Whose Mafia Is it Anyway - Game Over!

[#HBC | Ryker]

Following up, his vote on FF makes zero sense, especially considering that he felt Spak was scummy after Gorf's post.

This was in the middle of the Soup **** storm, so I don't think it ever got proper attention. Can you explain why his vote on FF is bad? I remember that one as "there's things out there, but I am not going to let a slot with one post stand at this time."

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I don't think Soup is scum. Soup is an experienced player and I highly doubt that he would be careless and carefree enough to "mishammer" as scum. It comes off to me as silly townie and his emotions and frustration leading up to his claim feels genuine to me.

Ryker's laser focus on Soup and lack of direction otherwise is weird to me and I don't like it.

Gorf, I think your issue with Spak is more of his playstyle and the way he words his posts. If you look at last game, with his interactions with Lore, he responded in a similar way.

Pythag is still scum and our best lynch option.

Then we're into today.

Defends Soup, doesn't like me, Gorf plz understand, Pythag is scum.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Dude. You can't go "yeah Lore is the one I want gone" after admitting you're ignoring my stuff. At least read it, this is lazy as hell.

well clearly orange is the one i want gone but the incentive to ignore your stuff and the reasons id be down for your lynch largely overlap

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

imma break into the next dimension later tonight on with a pythag reread, cant really do it right right now

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Conclusion:

I can sum up the slots actions leading into today with two observations.

1.) Stick up his ass wrt Pythag. Does pursue it, but there's a complete lack of new information, so obviously there's nothing new there.
2.) White Knights Soup and Lore. Lore more heavily. This leads to foo-foo on Kary, but nothing ever comes of that because we're busy with Pythag, I guess.

I don't really like this slot and if someone that isn't Soup is going, it's a fine candidate. Currently waiting on responses from stuff I've asked, but I REALLY despise the stuff most recent in the thread where he doesn't want to talk to Gorf anymore or actually push Pythag when the lynch falls on those he's defending if he doesn't act.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I am similarly going to bow out of the thread for now and go back to my MMO. If Tom wants to do Lore and Gorf wants to do Pythag, I'll weigh in on both.

 

[ranmaru]

To elaborate on Spak: His #58 is the only post when others are conversing around him. So he doesn't really post much besides that, until Marshy asks him more about it. In his #93 he explains his thought process and starts to say he might be thinking it's just town lore. To me, this seems he made that post to shade Lore after Tom was calling him weird, rather than actually consider it may have been town lore at all. If he had actually thought about it, he wouldn't have made that post. He cares to **** on Lore rather than determine his alignment.

This bears repeating.

 

[ranmaru]

Orange has a similar manner of playing around the Soup discussion, they feel disconnected when posting.

 

[ranmaru]

I am going to play some Mario Maker 2

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Could see myself voting Orange, they seem to have an awful lot of faith in their own reads for some reason, the slot has just been a bit off from the start.

Soup seems to be playing on a different planet to everyone else. If he could explain why his reads on myself / Spak changed then that would help to tie up some loose ends and I could see myself letting him live for another day.

Y'all gonna complain about my playstyle, this is your chance to ask me things and I will do my best to answer you tomorrow daytime.

Whatever, I'm out for tonight.

 

[Lore]

Oh also he seems to be sheeping other people's opinions recently. Although he openly admits to it ("I feel similar to Tom...") so that does confuse me as to what level of self-awareness he is playing on if he's mafia.

This is intentional on my part. I'm trying to account for my bad habit of tunneling by looking at other peoples' opinions, pointing out when I agree, and trying to account for them when making read lists.

Personally I think I failed at not tunneling here, although I'm still wholly convinced Soup is scum. I will work further on it next game / later in this one.

well clearly orange is the one i want gone but the incentive to ignore your stuff and the reasons id be down for your lynch largely overlap

Yeah but at least read my stuff if you want me gone instead of admitting you're ignoring lmao. This is less of me defending myself, more like calling out a (light) party foul.

Could see myself voting Orange, they seem to have an awful lot of faith in their own reads for some reason, the slot has just been a bit off from the start.

Soup seems to be playing on a different planet to everyone else. If he could explain why his reads on myself / Spak changed then that would help to tie up some loose ends and I could see myself letting him live for another day.

Y'all gonna complain about my playstyle, this is your chance to ask me things and I will do my best to answer you tomorrow daytime.

Whatever, I'm out for tonight.

Tbh your playstyle this game has been vastly superior to the last one imo. Thanks for generally being more chill.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Yeah but at least read my stuff if you want me gone instead of admitting you're ignoring lmao. This is less of me defending myself, more like calling out a (light) party foul.

i mean i have my reasons for wanting you gone (a lot of your play is VASTLY self centered, plenty of standout posts that i lightly skim and go "WOW what did i just read," you clog the thread, etc) but as far as i stand right now, im not interested in making the push because itd require me to read your posts. and thats a chore. a while back i said i defaulted to sheeping marshy for my read on you because im not sure if youre lynchbait like rockin was last game. im still not sure if you are, and thats because i havent read your posts. if tom comes in with a solid analysis of your play, i might sheep him whichever way he goes (if my orange wagon doesnt go through, which it looks like it could).

let me guess: youre gonna use this interaction to find my play "weird" and say it "constitutes a reread toMorrow" right?

 

[Lore]

Tom I've been thinking of potential oracle!Soup, and the order of operations does change some things. If they don't have a roleblocker (and if Soup isn't lying, which I extremely doubt), we get at least one result since I doubt scum wouldn't attempt to get the kill.

However, we have a pretty decent chance that they have a roleblocker, since there's only 3 different scum PRs possible (assuming they get at least one PR). If they only get one PR, we have a 33% chance. If they get two, it's much higher. They might get zero PRs, but that'd honestly be weird as hell.

Or, instead they might just not shoot him at all, leaving us to lynch him toMorrow. Then we still only get the 1 result, and they get to freely choose anyone else for a NK, confident that Soup will die D2 anyway. This possibility becomes more credible due to the fact that they might decide not to risk a potential protective role saving Soup.


Game logic-wise, I think leaving him alive is risky. However! I'm also absurdly biased here and my view stems from that. I see Soup as lying scum.


Out of respect for your question: I have no clue what I'd do if Soup somehow flips town. I'd have to dive into reading his wagon members and decide from there.

 

[ranmaru]

Lore, what is your stance on Orange right now?

 

[Lore]

i mean i have my reasons for wanting you gone (a lot of your play is VASTLY self centered, plenty of standout posts that i lightly skim and go "WOW what did i just read," you clog the thread, etc) but as far as i stand right now, im not interested in making the push because itd require me to read your posts. and thats a chore. a while back i said i defaulted to sheeping marshy for my read on you because im not sure if youre lynchbait like rockin was last game. im still not sure if you are, and thats because i havent read your posts. if tom comes in with a solid analysis of your play, i might sheep him whichever way he goes (if my orange wagon doesnt go through, which it looks like it could).

let me guess: youre gonna use this interaction to find my play "weird" and say it "constitutes a reread toMorrow" right?

I don't get this whole clog the thread thing. This is a game, and I enjoy playing it. I truly hate sitting on the sidelines and not being active; it's boring and not something I enjoy. Plus I feel like sidelining is a playstyle that benefits scum more than town, but take that statement as null since I'm 99% certain I've said that in other games too. It's just how I feel in general.

And nah it's not that it's weird, you've been open about how you're just kinda chilling. I just didn't like being told "yo you're a major lynch candidate for me" then "yeah I ignored your posts lol." I wasn't insulted or anything, but I'd rather you actually read if you want to bring me up as a lynch candidate lol.

I do think you've been sidelining a bit, but I can't tell how much of that has been July 4th Week Gorf or Normal Gorf. I don't have much of a meta for you (and I tend to ignore meta most of the time) too. So you're a pretty firm null that I'm sure will build up enough to get a read on as the game goes on.

 

[Lore]

Lore, what is your stance on Orange right now?

Mixed. I didn't really dislike Spak/Orange's play after the beginning, but I've already said that I'm not sure on my read for the slot.

What's more interesting to me imo is how many people keep repeatedly bringing up Spak. There's quite a few people either pushing or discussing Spak, which is interesting. If I was a vig, this is the kind of slot I'd shoot: an unclear read that a lot of people have made posts/reads about.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Tom I've been thinking of potential oracle!Soup, and the order of operations does change some things. If they don't have a roleblocker (and if Soup isn't lying, which I extremely doubt), we get at least one result since I doubt scum wouldn't attempt to get the kill.

What did you think NAR was that caused things to change?

 

[Lore]

What did you think NAR was that caused things to change?

I'm assuming that it's because RB is the only scum action that happens before Oracle and would stop the Oracle.

Tom Have you explained why you don't doubt Soup? Or have you just talked about how you want a potential N1 result?

 

[Lore]

Misunderstood your question Ryker, ignore my explanation.

ranmaru Have you explained why you felt the need to more or less ask for permission before dropping a Soup vote?

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I'm assuming that it's because RB is the only scum action that happens before Oracle and would stop the Oracle.

And? What did you think it was? How does that make a difference on letting Soup live for a night?

 

[Lore]

And? What did you think it was? How does that make a difference on letting Soup live for a night?

Just corrected myself, no worries. I misunderstood your question.

 

[ranmaru]

I am ready to flip soup, and feel we got enough out of him that I would vote him if others were fine if he were lynched right now. I did the same last game before voting Tom I think.

That was my explanation for that, alongside the fact of making sure if others are ready to have Soup at L-1. Generally a pro-town thing to do. People want more time, and I am fine with that.

 

[Lore]

That was my explanation for that, alongside the fact of making sure if others are ready to have Soup at L-1. Generally a pro-town thing to do. People want more time, and I am fine with that.

I feel like "his flip will give us info and if other people want it I'll hop on" is a bit weak reasoning for lynching someone who claimed a PR.

 

[ranmaru]

I never said I wanted him gone for info.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Just corrected myself, no worries. I misunderstood your question.

But are you going to answer it?

 

[Lore]

But are you going to answer it?

I'm a dumbass and thought it was a Tom post that you originally quoted, so I was answering for him. Didn't realize it was mine. I'm tired lol.

For me, I thought that it could be a situation where the Oracle happened after a vig shot but before a scum kill, which in hindsight is a really dumb assumption.

 

[Lore]

The censored word is dumb ass. I wish that the censor only covered the ass part.

 

[Lore]

I never said I wanted him gone for info.

Have you put up your reasoning anywhere?

 

[ranmaru]

I have done so.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I'm a ******* and thought it was a Tom post that you originally quoted, so I was answering for him. Didn't realize it was mine. I'm tired lol.

For me, I thought that it could be a situation where the Oracle happened after a vig shot but before a scum kill, which in hindsight is a really dumb assumption.

Okay, so you assumed it was after Vig and before scum.

How does NAR being cleared up change your read on what we should do?

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

I don't get this whole clog the thread thing. This is a game, and I enjoy playing it. I truly hate sitting on the sidelines and not being active; it's boring and not something I enjoy. Plus I feel like sidelining is a playstyle that benefits scum more than town, but take that statement as null since I'm 99% certain I've said that in other games too. It's just how I feel in general.

And nah it's not that it's weird, you've been open about how you're just kinda chilling. I just didn't like being told "yo you're a major lynch candidate for me" then "yeah I ignored your posts lol." I wasn't insulted or anything, but I'd rather you actually read if you want to bring me up as a lynch candidate lol.

I do think you've been sidelining a bit, but I can't tell how much of that has been July 4th Week Gorf or Normal Gorf. I don't have much of a meta for you (and I tend to ignore meta most of the time) too. So you're a pretty firm null that I'm sure will build up enough to get a read on as the game goes on.

your clogging the thread here has mostly consisted of an asinine back and forth between you and soup that is going to be a chore and a half if i ever have to go through the trouble of reading it, but from last game, a lot of the theory crafting and interactions you had were just sooooo long and just went absolutely nowhere. thats mostly just a personal thing for me, and im not telling you to stop. im just telling you ill never be bout it. ask ran.

i mean ive been chillin but ive also been playing the game, just willfully ignoring most of your posts. youre a major lynch candidate because your wagon has been a consistent presence and people have consistently thrown your name around for things i see as reasonable, along with what i stated. if one of you, soup, orange or pythag dont get lynched toDay, id be shocked.

im super interested in seeing what you mean by me sidelining if you decide to dive deeper into that route later on because i strongly disagree (unless you and i have different meanings of sidelining). but that read on me is fair enough if your attentions been paid elsewhere

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

i wonder if cuntbag is still not censored

 

[ranmaru]

"his flip will give us info and if other people want it I'll hop on".

Where did you get this from, and why did you think I was saying that?

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

yo no lie the kid makes some ****in BANGERS

 

[Lore]

your clogging the thread here has mostly consisted of an asinine back and forth between you and soup that is going to be a chore and a half if i ever have to go through the trouble of reading it, but from last game, a lot of the theory crafting and interactions you had were just sooooo long and just went absolutely nowhere. thats mostly just a personal thing for me, and im not telling you to stop. im just telling you ill never be bout it. ask ran.

i mean ive been chillin but ive also been playing the game, just willfully ignoring most of your posts. youre a major lynch candidate because your wagon has been a consistent presence and people have consistently thrown your name around for things i see as reasonable, along with what i stated. if one of you, soup, orange or pythag dont get lynched toDay, id be shocked.

im super interested in seeing what you mean by me sidelining if you decide to dive deeper into that route later on because i strongly disagree (unless you and i have different meanings of sidelining). but that read on me is fair enough if your attentions been paid elsewhere

Fair, no worries then. Also fair on my lynch being one of the viable ones.

On sidelining, you just haven't been out and about, interacting as much. I should say that it's less scum sidelining, more literal "he interacts when he's here but generally is just chilling." It's not scummy sidelining if that makes sense, just makes it a bit hard to read your slot on my end. I'll get more of a read as you post more.

Okay, so you assumed it was after Vig and before scum.

How does NAR being cleared up change your read on what we should do?

Pretty much exactly what I sad to Tom. The Vig not being before Oracle made me think that Oracle had even less of a chance to go off. It was a dumb assumption.

My issue on my end is that my scum read on Soup is biasing me though. The game theory is laid out, but I worry that I'm having a slanted reading of the theory due to my read.

99% sure Soup's lying though, let me be clear.

Where did you get this from, and why did you think I was saying that?

"I am ready to flip soup, and feel we got enough out of him that I would vote him if others were fine if he were lynched right now."

That's the impression I got from this post. "I am ready to flip Soup" implies, to me, that you are more interested in the flip's general info than getting scum. It's a really soft commitment to a lynch of a PR-claim, and I dislike it.

Even if my reading is wrong, it's still a very weak statement for this type of lynch. I'm absolutely not a fan of this type of hesitancy.

 

[Lore]

EBWOP: "Said to Tom." Typo.

 

[ranmaru]

Your reading is wrong. Go read the last page and tell me that again.

 

[Lore]

Your reading is wrong. Go read the last page and tell me that again.

I will in a bit, but it doesn't change the fact that your commital to the lynch, in the end, is weak as hell.

 

[ranmaru]

It does, and I'll be waiting.

 

[KevinM]

KevinM answer my #534

Still reading so subject to change but I look more heavily at Ryker and Kary if Soup was just bad town.