Toonami Mafia - Game Over - Daytime Programing wins!

[Clownbot]

PJB, I don't even get what point you're trying to make. Nabe isn't saying that RR adopted this entire setup from Superheroes.

This claim is just ughhhhh. I guess it's technically verifiable but not immediately. If it's legit I wonder if Nabe could have used it in a way that didn't make him utterly unhelpful to town during the Day.

 

[Clownbot]

Nabe if you expect us to use my ability toDay (I hope you do) then we have to wait another Day to verify your claim.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

502ing so I'm sorry if this post shows up 40 times.
My claim post should say BSP, not BSL.

The way Vinyl suddenly shifts timbre and walks away in the day's end flavour suggests he was compelled to leave; I think it's an abductor. Janitors are typically night roles, and janned flips still say the player has died. That there's even a question about Vinyl's status suggests he's alive; Janitors are made purely to obscure flips, not to make players question the nature of the game's mechanics. "Gone missing" is an abductor beat.

I think Vinyl is mafia given the read, but I don't think his flip disappearing suggests his alignment. It's probably an abductor who just needs to hit his wincon by taking players. An abductor modded to steal lynches will play a large part in the setup's balancing, so hopefully we'll see that reflected in Night kill flips which we do seem to be getting.

The mechanical specifics are not a point we need to be stuck on right now. Whoever caused this to happen to Vinyl, they'll have been informed of his role and faction, and that will reflect in their play. Jans and abdos both get that information on their targets.


Vote: BSP
BSP is scum (probs mafia) and you guys should vote for him. I have a final tonight, but I'll be back tomorrow with an iso. Very sure this guy is scum. Feel it, feel it. Smell it (hi Pajamas).

This was my first post toDay where I brought up all three of my talking points for the day. (Abductor, Vinyl is mafia, BSP is mafia) As I've said, all of these points were based on my PJB shot last Night.

I've played the way I have since I got the role because of the role. My role is demonstrable, and if I'm not lynched, can and will be demonstrated tonight.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Nabe if you expect us to use my ability toDay (I hope you do) then we have to wait another Day to verify your claim.

I thought you said you weren't going to use it and that you weren't sure why Joey wanted to use it toDay?

How does it work?

 

[Clownbot]

No, I did not say that.

The way it works is that during Twilight I can post a command that automatically takes us into another Day phase. That Day, however, only lasts 24 hours.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

I am not bulletproof.

I would like to believe that if your claim is true, that means we managed to lynch scum in Vinyl... unfortunately, I'm of the opinion that it's actually because Vinyl is still alive.

So is there a reason you just waited around watching the wagon build around you instead of just claiming in the first place? You realize that you've wasted practically the entire day phase?

 

[Clownbot]

We can still afford to wait until the next Night phase for you to verify your claim but **** this makes things more frustrating. I don't know why you want to shoot Rake considering his claim has a chance of being legit (as in the NA-immune part of it)

 

[Clownbot]

PJB the points you're making are with all due respect pretty bad. Nabe can vig people who were voting him at the end of the Day, he explained this as the reason he did nothing but twiddle his thumbs during it.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

frozenflame751 replaces KevinM

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Yes but if he's not getting lynched, all I have to do is unvote him if I don't want to get shot, and so can everyone else. The fact that a wagon built up previous to the day ending does not change this, when all the information in his claim is presented.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

I mean seriously, he just TOLD us that all we have to do in order to not get shot is unvote him. If he's not going to be the lynch, why would anybody continue voting him?

 

[Clownbot]

I see your problem and it's something I've considered myself, though it is possible that people could still have their vote on him at the end of the Day due to simply not getting to the thread in time.

The problem I have with Nabe's claim is that he's created a scenario in which we may not get a lynch because a person could refuse to hammer, especially considering toMorrow is only 24 hours long. What verification would we have of his ability then? As much as I'd like to say "Oh well if this person doesn't hammer we'll just lynch them toMorrow" it doesn't solve the question of Nabe's alignment, not to mention the fact that there's no guarantee the refusing party is scum. Unless someone acknowledged as scummy is actually willing to give themselves up just to verify Nabe's claim this is going to be a problem.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Day is extended to the 1st of January for FF per my replacement policy.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

I'm Samurai Jack, Toonami Vigilante. I can only shoot players who hammered on a mislynch the previous Day phase, or any players who were still voting me at the end of a previous Day phase. That's why I've been trying to accumulate votes on me toDay, and I have two of three of my scumpicks on me

wow really Nabe. talk me through why you decided to claim the specifics of your role toDay, and why on balance you thought it was a good idea given the possibility of, say, a mafia roleblocker.

The only thing that you need to do is the following: if I do not kill a player toNight, lynch me toMorrow.

GJ attempt to strongarm a play when you're a scumspect. exactly the problems laid out above; #1 why claim, #2 roleblocker etc.

Yes but if he's not getting lynched, all I have to do is unvote him if I don't want to get shot, and so can everyone else. The fact that a wagon built up previous to the day ending does not change this, when all the information in his claim is presented.

+1

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

If town wants someone dead, they'll die. In this case, it'll be the hammer on a town player or anyone town tells to be voting me by the end of the Day, but it has to be town-directed at this juncture since it's public, and town directs vigs all the time.

TBH Peanut, I equally like the idea of a situation where you pursue me to the end of the Day and get caught with your vote still on me


@Kary, I claimed because I'm being talked about as all but the Day's lynch, already over and done. Common sense, I don't want to be mislynched. Inactivity has kept me from pursuing this Day in an ideal way; obviously I'd prefer to be unclaimed with a single vote on me from my scumread.

A roleblocker obviously didn't enter into that consideration, since it's about me not dying. If there's a roleblocker, I guess I'm SOL. Not that they would be likely to stop me from killing a townie, in that event. Of course, if there's a day-abductor in this setup, then it's much less likely that there's a mafia roleblocker.

I suspect my kill will get through without an issue, and if I'm allowed to kill the players I talked about, I'm confident they'll flip scum.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

We can still afford to wait until the next Night phase for you to verify your claim but **** this makes things more frustrating. I don't know why you want to shoot Rake considering his claim has a chance of being legit (as in the NA-immune part of it)

Well, if Rake is town, he won't die from a shot. And if he's scum, he's lying, and he will! Seems win-win, but I'm very much banking on the latter.

My vote's on Rake though, and I'd like to shoot WATT who is currently voting me.

 

[Clownbot]

You are ignoring the possibility that Rake is independently aligned as well as the fact that my ability, which I still very much plan to use this Twilight, will take us to another Day without a Night phase for you to verify your power. With a new Day, the votecount will be reset.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

@Kary, I claimed because I'm being talked about as all but the Day's lynch, already over and done. Common sense, I don't want to be mislynched. Inactivity has kept me from pursuing this Day in an ideal way; obviously I'd prefer to be unclaimed with a single vote on me from my scumread.

A roleblocker obviously didn't enter into that consideration, since it's about me not dying. If there's a roleblocker, I guess I'm SOL. Not that they would be likely to stop me from killing a townie, in that event. Of course, if there's a day-abductor in this setup, then it's much less likely that there's a mafia roleblocker.

so plausible setup reasons for why you wouldn't claim go out the window in the event that you're going to be lynched. that's reasonable enough; the debate becomes whether you were going to be lynched. let me tell you a story...

Modnote: Correct me if I made mistakes

1. Rake - [1] - Nabe,
2. Soup - [0] -
3. Kary - [3] - Wots All This Then?, KevinM, Rajam,
4. KevinM - [0]
5. Wots All This Then? (Orboknown/JDietz hydra) - [2] Vanderzant, Gangstalicious,
6. PrivateJoker-Brown - [1] - Kary,
7. Rajam - [1] - Clownbot
8. Vanderzant - [0]
9. Nabe - [0] -
10. Gangstalicious (Inferno3044/J) - [1] - Rake,
11. Clownbot - [0]

Not Voting [3] Soup, PrivateJoker-Brown,

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Deadline is at December 30th 11:59 CST.

No votes on Nabe whatsoever. Potentially 3-4 people having voiced Nabe as an option for toDay.

Vote: WATT

You make a vote on WATT without any warning or explanation.

My read on Nabe stands on it's own, regardless of the fact that he replaced MiR instead of RF. It's just not quite as strengthened as before :/

I'm not very interested in any of the current wagons. I suppose if people wish to join me in making a new wagon?

Vote: Nabe

What is, in my opinion, a pretty ill-timed vote from a quiet, plausibly scum slot. not something i'd lose sleep over.

Vandy, help me lynch Nabe and we'll get WATT another day? He doesn't show interest in responding to me either way.

Vote: Nabe

follow-up vote from earlier pressure/questions throughout the day.

this post is AtE

Vote: Nabe

someone hammer

you decide to self-vote.

-----------

so my question is, at what point did it look likely, nay, inevitable that you were going to get lynched toDay? Because I feel like saying that the waggon on you is your own damn fault, and inactivity/johns aside, you could have done a lot more to avoid getting lynched than you did.

I know the possibility of two lynches flying around might make you worry. But you could've pushed Rake/BSP as a lynch; could've pushed Rajam, could've talked through your dislike of WATT. this all smells to me like you wanted to claim toDay; and IMO that's either because you're paranoid about being mislynched, or you're scum.

as an aside, I don't share your confidence in your scumreads, or that your ability will go off without a hitch.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

You are ignoring the possibility that Rake is independently aligned as well as the fact that my ability, which I still very much plan to use this Twilight, will take us to another Day without a Night phase for you to verify your power. With a new Day, the votecount will be reset.

Scum means anti-town.

Your new Day lasts 24 hours, right? With a Night phase after? So I'll shoot after. =/ I wish you didn't have to use it so soon, we've got a D1 scum modkill and likely a mafia lynch following that puts us way ahead of the curve, but I appreciate that Joey claiming it puts you in a certain position.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

Nabe, you realize it would be completely unproveable that you did shoot me, right ?

And i'd still be alive.

So we'd be in the same situation as today.

Only down one person.


And you mysteriously left out option D , wherein your BSing your role to avoid a lynch.

/buthey

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Kary, people have been talking about how scummy they found MiR since before I replaced in, and since the start of toDay people have mentioned my lynch in passing as if it were a foregone conclusion. There were enough votes promised to do so.

Me self-voting was absurdism at Vand's expense. See: the Australia post. It's by way of verbal taunting because everything that comes out of his mouth is bat**** insane. That anyone found that scummy or even notable defies description.

I'm not sure why you suggest pushing Rajam, since I haven't commented on him at all. You're supposedly telling me what I should have done from a town perspective, lol. Lying about my reads and pushing someone else in place of me doesn't fit.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

I personally feel like his role is BS. Not only is it a claim that seems provable, (but it's not) but it also includes a cute little thing where it scares people away from voting him by saying there's a chance he can shoot us.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Nabe, you realize it would be completely unproveable that you did shoot me, right ?

And i'd still be alive.

So we'd be in the same situation as today.

Only down one person.


And you mysteriously left out option D , wherein your BSing your role to avoid a lynch.

/buthey

I think it's pretty clear that when I'm claiming the role I know I have, I'm going to be phrasing my argument from the side of me telling the truth. FUD harder.

Your role's existence does not make sense against my role and Clownbot's. You are not NK-immune and you will die when I shoot you.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I personally feel like his role is BS. Not only is it a claim that seems provable, (but it's not) but it also includes a cute little thing where it scares people away from voting him by saying there's a chance he can shoot us.

It's extremely provable. The person I say I'll kill dies. Voila! Proof of my role!

The bolded is incorrect, since quick application of common sense shows that (as has already been pointed out, by you) people will unvote, or for that matter, go through with it and get me lynched. This is simple FUD that a) suggests people are stupid, and b) goes against a post you just made earlier today.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

FUD FUD FUD
It rhymes with mud

I get the feeling I'm going to be a broken record tonight.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Nabe, you stated that you wanted your scumreads to vote you, so was the way you were acting an attempt to get me to vote you? I think it clarifies what you were doing but now that it's out of the way, you shouldn't have a problem telling me your intentions.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

If town wants someone dead, they'll die. In this case, it'll be the hammer on a town player or anyone town tells to be voting me by the end of the Day, but it has to be town-directed at this juncture since it's public, and town directs vigs all the time.

TBH Peanut, I equally like the idea of a situation where you pursue me to the end of the Day and get caught with your vote still on me


@Kary, I claimed because I'm being talked about as all but the Day's lynch, already over and done. Common sense, I don't want to be mislynched. Inactivity has kept me from pursuing this Day in an ideal way; obviously I'd prefer to be unclaimed with a single vote on me from my scumread.

A roleblocker obviously didn't enter into that consideration, since it's about me not dying. If there's a roleblocker, I guess I'm SOL. Not that they would be likely to stop me from killing a townie, in that event. Of course, if there's a day-abductor in this setup, then it's much less likely that there's a mafia roleblocker.

I suspect my kill will get through without an issue, and if I'm allowed to kill the players I talked about, I'm confident they'll flip scum.

@Underlined: So then why the heck did you feel the need to be the most anti-town ****** you could until the votes piled on you if you were planning to claim regardless when you got in trouble? Based on the underlined you clearly understood that all that really needed to happen was for you to convey your claim to people, and from there they could coerce the person town wanted vigged most to vote you at the end of the day or get lynched.

There was no need for you to wait this long and be so unhelpful in the meantime. I may have bought it if you were trying to be helpful/reasonable during the day all the way through and were forced to claim then, but you weren't.

Yesterday you literally said "I hope I wake up to L-1 so I can claim.", but I see no reason for you to have waited to do so in this scenario. (I didn't even see one at the time, L-1 is unnecessarily dangerous). Yet you didn't seem to mind that you weren't at L-1 yet today either, even though your reasoning for it was you wanted as many people voting you as possible.

That reason of which I may add is flawed, since it in no way helps you to have votes on you throughout the day and especially not if they have to still be on you at the end of the day to matter. Even if you had gotten your scum-picks to vote you there's no real reason they couldn't have voted somewhere else, in which case if town agreed they should die we'd have to coerce them into re-voting you or dying... which leads to the same scenario as if you claimed and just asked for that situation without being intentionally confrontational/useless.



So if you're town: you ****ed up. You screwed this one over so hard that you managed to waste a large portion of the day being concerned about you and getting nowhere and now with a day left and another lynch to figure out. It would be literally be more helpful for you to die as the weakest Vig role I've ever heard of in mafia so far to clear your slot's name than it would be to keep you around through another two rounds of lynches and a night when you didn't even think of the possibility of a roleblocker when discussing your previous night actions.

I'm giving you more credit as a mafia player than this that you thought today's sequence of events was a good idea. I'm pretty sure you were intentionally wasting time the last day or two building up to a semi-believeable fakeclaim you could run with.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

The speculation against Nabe isn't enough for me to vote him, especially since it makes um...sense. The pile on Nabe is actually more startling than his claim for me.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Oh... and giving Town the ability to kill twice in a row plus a vig seems kind of jank, but that's speculative and dependent on just how stacked scum is.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Is your vote on Nabe now purely because of his claim? What do you think about voting Gangsta today?

 

[Wots All This Then?]

A roleblocker obviously didn't enter into that consideration, since it's about me not dying. If there's a roleblocker, I guess I'm SOL. Not that they would be likely to stop me from killing a townie, in that event. Of course, if there's a day-abductor in this setup, then it's much less likely that there's a mafia roleblocker.

I suspect my kill will get through without an issue, and if I'm allowed to kill the players I talked about, I'm confident they'll flip scum.

@Bold: How would they have any way of knowing you were aiming for a townie, or even necessarily be a mafia roleblocker, I don't see why this thought entered your mind.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Is your vote on Nabe now purely because of his claim? What do you think about voting Gangsta today?

No, did you see how he acted beforehand? He wasted so much of our time it's unbelievable.

Even if he was town and thought he was justified in wanting more people to be voting him mid-day, he should have known that the time we could have been spending discussing anything other than him would be far more valuable to us.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

I don't think a Nabe lynch is fruitful at this point, even if he is mafia, he's doing something at a last resort, and mafia is aware of this. The lynch on Nabe would only be telling based on who hammered him, because right now I don't feel that any of his mafia partners are voting him right now. It just doesn't feel like a scum thing to do, and even if PJB wants to spin it like he was trying to avert attention from him, because a claim like this is the complete opposite.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

The speculation behind nabe being unhelpful and anti-town makes sense with a role like his, because his intention is to get voted. He could play normally, but that's nearly as successful. My only problem is why he ignored me, because I do agree that a part of his play was unnecessary.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

EBWOP: not nearly*

The 'test his role' is complete rubbish too, that's just an excuse if anything. I have no intention to vote Nabe currently.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

I don't think a Nabe lynch is fruitful at this point, even if he is mafia, he's doing something at a last resort, and mafia is aware of this. The lynch on Nabe would only be telling based on who hammered him, because right now I don't feel that any of his mafia partners are voting him right now. It just doesn't feel like a scum thing to do, and even if PJB wants to spin it like he was trying to avert attention from him, because a claim like this is the complete opposite.

@Bold: Wut. 10 Wuts.


Soup, did you just literally suggest that lynching scum is a bad thing? Just hand in your badge dude... You wanna explain out why you'd ever be not okay with that in words I can understand, because what you said above is incomprehensible.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

So if you're town: you ****ed up. You screwed this one over so hard that you managed to waste a large portion of the day being concerned about you and getting nowhere and now with a day left and another lynch to figure out. It would be literally be more helpful for you to die as the weakest Vig role I've ever heard of in mafia so far to clear your slot's name than it would be to keep you around through another two rounds of lynches and a night when you didn't even think of the possibility of a roleblocker when discussing your previous night actions.

I've wanted to like you and keep my read on you consistent but paragraphs like these are completely out of proportion and bother me. Going so far to discredit his slot by calling him a 'weak vig' as a reason to lynch him doesn't look good, and not right now. We're close to deadline and suddenly you're set on sitting on your vote on Nabe. It's clear you don't believe him, but this is at the stake that you were getting shot. He didn't show interest in that at all, and for me, you'd rather fall back on pretenses instead of understanding his play. Give me something more besides 'he played bad there he needs to die.'

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

@Bold: Wut. 10 Wuts.


Soup, did you just literally suggest that lynching scum is a bad thing? Just hand in your badge dude... You wanna explain out why you'd ever be not okay with that in words I can understand, because what you said above is incomprehensible.

If Nabe is mafia, then he's doing something as a last resort. If his role is fake, and mafia know this, then they won't vote him.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

If Nabe is mafia, then he's doing something as a last resort. If his role is fake, and mafia know this, then they won't vote him.

Why would you not want to lynch him no matter how many resorts he's been to if he's mafia though.

Why wouldn't they vote him even if they think his role is fake. More importantly why would he bull**** this if it isn't his role and is town?

 

[Clownbot]

If Nabe is mafia, then he's doing something as a last resort. If his role is fake, and mafia know this, then they won't vote him.

Even if this was acceptable logic I can't see how it makes a Nabe lynch fruitless.