Why is online in this game so bad?

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OnyanRings

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Yeah, Quickplays is terrible and the GSP system makes me feel bad everytime i lose, seeing those numbers go down with each loss is very unsatisfying.

I found that playing in arenas is much more enjoyable :
-You can switch characters in between matches.
-You don't lose any points for losing.
-You have complete control over the rules.
-You're much less likely to get a laggy match.

TL;DR : Just play arenas.
 

Xquirtle

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Ever seems like everyone should've listened when i told you not to pay for online?
Yeah, i've thought about this in a bigger sense as well. Like nintendo probably thinks that the game is a huge success, because based on sales it for sure is. Its almost a false sense of success since basically tons of people will always buy smash and pay for the online, even when the online is garbage. The game itself is great, so they earned that praise, but obviously, the online is uniquely awful. It has this awkward combination of triple A "polish" and hilariously stupid decision making / terrible "netcode" design. When i say triple A polish, i just mean the graphics and animations are pretty good. Its just not often that you see such an exceptional game with such a horrifying online experience.

Anyway, I don't think that boycotting the 3 dollar online will do anything. The way to fix this is to relentlessly complain on a large scale, which basically is happening anyway. Didn't nintendo say that they are working on improving online? whatever that means
 

J.I.L

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Yeah, i've thought about this in a bigger sense as well. Like nintendo probably thinks that the game is a huge success, because based on sales it for sure is. Its almost a false sense of success since basically tons of people will always buy smash and pay for the online, even when the online is garbage. The game itself is great, so they earned that praise, but obviously, the online is uniquely awful. It has this awkward combination of triple A "polish" and hilariously stupid decision making / terrible "netcode" design. When i say triple A polish, i just mean the graphics and animations are pretty good. Its just not often that you see such an exceptional game with such a horrifying online experience.

Anyway, I don't think that boycotting the 3 dollar online will do anything. The way to fix this is to relentlessly complain on a large scale, which basically is happening anyway. Didn't nintendo say that they are working on improving online? whatever that means
These people better be doing that. And also work on some other things like making world of light multiplayer. These people spent so much time on marketing and graphic designs that they forgot to actually make a good user friendly game. Smash ultimate is a complete disappointment. But they are raking in checks because they just marketed it really well and had to graphics.
It’s infuriating how such a dissapoijtment this game is.

It’s even more disgraceful that they had a solid formula in smash 4 that just should have been expanded on.... but they just went in a different direction that was utterly worse. What were those devolpers thinking? Goodness. Such ineptitude. How pathetic.
 
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yyy50yyy

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These people better be doing that. And also work on some other things like making world of light multiplayer. These people spent so much time on marketing and graphic designs that they forgot to actually make a good user friendly game. Smash ultimate is a complete disappointment. But they are raking in checks because they just marketed it really well and had to graphics.
It’s infuriating how such a dissapoijtment this game is.

It’s even more disgraceful that they had a solid formula in smash 4 that just should have been expanded on.... but they just went in a different direction that was utterly worse. What were those devolpers thinking? Goodness. Such ineptitude. How pathetic.
I think you are being a bit too harsh, the game itself really does shine as the best smash competitively and casually for a long while. The solo world of light is a much needed resolve to events and a campaign based mode. The devs did seem to make online a less than optimal experience at times, but I have found arenas to be the near to perfect fix for that. Claiming "such ineptitude" is pretty hypocritical as I don't see you making a superior game and online experience. This game does have rough spots with its online play don't get me wrong, but this game is super easy to pick and is extremely user friendly. If this game is such a disappointment why are you still playing?
 
D

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Yeah, Quickplays is terrible and the GSP system makes me feel bad everytime i lose, seeing those numbers go down with each loss is very unsatisfying.

I found that playing in arenas is much more enjoyable :
-You can switch characters in between matches.
-You don't lose any points for losing.
-You have complete control over the rules.
-You're much less likely to get a laggy match.

TL;DR : Just play arenas.
"Seeing those numbers go down with each loss is very unsatisfying." This is very aptly put. Whatever metrics are used for matchmaking, we the players don't need to see it. And we certainly don't need to see in real-time the game passing judgment on us. It's an idea that should have been shot down when it was a mere concept, which makes me think it was implemented by someone who doesn't know what they're doing when it comes to online play, or Sakurai--or both.

All of those points about arena battles are good and I've tried to get into them as well, but unfortunately they come with some downsides:
-If you really want a specific set of rules for your own arena, good luck trying to lure players to join you, especially if you want 4 players
-Since the above is not viable, you're left with browsing arenas trying to find the next closest thing you wanted, sometimes needing to join and back out
-when you do find an arena that looks promising, you usually have to wait to fight, on top of the wait you spent to find the arena
-about half of the time after this, the arena just gets shut down before you have a chance to actually fight, or you got booted, idk
-about 3/4 of the remaining half, the matches will be laggy, or you may get just a couple matches in before the host decides to shut down the arena
-now you're back to actively spending another 5-10 minutes to find your next battle

In the small percentage where the stars have aligned, arena battles were tons of fun. But at that point it's about the same percentage that things are fun when I do it through Quickplay, and at least there I don't have to put in so much work to find people to play with. Lesser of two very, very, very bad evils for me.
 

J.I.L

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I think you are being a bit too harsh, the game itself really does shine as the best smash competitively and casually for a long while. The solo world of light is a much needed resolve to events and a campaign based mode. The devs did seem to make online a less than optimal experience at times, but I have found arenas to be the near to perfect fix for that. Claiming "such ineptitude" is pretty hypocritical as I don't see you making a superior game and online experience. This game does have rough spots with its online play don't get me wrong, but this game is super easy to pick and is extremely user friendly. If this game is such a disappointment why are you still playing?
It’s going to shine the best competively because there are a plethora of cheap characters to use, and casually since it’s roster is so huge and because smash itself is a casual game. Nothing really unique on that casual part.
This online system is a cheap rushed piece of mediocrity. The ideas that went into this thing showed ineptitude on the devolpers because their ideas are garbage hence with the outcry against this online system.
BA is mediocre. Who likes waiting in stupid lines, where owners can boot whoever... where you get sent back to line if you do to much with your stick guy...where it can be shutdown and where stakes are low this making competition not as exciting when with gsp... my win means something.

Smash itself is user friendly but ultimate compared to previous smash games like 4, this game is a dissapointment. Sakurai either needs to sell the franchise or get a good online devlopement department. Because these one for ultimate we’re inept in terms of creating a good online play.
 

TriggerX

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I wouldn't say that the online being garbage is a Smash problem, I feel like it is a Nintendo problem.

Splatoon suffers from the same dumb decision making when it comes to its online lobby. If Im not mistaken, in that game you cant create parties. Essentially you have to start a match, and as the match is looking for opponents, you can send invites to friends or they can join you. And if they manage to get in because the lobby doesn't fill up, there is no guarantee that you will all be on the same team. Someone correct me if Im wrong, but I only played it a handfull of times.


Apparently the new Sonic Racing game is setup similarly on the Switch, which means the online lobby and party system is handled much differently than it's PS4 and XB1 counterparts.

Unfortunately when it comes to online play, Nintendo has no idea what they are doing.
 

J.I.L

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"Seeing those numbers go down with each loss is very unsatisfying." This is very aptly put. Whatever metrics are used for matchmaking, we the players don't need to see it. And we certainly don't need to see in real-time the game passing judgment on us. It's an idea that should have been shot down when it was a mere concept, which makes me think it was implemented by someone who doesn't know what they're doing when it comes to online play, or Sakurai--or both.

All of those points about arena battles are good and I've tried to get into them as well, but unfortunately they come with some downsides:
-If you really want a specific set of rules for your own arena, good luck trying to lure players to join you, especially if you want 4 players
-Since the above is not viable, you're left with browsing arenas trying to find the next closest thing you wanted, sometimes needing to join and back out
-when you do find an arena that looks promising, you usually have to wait to fight, on top of the wait you spent to find the arena
-about half of the time after this, the arena just gets shut down before you have a chance to actually fight, or you got booted, idk
-about 3/4 of the remaining half, the matches will be laggy, or you may get just a couple matches in before the host decides to shut down the arena
-now you're back to actively spending another 5-10 minutes to find your next battle

In the small percentage where the stars have aligned, arena battles were tons of fun. But at that point it's about the same percentage that things are fun when I do it through Quickplay, and at least there I don't have to put in so much work to find people to play with. Lesser of two very, very, very bad evils for me.
I got to slightly disagree with you there. Even though gsp is not perfect, if this online system was good and user were really happy and content with this online system. Gsp wouldn’t be as big of a bother, I think it’s good they implemented some type of ranking system. It’s a step up from smash 4. What they need to do is before match, show the gsp of your oppent instead of it being after. Trust me, that’d elevate stress as well.
 

Xquirtle

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I wouldn't say that the online being garbage is a Smash problem, I feel like it is a Nintendo problem.

Splatoon suffers from the same dumb decision making when it comes to its online lobby. If Im not mistaken, in that game you cant create parties. Essentially you have to start a match, and as the match is looking for opponents, you can send invites to friends or they can join you. And if they manage to get in because the lobby doesn't fill up, there is no guarantee that you will all be on the same team. Someone correct me if Im wrong, but I only played it a handfull of times.


Apparently the new Sonic Racing game is setup similarly on the Switch, which means the online lobby and party system is handled much differently than it's PS4 and XB1 counterparts.

Unfortunately when it comes to online play, Nintendo has no idea what they are doing.
You're right. Nintendo was anti-competitive anything for years. They marketed gimmicks and single player games, and intentionally did not dive into anything that was competitive online. In fact, they were blatantly against it. Now they are a decade behind on online technology after living in their weird bubble, and online play is the most important aspect of every player vs player video game these days. Ulti is dead as all get out on twitch, which is absurd considering its sales and popularity. The online experience is just so awful that it doesn't grip people in in any way. Its just something that devoted players suffer through. If it had real ladders, leagues (bronze gold plat diamond etc), rank 1 spots to chase after, tournaments, etc... it would be way more popular.

Splatoon actually has a ladder i think... not certain, but i've heard that it is better than smash ulti.
 
D

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It may be a mix of both, but generally the developers for each game decide how the online works. Splatoon's online is not very good for grouping with friends (it's....possible but unless you're both good and can be in a squad then it's not worth it), but I'd say it's otherwise much better than Smash Ultimate's online.

And, Super Mario Maker 2's online is looking better than ever. I mean--online Mario platformer multiplayer? That's a first, as far as I know. We'll have to see how it is in action though.

Other games that are on the Switch can do online multiplayer much better, such as Rocket League or Paladins, especially when it comes to grouping with friends and playing the type of matches you want. So again....it's really Sakurai's fault in this case.

EDIT:
I got to slightly disagree with you there. Even though gsp is not perfect, if this online system was good and user were really happy and content with this online system. Gsp wouldn’t be as big of a bother, I think it’s good they implemented some type of ranking system. It’s a step up from smash 4. What they need to do is before match, show the gsp of your oppent instead of it being after. Trust me, that’d elevate stress as well.
I don't let GSP bother me personally, but like OnyanRings OnyanRings said, it's unsatisfying seeing it decrease just because you're playing the game. Take the aforementioned Rocket League and Paladins for example: regardless of whether you win or lose a match, you're always seeing numbers increase--usually in the form of level experience or whatnot, which will eventually grant bonuses of their own. So you never feel like you were wasting your time. It may seem like a little thing, but I think it makes a big difference now that I know what it's like when something like that is not only absent, but actively working in an opposite fashion.
ANOTHER EDIT: I guess there are coins but....I've got plenty so that doesn't really do much for me and I usually don't even notice that I earn them.
 
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yyy50yyy

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It’s going to shine the best competively because there are a plethora of cheap characters to use, and casually since it’s roster is so huge and because smash itself is a casual game. Nothing really unique on that casual part.
This online system is a cheap rushed piece of mediocrity. The ideas that went into this thing showed ineptitude on the devolpers because their ideas are garbage hence with the outcry against this online system.
BA is mediocre. Who likes waiting in stupid lines, where owners can boot whoever... where you get sent back to line if you do to much with your stick guy...where it can be shutdown and where stakes are low this making competition not as exciting when with gsp... my win means something.

Smash itself is user friendly but ultimate compared to previous smash games like 4, this game is a dissapointment. Sakurai either needs to sell the franchise or get a good online devlopement department. Because these one for ultimate we’re inept in terms of creating a good online play.
Nah, competitive is not based on cheap characters, its based on the speed, options, and ability to play the game. That's why so many pros from other games are flocking to ultimate, it is truly a great competitive experience where skill can shine through, as well the support it is getting is amazing. Smash is regarded as a casual game, but ultimate does a great job in allowing a competitive scene to arise and flourish. The online is not the best as stated before, but the arenas offer a lot of great options to fix this. GSP is such a weird system that I just has a feeling to it. Hard to describe. When I was doing quickplay's I didn't feel there was this skill gap between the hundred thousand gsp 1 mil and 2 mil gsp. Where as in battle arenas there is a large jump between skill levels and its very obvious. Even between beginner battle arenas and veteran the jump is huge and really gives something to work towards.
 

J.I.L

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It may be a mix of both, but generally the developers for each game decide how the online works. Splatoon's online is not very good for grouping with friends (it's....possible but unless you're both good and can be in a squad then it's not worth it), but I'd say it's otherwise much better than Smash Ultimate's online.

And, Super Mario Maker 2's online is looking better than ever. I mean--online Mario platformer multiplayer? That's a first, as far as I know. We'll have to see how it is in action though.

Other games that are on the Switch can do online multiplayer much better, such as Rocket League or Paladins, especially when it comes to grouping with friends and playing the type of matches you want. So again....it's really Sakurai's fault in this case.

EDIT:

I don't let GSP bother me personally, but like OnyanRings OnyanRings said, it's unsatisfying seeing it decrease just because you're playing the game. Take the aforementioned Rocket League and Paladins for example: regardless of whether you win or lose a match, you're always seeing numbers increase--usually in the form of level experience or whatnot, which will eventually grant bonuses of their own. So you never feel like you were wasting your time. It may seem like a little thing, but I think it makes a big difference now that I know what it's like when something like that is not only absent, but actively working in an opposite fashion.
ANOTHER EDIT: I guess there are coins but....I've got plenty so that doesn't really do much for me and I usually don't even notice that I earn them.
Hm... I guess you may be right. But we defitnly do need some tier system where you increase or decrease based on well you play. I’m not a fan of participation trophies in online battle. If you play sucky you get penalized via lower rank, points or whatever.
 
D

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Hm... I guess you may be right. But we defitnly do need some tier system where you increase or decrease based on well you play. I’m not a fan of participation trophies in online battle. If you play sucky you get penalized via lower rank, points or whatever.
People forget that Smash 4 also did matchmaking, it just wasn't so transparent like it is in Ultimate. And because of that, you could just concern yourself with playing the game and having fun. In Smash 4 there also weren't any "participation trophies" but it also never gave players visible penalties for playing the game.
 

Xquirtle

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People forget that Smash 4 also did matchmaking, it just wasn't so transparent like it is in Ultimate. And because of that, you could just concern yourself with playing the game and having fun. In Smash 4 there also weren't any "participation trophies" but it also never gave players visible penalties for playing the game.
You sure about that? I learned on smash 4 and it felt like there was zero match making. It took me hundreds of games to get a new tag to a 50% win rate lol. Like my experience was just getting completely and utterly dumpstered for 10+ games in a row until i found another potato. Even though i had been playing with friends and such since 64, i was totally outclassed in FG.
 

J.I.L

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People forget that Smash 4 also did matchmaking, it just wasn't so transparent like it is in Ultimate. And because of that, you could just concern yourself with playing the game and having fun. In Smash 4 there also weren't any "participation trophies" but it also never gave players visible penalties for playing the game.
There was match making in smash 4? But I agree with having fun. Sighs... the beautiful memories of that games online. Had so much fun and good times. I mean ultimate doesn’t give penalties... just that gsp loss depresses players which I get. Though the good thing about 4 was that it had records based on name tags which is thoroughly did enjoy. I’d change my name tag based on how serious I was so I could protect the record of my name tag when I used my mains. And then ultimate, like the genius we obviously know those online devolpers are, took that away and makes name tag less meaningful. Sighs... those ultimate online devolpers...anyway.
Xquirtle Xquirtle my dude,Mc-squirrtle ... I was rocking with your prior posts on smash ultimate putrid online but then you said you struggled against for glory players? Lol, for glory was a joke. For glory hell is where is was at if you wanted serious 1v1. I got sent there about 17-18 times if I remember correctly. Too many charmin ultra soft players kept reporting me because I kicked their butts and taunted on normal for glory servers.
 

Xquirtle

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There was match making in smash 4? But I agree with having fun. Sighs... the beautiful memories of that games online. Had so much fun and good times. I mean ultimate doesn’t give penalties... just that gsp loss depresses players which I get. Though the good thing about 4 was that it had records based on name tags which is thoroughly did enjoy. I’d change my name tag based on how serious I was so I could protect the record of my name tag when I used my mains. And then ultimate, like the genius we obviously know those online devolpers are, took that away and makes name tag less meaningful. Sighs... those ultimate online devolpers...anyway.
Xquirtle Xquirtle my dude,Mc-squirrtle ... I was rocking with your prior posts on smash ultimate putrid online but then you said you struggled against for glory players? Lol, for glory was a joke. For glory hell is where is was at if you wanted serious 1v1. I got sent there about 17-18 times if I remember correctly. Too many charmin ultra soft players kept reporting me because I kicked their butts and taunted on normal for glory servers.
It was the first time I took a smash game seriously outside of tap jumping and only using my C stick and meta knight tornado against friends in college. I sucked, and it did not feel like I was receiving any sort of match making (my point). Smash is an incredibly punishing game if your opponent is just a little bit better, and its almost impossible to beat somebody who is significantly better. Anyway, I've since played tens of thousands of matches (no joke) between 4 and Ulti to work past it. I just didn't pull up FG day 1 on my wifi 3ds with zero real 1v1 experience and start wrecking people.
 
D

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Yes matchmaking was present in Smash 4, based more on the win rate apparently. If you think it didn't exist at all then you're being ignorant. I played Smash 4 a ton and my win rate always hovered just over 50%, and I felt like I usually was playing people on my skill level.
I found this gem though from someone four years ago on another site:
---------------------------
MarkyD7 4 years ago#10
Pretty sure there's a skill based matchmaking system in place. I used to fight people I would wreck and now I consistently get good matchups.

Just because you don't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist people....you think Sakurai would ruin the "fun" factor by explicitly showing your rank?
---------------------------
....if only he could have known....
 

Xquirtle

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Yes matchmaking was present in Smash 4, based more on the win rate apparently. If you think it didn't exist at all then you're being ignorant. I played Smash 4 a ton and my win rate always hovered just over 50%, and I felt like I usually was playing people on my skill level.
I found this gem though from someone four years ago on another site:
---------------------------
MarkyD7 4 years ago#10
Pretty sure there's a skill based matchmaking system in place. I used to fight people I would wreck and now I consistently get good matchups.

Just because you don't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist people....you think Sakurai would ruin the "fun" factor by explicitly showing your rank?
---------------------------
....if only he could have known....
I wouldn't deny its existence entirely but it did not seem very good. Like ulti is just clearly better at match making, and I still think its pretty bad, but its much more evident that its there. If 4 was win % based, which is very likely, then it basically has bad match making by definition. That would just push everybody but the very best and worst players into one lump at 50%.
 
D

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I wouldn't deny its existence entirely but it did not seem very good. Like ulti is just clearly better at match making, and I still think its pretty bad, but its much more evident that its there. If 4 was win % based, which is very likely, then it basically has bad match making by definition. That would just push everybody but the very best and worst players into one lump at 50%.
Well earlier today you said you felt like there was zero matchmaking in Smash 4 so I'm glad you've come around. And I never said it was good; just that it was there.
But good matchmaking doesn't outweigh all of the plethora of problems that Smash Ultimate's online currently has. Smash 4's online wasn't perfect, but it also wasn't......sh**.
 

Xquirtle

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Well earlier today you said you felt like there was zero matchmaking in Smash 4 so I'm glad you've come around. And I never said it was good; just that it was there.
But good matchmaking doesn't outweigh all of the plethora of problems that Smash Ultimate's online currently has. Smash 4's online wasn't perfect, but it also wasn't......sh**.
Yeah i literally meant that I 'felt' like it had none. I could never figure out how it actually worked or what the deal was with it. I remember trying to look it up because i was getting frustrated. Anyway, I still think i'd take ulti online over smash 4. We made clear steps backwards in the rule sets, and basically everything that is not match making, but the match making really does make it more enjoyable for me. and as trash as GSP is, I do like knowing roughly where each of my characters falls (I like to play and learn lots of characters).
 

Sucumbio

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WiiU 3d3 online was great really still laggy but with room to improve bs like what they did do but not important stuff like less lag. But somehow someway someone at the dev studio decided yes this is better... nay, ULTIMATE.
 

J.I.L

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Yeah i literally meant that I 'felt' like it had none. I could never figure out how it actually worked or what the deal was with it. I remember trying to look it up because i was getting frustrated. Anyway, I still think i'd take ulti online over smash 4. We made clear steps backwards in the rule sets, and basically everything that is not match making, but the match making really does make it more enjoyable for me. and as trash as GSP is, I do like knowing roughly where each of my characters falls (I like to play and learn lots of characters).
Just because ultimate has a few improvements from smash 4 does not mean its online is anywhere near as enjoyable as 4 was. Ultimate online is a complete barrel of animal waste. Those people rushed this thing so bad. And what's frusterating is they undid A LOT of what they did in smash 4. WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY? Just did what you did with smash 4 and improve on it. WHY WAS THAT SO DIFFUCLT FOR THOSE PEOPLE IN THE BOARDROOM TO UNDERSTAND? *Breathes*
That's what the most frusterating thing about it. I LITERALLY CANNOT GET A TEAM BATTLE. I'm always thrown into stressful 1v1 situations, the game wont even let you wait till you get your preferred rules. Why is things like team battle, 1v1 or smash 4 "preferred rules"? preferered rules in of itself is stupid as well. Just have standard rule sets for each modes and let people with their friends and family create their own rulesets in a friends mode (another thing those beatuies decided to get rid of from smash 4) or offline but online mode should have stanrd rulesets because it's public and you're playing with strangers. SOMETHING THEY USE TO LAWAYS DO. GOOD HEAVENS YOU ONLINE DEVOLPERS...WHAT HAPPENED TO YOUR LOGIC? If I were in power.... I would berate so hard... SO HARD.... Whoever came up with th ieas for this online game. They would get berated so hard then I would finish it off with a nice clean and loud crisp of "YOU'RE FIRED" with extra explistives thrown out as they leave the room sulking. Because this online system is a COMPLETE DISGRACE.

EDIT: ya know what? I'M NOT DONE! Their offline system is A JOKE as well.
1. Why in the world did you spend so much time on world of light ( which somehow is still infeior to brawls campaign mode which they made a DECAD AGO) and not EVEN ALLOW MULTIPLAYER?
2. Why is my name tag for smash account forcebally put on into my chracter icon. The problem is, Ihave my exact same name tag for specfic controls I use. So everytime my bro is done playing, I play and see my name tag thinking its my controls. Only to find out its actaully just the defualt (no name tag) thats just hihglights as my account name tag which is identical to the name tag with my speicfic controls. So I go in the first game with default controls which I don't play with and always have to SD my first game.
3. Why did these devolpers decide to sperate offline (AND BA?) from online iin terms of Battle Data? Why couldn't they just combine and then let players sperate it if they wished. And why is BA considered OFFLINE?
4. Why in online don't they show the characters name while playing? a small nitpick...and it's kinda stupid they have name tags of users account under their character screen instead of the name of character
5. Why are there so much character inquaility? At least in previous games where were only a few cheap characters, now in ultimte you have mutlple cheap characters.
6. Why did you restrict dodge role? That's so stupid. Dodge role was never really that hard to punish in previus games. Why resirct it. You just make it harder and more stressful for casuals while only stroking the ego of like medicore players who struggle to punish dodge rolling.
7. The heck is the point of smash tags? An uncessary addtion
8. Why the bleep do I have to beat medicore world of light just to change menu music?

This game is just a striahgt up dissapointment. It's a downgrade from smash 4 IMO.
 
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Xquirtle

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Just because ultimate has a few improvements from smash 4 does not mean its online is anywhere near as enjoyable as 4 was. Ultimate online is a complete barrel of animal waste. Those people rushed this thing so bad. And what's frusterating is they undid A LOT of what they did in smash 4. WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY? Just did what you did with smash 4 and improve on it. WHY WAS THAT SO DIFFUCLT FOR THOSE PEOPLE IN THE BOARDROOM TO UNDERSTAND? *Breathes*
That's what the most frusterating thing about it. I LITERALLY CANNOT GET A TEAM BATTLE. I'm always thrown into stressful 1v1 situations, the game wont even let you wait till you get your preferred rules. Why is things like team battle, 1v1 or smash 4 "preferred rules"? preferered rules in of itself is stupid as well. Just have standard rule sets for each modes and let people with their friends and family create their own rulesets in a friends mode (another thing those beatuies decided to get rid of from smash 4) or offline but online mode should have stanrd rulesets because it's public and you're playing with strangers. SOMETHING THEY USE TO LAWAYS DO. GOOD HEAVENS YOU ONLINE DEVOLPERS...WHAT HAPPENED TO YOUR LOGIC? If I were in power.... I would berate so hard... SO HARD.... Whoever came up with th ieas for this online game. They would get berated so hard then I would finish it off with a nice clean and loud crisp of "YOU'RE FIRED" with extra explistives thrown out as they leave the room sulking. Because this online system is a COMPLETE DISGRACE.

EDIT: ya know what? I'M NOT DONE! Their offline system is A JOKE as well.
1. Why in the world did you spend so much time on world of light ( which somehow is still infeior to brawls campaign mode which they made a DECAD AGO) and not EVEN ALLOW MULTIPLAYER?
2. Why is my name tag for smash account forcebally put on into my chracter icon. The problem is, Ihave my exact same name tag for specfic controls I use. So everytime my bro is done playing, I play and see my name tag thinking its my controls. Only to find out its actaully just the defualt (no name tag) thats just hihglights as my account name tag which is identical to the name tag with my speicfic controls. So I go in the first game with default controls which I don't play with and always have to SD my first game.
3. Why did these devolpers decide to sperate offline (AND BA?) from online iin terms of Battle Data? Why couldn't they just combine and then let players sperate it if they wished. And why is BA considered OFFLINE?
4. Why in online don't they show the characters name while playing? a small nitpick...and it's kinda stupid they have name tags of users account under their character screen instead of the name of character
5. Why are there so much character inquaility? At least in previous games where were only a few cheap characters, now in ultimte you have mutlple cheap characters.
6. Why did you restrict dodge role? That's so stupid. Dodge role was never really that hard to punish in previus games. Why resirct it. You just make it harder and more stressful for casuals while only stroking the ego of like medicore players who struggle to punish dodge rolling.
7. The heck is the point of smash tags? An uncessary addtion
8. Why the bleep do I have to beat medicore world of light just to change menu music?

This game is just a striahgt up dissapointment. It's a downgrade from smash 4 IMO.
I'd say that the core game itself - the combat and movement - is clearly better than 4. Most of these things, personally, i just don't care about. WoL is trash and inferior to brawl, but whatever. idc. All that I would fix in the game is to narrow the online rule sets so that there is a pure 1v1 ranked mode, change GSP to a traditional ELO / league based system with a real ladder, and add some sort of filter for laggy matches. Like surely the game COULD detect that a match, despite close geographical proximity, will have 1 second of input lag, and just don't match those players. Although, it probably already does, and it just allows players to have horrible connections and ruin the experience for everybody else to be inclusive.

Imo, dodge roll and air dodge changes were the best thing they did. Defensive camping was so obnoxious in smash 4, especially with online lag making punishes tighter. Personally, I'd like for ultimate's dodge roll to be as bad as melee's dodge roll. Its actually one of my favorite things about melee, that dodge rolling is so bad. Really brings out the offense and makes movement and spacing more important. Not saying that it isn't punishable in ultimate, but lets be honest here, the most common strategy that I see online is a dodge roll spamming projectile camping link/samus. Its still a heavily heavily used defensive option, especially the lower your gsp goes. It just gets stronger and stronger as players get worse and have no idea how to handle it.
 

J.I.L

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I'd say that the core game itself - the combat and movement - is clearly better than 4. Most of these things, personally, i just don't care about. WoL is trash and inferior to brawl, but whatever. idc. All that I would fix in the game is to narrow the online rule sets so that there is a pure 1v1 ranked mode, change GSP to a traditional ELO / league based system with a real ladder, and add some sort of filter for laggy matches. Like surely the game COULD detect that a match, despite close geographical proximity, will have 1 second of input lag, and just don't match those players. Although, it probably already does, and it just allows players to have horrible connections and ruin the experience for everybody else to be inclusive.

Imo, dodge roll and air dodge changes were the best thing they did. Defensive camping was so obnoxious in smash 4, especially with online lag making punishes tighter. Personally, I'd like for ultimate's dodge roll to be as bad as melee's dodge roll. Its actually one of my favorite things about melee, that dodge rolling is so bad. Really brings out the offense and makes movement and spacing more important. Not saying that it isn't punishable in ultimate, but lets be honest here, the most common strategy that I see online is a dodge roll spamming projectile camping link/samus. Its still a heavily heavily used defensive option, especially the lower your gsp goes. It just gets stronger and stronger as players get worse and have no idea how to handle it.
Just make a ranked serious play that allows 4 player smash, team battle and 1v1. We can use whatever your ELO ranking is. For 1v1, allow people to choose between BF or FD stages.
Allow us to change characters between matches. If they can start off with this, that’s an improvement.

So punishing defense to expand offense. That’s stupid. If you’re really good offensively, be above the defensive camp play. Side air dodge is fine, but at least allow us to roll normally. My falco’s role in smash 4 was so nice. Just role back and forth across the end of the beautiful omega stages as my oppent got 50 lasers to the face, my shield kick to the face when they tired to creep up on me or my sweet side bash dash if they ran up to me. I’d kill them then taunt them. Or in team battle... let my partner go in the frontline and go 1v2 while I stood in the back and shot my laser (more effective then it sounds).good ole days of smash 4.

Edit: speaking of lasers... that woman. I got to rematch her. She got so full of herself because she beat me when I had stinking joy con controllers. Time for part 2. Has she released any footage of our match.
 
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Zareidriel

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Unpopular opinion: this online is the best yet and I love it. Aside from the billions of obvious improvements that could be made, the system is solid. GSP doesn't matter and people are way too obsessed over gaining and losing it. I get free for all or item games about 1 of 50 or 100 and that's a fine ratio for me. Being able to jump into a 3 stock, 7 minute match with no items on BF or FD at the touch of a button is a godsend of convenience.

Honestly the only thing I don't like about smash ultimate's online is the players. Everyone is basically always leaving after one game, win or loss. Probably trying to game their precious GSP. It's hecking dumb. Just play the hecking game, people.
 
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J.I.L

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Unpopular opinion: this online is the best yet and I love it. Aside from the billions of obvious improvements that could be made, the system is solid. GSP doesn't matter and people are way too obsessed over gaining and losing it. I get free for all or item games about 1 of 50 or 100 and that's a fine ratio for me. Being able to jump into a 3 stock, 7 minute match with no items on BF or FD at the touch of a button is a godsend of convenience.

Honestly the only thing I don't like about smash ultimate's online is the players. Everyone is basically always leaving after one game, win or loss. Probably trying to game their precious GSP. It's hecking dumb. Just play the hecking game, people.
Of course the 1v1 Battle Field player like this online game, and of COURSE meleebrawler meleebrawler likes a comment praising this online game immdietatly after its posted. loool. I got to take a break from this forum....

But hey mate. Have you ever thought there is more to smash online then getting a bunch of 1v1s? I mean, it's cool you like it...but you only seem to like it because its taken care of your thing which is 1v1, but that dosen't mean this online system is even remotly close to being satisfactory. Heck, it might be too praise worthy to call this online system medicore. Straight garbage sounds much more fitting.
 

yyy50yyy

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Messages
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Just make a ranked serious play that allows 4 player smash, team battle and 1v1. We can use whatever your ELO ranking is. For 1v1, allow people to choose between BF or FD stages.
Allow us to change characters between matches. If they can start off with this, that’s an improvement.

So punishing defense to expand offense. That’s stupid. If you’re really good offensively, be above the defensive camp play. Side air dodge is fine, but at least allow us to roll normally. My falco’s role in smash 4 was so nice. Just role back and forth across the end of the beautiful omega stages as my oppent got 50 lasers to the face, my shield kick to the face when they tired to creep up on me or my sweet side bash dash if they ran up to me. I’d kill them then taunt them. Or in team battle... let my partner go in the frontline and go 1v2 while I stood in the back and shot my laser (more effective then it sounds).good ole days of smash 4.

Edit: speaking of lasers... that woman. I got to rematch her. She got so full of herself because she beat me when I had stinking joy con controllers. Time for part 2. Has she released any footage of our match.
Yo, you actually complain about cheap characters in ultimate and then you explain your smash 4 tactic of running away and spamming lasers. You serious?
That exact "strategy" you described is why smash 4 was not taken as seriously as melee, and why ultimate has been an enormous step up in competitive play. Forcing players to be more tactical with their rolls options and out of shield options opens the game and allows any number of characters to be played at a high level.
I would love to see that footage btw. Sheesh I think I would love to just play you in general and get my own footage for uploading. If you are giving out Johns now about the joy cons you will always give out Johns when you lose serious 1v1's. DM if you want to do a 1v1, I have to see your tactics in person.
 
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D

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Unpopular opinion: this online is the best yet and I love it. Aside from the billions of obvious improvements that could be made, the system is solid. GSP doesn't matter and people are way too obsessed over gaining and losing it. I get free for all or item games about 1 of 50 or 100 and that's a fine ratio for me. Being able to jump into a 3 stock, 7 minute match with no items on BF or FD at the touch of a button is a godsend of convenience.

Honestly the only thing I don't like about smash ultimate's online is the players. Everyone is basically always leaving after one game, win or loss. Probably trying to game their precious GSP. It's hecking dumb. Just play the hecking game, people.
I've said this before earlier in the thread, but if you only play 1v1 it's a LOT easier to get the type of matches you want (I'll leave it to you to figure out why that is), but that's only a piece of the entire picture. So it's not so much an unpopular opinion as it is one with a small field of view.

Realistically, if I imagined Sakurai trying to fix (the majority of) the online situation, after hitting "Quickplay"/"Elite Smash" there would be another submenu with 3 additional options: 1v1, Team Battle, and Free for All. In any of those modes, the remainder of your preferences would still apply. But I adamantly believe those three options should not be left to chance. This wouldn't fix everything I've found frustrating with the online, but it would at least remove it from the category of "unacceptable".
 

J.I.L

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I've said this before earlier in the thread, but if you only play 1v1 it's a LOT easier to get the type of matches you want (I'll leave it to you to figure out why that is), but that's only a piece of the entire picture. So it's not so much an unpopular opinion as it is one with a small field of view.

Realistically, if I imagined Sakurai trying to fix (the majority of) the online situation, after hitting "Quickplay"/"Elite Smash" there would be another submenu with 3 additional options: 1v1, Team Battle, and Free for All. In any of those modes, the remainder of your preferences would still apply. But I adamantly believe those three options should not be left to chance. This wouldn't fix everything I've found frustrating with the online, but it would at least remove it from the category of "unacceptable".
That is 100% FACTS. It would turn this online game from a stressful piece of garbage to a satisfactory bowl of barley average.
 
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Unpopular opinion: this online is the best yet and I love it. Aside from the billions of obvious improvements that could be made, the system is solid. GSP doesn't matter and people are way too obsessed over gaining and losing it. I get free for all or item games about 1 of 50 or 100 and that's a fine ratio for me. Being able to jump into a 3 stock, 7 minute match with no items on BF or FD at the touch of a button is a godsend of convenience.

Honestly the only thing I don't like about smash ultimate's online is the players. Everyone is basically always leaving after one game, win or loss. Probably trying to game their precious GSP. It's hecking dumb. Just play the hecking game, people.
It's been said countless times in this thread, but just because Quickplay works satisfactorily for the subset of players that exclusively plays 1v1's doesn't mean it's good. If anything, it just makes it even more inconvenient and stressful for those who don't like playing 1v1's all the time. People who prefer Team Battles are especially screwed, since the game usually just defaults to a 3/4-person FFA when searching for players, or matches you into a 1v1 for whatever reason.
And yeah, the Quickplay playerbase is pretty awful. Even if they ironed out all the issues I have with the mode itself, I still probably wouldn't bother with it because of the players.
 
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TheDuke54

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I stopped doing team battles because of that dude. The 3 ffa sucks so bad cause no one and literally no one wants to fight. They just want to target whoever is in the middle like it is monkey in the middle. Which usually ends up being me because I'm trying to get them all to turn it into a legit ffa. And not a 'I'm to scared to lose my internet points'
 
D

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1v1 is not my least favorite ruleset, but it really only works when both players are pretty evenly matched. I could go on for paragraphs about why I prefer team battles though--they're more focused than a FFA and you can pull off some great comebacks and teamwork simply not possible in a 1v1. And while it doesn't devolve into just flailing around hitting anyone in reach or playing "monkey in the middle", it provides just enough chaos to more easily land an unsuspecting Flare Blitz or Warlock Punch where such moves are almost never possible in 1v1. Not everyone is a good team player, but when you and your teammate work together it's a thing of beauty.

So to have that mode essentially taken away from me, except in rather rare cases, is pretty frustrating and upsetting.
 

J.I.L

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I stopped doing team battles because of that dude. The 3 ffa sucks so bad cause no one and literally no one wants to fight. They just want to target whoever is in the middle like it is monkey in the middle. Which usually ends up being me because I'm trying to get them all to turn it into a legit ffa. And not a 'I'm to scared to lose my internet points'
lol, as much as I share you all is sentiment to the terribleness of this online... it still dosen't mean I don't maniuplate what i'm givento exact the best outcome.
When you get 3 FFA (or even 4)....just don't fight. ESpcially in 3 free for all. Don't be the monkey.... when I get FFA...it usually turns into a 1v1 where I just spectate. Usually either the winner of the "1v1" SDs, fights me (and most of the time losses) or I just SD myself to help the person out. Usually results in GSP gain and you just keep it moving.
Ze Diglett Ze Diglett what wrong with the playerbase?
@Mewtwo I feel you dude. Team Battle is my favorite mode too, sucks its the thing I get less. It really is upsetting.
 
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Ze Diglett Ze Diglett what wrong with the playerbase?
Degenerate play (as in, running away the whole match and refusing to actively engage anybody; why even play the game if your whole gameplan is to not play?), nobody stays for more than one game, and just general ****ty attitudes - stuff like teabagging is rampant now that they've removed taunts wholesale.
 

TheDuke54

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I don't even touch online all that much anymore unless it is with friends, to be honest. But even when I get matches I didn't want I still fought/played. I'd find it more boring and a waste of my time to just avoid fighters and do nothing.
 

J.I.L

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Degenerate play (as in, running away the whole match and refusing to actively engage anybody; why even play the game if your whole gameplan is to not play?), nobody stays for more than one game, and just general ****ty attitudes - stuff like teabagging is rampant now that they've removed taunts wholesale.
I don't engage people in 3/4 FFA. It's not my ruleset plus people will kill each other while you sit back and then get rid of whoever is left standing. Then you get that sweet gsp boost.
I usually don't stay for more then one game unless it's on accident or someone who I think I can best two games in a row. I sometimes even click rematch, then I see the person in the room.... I quit just before game locks you in.
I teabag all the time. If I can't taunt...I got to do something. though I'd prfer taunt over teabagging for sure.
As a matter of fact, I got to give nintendo this esteemed appraise. They allow you to do whatever you want on quickplay. As long as you don't break any rules (like offensive name, idling or anything immediealty punishable with bans) you're GOOD to go. No more for glory hell, no bans for being a "mean player"...no penealties for being a "toxic player" or whatever. It's good. I at least have freedom. Ness is my new main I use (3rd main). Because nintendo decided to buff up his PK fire and I have taken full advantage. I just PK fire my way to elite smas. Once I get to elite smash, I change my ruleset to 300 stamnia 3 stock, 7 minutes with items (I only do this with ness, It dosen't work with my two other mains) 1v1. If nintendo is going to use this stupid system of "preferred rules" (which I think should be abloished and done away with)... I might as well take full advntage of it.

I tell you this because I do this and don't get punished. I still get players to play with in 1v1 and it no soft bans or penetlies. And when I win with ness PK spam.... I tea bag. LOOOOOOOOOL. And nintendo does nothing to me..... I bet people report me with "bad sportmanship" and nothing happens to me. LOL. For that allowance of freedom....nintendo does deserve some appraise.
 
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TheDuke54

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Either that's a troll post or you're also part of the problem. You complain so much about the situation of online, yet indulge in it yourself. So you really don't have a reason to complain.
 

Coolboy

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I don't engage people in 3/4 FFA. It's not my ruleset plus people will kill each other while you sit back and then get rid of whoever is left standing. Then you get that sweet gsp boost.
I usually don't stay for more then one game unless it's on accident or someone who I think I can best two games in a row. I sometimes even click rematch, then I see the person in the room.... I quit just before game locks you in.
I teabag all the time. If I can't taunt...I got to do something. though I'd prfer taunt over teabagging for sure.
As a matter of fact, I got to give nintendo this esteemed appraise. They allow you to do whatever you want on quickplay. As long as you don't break any rules (like offensive name, idling or anything immediealty punishable with bans) you're GOOD to go. No more for glory hell, no bans for being a "mean player"...no penealties for being a "toxic player" or whatever. It's good. I at least have freedom. Ness is my new main I use (3rd main). Because nintendo decided to buff up his PK fire and I have taken full advantage. I just PK fire my way to elite smas. Once I get to elite smash, I change my ruleset to 300 stamnia 3 stock, 7 minutes with items (I only do this with ness, It dosen't work with my two other mains) 1v1. If nintendo is going to use this stupid system of "preferred rules" (which I think should be abloished and done away with)... I might as well take full advntage of it.

I tell you this because I do this and don't get punished. I still get players to play with in 1v1 and it no soft bans or penetlies. And when I win with ness PK spam.... I tea bag. LOOOOOOOOOL. And nintendo does nothing to me..... I bet people report me with "bad sportmanship" and nothing happens to me. LOL. For that allowance of freedom....nintendo does deserve some appraise.
that's just..kinda sad my dude..that is all i am gonna say about that..no one likes a Ness spammer just saying and it doesn't require any skill, even a 6 year old could do it no lie :l
your reply is a great example of taking a game waaay to seriously..take a chill pill listen to music/do something else cause my dude..you are getting waaay to worked up over some videogame >~>
btw being a Ness spammer just means you aren't a good player like at all..do you really want that reputation of being some sad Ness player who can't do anything else? yeah this might sound harsh but yeah i think someone needs to say it how it is.
 
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Xquirtle

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Just make a ranked serious play that allows 4 player smash, team battle and 1v1. We can use whatever your ELO ranking is. For 1v1, allow people to choose between BF or FD stages.
Allow us to change characters between matches. If they can start off with this, that’s an improvement.

So punishing defense to expand offense. That’s stupid. If you’re really good offensively, be above the defensive camp play. Side air dodge is fine, but at least allow us to roll normally. My falco’s role in smash 4 was so nice. Just role back and forth across the end of the beautiful omega stages as my oppent got 50 lasers to the face, my shield kick to the face when they tired to creep up on me or my sweet side bash dash if they ran up to me. I’d kill them then taunt them. Or in team battle... let my partner go in the frontline and go 1v2 while I stood in the back and shot my laser (more effective then it sounds).good ole days of smash 4.

Edit: speaking of lasers... that woman. I got to rematch her. She got so full of herself because she beat me when I had stinking joy con controllers. Time for part 2. Has she released any footage of our match.
I mean you're entitled to your opinion, but smash 4 is considered to be the worst smash game, by far, for its terrible movement, shields being too strong, roll being too strong, and air dodge being too strong. All of that stuff, rightfully so, was nerfed (or in the case of movement, fixed) in ulti. Still, i would not care if they made dodge rolls even worse, similar to melee. Spot dodging is still good, but rolling is much worse and easier to punish in melee. I get the impression, from your posts in general, that you like to camp people with laser and roll away to camp some more. That play style, in my opinion, should be squashed in favor of more close range engagements. I don't blame you for doing it, but I think that the game would be better as a whole if defense was worse. I like to play against players that actually fight me. They are the only people i rematch, win or lose. if you're going to try to camp me and force a boring game, I'll grind out my win, tea bag the final blow screen and give you a "you're amazing" before i slam that B button for no rematch :b:

In fact, the worst thing about online in ulti is that it panders to a degenerate corner camping meta that is just obnoxious to play against and drives away new players that see it for what it is - cheese.
 
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