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Guide Zelda Social: But also the FE Heroes Internet Cafe

Locke 06

Locke 06

Sayonara, bye bye~
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Lavani said:
Good luck!

I never considered using the falco lasers for another usmash setup, they were already my favorite neutralB for him on paper but that kinda seals it. I can see where the default Blaster would have merit though. What's your favorite setup for Fox? I'm on 2132 atm, though there's pretty much no thought put into the downB beyond "other people seem to like that custom"
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I'm currently playing around with them. I looked at the Fox boards and saw the arguments for all of them, but I really don't think default Blaster sucks. Coming from a Mega Man mindset, free damage is free damage, and while it doesn't actually do anything significant, it makes my opponent avoid long range like the plague while falco laser is easily powershielded at long range along with its awful cooldown. I haven't tried laser 3, because it doesn't sound like it would fit in my gameplan (and I have limited time)

I've heard stuff about twisting Fox (haven't tried it yet) and default firefox being bad in comparison to fast firefox... but recoveries without hitboxes get abused all the time (see Rosalina). I'm a little conflicted, but I like default's distance and hitbox for at least some safety. I also dislike "kill dumb early" customs out of principle... but that's another story.

Big reflector's windbox is nice in some MU's according to what they say, but like... iunno.

Default side-B all the way. Wolf flash is a really nice recovery, but default side-B can pseudo combo into uair and you can use it to escape traps much better than wolf flash. (You can't shorten it in this game though... can you?)

Like I said... day 5 fox. I've messed with him a bit before, but never seriously. And I've watched plenty of Megofax to get an idea of what I want to do, as well as developed an actual personalized game plan with him based on my Mega Man which is kinda cool. Fox, as a character, is the antithesis of Mega Man, which is why I think I like playing as him.

Edit: I will say, his movement feels really natural to me for some reason. I just need to learn to space my movement better in order to bait and how to safely cross up nair without getting anti-air'd.

kyokoro_pamuyo said:
Did you say.... Northwest?
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Color me confused.
 
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Berserker.

Berserker.

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I mean seriously

I'm using Smash art just waiting for the moment to punish with a character that sucks at punishing. Basically, I'm just fishing for a read. This art is only good for anyone that's a master of reading. I mean, I'd still use it if I'm greedy but man. It really sucks. I'm better off just using speed to KO. Buster to rack up their damage to 150%+ then speed to kill... Or just use jump art and do some dumb death combo (n-air > d-air is a thing at higher percents)

I'd say the same for shield but it has some hidden uses. Like, you use it when you're getting bodied.
 
Lavani

Lavani

Indigo Destiny
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Locke 06 said:
I'm currently playing around with them. I looked at the Fox boards and saw the arguments for all of them, but I really don't think default Blaster sucks. Coming from a Mega Man mindset, free damage is free damage, and while it doesn't actually do anything significant, it makes my opponent avoid long range like the plague while falco laser is easily powershielded at long range along with its awful cooldown. I haven't tried laser 3, because it doesn't sound like it would fit in my gameplan (and I have limited time)

I've heard stuff about twisting Fox (haven't tried it yet) and default firefox being bad in comparison to fast firefox... but recoveries without hitboxes get abused all the time (see Rosalina). I'm a little conflicted, but I like default's distance and hitbox for at least some safety. I also dislike "kill dumb early" customs out of principle... but that's another story.

Big reflector's windbox is nice in some MU's according to what they say, but like... iunno.

Default side-B all the way. Wolf flash is a really nice recovery, but default side-B can pseudo combo into uair and you can use it to escape traps much better than wolf flash. (You can't shorten it in this game though... can you?)

Like I said... day 5 fox. I've messed with him a bit before, but never seriously. And I've watched plenty of Megofax to get an idea of what I want to do, as well as developed an actual personalized game plan with him based on my Mega Man which is kinda cool. Fox, as a character, is the antithesis of Mega Man, which is why I think I like playing as him.


Color me confused.
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tbh at first I thought Fox was a character that benefitted massively from customs and should absolutely be running something like 2332, but there's a lot of merit to the defaults. I agree wholeheartedly that default sideB is the way to go, it actually true combos into uair/bair at kill percents and has more on-stage application, much more worthwhile than a gimmicky spike and diagonal recovery. I could definitely see the rationale in staying with Fire Fox too, I agree with you on the hitboxless recovery thing (;_;) and Twisting Fox kinda guts the distance noticeably.

Day 5 Fox is still more than my "two nights of drunken theorycraft against CPUs" Fox so V: Character doesn't work for me though, I can't play fast/aggressive characters well.

And no, you can't shorten Fox Illusion in this game.

berserker. said:
I mean seriously

I'm using Smash art just waiting for the moment to punish with a character that sucks at punishing. Basically, I'm just fishing for a read. This art is only good for anyone that's a master of reading. I mean, I'd still use it if I'm greedy but man. It really sucks. I'm better off just using speed to KO. Buster to rack up their damage to 150%+ then speed to kill... Or just use jump art and do some dumb death combo (n-air > d-air is a thing at higher percents)

I'd say the same for shield but it has some hidden uses. Like, you use it when you're getting bodied.
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Smash art seems awful tbh

You give up damage, so if you fail to kill you aren't really getting anything in your favor out of your efforts. You're also giving up shield safety, have fun getting bodied off any shielded hit. And you open yourself up to the same vulnerabilities that you get as buffs, except your opponent still does full damage.

I used to think Shield was bad, but after seeing 9B surviving to 200% consistently I'm honestly really impressed by what it can do for Shulk's longevity and ability to abuse rage. Smash really only seems like the "well I'm dead on the next hit, might as well yolo" art to me.
 
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Locke 06

Locke 06

Sayonara, bye bye~
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Lavani said:
tbh at first I thought Fox was a character that benefitted massively from customs and should absolutely be running something like 2332, but there's a lot of merit to the defaults. I agree wholeheartedly that default sideB is the way to go, it actually true combos into uair/bair at kill percents and has more on-stage application, much more worthwhile than a gimmicky spike and diagonal recovery. I could definitely see the rationale in staying with Fire Fox too, I agree with you on the hitboxless recovery thing (;_;) and Twisting Fox kinda guts the distance noticeably.

Day 5 Fox is still more than my "two nights of drunken theorycraft against CPUs" Fox so V: Character doesn't work for me though, I can't play fast/aggressive characters well.

And no, you can't shorten Fox Illusion in this game.
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I'm a little worried that I'm just going to be dropping combos left & right because I haven't played the character enough... but he's still so good. As long as I don't touch a shield with anything other than cross ups or jabs, I'm golden. I think CPU9 practice with Fox is actually quite useful.

My favorite thing to do ever is pivot jump cancel usmash (ala Mario bros). It's so stylish and beautiful on Fox.

I usually can't play them well either... I keep running into giant hitboxes like Falco Fsmash when people think I might be there. But people don't do that nearly as much against Fox because whiff = usmash punish and I'm getting better at it. I said this in the CCM thread, but I really think Fox is a unique offensive pressure character similar to how Mega is a defensive pressure character. Lack of offstage game makes me cry everytime though.

DK is literally combo food for Fox though. I probably won't play him in bracket outside of custom DK.

Edit: Forgot to address Fox Illusion.... why did they take that out? His recovery is still pretty abusable.
 
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Berserker.

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Lavani said:
Smash art seems awful tbh

You give up damage, so if you fail to kill you aren't really getting anything in your favor out of your efforts. You're also giving up shield safety, have fun getting bodied off any shielded hit. And you open yourself up to the same vulnerabilities that you get as buffs, except your opponent still does full damage.

I used to think Shield was bad, but after seeing 9B surviving to 200% consistently I'm honestly really impressed by what it can do for Shulk's longevity and ability to abuse rage. Smash really only seems like the "well I'm dead on the next hit, might as well yolo" art to me.
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Smash art is bad. Lol. As in like, your neutral becomes average to non-existent. That's already a big reason to avoid using it.

Shield is actually great but the way of using it is.... unorthodox. Back in the day, we Shulks chimed on how Shield's defensive buffs were nuts. One was like, "I got combo'd hard by Sheik for like 20 hits or something.... 25% damage. Lolol." It came to my realization that shield art is great for... well, surviving and for reducing the reward for bodying Shulk. Oh and you're indirectly staling your opponent's attacks so there's that
 
Berserker.

Berserker.

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ArcticWolf said:
*sees mains*
:4lucina:? @ Berserker. Berserker.
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She's my secondary

Mac's f-smash deals 12% damage on shield Shulk. That's like... -8% from the original damage output
Locke 06 said:
Use when not in neutral? Like... ledge traps where utilt/ftilt/grabs will kill?
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Well, I'd say smash art is "situational" at best. I mean, yes. That could definitely work. Shulk's ledge traps are nuts, but outside of using it while you have the upper hand? Ehhh. It's not so good.

Now I mention situational, Shulk's arts are sort of designed to be "situational"
 
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Lavani

Lavani

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Smash gives you kill throws, I guess. That's kind of a big deal in this game.

I would think the other four arts would still be more useful though.
 
Berserker.

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Also, I got f-smash'd by Little Mac in shield art. Still was able to punish him after with dash grab. The good things about Shield art are fairly hidden, subtle yet surprisingly really helpful.
 
UkeNicky

UkeNicky

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I leave for an hour or so to play Mario Kart 8 and come back to see two whole pages about Fox



Fox too op, pls nerf next Sakurai and while you at it nerf Diddy smore tuu
this will surely please Breadquanda
 
Berserker.

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ArcticWolf said:
I tried playing her before, I felt like I couldn't even do anything with her.
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Well, she's still pretty bad but she's basically "F-smash" the character.
UkeNicky said:
I leave for an hour or so to play Mario Kart 8 and come back to see two whole pages about Fox



Fox too op, pls nerf next Sakurai and while you at it nerf Diddy smore tuu
this will surely please Breadquanda
Click to expand...
Don't think Fox is anywhere near 1.04 Diddy level
 
Locke 06

Locke 06

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Fox's BAir still autocancels when you delay it so that it hits DK's head allowing it to true combo at low %'s into utilts.

Sploooooooosh.

That's enough for one night. Night gorls.
 
Locke 06

Locke 06

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berserker. said:
When he was my actual secondary. I still use him when I feel like it but I realized, "If I'm good with Fox.... Why the hell should I use Shulk?"

Then I dropped him
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That thought crossed my mind... It slightly worries me, but I'll cross that bridge when I get there. AAA utilt is still my calling card and my Fox is pretty raw.

I also prefer defense over offense, so Mega's pretty solidly my main forever.
 
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Berserker.

Berserker.

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Wow. Just wow.

So there's this 10 year old kid new to Smash. He mainly plays Melee. He's been asking really DUMB questions like, "How do you SH with Fox?" Well YEAH, that is dumb but he's been harassed and I'm starting to feel sorry for him. I mean sure, I learned how to short hop when I was 12 years old (which is older than 10, capt. obvs) but.... I've seen the comments to the guy. It's really offensive, and I won't be surprised if he'll leave the community with a sour taste. Then again, I'm in the same community who has one of the more frequent and notable posters say that DIDDY IS FINE HE DOESN'T NEED TO GET NERFED
 
Soul.

Soul.

　
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berserker. said:
When he was my actual secondary. I still use him when I feel like it but I realized, "If I'm good with Fox.... Why the hell should I use Shulk?"

Then I dropped him
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Why lol. If you lose with Monando Boy you use Fox and **** on everyone. You don't have to main him when he's just used to cover Monando Boy's bad/disadvantageous MUs
 
Berserker.

Berserker.

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Soul. said:
Why lol. If you lose with Monando Boy you use Fox and **** on everyone. You don't have to main him when he's just used to cover Monando Boy's bad/disadvantageous MUs
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It'd be waaay easier to use Fox alone since his match up spread is ultimately superior to Shulk's. Shulk is a difficult character to master, learn, and hell even to practice with so I need to budget a lot of time into him. I can just make the workload a lot smaller for me if I dropped Shulk for Fox but nah. I got personal attachments to Shulk so.... yeah.

Plus, winning with Shulk feels better. It also comes with a slick victory theme
thehard said:
Just dropping by to post this

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Nice avatar ;)
 
Trieste SP

Trieste SP

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Just watched Chokaigi. Luminous's DDD is amazing. The way he spaced out ZeRo's Diddy shows he definitely understood the character. BRB, gonna take some notes from the match.
 
McKnightlíght

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Getting back into the dunk game
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"From Double posting in ur threads."


I never noticed this before. I wonder how he got permab&T?
 
Alacion

Alacion

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Got beat pretty bad by a FG Pikachu. Why are his moves so safe? Why doesn't he (and local Pikachu players) ever go in?

There's no way Fox is better than Pikachu or ever will be. What is quick attack?
 
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