Zelda + Sheik

[Pubik Vengeance]

Okay, so I realize it isn't so much of a good idea to switch between Zelda and Sheik, but I think if someone went out to try and master such a strategy they could end up having success.

So I am wondering, does anyone here know anyone that switches between Zelda and Sheik that isn't a complete casual and plays competitively?

I am willing to guess there won't be anyone but I am still curious.

Thanks.

 

[Agent Snop]

i play with both the best thing i can tell you is to switch when your opponent know your moves they get confuse is like fighting 2 character hope it work for you
2 is better then 1.

 

[Pubik Vengeance]

Hmm interesting. Do you attend tournaments often with this strategy?

Because, yeah, like you said, it could really catch an opponent off gaurd, but it seems really difficult to do.

 

[Agent Snop]

no toury but best time to do this is when you send your opponent like across the stage or when your opponent is trying to come back to the stage

 

[Iris]

It's too slow and punishable to be used to catch most players off, and most people who can play competitively can adapt.

It's best to use them in the build damage/KO way. Sometimes the matchup calls for only one of them, but in scenarios when they're both effective it's a good idea. Start as Sheik and get them to a good 70 or 80%, then smash them away and change. Zelda will have a bunch of full power moves to use now to add the final hits and kill. A good idea could be to throw in her quick smashes for damage building and do a d-tilt to up-tilt combo to finish them at around 100%.

 

[SinkingHigher]

Are you kidding? That's my favourite strategy. I used to main with Sheik in Melee, so I am used to her moves. I switched to Zelda is Brawl though. After a while, I realised the key to Zelda/Sheik is to use both players.

I open with Sheik. Get the damage up to about 80-100% pretty quickly. If you know how to use Sheik well, you will probably get about 10% damage by this time. She is extremely agile.

I know there is a giant lag time, but what I do is jump off the edge of the stage, high up, so they can't attack me while I begin the transformation, and by the time I'm done, I'm level with, or below the stage, and then either Vanish or FW back to the stage. Since Zelda attacks at the beginning and end of FW, and she's invincible inbetween, there's really nothing they can do.

If you can, jump off with Sheik, transform into Zelda, teleport INTO the opponent, which, if you do it right, will knock them off the edge. Then, jump after them and spike. They need to be at high damage so that you can land and jump before they get back to the edge though.

Make sure you practice the 16-direction thing though. Sometimes it takes abnormally long, and you're so low that you need to go North-North-West.

Goodluck.

 

[Agent Snop]

Are you kidding? That's my favourite strategy. I used to main with Sheik in Melee, so I am used to her moves. I switched to Zelda is Brawl though. After a while, I realised the key to Zelda/Sheik is to use both players.

I open with Sheik. Get the damage up to about 80-100% pretty quickly. If you know how to use Sheik well, you will probably get about 10% damage by this time. She is extremely agile.

I know there is a giant lag time, but what I do is jump off the edge of the stage, high up, so they can't attack me while I begin the transformation, and by the time I'm done, I'm level with, or below the stage, and then either Vanish or FW back to the edge. Since Zelda attacks at the beginning and end of FW, and she's invincible inbetween, there's really nothing they can do.

If you can, jump off with Sheik, transform into Zelda, teleport INTO the opponent, which, if you do it right, will knock them off the edge. Then, jump after them and spike. They need to be at high damage so that you can land and jump before they get back to the edge though.

Make sure you practice the 16-direction thing though. Sometimes it takes abnormally long, and you're so low that you need to go North-North-West.

Goodluck.

great strategy

 

[Tristan_win]

Go to the Sheik forum and ask the same question

I would imagine all of the regulars including myself would answer this with a yes.

 

[SinkingHigher]

great strategy

Hehe, fankz. :3

 

[Pubik Vengeance]

Wow, this is really interesting. Thanks for the input you guys.

 

[popsofctown]

I know there is a giant lag time, but what I do is jump off the edge of the stage, high up, so they can't attack me while I begin the transformation, and by the time I'm done, I'm level with, or below the stage, and then either Vanish or FW back to the edge. Since Zelda attacks at the beginning and end of FW, and she's invincible inbetween, there's really nothing they can do.

If you can, jump off with Sheik, transform into Zelda, teleport INTO the opponent, which, if you do it right, will knock them off the edge. Then, jump after them and spike. They need to be at high damage so that you can land and jump before they get back to the edge though.

Make sure you practice the 16-direction thing though. Sometimes it takes abnormally long, and you're so low that you need to go North-North-West.

Goodluck.

That's not a tournament-viable strategy. Faore's wind can be edge-hogged. It takes a little skill to edge hog it, but you can. Unless you like to strategize based on assumptions of your opponent's incompetence, you should count this idea out completely.

 

[SinkingHigher]

That's not a tournament-viable strategy. Faore's wind can be edge-hogged. It takes a little skill to edge hog it, but you can. Unless you like to strategize based on assumptions of your opponent's incompetence, you should count this idea out completely.

You don't have to grab the ledge. You can just land on the stage.

Try it out before judging it.

 

[Agent Snop]

well it work for me

 

[imdavid]

i agree with the transform when needing a kill

 

[sFoster]

For online tournaments, I wonder if you could signal your computer to create a bunch of bandwidth lag.. freeze up the rest of the game while you transform, and then cancel the computer bandwidth once the load has completed. lol

 

[popsofctown]

You don't have to grab the ledge. You can just land on the stage.

Try it out before judging it.

If you refer to the original post of the concept, it specifically said the edge.
If you modify it to say that you will teleport back to the stage, I've no objections.

 

[Excellence]

I knew a very good Zelda/Shiek player, who played both, until he got mad at me and deleted me (Seraph). What I noticed is, battles have a certain tempo to them. The tempo is decided by the characters playing each other, but is largely affected by the leading character. For example, Shiek and Bowser, assuming Shiek is controlling the match, her attack style makes up the tempo.

What needs to be done is, change the tempo once the opponent has been brough to rythmn. Can you imagin an opponent who has just got used to Zelda's slower base only to have to speed up due to Shiek? If your opponent is slow, use Zelda's range to rack up damage and force them to keep getting close while you runaway or knock them away. Then switch to Shiek for the KO or vice-versa.

The thing which makes Zelda/Shiek being played together is the fact that they have two different styles of play that when used together fill in each other's weaknesses.

 

[SinkingHigher]

If you refer to the original post of the concept, it specifically said the edge.
If you modify it to say that you will teleport back to the stage, I've no objections.

LOL. Fixed.

That was meant to say stage. (I'm sick. My concentration is not what it usually is.)

 

[rageagainst]

we're talking competitively here.

competitively, MOST of the time the answer is no, just finish killing them with sheik instead of swtiching to Zelda when your opponent is at around 80%. BUT, IF you have the time, IF you have the spacing, IF you know how to play with both chars, then definately go for it.

switching safely is VERY situational, one example of how to do it safely is if you knock your opponent off with sheiks Dsmash off the side of the stage at around 80%, then RUN to the other side and switch (shiek is pretty fast) this SHOULd work if your oppononent doesn't have projectiles. However, depending on the opponent, it may be worth the risk of taking 1/2 lasers or whatever projectile they have, in order to switch.

Zelda should not switch back to Sheik in the middle of the battle unless you are getting ripped apart by one of those rare matchups that favor Sheik and not Zelda (like lucas/ness)

 

[Airgemini]

Most of the time when I KO with Zelda I transform to Sheik and back to remove the diminishing effects on her attacks.

 

[Ztarfish]

You have more control over transformation than you think you do. Neither you nor your opponent really know how long it'll take, so even if you mess up big time and your opponent is charging an Fsmash right next to you, you still have time to shield it right after you transform.

That being said, dont transform in a situation where your opponent will charge an Fsmash right next to you.

And yes, switching to Sheik for the purpose of refreshing stale moves is a viable tactic as long as you're not dumb about it.

Personally I don't do this, cause I'm dumb about it. But whatever.

 

[sniperworm]

I transform when I respawn (during invincibility so I don't get murdered) when I feel things totally aren't going my way. It's funny that most people don't know that you keep the leftover invincibility when you transform (free shots anyone?). Either that or when I get a vertical kill (so I have plenty of time) and I want to change the pace of the match.

I don't usually change to get kills because Zelda can kill (even with diminished attacks) and Sheik's edgeguarding is awesome.

For me, on the whole, transforming is more just for casual though. During tournies it's pretty much an accident when I do it (since I'm not as good with Sheik as I am with Zelda).

 

[Ztarfish]

Yeah it is pretty weird that you retain respawn invincibility after transformation in Brawl when you didn't in Melee and transformation was 10 times faster.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

I think it's really useful to change the pace of a match, and to solve matchup issues, so I almost feel it necessary to be able to main with both