Top Players & Videos by Character v3.5

[Myst007_teh_newb]

I'm far better at Melee than I am at PM. Melee I've taken sets off Axe, Silly Kyle, GG7, Jackie, Medz, etc. Weirdly I've never been able to beat Tai. It's always last game last hit with him being slightly more clutch.

Plus ZSS is like a lower-mid tier, and Melee Falco is Melee Falco. I feel like some of my performance issues do have to do with ZSS not being a good character.

Randomly gonna chime in, but I don't think that ZSS has enough bad matchups to be lower-mid. Spacies are a problem, but aside from them, there are no real polarizing matchups for her. She has the mobility to play around most characters. And she has the projectile and disjoints needed to deal with other problem characters. Tons of tools. Tons of movement options. Combos are crazy, crazy good.

Solo ZSS certainly has the tools to win tourneys, imo.

 

[Strong Badam]

Ive played against jason waterfallz and i think ZSS is fine. Also falco is like high-mid in this game. Hes not the same falco. Without invincibility on shine. Grab armor. State of CC in the game i feel hes a lot weaker in this game and only see amazing falcos doing a lot in tournament.

Please explain to me why grab armor is significant to Falco's gameplay.

 

[Shokio]

I still don't entirely like the new ZSS, and despite my initial salt, she's definitely not a bad character. Olimar is what you call a bad character. I think she's mid-tier.

But like Jason said, her MU spread is actually pretty good. The only insanely difficult MU's for her are spacies, and while she has trouble with the Fire Emblem boys, she definitely has the tools to exploit their weaknesses as well.

As I've said in the ZSS threads, I just think some other chars need to get balanced to the ZSS-level of balance. And by that I mean a proper trade-off ratio of Work vs. Reward. But this isn't the thread for all that.

 

[kevinw0w]

wait, is this the tier-list speculation thread?

 

[KayB]

wait, is this the tier-list speculation thread?

It isn't.

Though we can briefly go into a very short tangent expressing our shock and worry about the fact that Strong Bad is now a moderator. /s

 

[Juushichi]

If your bad MUs are like spacies/Marth/Ike/Roy, but otherwise have a good matchup spread.

News flash, you are probably not playing a mid tier character.

 

[Zwarm]

It isn't.

Though we can briefly go into a very short tangent expressing our shock and worry about the fact that Strong Bad is now a moderator. /s

A moderator with "Anarchy" under his name, no less.

 

[KayB]

Btw, I have finals approaching and some other personal obligations, so updates may or may not be delayed. Just a heads up.

 

[Vixen]

Randomly gonna chime in, but I don't think that ZSS has enough bad matchups to be lower-mid. Spacies are a problem, but aside from them, there are no real polarizing matchups for her. She has the mobility to play around most characters. And she has the projectile and disjoints needed to deal with other problem characters. Tons of tools. Tons of movement options. Combos are crazy, crazy good.

Solo ZSS certainly has the tools to win tourneys, imo.

ZSS Loses to Fox, Falco, Wolf, Falcon, Ness, arguably Peach and shiek just off the top of my head. Her match up vs MK is probably closer to MK favor. Both me and Oro have a history of losing to K9. Match ups aren't everything. It's also the general feel of the character. ZSS has to work far harder than most of the cast to be played competently at a competitive level. Plus losing to the upper echelon of characters firmly cements her in lower-mid in my mind.

 

[Vixen]

Ive played against jason waterfallz and i think ZSS is fine. Also falco is like high-mid in this game. Hes not the same falco. Without invincibility on shine. Grab armor. State of CC in the game i feel hes a lot weaker in this game and only see amazing falcos doing a lot in tournament.

I don't think ZSS is necessarily bad. She's just lower-mid. I think of her as like... where Mario is on the melee tier-list. On the bottom half of mid-tier.

She's the epitomy of a tryhard character. She has to work really hard for what everyone else gets for free.

 

[Shokio]

If your bad MUs are like spacies/Marth/Ike/Roy, but otherwise have a good matchup spread.

News flash, you are probably not playing a mid tier character.

There's definitely more, like the ones Vixen listed + Squirtle, I was just pointing out the most skewed one.

ZSS has to work far harder than most of the cast to be played competently at a competitive level.

That's pretty much the bottom line. It's not that she's bad, it's just that you have to put in 5x more work than her to accomplish what a competent Shiek can do effortlessly in fewer moves/inputs (just as an example).

But again, this isn't a ZSS thread so let's not derail this.

 

[Vixen]

There's definitely more, like the ones Vixen listed + Squirtle, I was just pointing out the most skewed one.



That's pretty much the bottom line. It's not that she's bad, it's just that you have to put in 3x more work than her to accomplish what a competent Shiek can do effortlessly in fewer moves/inputs (just as an example).

But again, this isn't a ZSS thread so let's not derail this.

All I was trying to get at is that I play a mediocre character and keep it close vs my regions best players.

 

[iPunchKidsz]

"mediocre character" ? Or you just don't push your character hard enough? LOL

 

[Shokio]

*shots fired*

 

[Zwarm]

Squirtle having an advantageous MU? Don't be silly

 

[Strong Badam]

Let's keep the discussion to who's good with what characters, please. Character viability doesn't matter when you're competing with other players using the same character; take that conversation to the Tier List Speculation thread. Minor tangents on character balance/metagame application when discussing footage is quite fine but y'all have been on this ZSS stuff for nearly a full page now.

 

[Vixen]

"mediocre character" ? Or you just don't push your character hard enough? LOL

ZSS is mediocre, or do you not read?

Also I'm one of the premier ZSS players real talk. <3

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

Who are you?

 

[KayB]

For ****s sake guys, not here

 

[PlateProp]

For ****s sake guys, not here

Tires don exits

 

[Deleted member]

So uhh... lets change the topic

Sethlon and I are currently at 9-8 in sets with him up. We've played 17 sets over IaB in 3.5 alone. The subsections for sethlon and I should be filled with pure murder.

 

[Thane of Blue Flames]

So uhh... lets change the topic

Sethlon and I are currently at 9-8 in sets with him up. We've played 17 sets over IaB in 3.5 alone. The subsections for sethlon and I should be filled with pure murder.

Brunchables for top 5 PM player?

(I could see it, honestly. I really wish I could see you go toe-to-toe with Ally, Prof, or one of the PM greats. Were you there for Lucky v/s Texas?)

And while we're firing shots, DJ Nintendo could be kicked off the Ike list and it wouldn't make a f***ing difference.

 

[Deleted member]

I didn't get to fight vs Lucky in singles whenever he came down. Only in doubles

 

[TreK]

Denti's still probably a freaking good Ivysaur, but he doesn't play 3.5
His reason according to Twitter was something along the lines of "if I wanted to lose to Melee characters I'd play the game with more cash prize" or "I don't want to play a game where my character is designed to lose to Melee top tiers" iirc. Something like that.

With that in mind I'd say JZ and Machiavelli are the two best Ivies atm. Problem JZ doesn't do a lot of tourneys afaik, and Machiavelli lives in the hidden boss region of Socal that's putting in mad work but refuses to have a decent streamer.
Here are Mach's first replays in like a month or two :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xPwU2PP8tBs vs Stauffy (Lucario) WSF*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kw07ZSHrfZU vs iPunchkidsz (Lucario) LSF
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6SnU6PIBgjE vs Professor Oats (Sheik) LF
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZCX_OPf9pM vs Stauffy (Lucario) GF*

It's interesting how JZ and Mach are achieving similar levels of success with vastly different styles. I'd like to see them at a common tournament to see who places highest so I can steal some stuff.

Unless there are more hidden bosses, what's next is like, a tier below. But we're pushing =3
Bobo from MTL picked up the character like a month ago but is showing the fastest improvement rate I've ever seen lmao. I wish he'd attend more tourneys but that's one player you should keep track of eventually.

New French videos are coming soon. This time, some will have commentary. You probably won't understand a word but that's part of the fun !

 

[DMG]

Denti's had all of his characters nerfed, and Smash 4 was gonna be his grind for the next 1-2 years easy. Even if PM was different for him, I can't imagine he would split focus from Smash 4 at all

 

[the_irish_dude]

Sethlon - "JZ Plays Ivysaur like Captain Falcon...and it works. It shouldn't work, but it does. It's scary"

 

[DMG]

He should play Captain Falcon like Captain Falcon

 

[the_irish_dude]

He plays Falcon in Melee lol

 

[DMG]

This pleases me

 

[the_irish_dude]

I thought it would

I wish he didn't move to michigan He will be back here for Aftershock tho!

 

[Bazkip]

Bobo from MTL picked up the character like a month ago but is showing the fastest improvement rate I've ever seen lmao. I wish he'd attend more tourneys but that's one player you should keep track of eventually.

He attends most of our weeklies though it's hard to get everything on stream.
We've got big tournaments this weekend and next so there's a good change we'll have more footage of him.

 

[the_irish_dude]

Do you have a moment to talk about our lord and savior Strong Bad?

 

[FlashingFire]

Haha I've been wondering how long Denti's name was going to stay on the Ivy list without any videos.

 

[Soft Serve]

Denti's still probably a freaking good Ivysaur, but he doesn't play 3.5
His reason according to Twitter was something along the lines of "if I wanted to lose to Melee characters I'd play the game with more cash prize" or "I don't want to play a game where my character is designed to lose to Melee top tiers" iirc. Something like that.

With that in mind I'd say JZ and Machiavelli are the two best Ivies atm. Problem JZ doesn't do a lot of tourneys afaik, and Machiavelli lives in the hidden boss region of Socal that's putting in mad work but refuses to have a decent streamer.
Here are Mach's first replays in like a month or two :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xPwU2PP8tBs vs Stauffy (Lucario) WSF*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kw07ZSHrfZU vs iPunchkidsz (Lucario) LSF
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6SnU6PIBgjE vs Professor Oats (Sheik) LF
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZCX_OPf9pM vs Stauffy (Lucario) GF*

It's interesting how JZ and Mach are achieving similar levels of success with vastly different styles. I'd like to see them at a common tournament to see who places highest so I can steal some stuff.

Unless there are more hidden bosses, what's next is like, a tier below. But we're pushing =3
Bobo from MTL picked up the character like a month ago but is showing the fastest improvement rate I've ever seen lmao. I wish he'd attend more tourneys but that's one player you should keep track of eventually.

New French videos are coming soon. This time, some will have commentary. You probably won't understand a word but that's part of the fun !

Mach is in az atm, we will get some vids of him up. Oh my god is his ivy movement crispy as ****, makes me wish I could play the character. It's gorgeous

 

[Deleted member]

yeah so that captain falcon spot

uh

 

[DMG]

yeah so that captain falcon spot

uh

Yes, my son?

 

[NTG]

He might not be one of the best when it comes to decision making, but if any of you Falcon mains are looking for ideas, Fatality has some of the nastiest and most creative punishes I've ever seen with PM Falcon. Saw him at a tournament yesterday. At worst he's wildly entertaining to watch, he combos things that just don't seem like they should work. This video's from a little while ago, he's actually a decent bit better now. But strings like the one at 2:30...damn.

 

[Deleted member]

He might not be one of the best when it comes to decision making, but if any of you Falcon mains are looking for ideas, Fatality has some of the nastiest and most creative punishes I've ever seen with PM Falcon. Saw him at a tournament yesterday. At worst he's wildly entertaining to watch, he combos things that just don't seem like they should work. This video's from a little while ago, he's actually a decent bit better now. But strings like the one at 2:30...damn.

I'm well aware of Fatality, the euphoric fedora wearing wonder is literally my favorite Falcon player next to DMG and Strawhat. Fatality is just plain filthy, like damn.

 

[Player -0]

I heard him talking to someone at Olympus and he said he's focusing on Smash 4 more right now as there are more Smash 4 tournaments. He also said that Falcon is top 10 in Smash 4 easy.

 

[NTG]

^Yeah, kind of a bummer but I get it. Shame PM Singles didn't get to finish.

I'm well aware of Fatality, the euphoric fedora wearing wonder is literally my favorite Falcon player next to DMG and Strawhat. Fatality is just plain filthy, like damn.

Seriously. What makes that video even crazier is that it's against Stingers, who happens to be the #1 PR'd player in NC PM.