Things you feel are wrong in SSB4?

[Kenith]

: just take rage away from this character and he will be fair.

Without that he would be pathetically underpowered.
No thank you.

 

[Ephemiel]

People seem to forget that both Chrom and Lucina are from the same world as Marth. Lucina also learned everything she knows FROM Chrom, meaning he would fight very similar to Lucina and Marth. If anything, Chrom would be a mix of Marth and Ike. Also, everyone forgets that reclassing isn't really canon, in the Awakening canon people can't just drop what they learn to instantly use something else.

 

[Deleted member 269706]

People seem to forget that both Chrom and Lucina are from the same world as Marth. Lucina also learned everything she knows FROM Chrom, meaning he would fight very similar to Lucina and Marth. If anything, Chrom would be a mix of Marth and Ike. Also, everyone forgets that reclassing isn't really canon, in the Awakening canon people can't just drop what they learn to instantly use something else.

While it is true that they come from the same world, that doesn't mean that they fight the same...I agree with you, that if Chrom were to be in the game he would probably be right in between Marth and Ike in terms of speed and strength. I completely disagree with the idea that Chrom and Marth are too similar in terms of fighting styles. Based off of the cutscenes from Fire Emblem: Awakening, we can see that his fighting style is significantly different. Here's a video of all the cut scenes from Awakening (will contain spoilers).

Spoiler

Ranting below:

Spoiler

Breakdown of POSSIBLE attacks seen by Chrom AND Lucina:
3:27 - Ftilt or Dash attack.
3:34 - Down Special
3:40 - Dair
4:30 - another possible Ftilt
5:00 - Final Smash (just a suggestion)
5:27 - Intro animation
5:42 - Fair, Nair, or side special
5:45 - Jab (Lucina's attacks)
5:54 - Taunt
5:57 - Ftilt or side special
6:25 - Recovery
10:05 - Fsmash (stun with first strike, knockback from second swipe)
10:21 - Bair
10:26 - Grab or side special

This in itself shows how different Chrom (and Lucina) are from Marth. On top of this, there are a number of other skills, types of attacks, and so on that could be implemented into his character. To name a few:

• Astra could be his jab, which canonically speaking, is 5 consecutive strikes.
  
• Galeforce could be a tilt or special attack which would stun the enemy, granting Chrom another strike (would act like ZSS's neutral special).
  
• Luna could act like Marth's Shield Breaker as it's original use is to half or negate the enemies defense.
  
• Sol could be used as a strike which heals Chrom based on how he hit the enemy (based either on timing or spacing?).
  
• Discipline could be a tilt or smash attack which upscales it's knock-back based on the enemies damage level (would act similar to Ness's back throw).

Every attack I named (Astra, Galeforce, Luna, Sol, & Discipline) are actual skills from the game and would retain their original purposes.

I don't want to hear anyone say that Chrom is too similar to Marth, that's BS and we all know it. Yeah, he'd be similar, but easily his own character. Anyone whose played the games knows this. There's a lot of potential for this character, it just needs to be thought out.

Viva la Chrom!

 

[Ephemiel]

While it is true that they come from the same world, that doesn't mean that they fight the same...I agree with you, that if Chrom were to be in the game he would probably be right in between Marth and Ike in terms of speed and strength. I completely disagree with the idea that Chrom and Marth are too similar in terms of fighting styles. Based off of the cutscenes from Fire Emblem: Awakening, we can see that his fighting style is significantly different. Here's a video of all the cut scenes from Awakening (will contain spoilers).

Spoiler

Ranting below:

Spoiler

Breakdown of POSSIBLE attacks seen by Chrom AND Lucina:
3:27 - Ftilt or Dash attack.
3:34 - Down Special
3:40 - Dair
4:30 - another possible Ftilt
5:00 - Final Smash (just a suggestion)
5:27 - Intro animation
5:42 - Fair, Nair, or side special
5:45 - Jab (Lucina's attacks)
5:54 - Taunt
5:57 - Ftilt or side special
6:25 - Recovery
10:05 - Fsmash (stun with first strike, knockback from second swipe)
10:21 - Bair
10:26 - Grab or side special

This in itself shows how different Chrom (and Lucina) are from Marth. On top of this, there are a number of other skills, types of attacks, and so on that could be implemented into his character. To name a few:

• Astra could be his jab, which canonically speaking, is 5 consecutive strikes.
  
• Galeforce could be a tilt or special attack which would stun the enemy, granting Chrom another strike (would act like ZSS's neutral special).
  
• Luna could act like Marth's Shield Breaker as it's original use is to half or negate the enemies defense.
  
• Sol could be used as a strike which heals Chrom based on how he hit the enemy (based either on timing or spacing?).
  
• Discipline could be a tilt or smash attack which upscales it's knock-back based on the enemies damage level (would act similar to Ness's back throw).

Every attack I named (Astra, Galeforce, Luna, Sol, & Discipline) are actual skills from the game and would retain their original purposes.

I don't want to hear anyone say that Chrom is too similar to Marth, that's BS and we all know it. Yeah, he'd be similar, but easily his own character. Anyone whose played the games knows this. There's a lot of potential for this character, it just needs to be thought out.

Viva la Chrom!

Might i remind you that they come from the same bloodline, so it can be implied that the fighting styles are extremely similar. Also Lucina, a clone of Marth in this game may i add, is Chrom's daughter and she specifically said she learned how to fight "from her father". Maybe he'd have some different moves, but Chrom would still be a Marth/Ike hybrid.

 

[Deleted member 269706]

Might i remind you that they come from the same bloodline, so it can be implied that the fighting styles are extremely similar. Also Lucina, a clone of Marth in this game may i add, is Chrom's daughter and she specifically said she learned how to fight "from her father". Maybe he'd have some different moves, but Chrom would still be a Marth/Ike hybrid.

From the same bloodline like a thousand years later on an entirely different continent and slightly different bloodline (since Marth has no reference of having the Mark of the Exalt). So it can also be implied that they're fighting style is much different. And since when is Smash Bros canonically correct? May I remind you that Ganondorf's move-set is based around Captain Falcon's. Last I checked those two have nothing in common.

 

[Ffamran]

From the same bloodline like a thousand years later on an entirely different continent and slightly different bloodline (since Marth has no reference of having the Mark of the Exalt). So it can also be implied that they're fighting style is much different. And since when is Smash Bros canonically correct? May I remind you that Ganondorf's move-set is based around Captain Falcon's. Last I checked those two have nothing in common.

Ganondorf and Captain Falcon are both male, muscular, tall, and have stylish boots. They also have hair.

 

[Ephemiel]

From the same bloodline like a thousand years later on an entirely different continent and slightly different bloodline (since Marth has no reference of having the Mark of the Exalt). So it can also be implied that they're fighting style is much different. And since when is Smash Bros canonically correct? May I remind you that Ganondorf's move-set is based around Captain Falcon's. Last I checked those two have nothing in common.

They're also from completely different games, with Ganondorf being a literal clone. Lucina, again, IS from Marth's bloodline. Even if it's thousands of years later, the sword style of the legendary Hero King Marth wouldn't have been changed too much.

 

[Deleted member 269706]

They're also from completely different games, with Ganondorf being a literal clone. Lucina, again, IS from Marth's bloodline. Even if it's thousands of years later, the sword style of the legendary Hero King Marth wouldn't have been changed too much.

My point is that Smash isn't canonically correct, so you can't assume that just because Lucina is a clone of Marth automatically means that Chrom would also have to fight that way. I also wanted to add that the way Lucina fights in game and in the cutscenes of Awakening is much different than her fighting style in Smash. And since Smash isn't canonically correct, it wouldn't be a problem to implement Chrom into Smash with a different moveset than that of Lucina's.

 

[Ephemiel]

My point is that Smash isn't canonically correct, so you can't assume that just because Lucina is a clone of Marth automatically means that Chrom would also have to fight that way. I also wanted to add that the way Lucina fights in game and in the cutscenes of Awakening is much different than her fighting style in Smash. And since Smash isn't canonically correct, it wouldn't be a problem to implement Chrom into Smash with a different moveset than that of Lucina's.

I can assume it because characters from other series in Smash do the same even if they're supposed to be different. Link and Toon Link, Fox and Falco and obviously Marth and Lucina for example.

 

[Tattles]

I can assume it because characters from other series in Smash do the same even if they're supposed to be different. Link and Toon Link, Fox and Falco and obviously Marth and Lucina for example.

It's because Chrom literally says in the game that Lucina's fighting style is like his, and she says that he taught her it. (i may have missed your point idk?)

Spoilers below:
i just realized, what ever happened to baby lucina... didn't she exist when everyone found out "marth" was lucina? off-topic lol, but i don't remember that ever being explained.

 

[Ffamran]

They're also from completely different games, with Ganondorf being a literal clone. Lucina, again, IS from Marth's bloodline. Even if it's thousands of years later, the sword style of the legendary Hero King Marth wouldn't have been changed too much.

It's because Chrom literally says in the game that Lucina's fighting style is like his, and she says that he taught her it. (i may have missed your point idk?)

Spoilers below:
i just realized, what ever happened to baby lucina... didn't she exist when everyone found out "marth" was lucina? off-topic lol, but i don't remember that ever being explained.

I would like to point out that having the same fighting style doesn't mean people are going to fight the same way. If it were true, then every boxer would be like Muhammad Ali which would be boring as hell. Hell, just look at Ryu, Ken, Gouken, and Akuma or Tekken's Mishima family. All of them were taught under the same style (with some branching off), but they all fight differently.

Assuming there's a Marth swordsmanship, then there's already noticeable differences. Marth (in SSB) is graceful and precision-based, Chrom is more hack 'n' slash and brutal, while Lucina since she tried to emulate Marth is more stabby, but is still using an imitation of Marth who died thousands of years ago and nobody, but Tiki knows how he fought. So, how she fought in Awakening might not be how Marth fought.

Also, you can emulate a fighter as much as you want, but you'll never be as good or identical to the original. There's a reason why Bruce Lee's Jeet Kune Do philosophy asks that people be like water and fight how they fight. Bruce Lee's a one of a kind fighter just as Sugar Ray Johnson is. What works for them might not work for others.

 

[Captain Norris]

With the game itself, I am still super mad that you gotta change your tag to your name every stinking time you enter something. Half the time I forget and end up with a different control scheme.

 

[Tattles]

I would like to point out that having the same fighting style doesn't mean people are going to fight the same way. If it were true, then every boxer would be like Muhammad Ali which would be boring as hell. Hell, just look at Ryu, Ken, Gouken, and Akuma or Tekken's Mishima family. All of them were taught under the same style (with some branching off), but they all fight differently.

Assuming there's a Marth swordsmanship, then there's already noticeable differences. Marth (in SSB) is graceful and precision-based, Chrom is more hack 'n' slash and brutal, while Lucina since she tried to emulate Marth is more stabby, but is still using an imitation of Marth who died thousands of years ago and nobody, but Tiki knows how he fought. So, how she fought in Awakening might not be how Marth fought.

Also, you can emulate a fighter as much as you want, but you'll never be as good or identical to the original. There's a reason why Bruce Lee's Jeet Kune Do philosophy asks that people be like water and fight how they fight. Bruce Lee's a one of a kind fighter just as Sugar Ray Johnson is. What works for them might not work for others.

Which is exactly why being a Marth clone doesn't do her character justice. Lucina isn't her own character. The name, voice, outfit, and character is from Awakening, but the fighter is not, if that makes sense. She doesn't belong in the game with the fighting style she has, which yea, can be said about a lot of fighters with the whole canon-argument. But it's just unfortunate that she doesn't have more to offer to the game, and could have made an impact on the game by bringing in a potentially interesting fighting style. A hybrid of grace and strength.

I also have to point out that comparing the way one game series handles this, doesn't mean it's constant across all game series'.

 

[Ffamran]

Which is exactly why being a Marth clone doesn't do her character justice. Lucina isn't her own character. The name, voice, outfit, and character is from Awakening, but the fighter is not, if that makes sense. She doesn't belong in the game with the fighting style she has, which yea, can be said about a lot of fighters with the whole canon-argument. But it's just unfortunate that she doesn't have more to offer to the game, and could have made an impact on the game by bringing in a potentially interesting fighting style. A hybrid of grace and power.

I also have to point out that comparing the way one game series handles this, doesn't mean it's constant across all game series'.

No really, have you seen the stuff Fox can pull in Star Fox Adventures? Double crescent kicks are the first thing that comes to mind. Do we have crescent kicks in SSB? We have helicopter kicks in the air and a side flip thing - I have no idea what Fox's Side Smash is called. Still, at least Fox has kicks which started in SSB, though, since Adventures was released years later.

Falco has a gangster background and is presumably a Star Fox equivalent of an Italian-American with a Brooklyn accent, I think Falco should have been more brawler-like using punches, haymakers, and stuff alongside whatever training he had when he joined Star Fox - even pilots have to fight on land some times. Nope, we got spinning and Drill Peck. Oh, and no mafia gangster holds a pistol like that. It has to be more sinister-like - kinda like ya wanna teach 'em a lesson, capiche?

Don't get started on Wolf. It's made worse by how he goes from a cocky British mercenary to a space cowboy and something in between in Command. If he was British, then I'd like him to a British (kick)boxer or use bartitsu which is boxing combined with savate, wrestling, fencing, and knife-usage. As a space cowboy, I better be seeing some trick shots and quick draws. Or if anything from Assault and Command, then we could have him be like Snake where Wolf uses a ton of lasers, missiles, rockets, grenades, mines, and other fun explosives. Nope, we got (in Brawl), a feral Wolf who's fighting style might have made more sense with either Panther Caroso except it needs to be more flamboyant and elegant or Leon Powalski which would have been perfect for our crazy, bloodthirsty chemeleon.

Then there's Link who's moves changes throughout each game, so it can't be helped, however, there are consistent things like the Spin Attack, stabbing, the Ending Blow, and the Jump Attack present in all the 3D Zelda games and which just recently made it in SSB when it should have been in since 64 - just rip the animation from OoT.

Back to Lucina. I made this suggestion a lot, but she could keep Marth's style while Marth gains a fencer-based style that fits his tipper-based combat since fencers, especially rapier-orientated fencers, tend to stab people. Also, stabs are much more deadly than slashes. An example from Assassin's Creed would be Arno Dorian, Edward Kenway, and Haytham Kenway. Arno's your classic French fencer; he'd be Marth in this comparison. Edward is a pirate who's brutal, but that doesn't mean he lacks discipline and fluidity; he'd be Chrom. Haytham is more structured than his father, but is straightforward compared to Arno; he'd be Lucina.

So, I don't get why Chrom would be "an Ike" clone or "another Roy". Lucina should have been different, but whether she was "padding" which means Sakurai didn't manage time well or ran into issues that caused him and his team to lose time like figuring out how to make the Ice Climbers work, 8-player on 3DS, or whatnot like licensing issues, we'll never know. Hopefully, she becomes Luigified or she or Marth become Bowserfied - extreme changes.

Hey, did I ever mention how Zelda never used the three Great Fairies's gifts?! Or how Link never kneels down when shooting an arrow?! Or how Luigi has electricity powers from that gift in Superstar Saga?! Or how easy it would be to reference Krystal's move set from Adventures?! Oh, and let's not forget that Mario has a ground pound move since Super Mario Bros. 3!!!

 

[Deleted member 269706]

Someone should really set up a Chrom thread in the Character Discussion sub-forum, I think it'd be better if we moved this conversation there.

 

[Tattles]

I

No really, have you seen the stuff Fox can pull in Star Fox Adventures? Double crescent kicks are the first thing that comes to mind. Do we have crescent kicks in SSB? We have helicopter kicks in the air and a side flip thing - I have no idea what Fox's Side Smash is called. Still, at least Fox has kicks which started in SSB, though, since Adventures was released years later.

Falco has a gangster background and is presumably a Star Fox equivalent of an Italian-American with a Brooklyn accent, I think Falco should have been more brawler-like using punches, haymakers, and stuff alongside whatever training he had when he joined Star Fox - even pilots have to fight on land some times. Nope, we got spinning and Drill Peck. Oh, and no mafia gangster holds a pistol like that. It has to be more sinister-like - kinda like ya wanna teach 'em a lesson, capiche?

Don't get started on Wolf. It's made worse by how he goes from a cocky British mercenary to a space cowboy and something in between in Command. If he was British, then I'd like him to a British (kick)boxer or use bartitsu which is boxing combined with savate, wrestling, fencing, and knife-usage. As a space cowboy, I better be seeing some trick shots and quick draws. Or if anything from Assault and Command, then we could have him be like Snake where Wolf uses a ton of lasers, missiles, rockets, grenades, mines, and other fun explosives. Nope, we got (in Brawl), a feral Wolf who's fighting style might have made more sense with either Panther Caroso except it needs to be more flamboyant and elegant or Leon Powalski which would have been perfect for our crazy, bloodthirsty chemeleon.

Then there's Link who's moves changes throughout each game, so it can't be helped, however, there are consistent things like the Spin Attack, stabbing, the Ending Blow, and the Jump Attack present in all the 3D Zelda games and which just recently made it in SSB when it should have been in since 64 - just rip the animation from OoT.

Back to Lucina. I made this suggestion a lot, but she could keep Marth's style while Marth gains a fencer-based style that fits his tipper-based combat since fencers, especially rapier-orientated fencers, tend to stab people. Also, stabs are much more deadly than slashes. An example from Assassin's Creed would be Arno Dorian, Edward Kenway, and Haytham Kenway. Arno's your classic French fencer; he'd be Marth in this comparison. Edward is a pirate who's brutal, but that doesn't mean he lacks discipline and fluidity; he'd be Chrom. Haytham is more structured than his father, but is straightforward compared to Arno; he'd be Lucina.

So, I don't get why Chrom would be "an Ike" clone or "another Roy". Lucina should have been different, but whether she was "padding" which means Sakurai didn't manage time well or ran into issues that caused him and his team to lose time like figuring out how to make the Ice Climbers work, 8-player on 3DS, or whatnot like licensing issues, we'll never know. Hopefully, she becomes Luigified or she or Marth become Bowserfied - extreme changes.

Hey, did I ever mention how Zelda never used the three Great Fairies's gifts?! Or how Link never kneels down when shooting an arrow?! Or how Luigi has electricity powers from that gift in Superstar Saga?! Or how easy it would be to reference Krystal's move set from Adventures?! Oh, and let's not forget that Mario has a ground pound move since Super Mario Bros. 3!!!

Lucina's un-uniqueness is pretty simple. She started out as an alt, so she didn't have the same development cycle as any other newcomer would, like Robin. Sakurai never intended for Lucina to be a unique addition to the roster, which is just an unfortunate happening. It is definitely a shame, as I highly doubt that they would bring her back for the next Smash game (thinking far into the future) without giving her a full redesign; but redesigning a character just to bring them back is unheard of as of now. If the next Fire Emblem game includes her as a main character (for more than, what, 10 chapters like in Awakening?) she has a shot at solidifying as a character; but not at this rate.

Marth shouldn't be altered for the sake of Lucina. Lucina should have been her own character in the first place, and could have been, but she isn't and she was never intended to be, unfortunately.

 

[Ffamran]

I

Lucina's un-uniqueness is pretty simple. She started out as an alt, so she didn't have the same development cycle as any other newcomer would, like Robin. Sakurai never intended for Lucina to be a unique addition to the roster, which is just an unfortunate happening. It is definitely a shame, as I highly doubt that they would bring her back for the next Smash game (thinking far into the future) without giving her a full redesign; but redesigning a character just to bring them back is unheard of as of now. If the next Fire Emblem game includes her as a main character (for more than, what, 10 chapters like in Awakening?) she has a shot at solidifying as a character; but not at this rate.

Marth shouldn't be altered for the sake of Lucina. Lucina should have been her own character in the first place, and could have been, but she isn't and she was never intended to be, unfortunately.

Dark Pit and Lucina seemed like alts who became their own characters while the Koopalings who are individuals like them, ended up as alts. I don't get why Lucina and Chrom weren't even considered, but Robin was. Robin's a player created character so, giving them a "canon" appearance sort of ruins it especially considering that none of Robin's palette swaps change their hair and facial strucuture like The Villager's. Hell, there's also Micaiah who would be a cool addition as another mage, but oh well. Chrom, the main Lord alongside his daughter Lucina were not considered. Chrom who's nothing like Ike, Marth, or Roy and Lucina who's nothing like Marth except by emulating him. Really? Well, whatever.

The issue with recent Fire Emblem games are that there isn't a main character, but several. Starting with Rekka no Ken, we had three main Lords, Lyn the tutorial/beginning Lady, Eliwood the first story Lord, and Hector the second story Lord. Sacred Stones had twin Lords, Radiant Dawn had Ike and Micaiah, and Awakening had three main characters: the Avatar, Chrom, and Lucina.

I swear if the next Fire Emblem has an axe-wielding, spear-wielding, magic Lord/Lady and Sakurai/future SSB developr admits that that Lord/Lady would have been an alt, but ended up as a freaking clone... I'M CALLING F-ING BS!

Same thing if Dark Pit stays the same in SSB5 when canonically he used different weapons and the damned fact there's half of Uprising's weapons left unused.

I think Marth's staying because it's Marth, the first Lord of Fire Emblem while Ike's the overseas/international Lord. I don't see Lucina staying since she's a clone for SSB4 and especially if FE14 doesn't involve her. If she were like Robin who brought in a unique fighting style, then she would have stayed. Now, if she stayed solely because she's a female FE character, then that would be stupid since we already have Lyn who could have been a playable character and Micaiah who could have been introduced as a newcomer. Let's not forget that FE14 could involve a female Lord.

There's no reason why Wolf's not back aside from time mismanagement and the Star Fox 64 3D theme which would mean an entire overhaul for Wolf since it's not space cowboy Assault Wolf anymore, but British Wolf. He's only barely a semi-clone because he shares similarly-functioning specials, a Final Smash for some stupid reason along with Falco using a freaking Landmaster instead of an Arwing and ledge attacks. Everything else about Wolf is unique.

I don't like padding and I don't like avoiding truths. If I were a developer, I'd probably have extremely bad publicity because I'd be so freaking blunt and honest. If I messed up and couldn't work characters in, I'd tell people, especially if they ask or if I know there was a huge following for them. Others, I might just say, no, since it wouldn't work like Ridley. Sorry, Ridley fans, but I'm not compromising in any way to make a bad*** who's freaking huge about as tall as Charizard just to make him playable. I'd rather be hated because I was honest than hated because I did "controversial" actions like making Lucina a clone, including Dark Pit, or not telling people there would be a "retro" theme meaning someone like Duck Hunt, Excite Biker, or Zero would be possible newcomer.

 

[Humanity]

My point is that Smash isn't canonically correct, so you can't assume that just because Lucina is a clone of Marth automatically means that Chrom would also have to fight that way. I also wanted to add that the way Lucina fights in game and in the cutscenes of Awakening is much different than her fighting style in Smash. And since Smash isn't canonically correct, it wouldn't be a problem to implement Chrom into Smash with a different moveset than that of Lucina's.

If you want a sword fighter with a mix of strength and speed, we've already got one- his name is Link. His specials may be different, but frankly they're significantly more interesting than most of the Fire Emblem cast's. There's only so many things you can do with a sword that qualify as "specials", and they've used up most of them. A well made Chrom would likely have felt like Link with Marth's specials, and I must say I agree with Sakurai that that wouldn't have been an interesting or worthwhile addition to the game. I like Chrom, and I like Lucina, but they wouldn't be good additions to Smash.

 

[LabrysXII]

I'm hoping I do not come off as an uninformed idiot, but I think rolls are a bit too safe in this version of Smash. At least in comparison to past games. With rolls being that safe, it could lead to certain players rolling a lot in their movement, without consequence (for the most part). If one were to apply that in the past games, it would definitely encourage bad habits in my eyes. So I would at least take away a little invincibility from the roll, if possible.

Otherwise, I believe the game is great so far.

 

[Hong]

then you need to consider that Robin can be every class and could even SPOILERS >

Spoiler

turn into a giant god dragon.

Sakurai did the right thing.

We have a Spoiler function to conceal these sorts of things, and I have applied it to your post.

It can be done like so:

Spoiler

Boo!

Which looks like:

[spoiler]Boo![/spoiler]

If you want to get really fancy, you can even label spoilers.

Spoiler: Who's there?

Peekaboo!

Which looks like:

[spoiler="Who's there?"]Peekaboo![/spoiler]

Thank you for your understanding.

 

[Dr.Megaman]

Lack of Roy.

Lack of more Mega Man presence. I'm happy with what I got, but I'll never be truly satisfied until we start representing the newer, better Mega Man games. They're not even acknowledged in Mega Man's final smash--Talk about fridge letdown.

Shulk's character design. I'm not a fan. His obscene range makes him a prime choice for players that enjoy wildly attacking in your general direction in hopes you run into them. His monado arts feels completely unnecessary and his buster mode in particular appears optimized for chaining which is another thing I'm not a fan of. The only thing I do like about Shulk is that he stops being a good character when you get good at punishing his lag.

On the 3ds the controls are rage inducing at times. In particular it makes playing Mega Man and doing very precise sequences such as home run contest frustrating because of inputs registering incorrectly.

On the 3ds the screen resolution is so small that it makes spacing difficult, imo. I'm literally upgrading to an XL just to fix this.

Counter dealing more damage/knockback based on how much damage/knockback the triggering attack would do is stupid. You can literally one-shot offensively customized characters with it, and mind you they cannot one shot you back! An attack as easy to use as counter simply shouldn't be that powerful.

I love the game, but these are a couple of things that could be improved to make it better.

Roy is in the game

 

[Sugistyle]

I gotta patch my version before i say anything, but it felt kinda 1 notch slower than brawl and melee.

 

[Samuel Intrater]

I was pissed enough when Brawl took away the individual Target Tests, but Target Blast is really lame to me personally.

 

[Deleted member 269706]

If you want a sword fighter with a mix of strength and speed, we've already got one- his name is Link. His specials may be different, but frankly they're significantly more interesting than most of the Fire Emblem cast's. There's only so many things you can do with a sword that qualify as "specials", and they've used up most of them. A well made Chrom would likely have felt like Link with Marth's specials, and I must say I agree with Sakurai that that wouldn't have been an interesting or worthwhile addition to the game. I like Chrom, and I like Lucina, but they wouldn't be good additions to Smash.

Every sentence listed here is an opinion.

 

[TheMagicalKuja]

I personally think that, Sakurai's bias aside, there was no way everyone could be pleased with the roster, but everyone who wasn't pleased seems to enjoy acting extra childish. Failing Hanlon's Razor, not understanding how programming and deadlines work... it's okay to be disappointed, but the rage in your complaints is pretty dumb.

That being said, I have my disappointments. Smash Run, a game I play more often for a reason I can't fathom, *REALLY* needed the ability to extend both parts (both the actual Run and the FINARU BATORU) and better predict what event's happening (rather than you *may* get a notice at a random interval if you're not in a Challenge door).

The stages in the 3DS mode are unfun; they're chaotic in all the wrong ways and the tiny screen makes it difficult to see hazards and control space. (Funny in that PM has the opposite problem, not enough happens and the stages fail to be distinct outside looks).

No mage mii.

Everything that's not a rushdown character gets hated on.

 

[WinterShorts]

I sware when someone makes a thread like this stupid people are gonna be like "No Melee mechanics". lol

But flaws? Hmmm, oh I KNOW: Lack of legal stages.

EDIT: Edited for the sake of correcting stuff.

 

[Pokechao]

Roy is in the game

Overused joke is bad

 

[Ryu Myuutsu]

I still think it's pointless to play captain hindsight on Chrom stating the could'ves, should'ves and would'ves while patting ourselves on the back for already creating a "unique" (and still non-existing) moveset for the guy. On paper, all of the world's problems can be solved in the blink of an eye.

Anyways, don't get me wrong, for a while I wanted Chrom but I was worried about what kind of attributes he could bring because (and let's accept this) he is yet another Lord with a sword, not so different from Marth or Ike. There is very little he can bring to the table that hasn't been done before in Smash before.

Robin on the other hand is a much fresher idea, he brings the magic swordsman archetype which is something that hasn't been done in Smash before. Yes, Chrom can reclass but so can Robin so that is not a unique to him. Despite this element, Chrom is presented in the story and during gameplay (initially) as a swordsman; it's his ability with a sword that is brought to the audience's attention from beginning to end, whatever you decide him to become is up to the player but storywise this doesn't change. As for Robin, he is presented as a tactician who can wield magic tomes and swords, something that is very unusual even in Fire Emblem.

When hunting for characters in Smash, it's easy to see these two side by side and think "Well, one is a swordsman. Cool but we got two of them already. This other one uses magic and swords, this could be interesting...". Yes, I know people around here like Chrom, but from an objective viewpoint Robin brings much more diversity to the roster and possess a play-style unlike the other characters from his/her franchise that a lot of players might find appealing to use.

I'm not saying that Chrom would have never been unique nor he wouldn't have been a clone or not, although we will never know, but when seeing why Robin was chosen it's just a no-brainer. A mystic knight-esque character as him really stands out the most. So I'm definitely certain that he was the best choice of character that was made for Fire Emblem.

 

[Lukingordex]

Without that he would be pathetically underpowered.
No thank you.

No, he would just be not able to kill Rosalina at 35% with a Fsmash when he's at 170%.

Lucario was already good in brawl with just the aura (his only horrible matchup was MK but that doesn't count sice MK was OP), he definitely doesn't need rage effect.

Smash 4 is almost perfect, it only has 2 problems: Rage effect and footstool.

 

[HylianDuelist]

RIP Balance
Why are the clones back?
RIP Marth, You will always be my Melee and Brawl favorite.
Attack of the Genwunners(No offense)
This should have been one of the clones
You Suck!

 

[Humanity]

Every sentence listed here is an opinion.

Yes, I know. All I meant to say was that I, personally, do not want another sword user with little to no mechanical differences from the others beyond hitbox size and shape. I thought I'd present my thought process for your consideration, but you have no obligation to agree with me.

 

[SmashBro99]

Clones.

Lucina makes sense.

Dark Pit is simply bias, we got Palutena already.

Dr. Mario is lame but he has fans so the are happy again.

Toon Link still doesn't have his own moveset?

Ganondorf ^

"But SmashBro99, clones are just created because they are quick and easy and give us more characters!"

Yeah give me one new character and dump Dark Pit/Dr. Mario thx.

 

[Pokechao]

You know what I think people are getting ******** about?
ZOMG KID ICARUS HAZ 3 CHARACTERZ FE HAS 4 CHARACTERZ BAAAAH DATS TOOOO MAAAAAANY!!!!!1!1!
And they are somehow perfectly fine wtih 8 Mario characters and 4 Zelda characters, suddenly 3 characters in a series is "TOOO MAAAAAANY BAAAAAH SAKURAI IZ BIAS BLAH BLAH"
People who complain about that are ********.

 

[Arle Nadja]

Roy is in the game

Calm down Satan. My jimmies can only get so rustled.

 

[Ffamran]

Calm down Satan. My jimmies can only get so rustled.

I'm assuming "Satan" is pronounced like "Sah-teen"?

So... How's Zelda doin' with the recent patch?

 

[Ryu Myuutsu]

Clones.

Lucina makes sense.

Dark Pit is simply bias, we got Palutena already.

Dr. Mario is lame but he has fans so the are happy again.

Toon Link still doesn't have his own moveset?

Ganondorf ^

"But SmashBro99, clones are just created because they are quick and easy and give us more characters!"

Yeah give me one new character and dump Dark Pit/Dr. Mario thx.

You realize that's not how it works, right?

And yes, clones are just created because they are quick and easy. No potential newcomer was shafted because of them. You are asking to give you a new character? Well, we got 12 new ones this time around.
Also, Toon Link as a clone makes sense. Ganondorf has his own moveset, he was decloned in Brawl.

As for one of the things I feel is wrong, it's basically the ignorance of our community in regards to the character roster and then making stupid statements such as the one above. It's adorable how people think that adding characters is an exchange process where one fighter takes a slot in the roster, thus somehow the presence of this fighter prevents a new one from happening. This is not the way how it works because characters that are selected for the roster are planned in advance at the beginning of development, even more so for clones who are mostly promoted alts. They take little time and resources to implement that their inclusion has little impact on anything else you might want to add to the game.

Speaking of clones, I think the complaints about them are incredibly stupid and overblown. We got 12 unique newcomers this time around; there are only three clones out of a 51 character roster so having them around is not harmful in any way. Is not that the game forces them upon you either. The character selection screen is called like that because you choose whoever you like to play as, like a menu at a restaurant. If you go to an ice cream store and they have a 30 flavor menu, and you see one flavor you don't like, do you make ****storm for that rather than just sticking to the ones you like?

So see, I'm not crazy about clones either (even though I like Lucina) but I know that nothing is lost in having them. They are not harmful in any way, even though the hatedom will try their damnest to have us believe that, it's simply not true.

 

[Team Plasma N]

Dark Pit being more or less an exact copy of Pit bothers me, he could easily be an alt. Unless if I'm missing some difference in damage percentages in the moves, but I'm pretty sure when I saw them most of them were more or less the same. I feel this character slot could have been used for someone else.

The game's speed feels fine to me on the ground, but the air game feels floaty... Only way to speed up the air game is through fast fall, but that's about it. It bothers me slightly, but not too much.

The ledges, they seem too easy to grab. Sometimes it feels like my character shouldn't have grabbed on to that ledge, I just feel a bit guilty about it.

It's harder to kill in this game. I find matches may last longer than they should due to lack of kill moves.

Other than that, I love this game.

 

[Tattles]

I'm assuming "Satan" is pronounced like "Sah-teen"?

So... How's Zelda doin' with the recent patch?

Not too different. Her recent "buff", if that's what you wanna call it, was nothing to write home about. She's still very good, but relies super heavily on hitting those sweet spots and lots of precision.

kinda dropped Zelda when Wii U version came out, i'm actually finding it harder to sweetspot fair-bair with the gamepad than the 3ds

 

[Ryu Myuutsu]

Dark Pit being more or less an exact copy of Pit bothers me, he could easily be an alt. Unless if I'm missing some difference in damage percentages in the moves, but I'm pretty sure when I saw them most of them were more or less the same. I feel this character slot could have been used for someone else.

That's not how it works though. If Dark Pit wasn't his own character and just an alt, nobody else would be "taking up" his slot in his place.

 

[Humanity]

That's not how it works though. If Dark Pit wasn't his own character and just an alt, nobody else would be "taking up" his slot in his place.

I think they meant that a clone of another character might have been a better choice.