Toonami Mafia - Game Over - Daytime Programing wins!

[#HBC | ѕoup]

I would probably cry if WATT was indy

 

[#HBC | Kary]

i would clap my hands and laugh

 

[Wots All This Then?]

you're the indy

THERE PROBABLY IS NO INDY.THERE WAS A SHOT LAST NIGHT BESIDES OURS.
sheesh not that hard.
@soup-the other head will resume his interrogation momentarily.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

wow, overreaction much?

 

[Wots All This Then?]

I didn't see the "clap and laugh" part.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

could you respond to me without the tunnel glasses because a lot of what you say is 'why did you defend da scums u r traitor and u bussed bw ftw epic win'

and all i can really do is tell you how it is, i don't know what you're looking for, hell i dont even understand it

 

[#HBC | Kary]

and you having a shot doesn't rule out you being indy

go fish

i'll see you later :D

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Dietz thought he caught you in a contradiction wrt number of indy's and what you thought Nabe was.(interrogation)
The connections are kinda straight forward from my POV

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

but that was proven false so where are we now ._.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

waiting for him imo. I didn't get the indy thing, he did.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Alright, but point stands I think your point on PJB is a huge reach with no real basis or logic: in stretch of the imagination does the fact PJB unvoted after a sketch claim to analyze it mean PJB was "scared mafia", especially since you maintain your stance that Nabe was scum and won't label his as Indy or say if you actually think Indy is here now.

You let Nabe "go" for no understandable reason even after extensive debate with other thread members including us, and you actively worked to keep Rake alive.

Add this all to the fact you made a terrible fakeclaim today that would have been the perfect reason to keep people hunting Indys instead of a mafia traitor and I want you 10 feet under.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

@Kary-ruy said it's fine. We pulled Gift of the mystical elf hoping for a doc, but it was a commuter
Truth be told we've never gotten the role we thought we were going to.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Taint true: I pulled Burst Stream of Destruction hoping for a vig and got it.

Anyways this is the crux of the question atm:

I don't think Nabe was Indy. I think Nabe was scum.

Then why are you pushing PJB right now? Either Nabe is Indy and scaring a mafia PJB, or they're both Mafia and PJB could not possibly have been scared by a claim he knew wouldn't hurt him.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

It probably is but I'm going on fumes and I'm still interested. I posted that on impulse but I still dislike PJB for obvious reasons that I've pointed out.

I literally cannot argue this with you. I did what I did. I have no reason to go 'yeah sorry let me go explain why i did that' because if you look you can see me explaining it that whole day, and even a bit here so like...

I don't really have anything to say about it. Your logic is wrong, and I'm not scum. Would that make you feel better?

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Taint true: I pulled Burst Stream of Destruction hoping for a vig and got it.

Anyways this is the crux of the question atm:

Then why are you pushing PJB right now? Either Nabe is Indy and scaring a mafia PJB, or they're both Mafia and PJB could not possibly have been scared by a claim he knew wouldn't hurt him.

...No? Look at what I'm saying. Look at what I've said. It all makes sense if you just read it. I want you to prove that you've actually read what I said, because PJB being scum aligns with my thoughts on what happened with Nabe. I never said Nabe was indy, ever.

"Scum won't vote Nabe"
*PJB unvotes Nabe and says he doesn't want to get shot, mafia doesn't want to lose nabe*

?????

 

[Wots All This Then?]

@2254: Not really. I hate that you blatantly fakeclaimed, I hate how you first responded to Orbo's case, I hate the implications you backing down on Nabe and Rake has, and I hate the logic you're using to push PJB.

@Ninja: I'd expect it much more likely for a townie unsure of a claim that could kill them to back off for a moment. The fact you keep insinuating it was out of fear and therefore was a mafia action irks me.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

The logic doesn't make sense FYPOV. I can't change that, and I can only argue what I believe. The same can be said for you, but I'm not the person you're looking for. Simple as that. I don't have anything to fight you about, I'm more concerned with other things, and frankly you can call my theory hooey or whatever, because it'tl still matter to me despite what you say.

It was a mafia action because Nabe was trying to survive. Mafia didn't want to lose Nabe. Look at that wagon again on Nabe, can you tell me if you think Mafia voted him (besides rake but we talked about this) that phase? Can you?

 

[Wots All This Then?]

9. Nabe - [6] - Wots All This Then?, Vanderzant, Clownbot, Kary, Rake, FrozenFlame751,
FF is confirmed town. We're town, so is Vanz. We actually lean town on kary but that might change depending on the flip we get today.
short answer-no

 

[Wots All This Then?]

I understand that they may have wanted to lend credence to the "better get votes off Nabe" idea by unvoting, but if you accept that as a true principle it seems VERY ballsy for a scummate to be the first one to unvote without questioning. That does nothing but take one vote off and cast scrutiny on the slot (PJB) for the time being no matter the outcome of Nabe's survival.

If keeping Nabe alive with this claim was their priority I'd expect to see more along the lines of what you did: brief continuing and then a hard defend.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

tl;dr

I don't recall PJB asking for others to unvote Nabe after he did. I DO remember you doing so.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

(re-reading the way Nabe's lynch went down)

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

9. Nabe - [6] - Wots All This Then?, Vanderzant, Clownbot, Kary, Rake, FrozenFlame751,
FF is confirmed town. We're town, so is Vanz. We actually lean town on kary but that might change depending on the flip we get today.
short answer-no

I understand that they may have wanted to lend credence to the "better get votes off Nabe" idea by unvoting, but if you accept that as a true principle it seems VERY ballsy for a scummate to be the first one to unvote without questioning. That does nothing but take one vote off and cast scrutiny on the slot (PJB) for the time being no matter the outcome of Nabe's survival.

If keeping Nabe alive with this claim was their priority I'd expect to see more along the lines of what you did: brief continuing and then a hard defend.

tl;dr

I don't recall PJB asking for others to unvote Nabe after he did. I DO remember you doing so.

What is it about PJB that makes you disagree, yet you agree that scum didn't vote Nabe that day? Like I said, I don't have anything to say about this. I did what I did.

I don't feel like arguing anymore.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

PJB unvoted as a townie to prevent his death. You called for lynching someone else.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

PS: PJB literally started the Nabe wagon. ... But Soup was on second.


I don't think they didn't vote him at all. You voted him briefly before backing as far down as possible.


You mean you don't feel like copping-out verbally anymore, and would instead prefer to lurk until this blows over.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

PJB unvoted as a townie to prevent his death. You called for lynching someone else.

Um...dude. Do you see the part where Mafia wouldn't vote Nabe? Did you see where I agree? How the hell was his unvote a townie move again? He didn't want to die? I unvoted and gave reason, PJB just rolled with it and didn't do anything the rest of the phase.

He hasn't even talked about it since. How is this townie? How am I just the evil mafia lord who happened to be wrong?

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

PS: PJB literally started the Nabe wagon. ... But Soup was on second.


I don't think they didn't vote him at all. You voted him briefly before backing as far down as possible.


You mean you don't feel like copping-out verbally anymore, and would instead prefer to lurk until this blows over.

Literally spent that whole day pushing Nabe as he openly ignored me. I had enough and voted him.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

then you unvoted him, and said "oh hey lets lynch gangsta!" when he gave the thing you could use to cop out to a townread on Nabe.
PJB is newer. He unvoted in a "hey lets not die!" manner.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Um...dude. Do you see the part where Mafia wouldn't vote Nabe? Did you see where I agree? How the hell was his unvote a townie move again? He didn't want to die? I unvoted and gave reason, PJB just rolled with it and didn't do anything the rest of the phase.

He hasn't even talked about it since. How is this townie? How am I just the evil mafia lord who happened to be wrong?

Rake did.

You really don't seem to understand that mafia not wanting Nabe to die doesn't mean mafia wouldn't vote him ever.


Because you defended two slots from dying. PJB just unvoted once: that's why we're hard on you. You unvoted and gave a completely un-understandable reason.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

tl;dr

You leave us to conclude that you pushed on Nabe because it would be towny, then panicked when he was so terrible at responding to the slightest pressure and votes actually accumulated.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

No. I pushed on Nabe because he ****ing ignored me. He literally didn't give me a chance to do anything with him. You really think I planned that?

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Literally spent that whole day pushing Nabe as he openly ignored me. I had enough and voted him.

You'd have had to as Traitor. It wouldn't be believable town to ignore Nabe's ignoring of you. It still wasn't town to stop pushing him.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

We get the initial push. That's fine. Then you completely dropped it, which is what is bugging us so much

 

[Wots All This Then?]

No. I pushed on Nabe because he ****ing ignored me. He literally didn't give me a chance to do anything with him. You really think I planned that?

I think you saw something to lightly push Nabe for to get him in the game and when he failed hard and responded by ignoring you you were forced to continue pushing him until he claimed. Then you attempted to back out once you had an excuse.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

I'm too tired of this to respond because it's going in circles. I'll come back later. No more of this back and forth ****.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Very well.

I hope to hear what others think of this theory, Particularly Vand.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

I think the whole thing is stupid

 

[vanderzant]

Will have to get at this after work as I have to leave in 5 minutes, but quickly I
still don't think there is an indy in this game.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Wow, a lot has happened.

I honestly don't understand soup's case against me. What's the big problem he has with me? I unvoted Nabe? Well no **** sherlock, the pressure was moving away from him and I didn't think he was going to be the lynch for the day. Add to that, the fact that he had claimed a shot who could target people that were voting him, and he had publicly stated that he wanted to specifically shoot me, well there you go.

Why haven't I commented on Nabe's alignment since his lack of a flip? Because other players like vand have already done that for me. He's very likely scum, and I would be highly surprised if he was town. The fact that I haven't commented on this to your satisfaction is really part of why you're voting me? The situation with Vinyl's flip is clearly not the same as Nabe in the slightest. I wasn't sure if Vinyl was alive or dead, now I know the these stolen flips are actually dead bodies. Information I did not have before.

Was there more you wanted answered?

I actually like WATT's theory on traitor soup.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

would you mind elaborating on what you like about WATT's theory?
for instance, how well does it fit with your read on soup?

 

[vanderzant]

Don't have enough time atm to go bring up quotes and stuff, but Soup's fake claim was a bit of an eye opener to me. The short of it is yes, I do think WATT has some very good points on Soup.

I don't think there is an indy in this game at all. I believe we've killed 3 Mafia so the most logical explanation is that we're looking for a 4th member, likely a traitor (due to balance reasons).

I do very well think he could very well fit the traitor bill, for what WATT's brought up and what I've noticed my self.

You only have to ISO soup on Day 2/3 and you'll see how weird his changes in direction are based on what Town knew at the time. He's seemingly ok with both Rake/Nabe dieing at different stages of Day 2, yet as soon as these slots looked like a chance of being lynched, Soup's focus suddenly shifts onto Gangsta. He was so incredibly vocal about both these plays.

That was in the gutter because I'm an idiot. I'm just VT. I fakeclaimed trying to garner reactions as I do believe that there is an indy, I figured there would be no issue, and I could use it as an incentive to indy/scumhunt.

Inferno's suggestion about Nabe being indy at least holds water and I got something out of it. I don't think he ever came back to say anything agter.

The most telling thing to me however is that Soup is still clinging to the idea of an indy being alive.

There is not a SINGLE piece of evidence that suggests an indy. Nothing. At. All.

He wants to entertain the idea that BW/Rake/Nabe are all Mafia, while simultaneously suggesting that we have ANOTHER mafia and indy alive.

That's five scum. In a 14 man set up. With a role that stops town's primary method of generating game related info (lynches). If BW was lynched on Day 1 and Vinyl Day 2, we'd most likely be in MYLO right now despite correctly lynching Mafia three out of four times. That is in NO way balanced and can not possibly be the case here.

I can't accept that SoupTown would believe this to be true, and coupled with how against the Nabe/Rake lynches he was, despite being ok with both these players dieing at various other stages of the game, I'm pretty sure he's going to get my vote toDay.

I also don't buy the "fakeclaim for reactions" business. There's 2000 posts of information. If he truly wanted to cement his read on Pjb, he only has to go back and look at his interactions with every freaking mafia member we've lynched. Day 4 is NOT the time to try and "spark" up discussion based on ****ty reaction gambits. His case on Pjb is bad in itself.

Adding to this, look how deep he was in his "fake claim"

6 alive
2 scum factions

ML and we're at 4 players alive. The indy must be some sort of survivor as there hasn't been a second kill at all (besides WATT's shot last night). I don't think we're in kingmaker/autolose at this point, as long as we lynch scum the following day.

I don't think looking for indy should be priority today, but I feel it would be relevant would we ~happen~ to lynch scum.

@Ninja

What makes you think Nabe was indy, is there two scum alive right now?

He's already talking about how the rest of the game is going to play out based on his claim. If this is designed to reaction test Pjb/Inferno, then he's going about in incredibly poorly, which I don't buy. You don't reaction test people over multiple days. You don't claim in LYLO "Hey guys I lied about my claim yesterday I'm actually just a VT, isn't it great?"

I kind of don't want to lynch today, but still running through numbers it wouldn't really matter. If we NL'd today then we could ML tommorow. I guarantee that WATT will die this phase regardless of what we do.

asdkjasjkdhs

This guy.

Vote: Soup