~ The Wolf Matchup Center

[Ishiey]

Pane showed me the clip of him reflecting Wario's fart... it was interesting, kinda like we reflect it and he absorbs it during SA but it boosts him up even further. IIRC it was a 1-minute fart. Also, yeah, Wario is NOT our worst MU X___x

I think the CG range on Wolf (to start) is 59% to maybe 120ish, but if he starts it early it goes on till 200s or something. Buffered pivot grabs change the range, is that the one you're talking about Choice?

Sorry the exports aren't up yet guys... I was working on editing the OP for ROB and then my comp crashed, then my internship started, then SWF crashed, and now I have a test tomorrow... I'm an idiot. lol I'll get on it soon though, promise!

 

[Choice]

i'm just talking about buffered turn around grab. the normal buffered cg. buffered pivot makes it go even longer but is impractical/no one knows how to consistently do that. theres too many inputs.

i'm positive that the normal cg ends at ->230%, and after double checking what micheal hey said regarding wario's cg, it definitely starts at 20%.

on falco
down throw x n > forward throw (52~130%)
up to 52%, falco can get out by holding shield
from about 73%, down throw needs to be diminished
from about 120% falco can get out
on wolf
down throw x n > forward throw (20~230%)
up till about 20% wolf can get out by down B (unless it's stale)
from about 220% wolf can get out by down B
on bowser
down throw x n > down B (0~180%+)
up to 168%, everything could be buffered
from 169%, wario can continue the chaingrab by walking (not recommended)
down B doesn't hit from about 140%? (not sure)

on dk
down throw x n > forward throw (0~110%)
on ganon
down throw x n > forward throw (0~90%)
on captain falcon
down throw x n > forward throw (0~70%)

　60~90%はOP相殺によって繋がらなかったりする？
　検証するのめんどうだから60%で投げ連〆るのが良いかも。

 

[_Kain_]

No one has told Choice about the super secret get out of CG free card with upsmash against Wario until 60%?

 

[Ojih~Sama]

u trolling bro??

tell me more

 

[castorpollux]

No one has told Choice about the super secret get out of CG free card with upsmash against Wario until 60%?

It doesn't work. I tried it vs Michael Hey kind of recently

 

[_Kain_]

it doesn't work. I tried it vs michael hey kind of recently

fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff

 

[Ishiey]

^ this.

So wtf then? Starting with a fresh dthrow works at 20%, and what's the highest % after which it stops working? And how long does it go until? Actual data that's clear and correct please X_x

 

[castorpollux]

i dont know the actual data.

I just remember being at 55% and saying "HEY MIKE CHAINGRAB ME NAO!"

(smirking in my head caz i "knew" i'd get a free usmash on his wario)



Nope... 230%

 

[Ishiey]

^ lol

 

[Choice]

hahaha, umm ish i know i checked what % was the latest it started at so i probably have that in some notepad file. once i find it i'll post it. if there anything else about wario cg you want?

 

[M.C. Pee-Pants]

I think we should talk about wario since we are already talking about that chain grab

 

[Ishiey]

Highest % at which you can start with a fresh dthrow for both the regular dthrow CG and the buffered pivotgrab CG, if possible. Also, at %s right before it starts working or right after it stops working, if Wario tries to go for the CG can we usmash him? Thanks <3

And that'd make sense (@ discussing Wario now), but I don't want to run too many at once. What do people want to see more, Wario or Olimar? TL will be happening regardless

 

[Ojih~Sama]

we should totally discuss the fox MU

 

[MegaRobMan]

Olimar, for personal reasons

 

[SinisterB]

I'd say Wario, but I can contribute more to Oli discussion.

I never play any Warios though so I have no idea how the MU works.

 

[Seagull Joe]

Someone just make a damn thread. I would like to take over this thread cause Ish never ends up contributing other then saying "We could discuss ___" and then nothing happens. No offense Arda lmao.

 

[Choice]

we still have yet to discuss wolf dittos

 

[MegaRobMan]

Wario-He's going to jump around a lot and airdodge in and out of your zone and come at you with Auto-cancelled dairs, which is why trying to grab wario is risky as all else. Only use Bair-Uair-fair-blaster-shine, in that order. Landing shine in the air is a ***** in this match up, kinda easy on the ground. Bait a grab with a spaced bair when he's on the ground and-fsmash. When he's at high%, kill with Fair or a slightly charged D-smash. Holding it down for half a second instead of using the C-stick is a good idea because they will be coming at you with an air-dodge, I swear to god. Don't make spot dodge a habit, you will get bitten every time.

Seagull Man told me to throw pivot grabs against wario like they are free, but I'm not good at pivot grabs with anyone other than Link.

I kinda know how to play Olimar, but I need to know tricks, like, other than reflector, what's the best way to deal with pikmin that are on me, what is safe blaster range, stuff like that.

 

[Ishiey]

Someone just make a damn thread. I would like to take over this thread cause Ish never ends up contributing other then saying "We could discuss ___" and then nothing happens. No offense Arda lmao.

None taken lmao, it's completely true X___x I tend to suck at doing things, but since you called me out, TL and Olimar will be up tonight after I get back from dinner and finish some BBR things since the deadlines are coming up

I was updating the ROB one, and then my computer crashed. It was really stupid. But I'll get to updating the OPs over the weekend, hopefully.

EDIT: Exports are up now, because I suck at doing things lol. I'm going to go around to the other boards and post the link later tonight.

 

[aatami]

I'm confused: Are the "old" matchup threads up to date, but need small revision, so the characters they discuss can't be voted? Or are they severely WIP and the characters they discuss can be voted?

Nevertheless, I vote Ike! If I can, of course.
If I can't, I vote Ness.

 

[castorpollux]

we still have yet to discuss wolf dittos

seriously. people listen to this man

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I think these discussions are beginning to get pointless. Kain / Semifer / Holms / T hardly post or don't post at all, Choice / JJ aren't that active at the moment and other than Seagull / me the other Wolves either don't play that much or don't contribute anything. Whenever I look at a match-up thread it's usually Seagull / me giving some input and one or two other people.

 

[tekkie]

the wolf boards are extremely inactive and when they are active it's 99% useless

agreed ichu:

 

[MegaRobMan]

I think these discussions are beginning to get pointless. Kain / Semifer / Holms / T hardly post or don't post at all, Choice / JJ aren't that active at the moment and other than Seagull / me the other Wolves either don't play that much or don't contribute anything. Whenever I look at a match-up thread it's usually Seagull / me giving some input and one or two other people.

If we discussed or , I could be of help, but other than D3 (and I need help with this matchup) Snake (less help, but some needed) and Wario (minor help needed, but some as well), I don't see any other characters around here that I feel I could help with other than minor things, and other people could do it better. I know how to play vs TL, but I haven't beaten MJG in tourney so I don't know if my advice is good enough, though I have beaten him in a friendly before and almost beat him in a round.

 

[Ishiey]

I'm confused: Are the "old" matchup threads up to date, but need small revision, so the characters they discuss can't be voted? Or are they severely WIP and the characters they discuss can be voted?

Nevertheless, I vote Ike! If I can, of course.
If I can't, I vote Ness.

I need to fix up the OP :x but you can bump "old" threads if you feel like something needs to be rediscussed or if you have a question about the MU. You can vote for another discussion whenever, and as long as others want to see it happen too and there aren't too many going on currently, it'll happen.

Welcome to the boards, btw

agreed ichu:

Yes. Exactly. Kinda sucks when someone actually tries to do something around here, even if we have a good thread it dies in under a week.

 

[ShadowSpear]

Yo, can we discuss Peach. I got knocked out of a tournament by a legit peach main and i'm not familiar with that Match Up at all... Can someone enlighten me with knowledge on this?

 

[castorpollux]

Yo, can we discuss Peach. I got knocked out of a tournament by a legit peach main and i'm not familiar with that Match Up at all... Can someone enlighten me with knowledge on this?

jumpshine camp

 

[Seagull Joe]

Yo, can we discuss Peach. I got knocked out of a tournament by a legit peach main and i'm not familiar with that Match Up at all... Can someone enlighten me with knowledge on this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6LPTzAyayQ

Did you lose to Kyon or 2link212?

 

[ShadowSpear]

Alright. Anything else?

 

[Seagull Joe]

Alright. Anything else?

Just aim me your questions.

Aim: Turkeywonder

 

[ShadowSpear]

Just aim me your questions.

Aim: Turkeywonder

Awesome vid! I liked how you mixed it up smoothly, with Bair, Shine, Fair, DACUS, insane ledge games ect. But, in my case i got out spaced by Peach's Float Cancel (I think thats what it's called...)Fair, Bair, Turnup Spam, and grabs. (And yes, it was Kyon's Peach...) But, Tbh i never really played a good Peach like his before anyway.

 

[Seagull Joe]

Awesome vid! I liked how you mixed it up smoothly, with Bair, Shine, Fair, DACUS, insane ledge games ect. But, in my case i got out spaced by Peach's Float Cancel (I think thats what it's called...)Fair, Bair, Turnup Spam, and grabs. (And yes, it was Kyon's Peach...) But, Tbh i never really played a good Peach like his before anyway.

*Trying to remember how I beat Kyon at Pound 5*

I think I just spaced Bairs on shield and threw out Fairs to kill.

When has to get back on stage from the edge, she's doomed...Stay half a rolls distance from the edge and prepare for how he gets up. If he gets up via roll then Dsmash. If he gets up via get up attack then dash grab and Dthrow. If he jumps then Fair her. And last option is for her to SH float back on stage, which can be immediately Dsmash'd on reaction.

Turnips are generally negligible. Just z-catch them, outprioritize them, ignore them, or reflect them.

When is floating, you can Dacus to scoop her up or Fsmash her. Don't Fsmash her shield though.

Make her approach you with FH Lasers and RAR/B-reversal Lasers.

 

[ShadowSpear]

*Trying to remember how I beat Kyon at Pound 5*

I think I just spaced Bairs on shield and threw out Fairs to kill.

When has to get back on stage from the edge, she's doomed...Stay half a rolls distance from the edge and prepare for how he gets up. If he gets up via roll then Dsmash. If he gets up via get up attack then dash grab and Dthrow. If he jumps then Fair her. And last option is for her to SH float back on stage, which can be immediately Dsmash'd on reaction.

Turnips are generally negligible. Just z-catch them, outprioritize them, ignore them, or reflect them.

When is floating, you can Dacus to scoop her up or Fsmash her. Don't Fsmash her shield though.

Make her approach you with FH Lasers and RAR/B-reversal Lasers.

Oh ok, i gotcha! In your opinion should a Wolf player play really aggresive or super defensive/campy during this particular Match Up?

 

[Seagull Joe]

Oh ok, i gotcha! In your opinion should a Wolf player play really aggresive or super defensive/campy during this particular Match Up?

A mixture of both.

 

[ShadowSpear]

A mixture of both.

Alright, got it. And on a side note...why exactly is D3 our worse Match Up, because i never played a Legit DeDeDe before...ever.

 

[Ishiey]

D3 has the regular CG, smallstep CG, buffered reverse pivot-grab infinite, and ledge infinite on us. I used to think that he also had usmash out of dthrow on us, but according to a thread on the D3 boards that's not right. Also, his bair really shuts us down on the ledge.

 

[Seagull Joe]

He does have an Usmash out of Dthrow on us if we still have landing penalty.

 

[ShadowSpear]

D3 has the regular CG, smallstep CG, buffered reverse pivot-grab infinite, and ledge infinite on us. I used to think that he also had usmash out of dthrow on us, but according to a thread on the D3 boards that's not right. Also, his bair really shuts us down on the ledge.

Wow....well really that sucks -__- Umm...well is there anything we can do to counter fight this or prevent this from happening to us? (And telling me not to get grabbed is easier said then done...) Or, is this pretty much the same senerio as the dreaded Fox vs Pikachu Match Up... (Yes, i Main Fox too. StarFox/StarWolf FTW!)

 

[Laem]

Well I never actually see d3's infiniting ppl so if you're gonna do that mu prepare to get regular CG'd.
But really, in your case, pick fox vs d3.

btw
jumpshine camp XD

 

[castorpollux]

wow taht was an awesome video gull. 6:08 was sick. barracuda drifter worthy


**EDIT**
my god another side b hit


u've come a long way gull. ure actually WOWing me