The Ultimate Life Form ~ Shadow the Hedgehog for Smash Ultimate! (Maria...)

[7NATOR]

I don't know what's going on, All i will say is that it is Entirely possible for Shadow to get in as a NON-Echo fighter in Base game

 

[smashingDoug]

So I've been trying to think of what kind of taunts Shadow would have

1. Shadow pulls out a green Chaos emerald and toss it up and down in his hand, saying "there's no time for games"
   Spoiler

   0:57
2. Shadow twists the inhibitor rings on his arms causing them to glow and make a noise, like a metal click or something
   Spoiler

   1:50
3. Shadow uses his shoes to hover off the ground, where he will spin around and warps away, only to warp back in (kinda like )
   Spoiler

   2:24

TCT~Phantom
Updated supporter list.

Spoiler: Supporters

1. TCT~Phantom
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can we not have him say theres no time to play games

 

[SonicMario]

I don't know what's going on, All i will say is that it is Entirely possible for Shadow to get in as a NON-Echo fighter in Base game

I think you're still vastly overestimating the probability of Sonic getting a 2nd character at all. Let alone one happening in the base game. They brought back literally every previous playable character in the series, there may not be alot of unique newcomers added and even regarding Echoes I don't think they overload the roster with them, though I do expect at least 2 new echo fighters aside from Daisy. How are you so sure a unique/Semi-clone 2nd Sonic character will be chosen with the lack of newcomer spots? Sonic's still popular, but I'm not so sure it's quite vocal enough (or even united enough for one particular character) Smash-wise that they have to add another Sonic character right now. There's both reps from other franchises that have been in the franchise for so long that have much more desired and requested characters (Ex: Donkey Kong. Dixie Kong and/or King K. Rool) as well as any potential characters from newer games that are also 1st party that could use the limelight. And 3rd party spots must be already pretty scarce when we'll have 7 from the get go. There may be one more in the base game, but I have a feeling it'll more likely be a new franchise that wasn't in Smash prior rather then a 2nd rep of a currently existing one. (My guesses would be Simon Belmont or Rayman)

If Shadow ends up in the base game, he'll more likely be an echo. There's no strong reason to suggest otherwise. If you want Shadow to at least be a semi-clone you have to hope his assist trophy doesn't return so that he's a candidate for DLC. And who knows what they do in DLC, they may even extend Echo fighters to DLC as well that come at a discounted price from regular fighters or even as a free update.

 

[7NATOR]

I think you're still vastly overestimating the probability of Sonic getting a 2nd character at all. Let alone one happening in the base game. They brought back literally every previous playable character in the series, there may not be alot of unique newcomers added and even regarding Echoes I don't think they overload the roster with them, though I do expect at least 2 new echo fighters aside from Daisy. How are you so sure a unique/Semi-clone 2nd Sonic character will be chosen with the lack of newcomer spots? Sonic's still popular, but I'm not so sure it's quite vocal enough (or even united enough for one particular character) Smash-wise that they have to add another Sonic character right now. There's both reps from other franchises that have been in the franchise for so long that have much more desired and requested characters (Ex: Donkey Kong. Dixie Kong and/or King K. Rool) as well as any potential characters from newer games that are also 1st party that could use the limelight. And 3rd party spots must be already pretty scarce when we'll have 7 from the get go. There may be one more in the base game, but I have a feeling it'll more likely be a new franchise that wasn't in Smash prior rather then a 2nd rep of a currently existing one. (My guesses would be Simon Belmont or Rayman)

If Shadow ends up in the base game, he'll more likely be an echo. There's no strong reason to suggest otherwise. If you want Shadow to at least be a semi-clone you have to hope his assist trophy doesn't return so that he's a candidate for DLC. And who knows what they do in DLC, they may even extend Echo fighters to DLC as well that come at a discounted price from regular fighters or even as a free update.

considering that a Second Sonic Character has been a popular request (not as popular as something like K.Rool, but it has alot of requests) Shadow himself being a character that got frequent Requests, the fact that Sonic has been in 3 games so far, and it isn't impossible for Sonic to get a 2nd rep

as for the echo thing, i don't see Sega allowing Shadow to be a carbon Copy of Sonic with TWO Spindashes and a Spring. Sega always shoves Shadow Chaos abilities in pretty much every game he's in, even if its not in the gameplay (Cutscenes or boss fights). Hell, His Assist Trophy has him doing Chaos Control. I do think if Shadow were to get in the game he would have too many substantial differences to be an echo character

 

[TerminatorLOL]

can we not have him say theres no time to play games

"There's no time for games"

I picked it since it was a memorable part of his introduction. Whats wrong with that line?

 

[SonicMario]

(This was going to be in the main thread for Ultimate, but I decided to move it here since it was pretty obvious people were getting tired of the Shadow debate)

7NATOR (Regarding two spin dashes and a spring)

IIRC, the two Spindashes are parts of Sonic's design for mix-ups. Savvy players will be able to tell the difference between Spin charge and Spin dash. But they're implemented in a way for Sonic to try to confuse the opponent. I know some people still clamor for a much more diverse Sonic moveset, and part of it came from how Sonic was rushed into Brawl. Though there's no guarantee that it wasn't at least somewhat part of Sakurai's original plan for Sonic anyway. (Back when he was in the project plan but Sega initially declined until the last minute). Even though Sonic was rushed, I imagine Sakurai still got at least some of what he would of gotten for Sonic had he been in the game from the start. I doubt he had like a totally different idea for Sonic initially that was thrown in the garbage as soon as Sega declined but then had to rush a brand new moveset right from the get go when Sega changed their minds. How he was in the final game probably wasn't 100% what he was going to be had he been there from the start, but I imagine Sakurai still kept ideas floating about in his head.

I don't think it would be too bad for Shadow to use the same kind of style. It's all about using their speed to their advantage, racking damage, and running away only to come running fast at the opponent again to rack up more damage and finish for a killing blow. Something that I think can fit both Sonic and Shadow's style well enough. I don't know if Smash 4 and/or Ultimate was made closer to Sakurai's original thoughts for Sonic or not. But he has gone through some tweaks here and there since his debut in Brawl that must of at least gotten a little closer to whatever Sakurai envisioned originally.

And if you think the spring is too goofy for Shadow for whatever reason. The Sonic series in most of it's stories are essentially a Saturday morning cartoon. Shadow has lines like:

Spoiler: WARNING: Very cheesy edgy Hedgehog lines

8:02-8:25 (Most of the endings in Shadow's game are kinda cheesy anyway but in particular this one is probably the most hilarious)

I don't think it's too much of a stretch even though I understand the disappointment of no teleporting recovery as a result

 

[FooltheFlames]

Can I be put down for the supporters list y'all? Shadow's awesome!

 

[smashingDoug]

"There's no time for games"

I picked it since it was a memorable part of his introduction. Whats wrong with that line?

At the time I was thinking it’s was a cringeworthy line to say. Forgot where it came from

 

[7NATOR]

(This was going to be in the main thread for Ultimate, but I decided to move it here since it was pretty obvious people were getting tired of the Shadow debate)

7NATOR (Regarding two spin dashes and a spring)

IIRC, the two Spindashes are parts of Sonic's design for mix-ups. Savvy players will be able to tell the difference between Spin charge and Spin dash. But they're implemented in a way for Sonic to try to confuse the opponent. I know some people still clamor for a much more diverse Sonic moveset, and part of it came from how Sonic was rushed into Brawl. Though there's no guarantee that it wasn't at least somewhat part of Sakurai's original plan for Sonic anyway. (Back when he was in the project plan but Sega initially declined until the last minute). Even though Sonic was rushed, I imagine Sakurai still got at least some of what he would of gotten for Sonic had he been in the game from the start. I doubt he had like a totally different idea for Sonic initially that was thrown in the garbage as soon as Sega declined but then had to rush a brand new moveset right from the get go when Sega changed their minds. How he was in the final game probably wasn't 100% what he was going to be had he been there from the start, but I imagine Sakurai still kept ideas floating about in his head.

I don't think it would be too bad for Shadow to use the same kind of style. It's all about using their speed to their advantage, racking damage, and running away only to come running fast at the opponent again to rack up more damage and finish for a killing blow. Something that I think can fit both Sonic and Shadow's style well enough. I don't know if Smash 4 and/or Ultimate was made closer to Sakurai's original thoughts for Sonic or not. But he has gone through some tweaks here and there since his debut in Brawl that must of at least gotten a little closer to whatever Sakurai envisioned originally.

And if you think the spring is too goofy for Shadow for whatever reason. The Sonic series in most of it's stories are essentially a Saturday morning cartoon. Shadow has lines like:

Spoiler: WARNING: Very cheesy edgy Hedgehog lines

8:02-8:25 (Most of the endings in Shadow's game are kinda cheesy anyway but in particular this one is probably the most hilarious)

I don't think it's too much of a stretch even though I understand the disappointment of no teleporting recovery as a result

Two Things

1. It still feels like a Shaft for Sonic to have TWO Very Similiar looking moves when he has Good amount more material to use that could replace one of the spindashes

but i understand the whole Rushed and Mix-up reasoning behind it

The thing is that it really wouldn't fit Shadow like that in terms of Fighting style. Shadow is more up close and personal then Sonic is in a fight, and Shadoow heavily uses his Chaos abilities when he fights his Opponents. Shadow is the type of Character to use more Brutal and Powerful hits to defeat the opponent unlike Sonic's more hit and run style.

2. While the lines are cheesy, They are unintentionally Cheesy. After Sonic heroes, Sega wanted to go with a more serious approach with the Sonic games, and Shadow was the Star of the first game to try this. Shadow is intentionally made to be a more serious, Darker Character compared to Sonic's more light hearted nature. Hell even the trophy in Smash mentions how Ruthless Shadow can be.

 

[Captain Shades]

Two Things

1. It still feels like a Shaft for Sonic to have TWO Very Similiar looking moves when he has Good amount more material to use that could replace one of the spindashes

but i understand the whole Rushed and Mix-up reasoning behind it

The thing is that it really wouldn't fit Shadow like that in terms of Fighting style. Shadow is more up close and personal then Sonic is in a fight, and Shadoow heavily uses his Chaos abilities when he fights his Opponents. Shadow is the type of Character to use more Brutal and Powerful hits to defeat the opponent unlike Sonic's more hit and run style.

2. While the lines are cheesy, They are unintentionally Cheesy. After Sonic heroes, Sega wanted to go with a more serious approach with the Sonic games, and Shadow was the Star of the first game to try this. Shadow is intentionally made to be a more serious, Darker Character compared to Sonic's more light hearted nature. Hell even the trophy in Smash mentions how Ruthless Shadow can be.

I don’t understand the hatred of Sonic’s moveset, it really fits him perfectly, since what else would Sonic do. Sonic was put into Smash in 2008, before the boost titles, so there really was little to pull from. Sonic uses spin dashes because that’s what Sonic’s known for, and really was the only thing he could do at least in the main line games. He took the homing attack from Adventure and the charged spin dash from the classic titles. He plays exactly like Sonic, which is what Sakurai strives for when making characters, or else, why wouldn’t he have move changes in later installments.

As for the ‘darker’ argument, I think Sega wants to forget about Shadow The Hedgehog and 06, or at least parody them and admit they messed up. The darker titles were probably the worst era of Sonic, so why should Sega keep him so dark and have Smash represent it. Shadow has really lightened up in recent times so having cheesy dialog makes sense.

You also bring up how Sonic’s moveset doesn’t benefit Shadow, but that’s far from the case. Shadow, more often than not, is portrayed as a Sonic clone in gameplay, as he really is a darker Sonic. He may use Chaos Powers in cutscenes, but it usually doesn’t come in to play when using the character. As for how Sonic’s play style can be changed to fit Shadow, I already made a post about it.

I’ve been reading a forum on the differences between the two characters and I feel I know what can be done to make Shadow different.

Sonic is all about style and adaptability, having less lethal moves as he believes in good.
Shadow is the opposite, wanting to get things done, having a strict mindset and willingness to be more lethal.

Sonic and Shadow can be essentially the same character with significant tweaks that go off this principle.

In the air, Sonic has more control, as he’s flashy and would want more air time. Shadow would drop quicker than Sonic leading into more ground control and combos, unlike Sonic who is more free when it comes to air.

Shadow should also have a reverse Marth and Lucina relationship with Sonic. Certain areas of Shadows moves should do more damage, like the tip of his drop kick. Shadow is about power, so getting the most out of his moves would naturally make more sense, but restrict the freedom that Sonic has to be effective and more adaptable at every angle.

Shadow and Sonic should be different in a way that lends Shadow to be more restrictive and require more calculated movements than Sonic, who is a free and adaptable fighter best suited for newcomers.

 

[7NATOR]

I don’t understand the hatred of Sonic’s moveset, it really fits him perfectly, since what else would Sonic do. Sonic was put into Smash in 2008, before the boost titles, so there really was little to pull from. Sonic uses spin dashes because that’s what Sonic’s known for, and really was the only thing he could do at least in the main line games. He took the homing attack from Adventure and the charged spin dash from the classic titles. He plays exactly like Sonic, which is what Sakurai strives for when making characters, or else, why wouldn’t he have move changes in later installments.

As for the ‘darker’ argument, I think Sega wants to forget about Shadow The Hedgehog and 06, or at least parody them and admit they messed up. The darker titles were probably the worst era of Sonic, so why should Sega keep him so dark and have Smash represent it. Shadow has really lightened up in recent times so having cheesy dialog makes sense.

You also bring up how Sonic’s moveset doesn’t benefit Shadow, but that’s far from the case. Shadow, more often than not, is portrayed as a Sonic clone in gameplay, as he really is a darker Sonic. He may use Chaos Powers in cutscenes, but it usually doesn’t come in to play when using the character. As for how Sonic’s play style can be changed to fit Shadow, I already made a post about it.

They could have changed some of his moveset in Smash 4 AND Ultimate. By that time Sonic has adapted the boost formula. Not to mention other attacks like the light speed dash, bounce attack, somersault plus slide,Ring toss, etc. having TWO Spindashes is just...ehh, especially since Sonic could do so much more. the only thing i could think of why Sonic is unchanged is because Sakurai doesn't like to do moveset overhauls alot of the time. It Took 4 Games in order for Ganondorf to use his Sword (barring Customs).

As for the Darker argument, i Don't mind the Cheesy Dialog for Shadow, but if you look at Shadow and look at Sonic, Sonic is a more light-hearted character compared to Shadow's more dark Heartedness. Just because we are not in an era where Sonic games are Dark, Doesn't mean Shadow has become light hearted, He is still Darker Character than Sonic even today

as for the Sonic clone aspect. if you look at all the games where Shadow plays similar to Sonic, those are games which doesn't really make it's characters distinct from one another. SA2 had Rouge play like Knuckles and Tails play like Eggman. Heroes there were a few differences but not to may distinct ones between the types of characters in that game. Rivals 1 and 2 had everyone as a Sonic Clone. Forces I'll give you credit, but considering that was ever the first Time Shadow was playable in the boost formula, along with the fact he wasn't in the main game but was Free DLC, well, yes. in games where the characters are Really Distinct, Shadow always had substantial Differences from Sonic, with his Chaos abilities and all that

even in games where Shadow plays similar to Sonic, He still uses his Chaos powers in Some Way. SA2 had the multiplayer which Had Shadow use Chaos Spear and Control, Heroes has Team Dark use Chaos Control, which freezes time for 5-10 seconds. Sonic Rivals, in which everyone was a Sonic clone, had Shadow use his Chaos Control as his ultimate attack. Forces is the only game where Shadow has ever not used his Chaos abilities, but even in that game had him use it in cutscenes

speaking of Cutscenes, Characters in Smash aren't always based on Gameplay aspects, but also Concepts. if we were to just base characters on Gameplay aspects, Rosalina would only have a Spin attack to her name for example. Hell a good amount of the characters in Smash wouldn't be fighting right now. Cutscenes do play a role for a Character, in in Cutscenes Shadow is alot of the time seen overpowering Characters with his Powerful hits and Chaos abilities rather than Sonic's more hit and run fighting style in Smash. Boss Fights also matter. In pretty much every Boss fight has Shadow use his abilities as well. Sonic Boom was the most recent game that had Shadow as a boss fight, and in that game he uses his boost, he uses His Chaos Spear, and his Chaos Blast.

another thing to prove is that the one time Shadow was in a fighting game which was a DAMN GBA Game (Sonic Battle) He played Completely different from Sonic in that game, mostly using his Chaos powers and also being more high damaging character. This hits home that in an actual fight, Shadow makes more uses of Powerful hits and his Chaos Abilities rather than Hit and Run with Spindashes like Sonic

Shadow can be considered an iconic character at this point. He's been in many games, and while he has times where he played similar to Sonic, He's also had games where He's played Substantially different.His Chaos abilities are his trademark and associated with him greatly. They even follow him outside of games and even into other media like Tv Shows (Sonic X and Sonic Boom). To have Shadow basically be a Echo Carbon Copy of Sonic with TWO SPindashes and a Spring with just Property changes n my opinion undermines Shadow.

 

[smashingDoug]

I don’t understand the hatred of Sonic’s moveset, it really fits him perfectly, since what else would Sonic do. Sonic was put into Smash in 2008, before the boost titles, so there really was little to pull from. Sonic uses spin dashes because that’s what Sonic’s known for, and really was the only thing he could do at least in the main line games. He took the homing attack from Adventure and the charged spin dash from the classic titles. He plays exactly like Sonic, which is what Sakurai strives for when making characters, or else, why wouldn’t he have move changes in later installments.

As for the ‘darker’ argument, I think Sega wants to forget about Shadow The Hedgehog and 06, or at least parody them and admit they messed up. The darker titles were probably the worst era of Sonic, so why should Sega keep him so dark and have Smash represent it. Shadow has really lightened up in recent times so having cheesy dialog makes sense.

You also bring up how Sonic’s moveset doesn’t benefit Shadow, but that’s far from the case. Shadow, more often than not, is portrayed as a Sonic clone in gameplay, as he really is a darker Sonic. He may use Chaos Powers in cutscenes, but it usually doesn’t come in to play when using the character. As for how Sonic’s play style can be changed to fit Shadow, I already made a post about it.

Forgot what the moves are called but sonic battle has special attacks what sonic uses what would work great in smash

 

[Captain Shades]

I can’t completely agree

It’s true that cutscenes are used, but I’d argue that third parties mainly represent the gameplay of the character as Smash doesn’t have multiple character slots for them. Bayonetta uses all her combo attacks, Mega is literally ripped right out of the NES, Sonic uses spin attacks as that’s the main gameplay gimmick of Sonic along with going fast, etc.

Shadow has appeared in multiple Sonic titles where he uses a lot of Sonic’s tool kit. The fact that Sega has made him play like Sonic on multiple occasions, including the most recent title being Forces, only adds to the idea that he can easily be an echo. I understand he’s different in spin-offs, but since Sakurai seems to focus on the core titles, as that’s were a majority of people will experience these characters or know them from, he’ll most likely base Shadow off the more clone incarnations

I always see the idea that Sega wouldn’t let their character be handled this way, but that’s really not the case. Sega has turned Sonic into a complete joke for years now with the Twitter, Boom, and the Sonic hate wagon that was the LEGO Dimensions story pack. Sega would probably let Sakurai do anything he wanted. I also doubt Sakurai would really waste time on another character from the same third party franchise when he can easily make him an echo to please fans, then focus his efforts on a brand new company’s mascot, such as Rayman. Shadow may have potential, but either way, just having him in would be great because whether original or echo the moveset would make complete sense and fit.

I guess there’s really no point in arguing, I feel that Sonic is fine the way he is and if Shadow is in, echo or not, that would be cool.

 

[7NATOR]

I can’t completely agree

It’s true that cutscenes are used, but I’d argue that third parties mainly represent the gameplay of the character as Smash doesn’t have multiple character slots for them. Bayonetta uses all her combo attacks, Mega is literally ripped right out of the NES, Sonic uses spin attacks as that’s the main gameplay gimmick of Sonic along with going fast, etc.

Shadow has appeared in multiple Sonic titles where he uses a lot of Sonic’s tool kit. The fact that Sega has made him play like Sonic on multiple occasions, including the most recent title being Forces, only adds to the idea that he can easily be an echo. I understand he’s different in spin-offs, but since Sakurai seems to focus on the core titles, as that’s were a majority of people will experience these characters or know them from, he’ll most likely base Shadow off the more clone incarnations

I always see the idea that Sega wouldn’t let their character be handled this way, but that’s really not the case. Sega has turned Sonic into a complete joke for years now with the Twitter, Boom, and the Sonic hate wagon that was the LEGO Dimensions story pack. Sega would probably let Sakurai do anything he wanted. I also doubt Sakurai would really waste time on another character from the same third party franchise when he can easily make him an echo to please fans, then focus his efforts on a brand new company’s mascot, such as Rayman. Shadow may have potential, but either way, just having him in would be great because whether original or echo the moveset would make complete sense and fit.

I guess there’s really no point in arguing, I feel that Sonic is fine the way he is and if Shadow is in, echo or not, that would be cool.

I guess we'll see what happens as the release date gets closer

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Forgot what the moves are called but sonic battle has special attacks what sonic uses what would work great in smash

He's got 6 of them. Sonic Wave, Sonic Storm, Sonic Drive, Sonic Meteor, Sonic Cracker, and Sonic Air Cracker.

I'm guessing you mean Wave/Storm. To be honest, I feel these could've been neat Side B's. However, I never thought about Sonic's playstyle, so it makes sense why he has two "Spins".

 

[DarkFoxTeam]

I can already tell there's going to be a lot of people that are going to be angry if Shadow ends up as an echo instead of his own unique fighter. Honestly, it's going to be either that or nothing. If getting Shadow in as an echo is the only way then I'll gladly take it. As long as he's playable in some form, I'll be really happy.

 

[7NATOR]

I can already tell there's going to be a lot of people that are going to be angry if Shadow ends up as an echo instead of his own unique fighter. Honestly, it's going to be either that or nothing. If getting Shadow in as an echo is the only way then I'll gladly take it. As long as he's playable in some form, I'll be really happy.

Don't worry my lad

Shadow as his own unique fighter is still totally possible though. I know people are on the whole "Shadow as an echo" Bandwagon and that think that Shadow could only get in as an echo...They are wrong

I bet my soul on Shadow getting in as his own fighter. I believe he can

 

[DarkFoxTeam]

Don't worry my lad

Shadow as his own unique fighter is still totally possible though. I know people are on the whole "Shadow as an echo" Bandwagon and that think that Shadow could only get in as an echo...They are wrong

I bet my soul on Shadow getting in as his own fighter. I believe he can

I don't think that's likely, honestly. We really should take Sakurai's words seriously when he says we shouldn't expect too many fighters.

His focus is more likely going towards 1st party Nintendo characters. If we're going to see another 3rd party character with an original moveset then it's likely going to be someone iconic like Simon Belmont.

Adding in Shadow as an echo would be easier for him since he'd just use Sonic's model as a base. He'd just need to tweak some things here and there. It'd make things faster and it would make a majority of fans happy. That's how I see it anyway. If Shadow does make it in as a unique fighter then I'll be satisfied either way. I just don't see it as a possibility.

Honestly, even as an echo, Shadow's chances are still low. Sure, we haven't seen his assist trophy yet, but it could just be Sakurai and his team messing with the fans. For all we know Knuckles just took over his AT role and that's it. There's also the possibility that both Knuckles and Shadow are AT since we're supposedly getting over 50 of them. I'd say we shouldn't get too optimistic about his chances.

 

[smashingDoug]

He's got 6 of them. Sonic Wave, Sonic Storm, Sonic Drive, Sonic Meteor, Sonic Cracker, and Sonic Air Cracker.

I'm guessing you mean Wave/Storm. To be honest, I feel these could've been neat Side B's. However, I never thought about Sonic's playstyle, so it makes sense why he has two "Spins".

For side B The one where he shoots out a blue wave/been

For up B the one where he says here I come a tosses a ring

He should also have his bounce attack and blue tornado

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

For side B The one where he shoots out a blue wave/been

For up B the one where he says here I come a tosses a ring

He should also have his bounce attack and blue tornado

I wanted his Bounce Attack as well. Sonic Wave/Storm would work well enough for a Side B, with obviously the air version matching Sonic Battle's design. Sonic Drive honestly feels kind off, though a simple Ring Dash for Up B makes some sense. It would take too long to set up, and with Sonic's speed, he can't have that. So a Ring Dash where he basically barrels through everything, but maybe only does phantom damage at best, while not taking any knockback(but can be hurt) could make it very useful. For Down B, I think he could still use the Spin Dash, but while in the Air, he'd use Sonic Bounce.(Sonic Meteor is pretty much a worse version of Sonic Bounce).

Also I want to correct someone; the Homing Attack actually originates from Sonic 3D Blast. The way it functions is more like Adventure(up to 06) for his Brawl and 4 appearances. In Ultimate, he now uses the version that was far slower and required you to directly lock-on first that started since Unleashed. It's more of the 3D era function, but it's still a move from the actual Classic area. His only strict Modern move is Shadow Rocket. The rest all came from previous Classic games first. But he was intended to be that, where he could keep moving without stopping, something generally used in Classic. He almost never stands around in gameplay bar the fighting games or is kind of slow outside of 06 and... the fighting games at times.

 

[SonicMario]

If Shadow gets in (Especially as an Echo Fighter), in tournaments the Sonic and Shadow players together should make it a tradition to recite word for word the intro to the first fight (Ya know, "I found you, faker!", "You're comparing yourself to me?", "I'll make you eat those words", etc.) between Sonic and Shadow in SA2.

If it happens in a particularly big moment like a finals or even Semi-finals. The one before their final battle on the ark ("I die hard", "Your adventuring days are coming to an end!", etc.) would also be acceptable

 

[ZTurtle]

So I found Shadow the Hedgehog at a thrift store for 5 bucks today, and I bought it because I remember liking it when I borrowed it from my cousin a long while back.

And oh man, this game is a MESS.

But DAMN I can't help but love it a lot. I can't say I would recommend it to any average joe, but somehow I have a lot of fun playing this game. Tedious missions, edginess, mediocre voice acting, and mess of a plot and all. It really does make me want to see Shadow in Smash even more honestly.

On a related note, is the PS2 version of ShtH slightly laggier than the other versions? I encountered a fair amount of minor frame drops here and there which I don't remember from when I played my cousin's GameCube version. It could just be that my PS2 is old, or I just don't remember the frame drops on the GC version, but I was just curious.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

So I found Shadow the Hedgehog at a thrift store for 5 bucks today, and I bought it because I remember liking it when I borrowed it from my cousin a long while back.

And oh man, this game is a MESS.

But DAMN I can't help but love it a lot. I can't say I would recommend it to any average joe, but somehow I have a lot of fun playing this game. Tedious missions, edginess, mediocre voice acting, and mess of a plot and all. It really does make me want to see Shadow in Smash even more honestly.

On a related note, is the PS2 version of ShtH slightly laggier than the other versions? I encountered a fair amount of minor frame drops here and there which I don't remember from when I played my cousin's GameCube version. It could just be that my PS2 is old, or I just don't remember the frame drops on the GC version, but I was just curious.

From what I remember, the versions differed slightly due to hardware factors. PS2 was lower quality, but I think it had a language change option otherwise. Xbox had the better graphics/speed, while GameCube was right between. I only really remember PS2 being the worst hardware-wise yet having a nice option. Xbox version might've had the language option too?

It's hard to remember when I only own the GCN version. It's not like the language thing is a good enough reason to repick up the game. I only do that in special cases. Like Soul Calibur II for the Xbox has a different character from the GameCube version. Might seem kind of an eh reason, but at least it affects gameplay.

 

[smashingDoug]

I could see him cut as an AT because he does function similar to the stopwatch. Also Sakurai Did say he doesn’t want much slowing gameplay down ie chaos control

But if he gets the fighter upgrade like Mac, This should be in as a song, maybe a stage as well?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I could see him cut as an AT because he does function similar to the stopwatch. Also Sakurai Did say he doesn’t want much slowing gameplay down ie chaos control

But if he gets the fighter upgrade like Mac, This should be in as a song, maybe a stage as well?

Thinking about it, isn't Westopolis pretty much Shadow's Green Hill Zone? I think it'll be the stage due to this alone. Everybody knows it who played the game because it shows up in over 200 playthroughs.

Music-wise, absolutely we need some good midis. For vocals, both versions of All Hail Shadow are a must, same with I Am(All Of Me). Rest is more difficult to say. These are the big ones. Vocals appear to require more licensing due to the artists, as the instrumentals I think are owned by Sega. That means one is easier to license. This is probably why we lost Sonic Boom in 4(the fact that Sonic Boom became a TV Show I doubt was anything more than a pure coincidence).

 

[smashingDoug]

Thinking about it, isn't Westopolis pretty much Shadow's Green Hill Zone? I think it'll be the stage due to this alone. Everybody knows it who played the game because it shows up in over 200 playthroughs.

Music-wise, absolutely we need some good midis. For vocals, both versions of All Hail Shadow are a must, same with I Am(All Of Me). Rest is more difficult to say. These are the big ones. Vocals appear to require more licensing due to the artists, as the instrumentals I think are owned by Sega. That means one is easier to license. This is probably why we lost Sonic Boom in 4(the fact that Sonic Boom became a TV Show I doubt was anything more than a pure coincidence).

I would say it’s more than a green hill Lol

• To complete the game 100%, the player will have to play this stage 326 times.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I would say it’s more than a green hill Lol

• To complete the game 100%, the player will have to play this stage 326 times.

By Green Hill, it's literally the most known stage in the game.

For good reasons. Green Hill is also the first ever Sonic stage. Hence the parallels.

 

[SonicMario]

Thinking about it, isn't Westopolis pretty much Shadow's Green Hill Zone? I think it'll be the stage due to this alone. Everybody knows it who played the game because it shows up in over 200 playthroughs.

I'd consider Radical Highway more so Shadow's Green Hill Zone. It's his first level in his debut game after all. Heck for some reason it even made it into the 3DS version of Generations even though Sonic never went through that level in SA2 (Not counting hacks and multiplayer anyway)

I think the only representation the Shadow video game would get is some music (At least it's theme All Of Me), Shadow's victory theme, and maybe even a couple trophies (Probably Black Doom and maybe that General guy with the different colored pupils)

 

[smashingDoug]

By Green Hill, it's literally the most known stage in the game.

For good reasons. Green Hill is also the first ever Sonic stage. Hence the parallels.

While Westopolismight be the most well known stage in the game, the black comet is basically the whole plot of the game

And the guy above me said is true as well,

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I'd consider Radical Highway more so Shadow's Green Hill Zone. It's his first level in his debut game after all. Heck for some reason it even made it into the 3DS version of Generations even though Sonic never went through that level in SA2 (Not counting hacks and multiplayer anyway)

I think the only representation the Shadow video game would get is some music (At least it's theme All Of Me), Shadow's victory theme, and maybe even a couple trophies (Probably Black Doom and maybe that General guy with the different colored pupils)

I specifically mean "Shadow's Green Hill Zone" from his specific game, not the series in general. That was badly worded, yeah.

While Westopolismight be the most well known stage in the game, the black comet is basically the whole plot of the game

Fair point. I think it depends upon what works better as a stage. Both could work.

 

[TCT~Phantom]

We would be lucky if Shadow got a stage, but if he did, expect something from SA2. Sega loves to remind people of the Sonic Adventure games, while Shadow the Hedgehog is being less remembered.

IMO Radical Highway suits Shadow well.

 

[FooltheFlames]

Um... What is it I have to do be put on Shadow's Supporters List? I asked last Sunday... ^^;

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

We would be lucky if Shadow got a stage, but if he did, expect something from SA2. Sega loves to remind people of the Sonic Adventure games, while Shadow the Hedgehog is being less remembered.

IMO Radical Highway suits Shadow well.

Yeah, I don't expect a Shadow stage either, but we were discussing in context of the best one from his game.

I think the most important part isn't what game the stage is from alone so much as how to make it fun. Shadow's game even has a remake of Radical Highway(as does Sonic Battle, and 06's Crisis City has some similarities too). It seems very popular and a stage style associated with Shadow pretty well.

 

[TerminatorLOL]

I think from an aesthetic point of view Radical Highway would be a better choice then Westopolis.

Radical Highway has these brighter colors to it and it's background. And memorable elements to it, like the big red bridge, the orange blimp, that Nights tower, Choa in Space 2 ads.

Westopolis is grey and lacks any real defining fechers. You have to play that level so many times and yet the only things I remember is the dive at the start, and that one bus you can flip.

 

[DarkFoxTeam]

Honestly, I still love Shadow The Hedgehog and I always have a blast when replaying it (GCN version). I know this isn't a popular opinion, but I enjoyed both the story and voice acting. It really moved Shadow's character forward by having him move on from Maria's death and trying to fulfill what she always wanted him to do. Sure, Shadow's backstory with Black Doom and Gerald Robotnik is weird, but it didn't really bother me. Plus, I think Jason really nailed the role of Shadow in the game. He really made it memorable for me.

Also, speaking of stages, I think Westopolis could make for a nice stage if they make it similar to Delfino Plaze and Skyloft where they have you move around the entire city as it's being invaded by the black arms with G.U.N. fighting them in the background.

However, I have to agree with the majority. I like the idea of Westopolis, but Radical Highway would make for the better stage choice as it was his stage debut and it's popular worldwide.

 

[TerminatorLOL]

I also actually enjoy playing Shadow the Hedgehog. The guns, while dumb, felt good to shoot with decent auto aim and that hover Shadow does as he's firing. If they ever make Omega a playable character in 3D Sonic game again, he should work like this. The objective based game play was a mistake though, having to search a level over & over for a item or a surviving enemy is not great. But when all you have to do is get to the finish, its just a fun Adventure/Heroes style 3D Sonic game to me

I'm not really a big fan of the games story. I was happy to be done with the amnesia and "is Shadow a robot?" plot lines but Black Doom wasn't a great villain and other then an excuse for the Eclipse Cannon to exist didn't add anything of substance to Shadow's origin (and its weird to try and make Gerald look like the good guy after SA2). The G.U.N. Commander was also really poorly written, blaming Shadow for Maria death when he is literally working for the organization that shot her. Almost everything else about the story is made kind of a mess by choice/mortality system making it unclear which events of your playthroughs are even canon.

 

[Arkaizer]

Shadow is definitely one of the few characters I really hope gets in, so I'd like to be on the support list. Like the OP mentioned, SA2 was one of the first Gamecube games I played that introduced me to the Sonic series (and one of the first games I played in general). I remember sinking hours into that game, especially with the chao garden. An Echo Fighter is probably his best shot at being playable, but if Sakurai goes the extra mile to make him unique I'd be incredibly happy. Though, an Echo Fighter would take this whole thing full circle, since he originally played like a sonic 'echo' in SA2...

I could list a bunch of reasons as to why I think Shadow the Hedgehog (the game) was a complete disgrace to the character that was built up from SA2 and Heroes and just a bad game in general but I won't.

 

[TerminatorLOL]

I could list a bunch of reasons as to why I think Shadow the Hedgehog (the game) was a complete disgrace to the character that was built up from SA2 and Heroes and just a bad game in general but I won't.

While I can still enjoy playing the game, I have to admit your not wrong. The game did do irreparable damage to the character's image.

 

[Mastermiine]

Can anyone help me resize

to match the size of I would really appreciate it.

And help me make a silver one that matches those 2?

 

[DarkFoxTeam]

Shadow is definitely one of the few characters I really hope gets in, so I'd like to be on the support list. Like the OP mentioned, SA2 was one of the first Gamecube games I played that introduced me to the Sonic series (and one of the first games I played in general). I remember sinking hours into that game, especially with the chao garden. An Echo Fighter is probably his best shot at being playable, but if Sakurai goes the extra mile to make him unique I'd be incredibly happy. Though, an Echo Fighter would take this whole thing full circle, since he originally played like a sonic 'echo' in SA2...

I could list a bunch of reasons as to why I think Shadow the Hedgehog (the game) was a complete disgrace to the character that was built up from SA2 and Heroes and just a bad game in general but I won't.

It's nice to see more Shadow fans join the thread.

However, I respectfully disagree with STH being a "complete disgrace" to Shadow. I think it did well with what it had to go from (SA2 & Heroes), but this isn't the place to talk about that. We'll just stick with discussions about Shadow's possibility, our hopes and overall Smash related material for him.