Toonami Mafia - Game Over - Daytime Programing wins!

[Wots All This Then?]

from what I remember, the traitor has to die in most cases for the mafia team itself to win.(i remember making this point in gigabots after looking up what a traitor was on mafiascum)
In ryker mafia, the traitor inherited the mafia kill(only game I've seen a traitor where the entire scumteam died)

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

In Ryker Mafia.

Ryu never played in Ryker Mafia. Why would Ryu bring this mechanic to his game? That's pretty ****ing daunting to town if they happen to get every scum, which need I remind you one was untargetable[/b[, one was a seeker and another was something (we're assuming abductor/janitor whatever the hell).

Scum was pretty stacked this game, and to stack them with a traitor that inherits a kill would be awful. I don't believe Ryu would do that. We're not looking for traitor. We're looking for last scum.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

seeker=neighbourizer.
I'm running on the fact that the jan/whatever was passive.
And Ruy was the vig in ryker mafia soup.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

What I'm saying is, it doesn't seem that OP from our POV.(our=our hydra)

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

I just looked at the game and I didn't see Ryu at all. Either way, it's just a really shoddy theory and I don't understand how it all concluded to me.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Your interactions with the confirmed scum.
I distinctly remember ruy flipping "Ballistic of the Serenade" or whatever

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Town:
Tracker
Gambler
Doctor
Hero (can make 2 MLs happen)
VTs

Mafia:
Seeker
Untargetable
Janitor/Whatver

Untargetable trumps the Trakcer.
Seeker is for information purposes.
Janitor/Whatever is for misinformation.
Doctor protects the PRs.
Gambler is some sort of JoAT, I guess.

It doesn't make sense for there to be a traitor. I've been kind of thinking about Kuz' Full-Life Consequences though, and if you want to talk about possible influence, look at what Kantrip was in that game.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

5. Red Ruy Ryker, the Violinist in the Ballistic Serenade, Town Vigilante of Justice

Lemme check FLC,

 

[Wots All This Then?]

You're talking about the One shotBP abductor? Or EE's indy traitor?

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Former. Kantrip abducted me and washed. After he was lynched, they were only allowed to save me or washed.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Indy Traitor sounds dumb to put in this game.

Rake couldn't be targeted by janitor/whatever...

I don't get like
why would scum have a role like that if it wasn't to counteract this, a janitor an untargetable and a seeker? far-fetched.

a lot of that reason is what makes me scratch my haed

 

[Wots All This Then?]

So your saying that the Jan/abductor/whatever is in this game?
And they're the one we're after?
and it's a mafia power?
Except it's not an abduct because vinyl came back. Unless you're saying that it can only hold one person at a time. But that's just ...ugh.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

abduct one player
abduct another, player originally abducted shows up dead

but yet again why would they waste their time abducting nabe...

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

i got class, be back later

 

[Wots All This Then?]

the thing is, that means they either held nabe, are out of abducts(unlikely as ****) or it's something more along the lines of What i suggested wrt nabe.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

#2157 really isn't, like, anything. I don't know what you want me to address there, all you did was quote me, and acknowledge that you had read it.

#2163 I didn't think Nabe was town. By the time we saw Nabe's lack of a flip, we had received Vinyl's flip. There was no longer any reason for me to doubt people's alignments based on the possibility of them still being alive. We had seen that the missing lynches were, in fact, dead. Not abducted.

In vinyl's case, it was an issue of setup balance. I figured if he was alive (which the wording of his "non-flip" led me to believe could be the case), there was no way he was scum. A setup that took somebody we lynched, and whisked them away unharmed, would be bull****. I figured if he was dead, he was scum. I was wrong about that one, sue me. i already explained all this stuff back when it was happening, so I don't know why you didn't catch it while you were supposedly "rereading me".

Nabe's lack of a flip wasn't indicative of his alignment. It wasn't the same as with vinyl, because now I understood more about how the setup worked. These people were dead, and something was covering up their flips. So in Nabe's case, it's an easy call to make. Read him the way I read him when he was alive. I read him as scum, btw. By the end of the day, there was little doubt. His play may not have made sense as good scum play, but it made exactly zero sense as town play of any caliber.

#2166 You think I directly believed Nabe and was playing along with his claim? Hell no, I've already explained how this went down. I didn't believe Nabe at all, his play made no sense to me. But you were steering the town away from him, and when I thought he wasn't going to be the play anymore, I unvoted him. I didn't directly believe him at all. I directly believed you. And since he had explicitly stated a desire to shoot me using the role he described, I unvoted him to be safe. Again, sue me.

Where's my previous theory about the missing flips you ask? Well this will be the dozenth time I've explained this, but Vinyl had already flipped by the time Nabe went missing. Since it obviously wasn't abductions, because they were dead, why would I talk about it?


you done with your terrible push yet?

 

[Wots All This Then?]

joker, kary opinion. Preferably today.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Kary was never more than a scum lean. It was more like a lazy push I never really got around to actually doing. I'm not a "Kary fan", but he's not a priority for me. Not compared to soup, at this point. Since we're really only looking for one more scum, Kary is likely fine. I wouldn't revisit it unless lynching soup didn't end the game.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

K.
Agreed that Vanz is incredibly likely obvtown and will die tonight if we ML/NL?

 

[Wots All This Then?]

I'm reading loM mafia and wanna just HBC soup the **** outta here but that would be irresponsible of me

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Yea, agreed. He's probably in trouble tonight, assuming this isn't us winning the game.

We deffo shouldn't NL, btw. No Lynching is always a deal with the devil. Town should pretty much never do it voluntarily, unless there's some kind of guaranteed information that will come out of it. That's very rarely the case, and it's certainly not here.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Not saying it is. I'm trying to sort through everything just In case I'm wrong on soup.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

It would be cool if every gave their top two townreads

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Not saying it is. I'm trying to sort through everything just In case I'm wrong on soup.

"it" being No-lynching

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

1. Soup - [2] - Vanderzant, PrivateJoker-Brown,
2. Kary - [0] -
3. Wots All This Then? (Orboknown/JDietz hydra) - [0] -
4. PrivateJoker-Brown - [1] - Soup
5. Vanderzant - [0] -
6. Inferno3044 - [1] - Kary,

Not Voting [2] Inferno3044, Wots All This Then? (Orboknown/JDietz hydra),

With 6 alive it takes 4 to lynch. Deadline is at January 21st 11:59 CST.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Chill out I've got this hydra partner: Soup is talking all kinds of crazy **** since I left yesterday, throwing the idea of a no lynch. He's even still fudging facts after his fake claim:

Why do you have it in your head that traitor would inherit the kill after all scum is dead?

D1: 10v4
ml
9v4
nk
D2: 7v4
ml
6v4
nk
D3: 5v4 (lylo)

That's three phases...and even then, doesn't a traitor count towards the faction majority?

Funny how we didn't make it to D4 like we should have in this post.
Sometimes you just have to DO things.

Vote: Soup

Right or wrong lets do this.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

It would be cool if every gave their top two townreads

This is... kind of an easy question, and i forsee a lot of the same answers.

Vand
WATT

 

[#HBC | Kary]

which one of you is putting the soup vote back on?

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Dietz.

10Dietzs

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Vandy, you're not slow. I wasn't trying to do FUD. I got mixed up and it's been a long game. Bringing a point to that when he corrected me and I accepted that is moot.

Ah you're right, this totally sounds like a mixup of you just asking for information:

Actually, Rake didn't lie about his role. He was untargetable, and he flipped just that. Um...WATT...You saw him visit the dead body, right? Um....wow how did I miss this WATT how could you have seen that regardless if he was scum or not the dude was untargetable???

Triple question marks means you're extra cordially asking correct? Don't try to wriggle away from this by telling Vand you were "mixed up"... you clearly wanted to throw suspicion on that point.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Kary why the Vanz vote?

because i'm angry and this isn't what I expect from vanz. I don't think it's fair to come in saying things like 'there's nothing that suggests an indy at all' in a game where flips are being hidden.

Ruy's a good mod. He doesn't make setups that are janky and can be lostujst form, numbers right out the gate.
4 mafia and the game looks like:
4v10
ml/nk
4v8
ml/nk
4v6 lylo on Day 3! That's just not going to happen. There's not an indy because there was a NK last night.

I really don't see what's wrong with 4 mafia right out of the gate. maybe town doesn't have enough PRs to only be allowed 2 mislynches, but I'm not going to rule it out.

There's not a separate faction that suddenly has a kill unless it's something like catherine's way of handling NKs. incredibly unlikely.
That leaves a traitor which inherited the kill. It's the most likely situation. It's not Vanz. I doubt it's PJB. I know it's not me, and I don't think it;s you. That leaves soup, and it makes the most goddamn sense out of anything I can think of.

Did you consider that Nabe might be the traitor? Surely that's just as likely as soup being a traitor that inherited the kill?

I know that you really like this theory right now, but I just don't get it. On one hand you're saying we ignore Soup's apparently genuine interactions with scumbuddy BW, and on the other hand you're saying we string him up for his interactions with his other scumbuddies Rake/Nabe. It just looks like you're picking your facts to suit your case.

If you can explain to me why Soup tiptoeing around the waggons D2-3 shows he's a traitor, rather than just a slightly confused townie who would rather let NAs clear whoever is lying, then hell I might vote him. But right now I'm not seeing it.

We're in mylo now I think.
5v1.
mislynch/NK
3v1 lylo.
Tomorrow would be lylo, which is what Vanz is talking about when he refered to Lylo.

ToDay would have to be 4v2 for it to be mylo (mislynch and lose)

seeker=neighbourizer.
I'm running on the fact that the jan/whatever was passive.
And Ruy was the vig in ryker mafia soup.

We're agreed that there is a role hiding the flips.

It is in all likelihood not a passive ability. I literally see no reason for anyone thinking that, I think it's real dumb.


now stop soup tunnel for a minute

 

[Wots All This Then?]

There has been two abductions/janitors this game. Is it wrong for me to assume that it's the work of an indy? I didn't even believe it before, and I don't now, but I wasn't sure how to think about it. WATT's theory made sense for Nabe, and oh my god I have talked myself to death about the fact Nabe's janitor/abduction was inherently useless because he was confirmed scum. There's one mafia alive. Someone died last night. An indy just doesn't decide to go ahead and kill people randomly. You're turning base logic into something twisted.

Soup let me ask you one last question: then why did you fakeclaim to find an Indy?

 

[Wots All This Then?]

because i'm angry and this isn't what I expect from vanz. I don't think it's fair to come in saying things like 'there's nothing that suggests an indy at all' in a game where flips are being hidden.

so there's five scum or do you think Nabe wzas indy? Where's the other kill coming from?

I really don't see what's wrong with 4 mafia right out of the gate. maybe town doesn't have enough PRs to only be allowed 2 mislynches, but I'm not going to rule it out.

I believe ruy called it the three strikes rule. Town should have at least 3 mislynches before getting to lylo(referenced it in BaM mafia a lot as to why 3 scum+abduct wasn't feasible there)

Did you consider that Nabe might be the traitor? Surely that's just as likely as soup being a traitor that inherited the kill?

Rake's interactions with Nabe d2 show that they were knowingly scum together

If you can explain to me why Soup tiptoeing around the waggons D2-3 shows he's a traitor, rather than just a slightly confused townie who would rather let NAs clear whoever is lying, then hell I might vote him. But right now I'm not seeing it.

Bold doesn't apply to D3. I've explained why a theoretical townnabe vig shot doesn't clear him on D2(rb, untargettable, etc)

ToDay would have to be 4v2 for it to be mylo (mislynch and lose)

4v2 is lylo with a NK. ml leads to a 3v2, nk ties the factions at 2 a piece.
5v1 is mylo because ml takes it to 4v1 and a NK takes it to 3v1. lynch town, NK, game over.

We're agreed that there is a role hiding the flips.

It is in all likelihood not a passive ability. I literally see no reason for anyone thinking that, I think it's real dumb.

so why did the flips stop? Rake's untargettable doesn't mean jack if he's dead so that didn't stop it. The flip hiding died with Nabe either way.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Kary, the difference between his interactions with BW, and his interactions with Nabe and Rake, are who was doing the interacting.

BW's interactions with soup seem genuine, because BW did not know soup was on his faction. It reads genuine from both sides only because it only requires one performance. Soup could have done a very convincing bus on BW, and BW didn't even have to fake being frustrated about it. It wouldn't be that hard to fake one side of a shouting match. This interaction, in particular, supports the idea that soup would be a traitor. Not a regular mafiosi.

His interactions with Nabe and Rake though, those are based on things that soup himself did. Again, soup defending their slots did not require their cooperation. He did it on his own.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

so there's five scum or do you think Nabe wzas indy? Where's the other kill coming from?

Woah! Hold up there, champ. I thought that kill came from you? How could you not know that? You claimed it already.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

with a hypothetical indy, where does the nonwatt kill come from is how that is meant to read(ie, there shouldn't be a kill from an indy when we've only had one[mafia] all game)

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Woah! Hold up there, champ. I thought that kill came from you? How could you not know that? You claimed it already.

Orbo is explaining that for there to have been the kill besides ours there would have to be mafia still left, which apparently Kary missed.

We find it extremely unlikely that an Indy has held a kill this long and just so happened to fill in the "mafia nk" that time.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

get delayed ninja'd?

 

[#HBC | Joker]

oh, so you're hypothesizing that the mafia would be gone in that scenario. Ok, you had me worried for a second.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

get delayed ninja'd?

Yes :<

10 :<'s