Suntan Luigi
Smash Lord
Can someone make the thread please? I want to know what stages to counter against peach with.
-
Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!
You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!
We need a sheik counterpick stage thread!
- Thread starter Suntan Luigi
- Start date
soap
Smash Hero
i like story, battlefield, and corneria
Shmooguy
Smash Champion
First of all, counter-picking neutral stages is ftl. Everyone knows neutral stages so your advantage is diminished, especially this late in the game. 90% of the time there is a better pick anyway. There are so many gay stages in this game (some that should be banned) and it would be a shame not to take advantage of them.
Spacies - Brinstar, then DK64 in that order. The lava and breakable part of the stage and having different platforms to up B onto help. Something about the breakable part makes it really difficult to L-cancel for space animals; it's possible but most of the time they mess up for some reason. Try to be on the top platform first when the lava rises up really high. Don't pick Rainbow Cruise, don't pick Poke Floats, don't pick Corneria, don't pick Green Greens, Battlefield is really not that bad for either of them and neither is FoD if you are playing a really good space animal (these stages only work well against scrubs).
Jiggly - Rainbow Cruise, Green Greens, Corneria, Poke Floats, you have a lot of picks here that completely **** Jigglypuff. Yoshi's Story is good, but be more wary of rests, as they'll kill at any percent on this stage.
Samus - Poke Floats, DK64. Takes away the usefulness of her grapple which makes it so much easier to edgeguard. DK64 isn't a small stage but it's okay. Also, don't worry about the barrel, Samus can bomb her way into it but you get a free hit after so it doesn't matter. You can pick Yoshi's Story too.
Marth - DL64, DK64. DL64 makes it harder for you to die and easier for you to get to a percent where it's difficult for Marth to kill you. Also the higher platforms means less Fsmash tip. DK64 gives you the higher platforms to recover a different way, plus Marth has to sweetspot the ledge, making it easier to edgeguard. Recoveries that go through the stage really aren't a problem, it's easy to see coming and easy to punish.
Sheik dittos - FD if you are better at chaingrabbing than the other Sheik. FoD if you are not good at gay stages and you are worse at chaingrabbing, otherwise pick a weird stage that you have experience on and that will also lessen the impact of chaingrabbing.
ICs - Rainbow Cruise, Brinstar, Poke Floats (obviously). Wobbles or not, they can kill you with one grab no matter what. So don't pick big stages, it'll take longer for them to die but damage percent and stage boundaries mean nothing to you.
Falcon - Jungle Japes? I personally have bad experiences on that stage but some people seem to do well on it. I do well on Dreamland for some reason, even though no Falcon's dislike that stage. Brinstar, Rainbow Cruise, and Pokefloats are by no means bad for Falcon.
Peach - I don't know what to pick here actually. I pick Pokemon Stadium because of the lower ceiling. Yoshi's Story seems like an obvious pick here, but Peach controls the middle of the stage way too well against Sheik there, and Shy Guys can actually change the trajectory of your downthrows. I don't like Corneria because if you get sucked into a dsmash while she's on an angled part of the stage it's 50%. She can't edgeguard you so much and there are low ceilings, so it's not a bad pick, but also if you grab her under the fin, she can tech off the walls, and considering the importance of grabs, I'd like to let the result of them be consistent. On Green Greens she can just camp the middle and dsmash you between the blocks. It works better on space animals but Sheik is still pretty susceptible to dsmash. I'm thinking I should pick Rainbow Cruise on Peach, but I haven't tried it yet.
Any counter-pick ideas for Ganon (assuming they ban FD), Doc, Mario, and Luigi?
Spacies - Brinstar, then DK64 in that order. The lava and breakable part of the stage and having different platforms to up B onto help. Something about the breakable part makes it really difficult to L-cancel for space animals; it's possible but most of the time they mess up for some reason. Try to be on the top platform first when the lava rises up really high. Don't pick Rainbow Cruise, don't pick Poke Floats, don't pick Corneria, don't pick Green Greens, Battlefield is really not that bad for either of them and neither is FoD if you are playing a really good space animal (these stages only work well against scrubs).
Jiggly - Rainbow Cruise, Green Greens, Corneria, Poke Floats, you have a lot of picks here that completely **** Jigglypuff. Yoshi's Story is good, but be more wary of rests, as they'll kill at any percent on this stage.
Samus - Poke Floats, DK64. Takes away the usefulness of her grapple which makes it so much easier to edgeguard. DK64 isn't a small stage but it's okay. Also, don't worry about the barrel, Samus can bomb her way into it but you get a free hit after so it doesn't matter. You can pick Yoshi's Story too.
Marth - DL64, DK64. DL64 makes it harder for you to die and easier for you to get to a percent where it's difficult for Marth to kill you. Also the higher platforms means less Fsmash tip. DK64 gives you the higher platforms to recover a different way, plus Marth has to sweetspot the ledge, making it easier to edgeguard. Recoveries that go through the stage really aren't a problem, it's easy to see coming and easy to punish.
Sheik dittos - FD if you are better at chaingrabbing than the other Sheik. FoD if you are not good at gay stages and you are worse at chaingrabbing, otherwise pick a weird stage that you have experience on and that will also lessen the impact of chaingrabbing.
ICs - Rainbow Cruise, Brinstar, Poke Floats (obviously). Wobbles or not, they can kill you with one grab no matter what. So don't pick big stages, it'll take longer for them to die but damage percent and stage boundaries mean nothing to you.
Falcon - Jungle Japes? I personally have bad experiences on that stage but some people seem to do well on it. I do well on Dreamland for some reason, even though no Falcon's dislike that stage. Brinstar, Rainbow Cruise, and Pokefloats are by no means bad for Falcon.
Peach - I don't know what to pick here actually. I pick Pokemon Stadium because of the lower ceiling. Yoshi's Story seems like an obvious pick here, but Peach controls the middle of the stage way too well against Sheik there, and Shy Guys can actually change the trajectory of your downthrows. I don't like Corneria because if you get sucked into a dsmash while she's on an angled part of the stage it's 50%. She can't edgeguard you so much and there are low ceilings, so it's not a bad pick, but also if you grab her under the fin, she can tech off the walls, and considering the importance of grabs, I'd like to let the result of them be consistent. On Green Greens she can just camp the middle and dsmash you between the blocks. It works better on space animals but Sheik is still pretty susceptible to dsmash. I'm thinking I should pick Rainbow Cruise on Peach, but I haven't tried it yet.
Any counter-pick ideas for Ganon (assuming they ban FD), Doc, Mario, and Luigi?
Drephen
Smash Master
doc/mario - battlefield
luigi - battlefield
peach - FD
Bowser - ????
DK - battlefield
yoshi - ????
Peach - FD/Corneria
Captain Falcon - Fod/Jungle Japes
gannon - FD
Fox - Battlefield/DK64
Falco - Battlefield/DK64
Ness - Battlefield
Samus - FD/Battlefield
IC - Brinstar
Kirby - ???
Zelda - ???
Shiek - ???
Link - FD
Young Link - Yoshi Story
Pichu - ???
Pikachu - battlefield
Jigglypuff - Yoshi Story/FD
Mewtwo - ???
GW - Battlefield
Marth - Corneria/FD
Roy - ???
These are the ones i usually do
I use battlefield mostly because a lot of characters recovery gets ****ed up aka ness,pika,luigi,etc
The ??? i really have no idea what to counterpick
FD i use on slower characters so i can run away if i need to.
luigi - battlefield
peach - FD
Bowser - ????
DK - battlefield
yoshi - ????
Peach - FD/Corneria
Captain Falcon - Fod/Jungle Japes
gannon - FD
Fox - Battlefield/DK64
Falco - Battlefield/DK64
Ness - Battlefield
Samus - FD/Battlefield
IC - Brinstar
Kirby - ???
Zelda - ???
Shiek - ???
Link - FD
Young Link - Yoshi Story
Pichu - ???
Pikachu - battlefield
Jigglypuff - Yoshi Story/FD
Mewtwo - ???
GW - Battlefield
Marth - Corneria/FD
Roy - ???
These are the ones i usually do
I use battlefield mostly because a lot of characters recovery gets ****ed up aka ness,pika,luigi,etc
The ??? i really have no idea what to counterpick
FD i use on slower characters so i can run away if i need to.
Suntan Luigi
Smash Lord
Drephen- It seems that you don't counter any character with Pokemon Stadium. Wouldn't this be a good stage against slow characters as well? Also what if the peach player bans FD, what other stage do you recommend I use? Some people I know who use spacies can sweetspot with the forward b and so d-smash doesnt work. Any tips or recommendations?
einthesuperdog
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Apr 30, 2007
- Messages
- 482
Someone's already made the thread.
Although it is pretty much known that sheik has a lot of counter pick options remember that she is also good on practically all of the neutral stages.
You may want to consider that in case you think people will switch characters on you.
If you fight a jiggs and decide oh well I can just camp him to death and kill him on a gay stage rethink that thought.
In many tournament cases players are allowed to switch characters for the next match so if you take that Jigglypuff player to Poke floats they just might switch to Fox a pretty common character to see nowadays. Then you are forced to fight a disadvantageous match or switch to another character.
Basically make sure you know what you are doing and also make sure you are at least somewhat familiar to the stage in case stuff like that happens.
Also I often go to Battlefield because even though its a pro Sheik stage many players are willing to stay the character they are on because its not totally lopsided. Just a thought.
Also Drephen's list is pretty amazing
Yoshi -> FD
Roy -> FD
Easy CGs
You may want to consider that in case you think people will switch characters on you.
If you fight a jiggs and decide oh well I can just camp him to death and kill him on a gay stage rethink that thought.
In many tournament cases players are allowed to switch characters for the next match so if you take that Jigglypuff player to Poke floats they just might switch to Fox a pretty common character to see nowadays. Then you are forced to fight a disadvantageous match or switch to another character.
Basically make sure you know what you are doing and also make sure you are at least somewhat familiar to the stage in case stuff like that happens.
Also I often go to Battlefield because even though its a pro Sheik stage many players are willing to stay the character they are on because its not totally lopsided. Just a thought.
Also Drephen's list is pretty amazing
Yoshi -> FD
Roy -> FD
Easy CGs
AIDS
Smash Lord
every stage is good with sheik, mostly yoshi's
she can work on almost any stage though....
she can work on almost any stage though....
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
peach - stadium, fd
fox - battlefield, kongo64, fod
falco - fod, battlefield
sheik - stadium, fd
marth - stadium, kongo64
ics - battlefield, kongo64
falcon - small neutral with platforms
jiggs - stadium, fd
doc - fod, battlefield, kongo64
mario - see doc
dk - japes, kongo64
link - fd
ganon - japes, kongo64, fd, battlefield, stadium
luigi - battlefield
samus - battlefield, stadium
everyone else - kongo64, stadium, fd, battlefield, dreamland (factors that influence depend on whether character can be cged or not and whether they can camp sheik; generally kongo is good though since sheik is **** there, same with battlefield)
fox - battlefield, kongo64, fod
falco - fod, battlefield
sheik - stadium, fd
marth - stadium, kongo64
ics - battlefield, kongo64
falcon - small neutral with platforms
jiggs - stadium, fd
doc - fod, battlefield, kongo64
mario - see doc
dk - japes, kongo64
link - fd
ganon - japes, kongo64, fd, battlefield, stadium
luigi - battlefield
samus - battlefield, stadium
everyone else - kongo64, stadium, fd, battlefield, dreamland (factors that influence depend on whether character can be cged or not and whether they can camp sheik; generally kongo is good though since sheik is **** there, same with battlefield)
I'm not going to argue with sheik players, but if it's open, you could always take peach to yoshi's story or green greens.
Witchking_of_Angmar
Smash Lord
I like Jungle Japes a lot because of sheik tricksies on that stage.
You can just vanish all over the place.
You can just vanish all over the place.
Bowser= Fourside
Yoshi= Fourside
Roy= mushroom kingdon 1
mewtwo= any best Fourside
Pichu= mushroom kingdom 2
Kirby= dreamland
just my ideas for characters
soap
Smash Hero
lol fourside is too good, just camp off screen into backthrow kos...
u should check out the list of tourny legal stages and bans in melee discussion
u should check out the list of tourny legal stages and bans in melee discussion
David, just so u know, most of the stages you just mentioned are banned in tournaments
I've also noticed that Poke Floats can be a good Shiek CP in certain situations. (Such as against Falco, IC, or G-Dorf)
JJR.O.B.
Smash Ace
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
because kirby dies off stage in the matchup whereas sheik doesn't if you recover high onto a platform? who knows. dreamland just tends to be amazing for sheik.