuff like Cloud, Ryu, etc. It would give them so much time to fine-tune the game, but is that what we really want is the question. With less content, they could polish them up really well which, admittedly, they don't really need to do for the original 12 as they aren't as dumb as the Melee characters - hi, Falco and Zelda - and almost all Brawl characters weren't really broken or stupid from character design more so game design since chain-grabs, hit stun canceling, and more made things really bad for characters. Problem with this is that players would have to constantly shell out more money on a game they might feel like should have been complete at the start.

The flipside is having pretty much everything in, but that means a ton of content the developers cannot fine-tune. It was noticeable already with Brawl which was delayed at least once, had weird things like Wolf's 60-frame meteor cancel and non-existent fast fall increase, Lucas's grab release problems, and how some characters e.g. Falco and Meta Knight made it out Q&A despite being horribly overpowered. Smash 4 had help from Namco Bandai and it's an even bigger game content-wise not to mention they had to make it for 2 platforms. Even with say, 5 years, that's a crapton of stuff to do. Melee was apparently developed in months and clones had to be made or else it would have had even less content. Notice how few characters get overhauled? Brawl "finished" overhauling characters since people complained about moveset clones, so they were made into semi-clones. Welp, what do you do know with 51 characters? Copy and paste the hell out everything and if there is something wrong, Meta Knight, you nerf the hell out of them. Hell, even Brawl copied-pasted things like Falco was basically Melee Falco with tweaks - most of which were horrible ideas. Only in special cases like with Bowser needing to match his more goofy self did things actually change.

It makes sense, though, as characters should have definite designs, except they should be overhauled if there's something wrong... Smash never did that; Smash just nerfed characters that were problematic like Falco, Marth, and Meta Knight. Other companies did overhaul like how SNK knew Iori Yagami was way too good of a character, so they took away his zoning, called it plot, and made him more into a rushdown than an all-around monster. His old self came back as DLC and some even argue that without his flames, he was still a monster of a character. SNK also evolved characters like how Kyo Kusanagi and Iori started out as moveset clones, but sequels made Kyo more rushdown and expanded on Iori's jack of all trades... Funny enough, they went the opposite in KoF XII where Kyo became all-around like his original self while Iori was overhauled to be a rushdown. In some cases, it's just aesthetic like how Ken still fights like he always had, but his moves look different in Street Fighter V.

Smash only evolved characters who were part of the development process: Mewtwo and Roy. Lucas was basically a cut and paste from Brawl and Smash 4 since they already had his Specials which were customs for Ness, they had his Side Smash which was one move shared between him and Lucas, and they even had his model sine Lucas is basically Ness without a hat and backpack, but with a pompadour. Mewtwo and Roy? They had their Melee template, but they took it further by redefining them, emphasizing their strengths. Both of them emphasized power which for Mewtwo lead to him being a glass cannon with 1.1.3 finalizing that by giving him an immense speed boost as most glass cannons tend to be fast-moving and Roy, whose power is at the base of his sword, should be moving fast to close the distance and hit there instead of being average in speed. They did that... For 2 characters. The other 51 characters part of the original development? There's Luigi, but Luigi was already different in Melee and still copied-pasted per game. Ganondorf got some nods with Flame Choke and... oh. Yeah. Almost all characters are the same; the few that aren't mostly had alterations to the properties of their moves and attributes affecting them Mario went from being a jack of all trades to leaning more towards a speedy comboer in Smash 4 and Sheik started off as... Sheik before slowly getting weaker and weaker by the game letting her become the annoying slapper and safe all the time Smash 4 Sheik. Others who were semi-cloned in Brawl remain pretty much the same in Smash 4. This hurts a lot of characters when previous mechanics don't work anymore or weird designs come back to bite them like how Falco's Blaster had the same total frames in each game, but Brawl reduced the startup, increased the firing rate, and increased the range which made SHDL real stupid and Smash 4 just removing the auto-cancel window, reducing fire rate and range pretty much wrecked his zoning game when going back to Melee's startup would have actually helped since the total frames were fixed meaning higher startup leads to lower recovery or how Marth's hitboxes never matched his animations in each game which is apparently considered fine or how his jab was pretty much borderline decent to bad until a patch actually changed how it worked making it good. Or how about Zelda? Do I need to say anything? A stagnant character who manages to get worse in each game and when things are fixed like her Up and Side Smashes in Brawl manage to be broken in Smash 4. What the hell? If they worked in Brawl and you just copied and pasted her from there, then why change whatever!? It was fine!

 

[GS3K]

Drank waaaaaaaay too many energy drinks (and I'm currently drinking one while typing), now I feel I can moonwalk off the walls

 

[Cress!]

http://smashboards.com/threads/let-the-battles-begin-cloud-matchup-thread.423711/#post-20645758
The Clouds think they go even with Sheik and that they can effectively edgeguard her.

NO YOU DON'T STOP MAKING UP THINGS TO OVERRATE YOUR CHARACTER

Also scroll down to see Ffamran advertise the dead Falco boards.

 

[Antonykun]

http://smashboards.com/threads/let-the-battles-begin-cloud-matchup-thread.423711/#post-20645758
The Clouds think they go even with Sheik and that they can effectively edgeguard her.

NO YOU DON'T STOP MAKING UP THINGS TO OVERRATE YOUR CHARACTER

Also scroll down to see @Ffamram advertise the dead Falco boards.

Ffamran tends to (in)directly advertise the deader than disco Flaco boards
btw I'm still salty gunner and swordfailure don't have a mod yet

 

[GS3K]

Ffamran tends to (in)directly advertise the deader than disco Flaco boards
btw I'm still salty gunner and swordfailure don't have a mod yet

The boards are deadzones m8.

 

[TTTTTsd]

http://smashboards.com/threads/let-the-battles-begin-cloud-matchup-thread.423711/#post-20645758
The Clouds think they go even with Sheik and that they can effectively edgeguard her.

NO YOU DON'T STOP MAKING UP THINGS TO OVERRATE YOUR CHARACTER

Also scroll down to see Ffamran advertise the dead Falco boards.

I don't think we can go even but B reverse Blade Beam does actually cover the 2 frame on Vanish so yes he can actually edgeguard her pretty sufficiently if she's recovering low. (This was stated by Emblem Lord, he's a very smart individual with real tournament experience)

Always do your homework.

 

[Ffamran]

Also scroll down to see Ffamran advertise the dead Falco boards.

I'd like to stay in my comfy sad box, please. ;_;

It's been dead after the last MU thread, Ryu's, was made. Nobody plays that MU much and that's the same for Cloud and will be the same for Bayonetta and Corrin. For every 100 of them, there's like 1 Falco.

 

[EODM07]

Afternoon girls. How's everyone doing?

Managed to clean my room today, had a shower and my breakfast as well. Glad I managed to get it done today. And I'll be looking through some stuff that University has sent me via email. Gonna read through some of the guides they got.

*Sees Abadango's tier list* I'll be honest. I don't see Lucina or Zelda being bottom tier. I can see them being maybe Low Tier to bottom of Mid Tier at best, but that's just me probably being WAY too generous.

Spoiler: Yuri pic of the day~

Spoiler: Something extra today too. :3

 

[GS3K]

I'm awake when I probably should be asleep, (6:00 a.m at the time of this post) since I had around 4 energy drinks.

 

[Berserker.]

Spoilers. Only for those who played/finished Undertale

Spoiler

 

[SBphiloz4]

Officially dropped Pichu for Sheik/Sheilda in Melee smh what I have become

 

[EODM07]

Just saw Episode 40 of Gintama 2015. And the Assassination Arc is still going. o_o
Well, it'll probably end next week. But I'm still hyped up for it.

 

[|ven|]

You can use JDownloader to download them, just copy the URL of the twitch video, click add link then paste the link and that's it.

I downloaded it. I don't know what I'm doing )))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

 

[EODM07]

I need to get a bit of this rust off. Would anyone be up for some matches?

If not, I can always spar tomorrow and play some Mario Maker today.

 

[buzzard]

I downloaded it. I don't know what I'm doing )))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

-Go to the twitch video you want to download and copy the link (like: http://www.twitch.tv/nintendo/v/30137266).
-Open JDownloader, look at the bottom for the "Add New Links" button and click it.
-Paste the link and choose where do you want to save it. Click Continue and wait while JDownloader scans the link.
-Go to the LinkGrabber tab if you're not redirected there, right click the file and choose "Start Downloads".
-Profit.

 

[|ven|]

-Go to the twitch video you want to download and copy the link (like: http://www.twitch.tv/nintendo/v/30137266).
-Open JDownloader, look at the bottom for the "Add New Links" button and click it.
-Paste the link and choose where do you want to save it. Click Continue and wait while JDownloader scans the link.
-Go to the LinkGrabber tab if you're not redirected there, right click the file and choose "Start Downloads".
-Profit.

Thank you! Just have to figure out how I'm going to cut my matches out Thanks again! It helps me a lot

 

[SBphiloz4]

"Your Zelda is not as good as your other characters, like your ZSS" - Random guy 2016

I'm sorry that I can't do 0-deaths with Zelda against you unlike Zero Skill Spamus and that my Zelda plays more lame and defensive than Sonic players :^)

maybe they say that because they don't want me to use Zelda more because she's banworthy

 

[EODM07]

This Palutena seems really good. Also, that Samus play by Jonny Westside.

 

[Locke 06]

Tfw your non-smash friend finds out you play smash.

Tfw when your hobbies get judged.

Tfw you realize a year ago you didn't even know what tfw stood for and now you use it. ;_;

 

[EODM07]

I feel like I should watch Stardust Crusaders now, since Diamond is Unbreakable got announced.

What do you girls think? o.o

 

[Xys]

Tfw your non-smash friend finds out you play smash.

Tfw when your hobbies get judged.

Tfw you realize a year ago you didn't even know what tfw stood for and now you use it. ;_;

The face when no face

 

[Lorde]

tfw your face gets stolen so you don't have a face