The Unofficial Super Smash Bros Balancing Committee- Anything and everything!

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Time to copy and paste my thoughts on Squirtle.
EDIT: I crossed out the invincibility thing because thinking more on it, It's pretty unwarrented. Also I changed up Water Pulse as suggested by L9999.
EDIT: Okay so I made the words small and colored them black instead. (They took out the ability to use strike-through. )
Squirtle no longer takes extra damage and knockback from Grass attacks.
Squirtle is slightly heavier.
Squirtle has a faster air release animation, keeping him from being Grab Release comboed.
Squirtle’s Dash attack can protect him from other attacks if he is hit in the shell, however, getting hit reverses his direction, and ends the move.
Squirtle’s Side tilt has more range.
Squirtle’s Down Tilt has more range.
Squirtle’s Forward Smash protects him from all damage, and is more powerful.
Squirtle’s Down Smash protects him from all damage.
Squirtle’s Up throw protects him from damage.
Squirtle’s Neutral Areal protects him from damage.
Squirtle has a new Down Special: Water Pulse. Squirtle claps his hands, creating a pulse of water all around him. The pulse deals minor damage, and causes opponents to have a chance to trip randomly. It is also good for combos due to it's quick animation, and low knockback.
Squirtle has a new Final Smash: Water Pledge. Squirtle traps foes around him with a watery aura, then creates a column of water around him to launch the trapped opponents. This attack is more powerful if it hits a fire, or grass hitbox such as Charizard's Flamethrower or Ivysaur's Razor Leaf.

I guess I'll vote for next.

 

[Furret24]

Time to copy and paste my thoughts on Squirtle.
Squirtle no longer takes extra damage and knockback from Grass attacks.
Squirtle is slightly heavier.
Squirtle has a faster air release animation, keeping him from being Grab Release comboed.
Squirtle’s Dash attack can protect him from other attacks if he is hit in the shell, however, getting hit reverses his direction, and ends the move.
Squirtle’s Side tilt has more range.
Squirtle’s Down Tilt has more range.
Squirtle’s Forward Smash protects him from all damage, and is more powerful.
Squirtle’s Down Smash protects him from all damage.
Squirtle’s Up throw protects him from damage.
Squirtle’s Neutral Areal protects him from damage.
Squirtle has a new Down Special: Water Pulse. Squirtle claps his hands, creating a pulse of water all around him. The pulse deals minor damage, and turns opponents around.
Squirtle has a new Final Smash: Water Pledge. Squirtle traps foes around him with a watery aura, then creates a column of water around him to launch the trapped opponents. This attack is more powerful if it hits a fire, or grass hitbox such as Charizard's Flamethrower or Ivysaur's Razor Leaf.

I guess I'll vote for next.

I don't think giving Squirtle's smashes, uthrow, and nair fullbody-invincibility is necessary.

 

[L9999]

Time to copy and paste my thoughts on Squirtle.
Squirtle no longer takes extra damage and knockback from Grass attacks.
Squirtle is slightly heavier.
Squirtle has a faster air release animation, keeping him from being Grab Release comboed.
Squirtle’s Dash attack can protect him from other attacks if he is hit in the shell, however, getting hit reverses his direction, and ends the move.
Squirtle’s Side tilt has more range.
Squirtle’s Down Tilt has more range.
Squirtle’s Forward Smash protects him from all damage, and is more powerful.
Squirtle’s Down Smash protects him from all damage.
Squirtle’s Up throw protects him from damage.
Squirtle’s Neutral Areal protects him from damage.
Squirtle has a new Down Special: Water Pulse. Squirtle claps his hands, creating a pulse of water all around him. The pulse deals minor damage, and turns opponents around.
Squirtle has a new Final Smash: Water Pledge. Squirtle traps foes around him with a watery aura, then creates a column of water around him to launch the trapped opponents. This attack is more powerful if it hits a fire, or grass hitbox such as Charizard's Flamethrower or Ivysaur's Razor Leaf.

I guess I'll vote for next.

For Water Pulse, I would make it a reference to the games. Squirtle claps his hands like you say, shoots a ring of water, and it randomly trips, as in the games Water Pulse confuses at random and confusion makes PkMn harm themselves, so it translates to tripping.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I don't think giving Squirtle's smashes, uthrow, and nair fullbody-invincibility is necessary.

Yeah probably not. I left out my original idea of Squirtle getting pushed back for countering with these moves because thinking more on it it probably would make him worse. The drawback on his Dash Attack is a remanent of this, as I forgot to delete it. I also feel that this weird mechanic shifts Squirtle away from what he was intended to be, so I think I'll edit out the invincibility.

For Water Pulse, I would make it a reference to the games. Squirtle claps his hands like you say, shoots a ring of water, and it randomly trips, as in the games Water Pulse confuses at random and confusion makes PkMn harm themselves, so it translates to tripping.

That's actually really good! I was wondering on how I could keep it true to the games, but I couldn't really get any good ideas other than flipping the target's direction. (Which actually switches your controls for a minute amount of time in 3Ds/Wii U for some reason.) I think the tripping mechanic works better in the fact that the character is doing it by itself.

 

[Zerp]

Here's Ivysaur's poll http://goo.gl/forms/MteKabXIHW
and here's Squirtle's results https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1oHLEiq8IyXBhrpH3SIMb5HRyMcNqH5BSwIbgbqjwEI0/viewanalytics
You can vote for or .

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Here's what I have to say about Ivysaur.
Ivysaur no longer takes extra damage and knockback from fire attacks.
Ivysaur’s air speed is faster.
Dodge Roll animation is faster.
Neutral attack has a finisher.
Down Tilt is faster.
Dash Attack is faster.
Up Smash is slightly weaker, but is still the most powerful in the game, and has more range.
Down Smash is faster.
Neutral Areal’s animation changed slightly. Ivysaur thrusts it’s legs out at the end to give the move more knockback.
Forward Areal is much faster.
Back Areal is faster.
Ivysaur has a new Neutral Special: Stun Spore. Ivysaur summons a yellow cloud that immobilizes all opponents that touch it. Using this move stops Ivysaur’s downward momentum. This move is good for stage control because of it's lingering hitbox.
Bullet Seed is now Ivysaur’s Down Special.
Ivysaur has a new Final Smash: Petal Dance. Ivysaur spins around, and a column of petals surrounds him. This deals major damage, and while Ivysaur doesn't have any drawbacks from this move, he does look dizzy at the end of it.

I vote .

 

[L9999]

Here's what I have to say about Ivysaur.
Ivysaur no longer takes extra damage and knockback from fire attacks.
Ivysaur’s air speed is faster.
Dodge Roll animation is faster.
Neutral attack has a finisher.
Down Tilt is faster.
Dash Attack is faster.
Up Smash is slightly weaker, but is still the most powerful in the game, and has more range.
Down Smash is faster.
Neutral Aerial’s animation changed slightly. Ivysaur thrusts it’s legs out at the end to give the move more knockback.
Forward Aerial is much faster.
Back Aerial is faster.
Ivysaur has a new Neutral Special: Stun Spore. Ivysaur summons a yellow cloud that immobilizes all opponents that touch it. Using this move stops Ivysaur’s downward momentum. This move is good for stage control because of it's lingering hitbox.
Bullet Seed is now Ivysaur’s Down Special.
Ivysaur has a new Final Smash: Petal Dance. Ivysaur spins around, and a column of petals surrounds him. This deals major damage, and while Ivysaur doesn't have any drawbacks from this move, he does look dizzy at the end of it.

I vote .

Up Special would need more range. Even with no edgehogs, Ivysaur would still be easy to gimp with the range it has in Brawl.
Also, can we? Then I vote him.

 

[Zerp]

Here's Red's poll http://goo.gl/forms/5ZZiZSE4r6
and here's Ivysaur's results
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1PtOADKsmbKozHny1ONlNOdF47gKMIox3lFYr74TZiug/viewanalytics
You can vote for any character, as long as they are named Snake.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

The Pokemon Trainer's concept seemed interesting at first, but the stamina system really made it impossible to utilize just one Pokemon in a match; you had to learn to utilize three different Pokemon.

 

[Pippin (Peregrin Took)]

The Pokemon Trainer's concept seemed interesting at first, but the stamina system really made it impossible to utilize just one Pokemon in a match; you had to learn to utilize three different Pokemon.

Also it was just weird that Pokemon trainer had no choice but to switch out but Zelda and Sheik could just stay the same the entire match.

 

[Muskrat Catcher]

I really liked pokémon trainer as well! As a pokémon fan, the ability to play as three pokémon at once was awesome! But your reward for the amount of work you would have to put into learning the character is just not high enough. You would have to dedicate yourself to three different characters! This means learning combos, options, matchups, kill setups, and techs for three times as many movesets in order to main him. And what do you get for doing so? A mid-tier character with not that much amazing abilities. If someone puts in the effort to learn to effectively use all three of the pokémon, they should be rewarded more! I don't know what specific buffs to give, and I don't think that the stamina system should be gotten rid of, but just make the characters a bit better!
I don't know of anyone that actually mained the pokémon trainer, just had him as a pocket or friendlies character

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Here is how I see the Pokémon Trainer working. His icon on the character select screen is a portrait of Red like in Brawl, and when you put your marker on it, Red and his onterage of Pokémon show up just like in Brawl. Tapping on the portrait of any of Red's Pokémon will put that Pokémon in the lead. Tapping on the Pokémon again will make that Pokémon the only Pokémon you can use during the fight, and Red, and the other Pokémon will black out. If you are using all three Pokémon in battle, then if you win, you will get a different victory animation that focuses on Red and the Pokémon you won the match with, and the announcer will say "Pokémon Trainer!" instead of "Squirtle!", "Ivysaur!", or "Charizard!"

I votes for . (Even now he keeps us waiting.)

 

[Zerp]

I'm in a bit of a rush but I have to go somehwere, so I'm uploading this early, sorry. Also, starting tomorrow, the time I'll normally upload this stuff will be a hour later from normal, the current time just doesn't work, there's always something in the way.
Sanke's poll http://goo.gl/forms/sPcWeMb4sj
Red's results: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1c61ysGcxtPfk3zar-ZPDfmRlLzXrgyTKPj1Z8G89uiI/viewanalytics
Vote for any of the characters that haven't gone yet (if your unsure check the results or wait for me to update this when I get back, I don't have the time to check 20 chars, sorry)

 

[Wintermelon43]

The 20 available characters are (But not pit? I think Zero Soul might have screwed up the counting)

I vote for Pac-Man

 

[L1N3R1D3R]

Vote for .

Don't know much about besides that his up tilt was unfairly powerful for how quick it was. That's the only thing I would see being changed, as the rest of him is pretty balanced and gives reward for clever play.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I don't see much for Solid Snake that needs changing, so I'm out.

Anyway, voting for Rosalina; .

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

The only reason why I didn't like Snake in Brawl is because like Ganondorf, it felt like Gravity affected him more than anyone else. I no longer have this problem with Ganondorf in Brawl, so as long as whatever fixed that is also done to Snake, I'll be happy.

 

[GanonMain]

I vote for the Nerf-A-Tron Frog

 

[MarioMeteor]

Something would have to be done about that up tilt. Maybe slightly weaken his jab and forward tilt, too. Other than that, I suppose he's fine.

I vote for Space Dolphin.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I want to take a moment to discuss taunts... It doesn't have anything to do with balance, but some taunts annoy me and not because they are made to do so. Take Snake for example, he has 3 taunts: Boxes. Yes all three are different, but all of them consist of him hiding in a box, so it doesn't matter if he strikes a different pose because we aren't going to see any pose behind that box. Also, the change in taunts for Pit, Sonic, and Mr. Game & Watch bother me. Sonic's "You're too slow!" and "Come on step it up!" taunt being changed to "Sonic speed!" and "Come on!" is sort of understandable, because people liked to spam those taunts to infuriate players with taunt parties, until you consider the fact that taunting multiple times can get you banned. I mean it isn't that bad, but I feel that Sonic's previous quotes fit him better. I have the same complaint about Pit as well. They changed "The fight is on!" to "Come on!" which partially gives him Male Corrin syndrome. He doesn't sound as battle ready as before. I also prefer "You're not ready yet!" over "Is that all you got?" but they are pretty much the same thing, and this was probably changed to fit his new personality in Kid Iccarus Uprising. Lastly, Mr. Game & Watch...I like all of his taunts, what I don't like, however, is that they threw out his jumping and screaming taunt for the sighing taunt, and left his two bell taunts untouched. Having pretty much the same taunt isn't necessary and one should have been replaced with the new taunt.

So what taunts bother you guys?

 

[Furret24]

I want to take a moment to discuss taunts... It doesn't have anything to do with balance, but some taunts annoy me and not because they are made to do so. Take Snake for example, he has 3 taunts: Boxes. Yes all three are different, but all of them consist of him hiding in a box, so it doesn't matter if he strikes a different pose because we aren't going to see any pose behind that box. Also, the change in taunts for Pit, Sonic, and Mr. Game & Watch bother me. Sonic's "You're too slow!" and "Come on step it up!" taunt being changed to "Sonic speed!" and "Come on!" is sort of understandable, because people liked to spam those taunts to infuriate players with taunt parties, until you consider the fact that taunting multiple times can get you banned. I mean it isn't that bad, but I feel that Sonic's previous quotes fit him better. I have the same complaint about Pit as well. They changed "The fight is on!" to "Come on!" which partially gives him Male Corrin syndrome. He doesn't sound as battle ready as before. I also prefer "You're not ready yet!" over "Is that all you got?" but they are pretty much the same thing, and this was probably changed to fit his new personality in Kid Iccarus Uprising. Lastly, Mr. Game & Watch...I like all of his taunts, what I don't like, however, is that they threw out his jumping and screaming taunt for the sighing taunt, and left his two bell taunts untouched. Having pretty much the same taunt isn't necessary and one should have been replaced with the new taunt.

So what taunts bother you guys?

Duck Hunt's side taunt should make his infamous laughing sound from the original Duck Hunt game, yet it doesn't. I don't get why.

Little Mac's side taunt also bothers me because of how little it looks like a taunt. It looks like it should be one of his idle animations. What kind of taunt is that?

I also hate how Bayonetta can cancel her taunts, yet nobody else can. Similarly, I also hate how Wario has infinite Bike Taunts online, yet everyone else (including Wario with his other taunts) only gets two (plus one for every kill made).

I agree with you on Game and Watch's Down Taunt btw.

 

[L9999]

I want to take a moment to discuss taunts... It doesn't have anything to do with balance, but some taunts annoy me and not because they are made to do so. Take Snake for example, he has 3 taunts: Boxes. Yes all three are different, but all of them consist of him hiding in a box, so it doesn't matter if he strikes a different pose because we aren't going to see any pose behind that box. Also, the change in taunts for Pit, Sonic, and Mr. Game & Watch bother me. Sonic's "You're too slow!" and "Come on step it up!" taunt being changed to "Sonic speed!" and "Come on!" is sort of understandable, because people liked to spam those taunts to infuriate players with taunt parties, until you consider the fact that taunting multiple times can get you banned. I mean it isn't that bad, but I feel that Sonic's previous quotes fit him better. I have the same complaint about Pit as well. They changed "The fight is on!" to "Come on!" which partially gives him Male Corrin syndrome. He doesn't sound as battle ready as before. I also prefer "You're not ready yet!" over "Is that all you got?" but they are pretty much the same thing, and this was probably changed to fit his new personality in Kid Iccarus Uprising. Lastly, Mr. Game & Watch...I like all of his taunts, what I don't like, however, is that they threw out his jumping and screaming taunt for the sighing taunt, and left his two bell taunts untouched. Having pretty much the same taunt isn't necessary and one should have been replaced with the new taunt.

So what taunts bother you guys?

Well, Kamui is supposed to be an inexperienced idiot but I agree he sounds really cheesy. Femui totally has first take clips, they sound really bad.

 

[Zerp]

The 20 available characters are (But not pit? I think Zero Soul might have screwed up the counting)

I vote for Pac-Man

Thanks for making the list
Also about Pit, while I normally double check, I actually remember triple checking him in particular because it didn't make any sense to me, and I thought that I must have messed up, but lo and behold, people actually voted Dark Pit above Pit, and honestly, I don't understand the logic behind it. It's pretty weird isn't it?

Anyways here's Snake's results https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1hIww0FAIIuoZJq49N7YOPuzL2D8oQ_GxCwYeQa1cWbs/viewanalytics
and here's Rosalina's and Luma's poll http://goo.gl/forms/WP0mdfWbZx
I think today's going to be pretty interesting, we're going to be seeing a lot more want for nerfs than with all the characters before, I want to see how it plays out.

 

[FamilyTeam]

What.
Anyway. Rosalina and Luma.
I disliked her from the very first time I fought against her LVL9 CPU when I first got the full game. Fighting her is really weird, as she can basically attack you from anywhere in the stage, and Luma can soak up lots of damage which really helps covering Rosalina's weakness in survivability due to her weight. Some of her moves are ridiculously strong as well...

But it's 2016, now. The last (or maybe second to last) patch just arrived weeks ago, and Rosalina's current balance is what we'll have to deal with until the dawn of time, but really... after learning how to play against her, and after the justified nerfs she's gotten... I'd say she's finally on par with the other characters.
Basically, I'm saying that Rosalina is in no way overpowered anymore. She's a very solid character with crazy potential for spacing, survivability and early kills, but she has glaring weakenesses.

First, the character isn't called Rosalina, it's Rosalina and Luma. Luma is part of the equation as well. Rosa relies a lot on that. She's one of the best characters in the game with the Luma alive and kicking, but without it, Rosalina is this gigantic floaty target that's easy to KO and doesn't have a Neutral Special that's probably Mid Tier at best. Luma is useful, but she's very easy to KO nowadays, and Rosa needs to live for 12.5 seconds without her once she's lost. That's why I'd say Rosalina is balanced: She really rewards players who can space properly, keep the Luma alive and know what to do once the Luma is lost, she has a Risk/Reward think going on. You can use your Luma to do lots of cool stuff, but you're gonna be in trouble if you lose it.

I'd say she's fine as is. Maybe a few slight buffs would be cool (slightly better weight and air mobility) but she's fine, now. People are still deluding themselves calling her Top Tier, as if she was as all-conquering and always useful as Sheik and ZSS.

 

[Deleted member]

People are still deluding themselves calling her Top Tier, as if she was as all-conquering and always useful as Sheik and ZSS.

lol. people like you are still trying to deny Rosa's a top tier character?

 

[FamilyTeam]

lol. people like you are still trying to deny Rosa's a top tier character?

She's very good, but I don't think she's complete Top Tier. She's probably still Top 5, but I don't think she's an absolute Top Tier.

 

[Wintermelon43]

IMO only Sheik and ZSS needs nerfss

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Rosalina is probably one character where I don't see the need of nerfing. Her offense relies a lot on the Luma, and without it, her offense takes a plummet for a while.

I will say though, that Rosalina's air speed is just sad (ranked below average when compared to the rest of the cast), because pretty much anyone with an above average walk speed value can keep up with her air speed without having to dash. That makes it rather difficult for Rosalina to make safe landings whenever she's trying to recover. And it's not like her down aerial is that reliable against attacks from below.

If Rosalina had a better air speed value (preferably 1.25), that could help her be a bit less reliant on Launch Star to recover. As long-ranged as Launch Star is, its inability to deal damage makes it quite risky to use when you have edge-guarders around. Try to recover over your opponents, they could potentially catch up to Rosalina before she lands. Try to target a ledge, and you could take a blow before you even grab it, even if it's something like a Footstool Jump.

Launch Star Attack may add hitboxes, but its shorter travel distance, along with the fact that the move halts Rosalina's momentum upon ending, makes it much less reliable for long-distance recoveries.

As for Rosalina's weight, the nerf that she got seemed pointless. If anything, I'm quite disturbed that Rosalina is lighter than even a Pikachu, but I guess if she was made to be heavier, people would heavily complain about it.

I will say that heavier weight doesn't exactly make a fighter better, especially when you look at fighters like Bowser, Dedede, and Ganondorf, where despite of their high weight, they lack the offensive potential that the lighter characters tend to have, and Samus does prove that even heavy fighters can be floaty.

As such, even if Rosalina's weight was as high as 100, although it would help her survive longer, it would not change the fact that her offense would remain poor without a Luma to help her out.

 

[Green Zelda]

Voting for !

 

[Wintermelon43]

Tbh, in smash 5, assuming the Ice Climbers will be added back, then I hope Rosalina becomes an aieral Ice Climbers, while Ice Climbers stay as how they are. Rosalina is a space goddess, so she'll be constatnyl flying around. Then Ice Climbers are the king of the ground, that can climb entire mountains. This would mean that:

Rosalina's ground game would be pretty bad, which means tons of nerfs to it, 2 or 3 attacks should stay good or ok, but not great. Luma should randomly disappear from the ground both to nerf ground game and to not make luma helpless on the ground.

In the air, Rosalina would have faster Mario & So- I mean air speed, she'd have less landing and ending lag on all aieral moves (Unless they are never a problem), and her aieral moves would be modified to be more defensive and ice climber like.

Luma would probably be more like Nana, but idk how this would be.

 

[L9999]

A range decrease in Gravitational Pull. GP pulls projectiles from a mile away and gimps Ness very easily. Of course, even with GP's range nerfed, Gravitational Gimps would still be possible, and Rosalina would still dont give a damn about any zoner's projectiles, but it would make the use of GP more precise and make those matchup less miserable for the losing characters, even if they are still terrible like they were meant to.

Tbh, in smash 5, assuming the Ice Climbers will be added back, then I hope Rosalina becomes an aieral Ice Climbers, while Ice Climbers stay as how they are. Rosalina is a space goddess, so she'll be constatnyl flying around. Then Ice Climbers are the king of the ground, that can climb entire mountains. This would mean that:

Rosalina's ground game would be pretty bad, which means tons of nerfs to it, 2 or 3 attacks should stay good or ok, but not great. Luma should randomly disappear from the ground both to nerf ground game and to not make luma helpless on the ground.

In the air, Rosalina would have faster Mario & So- I mean air speed, she'd have less landing and ending lag on all aieral moves (Unless they are never a problem), and her aieral moves would be modified to be more defensive and ice climber like.

Luma would probably be more like Nana, but idk how this would be.

Ice Climbers and Rosaluma are nothing alike. Yes, they have similar concept (together are good, must babysit partner) but it is much different. IC get severely punished for losing Nana, Rosalina, not really, she can just camp you out and proceed with her walking fortress gameplan.

 

[Furret24]

I'm far too biased against Rosalina to give a fair opinion here.

I vote .

 

[L1N3R1D3R]

I'm sorta mixed on . She does extremely well with Luma but drops significantly without it. I feel like the balance should be shifted so that she's not quite as good with Luma (nerf some moves' knockback, make more restrictions on when Luma can attack when Rosalina can't), but consequently she's slightly better without it (less lag, a bit more power). Overall it would slightly nerf her, but I think it would be a best of both worlds.

Voting .

 

[MarioMeteor]

She's very good, but I don't think she's complete Top Tier. She's probably still Top 5, but I don't think she's an absolute Top Tier.

She is with little doubt the third best character in the game. That's top tier.

That being said, unlike Grey and Blue Diddy, Rosalina actually requires a large amount of skill and finesse to use, and as such I don't think she's worthy of a nerf. What I think would benefit everyone is if she was made less reliant on Luma. Everybody ******* about how Luma can kill at 70% and how Rosalina can run away when he's gone, so I think Rosalina should have her attacks buffed, and Luma should have his toned down. That way Rosalina would still be the damage and Luma would still be the power, but the character actually becomes Rosalina and Luma and not Luma With Slight Assistance From Rosalina.
She should be made heavier, too.

Voting for Jumpman.

 

[Wintermelon43]

Voting for Pac-Man

 

[Zerp]

Here's Rosalina's and Luma's results: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1fe6uHMX0pXjVzA32UR_905g__P7Kx7lqD7aNybaWJf0/viewanalytics
And here's Pac-Man's poll: http://goo.gl/forms/CsZ3ymontr
Here's the group of extremely diverse individuals you can vote for:

Also, I'd like to know, how do you guys think we should handle Bayonetta and Corrin? Should I add them to the characters we can vote on or should we just do them after everyone else?

 

[MarioMeteor]

Either would work, but I say do them after everyone else, give them some more time to simmer. Who knows? Maybe some game-changing counter or something may be found in that time.

Voting for the Green Thunder.

 

[Furret24]

I say we do the latter, but I'm fine with either choice.

I vote .

 

[Green Zelda]

Also, I'd like to know, how do you guys think we should handle Bayonetta and Corrin? Should I add them to the characters we can vote on or should we just do them after everyone else?

Adding them to the list sounds pretty good.
Voting for pittoo, once again!

 

[L1N3R1D3R]

Voting for the underdog Italian plumber brother himself, .

is a very capable character that has lots of tools going for him, and he's definitely good enough to not need buffs and non-OP enough to not need nerfs. He has one of the best projectiles if not the best one in Bonus Fruit, and his Fire Hydrant helps matters further. As an extra plus, he has a great recovery, good "get off me" tools, and a decent combo game. Probably his worst thing is his grab, as down throw and back throw are the closest things he has to combo and kill throws, and they aren't really good. However, he has enough strengths to balance that out.