The Snorlax Room

[CT Chia]

So I played some singles matches today for the first time after months and months of VGC doubles

I kind of forgot why it's so atrociously bad

The "standard" metagame really needs to learn some things from VGC play

1. Avg # of turns for a VGC match is 9 turns I'd say. Standard singles is likely 40+.
2. There are too many different pokemon and strategies available that you simply can not deal with them all. Even with team preview just swapping your lead, you're hardly modifying your team. Picking out of a potential group makes much more sense.
3. Singles feels like just stalling out your opponent until you get in your lucky strategy instead of adapting and choosing in each turn on the fly
4. Singles becomes so much of a switch battle, with switching pokemon into others to resist attacks, absorb them, and other things. In doubles switching is generally frowned upon and only needed with utmost precision and necessary timing. Pokemon need to rely on their partners to cover their weaknesses working together.
5. There are so many more intricate strategies available in doubles, with tons of moves being designed solely for doubles (the same can be said about triples, but very few are)
6. Without the ability to potentially cover everything, tournaments can become just luck based on hoping you don't run into your counter
7. Rain is no where near as good in doubles lmao (however hail becomes way buffed :/)

 

[Enzo]

So I played some singles matches today for the first time after months and months of VGC doubles

I kind of forgot why it's so atrociously bad

The "standard" metagame really needs to learn some things from VGC play

1. Avg # of turns for a VGC match is 9 turns I'd say. Standard singles is likely 40+.
2. There are too many different pokemon and strategies available that you simply can not deal with them all. Even with team preview just swapping your lead, you're hardly modifying your team. Picking out of a potential group makes much more sense.
3. Singles feels like just stalling out your opponent until you get in your lucky strategy instead of adapting and choosing in each turn on the fly
4. Singles becomes so much of a switch battle, with switching pokemon into others to resist attacks, absorb them, and other things. In doubles switching is generally frowned upon and only needed with utmost precision and necessary timing. Pokemon need to rely on their partners to cover their weaknesses working together.
5. There are so many more intricate strategies available in doubles, with tons of moves being designed solely for doubles (the same can be said about triples, but very few are)
6. Without the ability to potentially cover everything, tournaments can become just luck based on hoping you don't run into your counter
7. Rain is no where near as good in doubles lmao (however hail becomes way buffed :/)

First off there's no need to just bash the standard metagame aka wifi(DW?) calling it atrociously bad just because u havent played it in a while and enjoy VGC

Points i disagree with:

4. What I understand from this is that you don't encourage the switching of pokemon...but isnt that what makes a team? There's needs to be synergy somewhere in your team whether it means dual screening for gorebyss to pass shell smashes or things like Jelliscor

5. I can't say im very experienced in VGC (because im not) but however i've seen top youtube battlers play VGC and what i tend to see is an extreme abuse of the two genie's prankster abilities thunder wave and tailwind(even whimsicott in some cases) leading way to a sweeper to come in. also protect spamming (omnipresent in dubz) isnt so creative. :/

6. I take pride in my teambuilding so I'd prefer if it would have some sort of effect on the match rather than playing on pure adaptation. The standard wifi ou metagame requires both intelligent teambuilding and adaptation skills rather than one or the other which you seem to imply


F

 

[Wave⁂]

Chibo, are you playing '10 or '11 VGC? There's no hail in gen V.

4. Synergy in doubles comes from the two Pokemon you have out. It can be as simple as Landbro / Thunderbro or Wimsicott / Terrakion, or something more subtle like Chandelure / Jellicent on a team of 6 otherwise speedy Pokemon, and bluff Choice Scarf when you're actually running Trick Room.

5. Doubles has always been a tier with many possibilities. Trick Room is incredibly, ridiculously powerful with Reuinclus, Musharna, Scrafty, Jellicent and other Pokemon. Encore Whimsicott completely screws with Trick Room teams, forcing the Trick Roomer to either switch out after turn 1 or reverse the Trick Room. Nobody ever uses Thunder Wave, I don't know what you're watching. Sweepers setting up in doubles, I don't know what you're watching. Protect spamming isn't like running a sandstorm team in Wifi OU. Sure, you go for that double Protect every other turn. But my Terrakion's just going to keep Swords Dancing, my Reuniclus is going to take that time to refresh my Trick Room turns, and I'm going to switch out to a Pokemon that counters both of yours. You want to alternate Protects? Well, I'll just team up on your vulnerable Pokemon while the other one sits around with its thumb up its ***.

6. Uh, what? Chibo said that tournaments aren't ideal because it's virtually impossible to account for every threat, not whatever you're saying.

 

[Asdioh]

Can someone explain what VGC is? I've seen it mentioned on PO but I have no idea what it is exactly.

 

[Wave⁂]

VGC is the ruleset made by Nintendo or Nintendo of America or Game Freak or Pokemon Company for VGC. It's (seemingly) designed for fast-paced gameplay. Double battles, bring-six-pick-four. The subtleties in the rules change year to year. In '09, you couldn't use any of some list of Pokemon banned. In '10, you were allowed a maximum of two Pokemon from a list of "Ubers". In '11, you are constrained to gen V Pokemon, along with a standard banlist. In at least '11, there's also Item Clause, I forget about the past years.

 

[OmegaXXII]

...um hi!

I never come to this part of SwF, but anyway

I have never played any of the newer pokemon titles, last one I played was Gold/Silver for Game Boy Color, but I really miss those kind of games and nowadays there's so many titles I missed out on....so I need some recommendations:

SoulSilver/HeartGold: I heard this game was like it's predecessor but I don't know if it's the same, any new pokemon included?

FireRed/Leaf Green:So are these like Red/Blue/Yellow? Can they link up to HG/SS?

Pokemon Black/White: This series is ions away from any of the old titles I've come to know, it looks like it's popular but is it as good as any of the previous installments?

What about Diamond/Pearl and Ruby and Sapphire should I try those out first if I'm want to go past the Johto region for the first time?

Any advice would be helpful, I've been seriously missing out.

 

[Firus]

Hey Omega! Welcome to the Poké Center!

HeartGold/SoulSilver are fairly similar to their predecessors, but they include the new Pokémon introduced in Ruby/Sapphire and Diamond/Pearl, plus there are a lot of new features. Personally, I'm not too huge a fan of them, but they're good games and it might be a good way to ease back into Pokémon if the last ones you played were Gold and Silver.

FireRed/LeafGreen are indeed like Red/Blue/Yellow, but like with HG/SS, they have new Pokémon (those introduced in Ruby/Sapphire) and new features. They can connect to HG/SS but only minimally -- you can transfer Pokémon over from them, but you can't trade back and forth or battle. As with HG/SS, I'm not much of a fan of these games, but I'd also recommend them less than HG/SS. If you're looking to go for one remake, I'd go for HG/SS, not FR/LG.

Black/White are actually quite good, in my opinion. They definitely deviate from the older titles, and until you beat the Elite Four you can't even encounter any of the Pokémon introduced prior to Black/White, but they're fun and the plot is actually very well-developed. I'd definitely recommend considering one of these.

As for Diamond/Pearl and Ruby/Sapphire...well, R/S are my favorites and D/P are my least favorites, so I'm biased and naturally inclined to tell you to try R/S and skip D/P, but I'll try and be a little more objective than that. R/S are definitely interesting to consider because even being just past G/S, the entire feel of the game changes, between graphics and the way things are organized, not to mention the addition of features like Abilities and Natures. D/P definitely have a similar effect, and they also come back to the natural track a little from R/S such as with bringing back the day/night feature, and there's also the split such that moves are determined to be physical or special based on the concept of the move rather than just the type.

Overall, I'd say HG/SS are worth giving a shot, B/W are definitely worth giving a shot, especially since they're the most recent ones (although you may want to wait and maybe just grab the third version when it comes out, though it could be a while since it's not officially announced yet), and I'd personally recommend that you give R/S a shot.

If you're able and willing to give everything since G/S a shot, I'd certainly recommend doing so if only for the sake of more solid continuity, but at minimum you could probably do just HG/SS and B/W and catch up.

Hope that was of some help to you! Anyone else can feel free to weigh in and give a second opinion too, that's just my take on it.

 

[OmegaXXII]

Wow Firus, seems like you know your games.

By reading your descriptions I can tell you've probably played each one, from what I see I'm guessing Ruby/Sapphire would be the way to go, I want to explore some of the newer regions but at the same time encounter totally new foes I've never encountered before, plus I feel I can start learning some of the newer basics that I think would help me catch up to the more recent games out now.

But personally I will start out with HG/SS since I'm a bit more familiar with the region plus I can catch up on all the new Pokemon, new techniques, and possibly fight new foes as well, I can't wait to face the Elite Five again.

I feel either one of these would be perfect for me considering I've last played Gold/Silver.

And if you say a newer version related to Black/White is coming out, then I will most certainly jump up to that one once I'm done.

Thanks for your input

 

[Daddy Ash]

I agree with Firus, if possible try and play a game from each gen. But if not HG/SS would be easiest way to get you back into the series and introduce you to the newer features and is for all intent and purposes like owning FR/LG as well.
I personally preferred Gen 4 (D/P/Pt) over Gen 3 (R/S/E), So I would recommend you to play Platinum over Emerald.
Best way to get back into pokemon would be Emerald, Platinum, HG/SS then B/W though for continuity of the series and newer features.

 

[CT Chia]

I've played all VGCs, though I'm certainly been playing nothing but VGC '11. Yea there are some lame things prankster and such, but there are so many different strategies than can be employed overall and modified with bring 6 pick 2. but such a fast gameplay just seems so much better in a competitive scene.

 

[PokemonMasterIRL]

I think what Chibo means to say is "Hey VGC 11 is cool, check it out."

Lol.


I went to VGC this year and it really is a cool and fun format.

 

[Tacel]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4WC9Mh4HaA&feature=youtube_gdata_player

 

[Riddle]

I have not been in this forum for a long time. What's going on everyone?

Also, where is my pokeball

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Hello from Hong Kong! After the T3 typhoons over here, the weather is nice and hot!

Unfortunately, my Internet access is rather unpredictable. :3

 

[Wave⁂]

****ing hell what are you doing over there

Also buy me a souvenir or else

 

[Terywj [태리]]

****ing hell what are you doing over there

Also buy me a souvenir or else

Visiting family and partying. What else would I be doing?

Kay. I'll need your address, though. *Creeper*
But if you seriously want something, PM me your address. I'll see what I can do.

 

[Starphoenix]

So, let me ask all of you Pokéxperts some questions, particularly about this bug I'm sporting in my avatar to the left. Genesect. I've already asked some other people about his history and that seems interesting enough. What I'd like to know is where does he rank in terms of power compared to the other popular "cool" legendaries such as Mewtwo, Deoxys, and Darkrai? Is he very powerful? Would he pose much of a challenge to these other Pokémon listed or no?

 

[choknater]

he's not uber, but vs those particular ones you listed i'm sure he could fight haha, since he is a bug/steel. his roles are very different from scizor, nice special movepool and has u-turn.

he's about at the level of jirachi/celebi and such though, and i think he shares the same base stat total.

 

[UltiMario]

Genesect is much more powerful than Jirachi or Celebi, but nearly on the level of Ubers like Mewtwo, Deo, and Darkrai.

He doesn't ACTUALLY exist as a Pokemon- he's unreleased right now, so you couldn't really use him if you wanted to... unless you want to play artificially in Dream World :/

He COULD pose a bit of a threat- specifically to Psychics, in Ubers if he was released, but when he's released he's better off in the OU tier, where the average power level is much lower and matches his own much more.

 

[Starphoenix]

Not even referring to the Pokemon metagame but just as a Pokemon is he as powerful as those listed? Since he hasn't been released I see how determining that would be difficult.

 

[UltiMario]

If we're talking about sheer power here, he doesn't compete with any of those, he's not even close.

 

[Wave⁂]

How do we know that? He probably hasn't appeared in the anime or movies yet, has he?

 

[Firus]

Oh man.

So the store I work at sells Pokémon cards, and recently my boss put out a bunch of old stock of Pokémon cards, meaning there were a bunch of unopened Base, Jungle, Fossil, Team Rocket, and Gym Leader cards among all of the new packs of cards. I bought a few packs and was debating not opening them, but today decided to open all of the unopened packs I had.

In one of the Base packs, I got a holographic Charizard.

The eight-year-old inside of me just exploded with joy.

 

[F8AL]

I hate am jealous of you Firus.

 

[Wave⁂]

That is... incredible.

 

[Daddy Ash]

I have a Holographic Charizard card, never thought they were still held in such high regard. Got it in about my 4th pack when I was younger, was so excited, glad I kept it now seeing as it's near mint condition. Ahh the memories, should find out the card and rest of my old Pokemon cards just for the nostalgia

 

[PokemonMasterIRL]

Pokemon Cards raaaaaape. I still play competitively. Get at my Hot Hooters Tech.

 

[Night-san]

I recently got all three base-set final form startee cards for free. The only disappointment is that none of them are first edition.

 

[Wave⁂]

The TCG was so much simpler back then. "GL" and "Prime" and "4" and "Delta" and "ex" and "LV. X" and the weird star thing, confusing.

 

[Daddy Ash]

I played semi-competitively with the first gen cards, lost interest by the time then moved past the jungle and fossil cards. Mainly just collected cards though than battled them, had a nice selection of holographic cards built up, ranging from charizard, chansey, machamp, mewtwo to fossil zapdos/moltres/articuno and one of my personal faves dragonite.

 

[Fuelbi]

The TCG was so much simpler back then. "GL" and "Prime" and "4" and "Delta" and "ex" and "LV. X" and the weird star thing, confusing.

The hell is the difference between all of those?

 

[Seikend]

What's that Pokemon?

 

[Terywj [태리]]

That would be your mother.

 

[OmegaXXII]

Funny, I still have a bunch of my old 1st edition cards in "Like New" condition, heck I still have a bunch of hollowgraphics including Dark Charizard.

Though I haven't even touched or seen those cards in years, they've been in my closet this whole time.

 

[CT Chia]

Did someone say Dark Charizard?

 

[Wave⁂]

Master race Ancient Mew owner, reporting in

 

[Xyless]

So I spent months breeding the perfect Pokemon for my friend's team for the national tourney, and I had the (almost) perfect team, all level 100, and all with the natures and IVs as close as I could get.

...and then today, he lost first round because I accidentally gave his Jellicent Water SPORT instead of Water Spout.

it was also his birthday yesterday, great present I gave him there

 

[Wave⁂]

That is hilarious.

Also a bit sad

 

[Fuelbi]

I dunno if I should laugh considering your months of effort were ruined

Feel sorry for you though bud

 

[CT Chia]

at least he was able to cover the whole field with water?

So I spent months breeding the perfect Pokemon for my friend's team for the national tourney, and I had the (almost) perfect team, all level 100, and all with the natures and IVs as close as I could get.

...and then today, he lost first round because I accidentally gave his Jellicent Water SPORT instead of Water Spout.

it was also his birthday yesterday, great present I gave him there

but like... he had sport when it hatched. you rly thought it had spout? lol. at lv 69, when it tried to learn spout, wasn't that an eye opener?