Social There are three of us now?! Good thing we are the true Link.

[Ryu_Ken]

I can already tell the competition is going to be heated over which Link is the best Link when this game drops. Though if you want my totally honest opinion, I think the clear fact that BoTW Link is on the starting roster for this game should speak volumes.

 

[Tri Knight]

Also, Young Link is supposed to be the midpoint between slow, strong Link and fast, weak Toon Link. Also, he's the only Link without the Master Sword.

If he's faster than Champion Link, Young Link will likely be a better zoner than Smash4 Link. In Smash 4 Toon Link was better than Link for that very reason.

If Champion Link's new direction makes him more of a swordsman then I will certainly prefer Champion Link.

 

[Quillion]

If he's faster than Champion Link, Young Link will likely be a better zoner than Smash4 Link. In Smash 4 Toon Link was better than Link for that very reason.

If Champion Link's new direction makes him more of a swordsman then I will certainly prefer Champion Link.

Again, they just need to adjust Smash 4 Link's stats to match BotW Link's.

 

[Tri Knight]

Again, they just need to adjust Smash 4 Link's stats to match BotW Link's.

But why keep him the same when we have two other Link's? Because it's not THE Link? In reality, these changes only make sense. Like I've said before, BotW sparked a new beginning for the franchise and did immensely well. It's fitting that they scrapped Twilight Princess Link for BotW Link. I'm saying this as someone who's favorite Zelda IS Twilight Princess.

And even then, Smash Ultimate still embraces the past through Young Link, who represents the 1st new beginning of the franchise, Ocarina of Time.

 

[Quillion]

But why keep him the same when we have two other Link's? Because it's not THE Link?

Because: I. WANT. OPTIONS. BotW Link may be THE Link now, but again, he's not MY Link.

OoT Link and TP Link are effectively different characters, both from each other and BotW Link. Heck, the two of them actually met in Twilight Princess. And given that this Smash is supposed to be the "Ultimate" iteration of such (likely before Sakurai leaves it for good and hands it off), it stands to reason that both OoT Link and TP Link should both come back. Ike got both his younger and older selves from his two games, so let's give Link the same luxury.

And like I said, Young Link is going to be the midpoint between BotW Link and Toon Link in terms of stats. I'll effectively treat him as a separate character from both Smash 4 Link and BotW Link.

I don't expect Classic Link to be in the game to begin with, but I can see him coming as a free update or a bargain-priced DLC (because selling an Echo character made from prior-made assets at full price wouldn't fly).

 

[Tri Knight]

Because: I. WANT. OPTIONS. BotW Link may be THE Link now, but again, he's not MY Link.

OoT Link and TP Link are effectively different characters, both from each other and BotW Link. Heck, the two of them actually met in Twilight Princess. And given that this Smash is supposed to be the "Ultimate" iteration of such (likely before Sakurai leaves it for good and hands it off), it stands to reason that both OoT Link and TP Link should both come back. Ike got both his younger and older selves from his two games, so let's give Link the same luxury.

And like I said, Young Link is going to be the midpoint between BotW Link and Toon Link in terms of stats. I'll effectively treat him as a separate character from both Smash 4 Link and BotW Link.

I don't expect Classic Link to be in the game to begin with, but I can see him coming as a free update or a bargain-priced DLC (because selling an Echo character made from prior-made assets at full price wouldn't fly).

You have options, you have three Link's to choose from. Just because Champ Link isn't YOUR Link doesn't mean he's not someone else's. Since every Link is different in their own right, one aesthetic and image of Link is just incorrect. He doesn't need to be left-handed, or carry a hookshot, or even wear the hero's tunic. They showed that in Breath of the Wild.

For all we know link could have a red tunic in the next game

 

[Quillion]

You have options, you have three Link's to choose from.

And I like all of them. I just mean that none of them are ideal to me.

Just because Champ Link isn't YOUR Link doesn't mean he's not someone else's. Since every Link is different in their own right, one aesthetic and image of Link is just incorrect. He doesn't need to be left-handed, or carry a hookshot, or even wear the hero's tunic. They showed that in Breath of the Wild.

For all we know link could have a red tunic in the next game

Which I ALSO acknowledged already. It's just that BotW Link has enough deviation from the previous Smash iteration of Link that they can actually be separate fighters with Classic Link being marked as the Echo. It would also be awesome because we're seeing different incarnations of Link come together in the same game, moreso than TP.

Plus, we know that Ultimate's engine was built to easily accept all the assets from Smash 4, meaning that they can, with a few tweaks, port over Smash 4 Link already. Smash 4 Link is almost a step above being a full Echo with having less development time since they don't have to re-model him.

I'm not asking that they waste resources on the transformation masks to give to Young Link here so that he can rep Majora's Mask better; I'm asking to take what's already made and easily insert it into Ultimate.

So really, what is your big worry with having Smash 4 Link as an Echo fighter ALONGSIDE current BotW Link? Are you afraid that it will cause people to be stuck in the past? Are you afraid that we'll have a "Ganondorf's moveset" situation?

 

[Ryu_Ken]

Which I ALSO acknowledged already. It's just that BotW Link has enough deviation from the previous Smash iteration of Link that they can actually be separate fighters with Classic Link being marked as the Echo. It would also be awesome because we're seeing different incarnations of Link come together in the same game, moreso than TP.

I don't think putting TP Link in alongside BoTW Link, even as an echo fighter, is necessary. That's like putting Melee Fox into Brawl just for the sake of satisfying the Melee players who think Brawl Fox isn't their Fox. We already have three Links, we don't need anymore than that. Plus, I imagine Nintendo would have to change up the naming of the Links to properly distinguish them based on their games (Wild Link, Twilight Link, Time Link, or Wind Link), not their forms like they've been doing before (Link, Young Link, Toon Link). That would be unprecedented, confusing, and unecessary just for the sake of adding another "clone."

 

[Quillion]

I don't think putting TP Link in alongside BoTW Link, even as an echo fighter, is necessary. That's like putting Melee Fox into Brawl just for the sake of satisfying the Melee players who think Brawl Fox isn't their Fox.

False equivalence: Brawl Fox is just Melee Fox in Brawl mechanics. The fact that Brawl Fox can't waveshine is a function of Brawl's inability to jump cancel the Reflector and the different airdodge. They didn't fundamentally change him otherwise.

But for Link, he absolutely WAS fundamentally changed between 4 and Ultimate. He still has a lot of the same moves, but his bombs are different, he has no hookshot, and he has the new double arrow mechanic. Adding TP Link back to Ultimate would have him be more divergent from current Link than even Dark Pit is from Pit. And I didn't even get into the aesthetic differences there.

We already have three Links, we don't need anymore than that. Plus, I imagine Nintendo would have to change up the naming of the Links to properly distinguish them based on their games (Wild Link, Twilight Link, Time Link, or Wind Link), not their forms like they've been doing before (Link, Young Link, Toon Link). That would be unprecedented, confusing, and unecessary just for the sake of adding another "clone."

Smash 4 Link being "Classic Link" would work just fine. It clearly marks BotW Link as the current, true Link while giving us an option to play a past iteration.

Next you'll say, "But the Zelda 1-ALttP/OoX/ALBW design is already Classic Link," am I right? Nothing published or licensed by Nintendo calls the old design "Classic Link". If they want to give the name "Classic Link" to TP Link, so be it.

 

[Tri Knight]

False equivalence: Brawl Fox is just Melee Fox in Brawl mechanics. The fact that Brawl Fox can't waveshine is a function of Brawl's inability to jump cancel the Reflector and the different airdodge. They didn't fundamentally change him otherwise.

But for Link, he absolutely WAS fundamentally changed between 4 and Ultimate. He still has a lot of the same moves, but his bombs are different, he has no hookshot, and he has the new double arrow mechanic. Adding TP Link back to Ultimate would have him be more divergent from current Link than even Dark Pit is from Pit. And I didn't even get into the aesthetic differences there.



Smash 4 Link being "Classic Link" would work just fine. It clearly marks BotW Link as the current, true Link while giving us an option to play a past iteration.

Next you'll say, "But the Zelda 1-ALttP/OoX/ALBW design is already Classic Link," am I right? Nothing published or licensed by Nintendo calls the old design "Classic Link". If they want to give the name "Classic Link" to TP Link, so be it.

Technically classic Link in this situation IS in fact, Young Link.

 

[Quillion]

Technically classic Link in this situation IS in fact, Young Link.

Do I have to keep repeating myself about Young Link's different stats from Link?

 

[Tri Knight]

Do I have to keep repeating myself about Young Link's different stats from Link?

Not at all. That only falls in line with Smash Bros Link.

 

[Ryu_Ken]

Smash 4 Link being "Classic Link" would work just fine. It clearly marks BotW Link as the current, true Link while giving us an option to play a past iteration.

Next you'll say, "But the Zelda 1-ALttP/OoX/ALBW design is already Classic Link," am I right? Nothing published or licensed by Nintendo calls the old design "Classic Link". If they want to give the name "Classic Link" to TP Link, so be it.

What are they gonna call BoTW Link, then? "Modern Link?" They're both two Adult versions of Link, so you'd have to distinguish one from the other, just like with Young Link and Toon Link.
It still sounds silly to me.

 

[Tri Knight]

What are they gonna call BoTW Link, then? "Modern Link?" They're both two Adult versions of Link, so you'd have to distinguish one from the other, just like with Young Link and Toon Link.
It still sounds silly to me.

Yes! That's the point I'm trying to make. If they wanted an adult Link back in Smash, why not go with the most modern, well distinguished Link since Ocarina of Time. As much as people loved Wind Waker and Twilight Princess, OoT Link is still on a whole other level, and you cannot deny that BotW in general is literally marking the 2nd beginning of the franchise and took the world by storm. So it's fitting that he's the new main face of Zelda.

This conversation is almost like saying Link should have had Pink hair since Smash 64.

 

[Ryu_Ken]

Not gonna lie, before Breath of the Wild came out, my favorite look for Link hands-down was Magic Armor TP Link. In TP HD, I completed the Wolf Trials just so I could have the maximun amount of rupees and run around Hyrule in the Magic Armor (although it took me a long time to farm the rupees afterwards to reach the max rupee count). Wished they'd bring that back as an alternate costume or color scheme.

 

[Rizen]

Magic armor +great spin spam was OP. I didn't appreciate MA until my 2nd playthrough of TP.

 

[Tri Knight]

Agreed. The one downside to that armor was the Rupee drain but it was aesthetically perfect.

I mean shoot, look at my avatar lol.

 

[Quillion]

What are they gonna call BoTW Link, then? "Modern Link?" They're both two Adult versions of Link, so you'd have to distinguish one from the other, just like with Young Link and Toon Link.
It still sounds silly to me.

Yes! That's the point I'm trying to make. If they wanted an adult Link back in Smash, why not go with the most modern, well distinguished Link since Ocarina of Time. As much as people loved Wind Waker and Twilight Princess, OoT Link is still on a whole other level, and you cannot deny that BotW in general is literally marking the 2nd beginning of the franchise and took the world by storm. So it's fitting that he's the new main face of Zelda.

This conversation is almost like saying Link should have had Pink hair since Smash 64.

BotW Link is just Link, and TP Link is Classic Link. There's no need to get hung up on something that will please multiple people for less effort than most Echo Fighters all because you couldn't think of this solution.

 

[Tri Knight]

TP Link is not classic Link though. Classic Link is OoT Link; Young or Adult. That's why I say if people want to play classic Link in that sense, Young Link fully represents that.

That's not enough to you, I get that. But that's just how I see it. Its enough for me.

 

[Quillion]

TP Link is not classic Link though. Classic Link is OoT Link; Young or Adult. That's why I say if people want to play classic Link in that sense, Young Link fully represents that.

That's not enough to you, I get that. But that's just how I see it. Its enough for me.

Again, how does having OoT Link and/or TP Link in one slot and current Link in another interfere with your satisfaction?

 

[Tri Knight]

Again, how does having OoT Link and/or TP Link in one slot and current Link in another interfere with your satisfaction?

It doesnt interfere at all. I'm satisfied that BotW is getting represented the way it deserves, just as Smash 64 and Melee represented OoT the way it deserves.

It doesn't hurt me whether or not we get TP/OoT echoes. I doubt we will but either way is whatever to me. But no, I'm sorry, in my most honest opinion I just don't find it to be necessary because we have 3 Link's that set a different example for the franchise well enough; Young Link being representation for the past, and Link being representation for the future, and Toon Link is simply an abomonation.

I'm satisfied with what we have and what they've done because we now have 3 Link's to choose from who each greatly represent a separate, but important, time frame for the Zelda franchise. I understand exactly what you want specifically and I'm not directly against it - I just don't find it necessary.

 

[Rizen]

Quillion , I get your frustration with the new Link but we're not getting a 4th Link.

TP Link is not classic Link though. Classic Link is OoT Link; Young or Adult. That's why I say if people want to play classic Link in that sense, Young Link fully represents that.

That's not enough to you, I get that. But that's just how I see it. Its enough for me.

If anything classic Link is this lil guy:

I always saw TP Link's design as the natural progression from OoT's N64 graphics to game cube graphics, rather than a new design.

 

[skydogc]

Quillion , I get your frustration with the new Link but we're not getting a 4th Link.

If anything classic Link is this lil guy:

I always saw TP Link's design as the natural progression from OoT's N64 graphics to game cube graphics, rather than a new design.

I would honestly love to have an 8bit Link as a different character. Specials being the Silver Arrows, Boomerang, Flute Tornado, and Sword Beam. Could work in The Magic Wand, Candle, Step Ladder, and Bombs into Smash Attacks for flavor. Use the Raft as a dash attack.

....Now I want this. I want this so much.

Edit: use the basic sword for jabs and tilts, the White Sword for Aerials, and Smashes use the Magic Sword.

 

[Spaceless]

As much as I love Legend of Zelda and Link especially three of them is more than enough. I get that some don't like his BOTW design but they have still two others to chose from. Adding yet another Link would just be wrong to the franchise because of all the other possible LoZ characters and also different franchises who want their characters but can't because yeay four Links.

 

[emefcue]

I will be playing smash ultimate this weekend and I am super excited! I am going to test as much as i can. i was wondering if recorded gameplay footage in slow motion if it could help more with frame data.

 

[Tri Knight]

I will be playing smash ultimate this weekend and I am super excited! I am going to test as much as i can. i was wondering if recorded gameplay footage in slow motion if it could help more with frame data.

There are ways to play Smash Ultimate? Is there an event or something?

 

[skydogc]

I will be playing smash ultimate this weekend and I am super excited! I am going to test as much as i can. i was wondering if recorded gameplay footage in slow motion if it could help more with frame data.

You lucky son of a #$%@&!!
Hey that's awesome man. Where at?

 

[Quillion]

Quillion , I get your frustration with the new Link but we're not getting a 4th Link.

If anything classic Link is this lil guy:

I always saw TP Link's design as the natural progression from OoT's N64 graphics to game cube graphics, rather than a new design.

Next you'll say, "But the Zelda 1-ALttP/OoX/ALBW design is already Classic Link," am I right? Nothing published or licensed by Nintendo calls the old design "Classic Link". If they want to give the name "Classic Link" to TP Link, so be it.

 

[emefcue]

There are ways to play Smash Ultimate? Is there an event or something?

You lucky son of a #$%@&!!
Hey that's awesome man. Where at?

at ceo 2018 tournament this year smash ultimate will be playable. This means that Nintendo might have other booths at other tournaments coming up. *fingers crossed* here is the tweet. https://twitter.com/CEOGaming/status/1008867310004768768

 

[Tri Knight]

at ceo 2018 tournament this year smash ultimate will be playable. This means that Nintendo might have other booths at other tournaments coming up. *fingers crossed* here is the tweet. https://twitter.com/CEOGaming/status/1008867310004768768

Dude that's awesome. Are you specifically playing Link? There are plenty other characters in interested in as well so I'd imagine you're playing more than just Link, right?

 

[emefcue]

I am going to try out Link specifically and also marth. Those are my main focus, but I also want to try out all the characters if possible. I am not sure how much time they will give us like they did to people at e3.

 

[skydogc]

I am going to try out Link specifically and also marth. Those are my main focus, but I also want to try out all the characters if possible. I am not sure how much time they will give us like they did to people at e3.

Doing God's work. Let us know how it goes!

 

[Batu]

I am going to try out Link specifically and also marth. Those are my main focus, but I also want to try out all the characters if possible. I am not sure how much time they will give us like they did to people at e3.

Please try some jab1 or jab2 follow-ups and dthrow combos. If you can record it with a cellphone that would be perfect!

 

[emefcue]

Please try some jab1 or jab2 follow-ups and dthrow combos. If you can record it with a cellphone that would be perfect!

No follow ups from jab 1. Its slower than smash 4.i tried crouching after jab 1 but it does not cancel any lag. Lag after jab 2 is identical or nearly identical to smash 4. They just made the line split into 1v1 and 4 free for all now. Im in line again and will play 1v1 against my brother who will be Mario. I will do more testing there.

 

[Tri Knight]

No follow ups from jab 1. Its slower than smash 4.i tried crouching after jab 1 but it does not cancel any lag. Lag after jab 2 is identical or nearly identical to smash 4. They just made the line split into 1v1 and 4 free for all now. Im in line again and will play 1v1 against my brother who will be Mario. I will do more testing there.

Sweet, able to get some footage?

 

[emefcue]

Sweet, able to get some footage?

No. But im going to try. Im in line again. If not, Gimr was behind me while i was playing 1 match recording me and that might be uploaded.

 

[Arthur97]

I wasn't the biggest fan of BotW, his look included, so I'm not thrilled. Remote bombs may be cool, but I don't like the BotW focus.

 

[Dreamking]

I think they should have included Revali's Gale as Up Special if they were going to alter his moveset to be more inspired by BOTW.

 

[NintendoKnight]

I'm actually pretty happy with how Link has turned out. Was a big advocate for a great rchange in moves, but I'm still content with what was given to us.

Let's just hope they really adjust his CQC moves so that he can contend with other close-range fighters.

 

[emefcue]

I tried doing a falling up air on someone grounded and was unable to get a hitbox to connect. the hit box might not extend as far down the hilt of the sword as in smash 4. also if you do a soft throw of a bomb upward from a standing position and detonate the bomb as soon as possible, the explosion misses your and you do not get hit. recoveries from bomb explosions seem impractical. the time of bomb release to detonation is almost 1 second. I feel saving your jump off stage, directional airdodge toward ledge, then double jump, then up-b is better than using a bomb to get your up b back.

the biggest adjustment in playing Link so far is his bombs. i am so used to bombs exploding on their own (ever since smash 64 ! ) that i found myself forgetting to detonate them. however i was able to get some slick set ups: take out bomb, run toward opponent, bait shield, grab, down throw, then detonate bomb.

overall, his aerials all felt VERY very satisying. his down air is amazing rightnow, with such little landing lag. back air can lead into a forward air follow up very nicely. up throw seems to have decent knock back. You can do jab 1 and 2 and then mix up with a down tilt to foward air , but most of the time it seems as the full 3 jabs is optimal unless you need a mix up. i was able to get the full 3 jabs and run into a dash attack rather easily. i think this is because everyone is generally faster. i was also able to do the full 3 jabs and dash into a nair to get a nair lock fairly easily.

his arrows felt nice and his boomerang not having a wind box, and also having a hitbox on return feels great.

overall, Link feels amazing. his bombs will take time to get used too but I think they are GREAT for ledge gaurds. all you have to do is z drop a bomb at the ledge and you cover practically EVERYTHING. knock opponent off stage, pull out bomb, z drop at ledge, go off stage to pressure opponent with nair/fair, get back on stage, they try to recover and you detonate the bomb. Link has soooooo many intricacies in this iteration of smash, its going to be so much fun exploring it. THEY NEED TO RELEASE A DEMO FOR THIS.

oh, and on the start up page for ultimate, it said, "event build 2018/ ver 6.0" or 0.6. something like that. so i could see them drastically changing things before release.