The significance of Project M ... AND YOU!

[TheTTimeLives]

I feel like this is a thread that should have been created awhile ago.

To preface, I've been aware of Project M since IGN covered it nearly a year ago I believe. In that time, the Project has represented a lot of things within the Smash Bros series and within the scene itself to me.

1. The return of Melee mechanics and ultimately the re-vitalization of a scene that, lets face it, faces extinction as the Gamecube becomes an older system and Melee becomes an aged game.

2. A re-balancing that allows more than just a fraction of the game to be desirable. (Think playing all the stages in Brawl instead of MK ditto on Final Destination everyday)

3. A venue to pool the best new creative mods, skins, move swaps, model hacks and music packs to obtain the maximum version of Brawl that we had imagined before release.

In more specific notes what's really drawn me in over time was the attention to making the individual characters as interesting and nostalgic (this word is overused but whatever) as possible. The re-imagined interpretations of the PK Trainer characters, Sonic, Wario and even the smaller changes to DK that make him like Donkey Kong Country keep me engaged and remind me why I enjoy each individual character in the Smash Bros universe. It's this passion for the characters and the commitment to balancing them whilst keeping them truly unique and exciting is why I love the Project and continue to support it.

With SSB4 now officially on the clock I felt this was a good time to start this thread. So what does Project M mean to you? How did you get involved with the game, what has kept your interest or re-excited you about smash? And what do you see for the future of P:M, Smash Bros and The Smash Bros Community?

 

[GP&B]

I initially read about shanus' experimentation with a Melee Falco PSA during Brawl+'s major decline. I've been reading what's now called the social thread since the very beginning and I believe at one point I had more posts in the thread than a majority of the PMBR. Yeah, I stalked the **** out of that thread.

Project M, to me, is a revitalization of interest in playing both this and Melee. I think just the idea of seeing Link and Mario being built to play at the top of their game excited me the most. Characters that had almost never seen success in all three games would finally get to shine in an engine developed around the playstyle of Melee.

I hope that regardless of whatever SSB4 turns out to be, P:M holds out and really becomes and is treated like a real tournament game. I wish for SSB4 to turn out well in a general sense (I had issues with Brawl outside of its engine), but I can't really judge without knowing Sakurai's intentions this time around.

I've never been involved enough with the community to really see what will happen to the community. There are people who have been here for years who could make much better statements about how P:M will affect the community when it comes down to the final release.

 

[Astraea31]

it means im going to be able **** up metaknight with shine combos up throw up air

****kk yeaaaaah

 

[Translucent]

I found out about Project M from IGN, and I really loved it. I hadn't really played a lot of Melee before, so it was like playing a whole new smash game for me. I really think Project M is the future, because I really don't think Smash 4 will be that competitive. I hope that people everyone realizes how awesome this mod is, and I'm hoping it can get into Apex next year as a main event.

 

[hotdogturtle]

a scene that, lets face it, faces extinction as the Gamecube becomes an older system and Melee becomes an aged game.

This part isn't even true though. Melee has literally been growing constantly since Brawl was released.

 

[Capick]

What does this game mean to me? Well, for one, it pretty much brought the series back to life for me. After playing Brawl for a year I just could never seem to enjoy that game again. It was so terribly boring, and it just was hard to feel good at the game. With this game, you can see your improvement, and you can see places where you can improve.

One of the other things I like about this whole project is the idea of one day, reaching the "Perfect Smash Game." You've got the PMBR, who has been improving on the more technical aspects of the game, spending a couple years (I think?) just reviewing and refining, always making the game better. Then you've got the player, and, if you're like me, this introduced game hacking to me for the first time. I've never hacked before. But Project M just naturally led me to the hacking scene, where you, yourself can look at the more basic stuff in the game (songs, stage/ character textures) and say, "Well, Brawl had some amazing stuff in it. But, you know, this stage could use a ledge here. How else could I make this better?" There's always that mentality of creating the perfect Smash game, and, while no one will ever reach it, it's fun knowing that it's getting closer. Brawl tapped into that a little bit with Stage Builder, one of the best new additions to that game.

I discovered it on IGN back when they were covering 2.0. Got to say, I'm glad I saw it, because it's only one of maybe three games I've played in the last year. Preeeeetty good stuff you guys.

 

[Greenpoe]

P:M is so great that I think I'm going to buy a bunch of SD cards, install the hacks and hand them out to strangers who own Brawl.

 

[Arcalyth]

P:M is so great that I think I'm going to buy a bunch of SD cards, install the hacks and hand them out to strangers who own Brawl.

This is the greatest idea ever. SD cards are cheap...

 

[Forlorn Penguin]

P:M is so great that I think I'm going to buy a bunch of SD cards, install the hacks and hand them out to strangers who own Brawl.

Ha ha. Go for it.

 

[Greenpoe]

Oh I was just kidding, but you guys are right! I have a lot of friends who have Brawl but have never tried Project M. Just gotta make sure that they remember to delete all their custom stages first or it screws everything up

 

[Deus]

I'm just still amazed at how awesome P:M and what an amazing job they've done. I was a huge melee player and when brawl came out it just felt like a slap in the face. Let's take the most unique, in-depth fighter game and see how much we can dumb it down. Ooo I know! Lets make the characters just randomly trip!

I'd like to think they'd go back the way of techincal with Smash 4, but I'm not getting my hopes up again...

P:M deserves to be the next smash game, it deserves MLG tournaments, that's how good it is and how good these developers are. They actually made what I had hoped brawl was going to be the entire time.

 

[MonkUnit]

P:M is so great that I think I'm going to buy a bunch of SD cards, install the hacks and hand them out to strangers who own Brawl.

We did a very similar thing at the Project M booth at APEX2013 and people loved it!

 

[PhantasyStar]

I personally love everything Project M is doing, I also was never a serious smasher until I had heard about Project M nearly a year ago. Not only that having a balanced list of characters/stages/ and tons of new content is great and can surely bring in new players as it ages (i've even done my share of promoting).

 

[Forlorn Penguin]

I'm just still amazed at how awesome P:M and what an amazing job they've done. I was a huge melee player and when brawl came out it just felt like a slap in the face. Let's take the most unique, in-depth fighter game and see how much we can dumb it down. Ooo I know! Lets make the characters just randomly trip!

I'd like to think they'd go back the way of techincal with Smash 4, but I'm not getting my hopes up again...

P:M deserves to be the next smash game, it deserves MLG tournaments, that's how good it is and how good these developers are. They actually made what I had hoped brawl was going to be the entire time.

Agreed. I'm pretty confident though that Smash 4 will be even less competitive than Brawl. At the very most, it might be better than Brawl, but still not close to Melee.

TOs just need to start embracing Project M.

 

[Vashimus]

Now now, guys, I know you're excited but settle down. You're making the PMBR blush when they read stuff like this.

 

[GHNeko]

this thread makes me feel warm inside.

 

[Sixth-Sense]

this thread makes me feel warm inside.

You guys deserve respect from the community, never, never in 1 googol years would I ever imagine being able to play with all the neat Brawl character, graphics, worlds, etc. with my beloved Melee engine, it's just so amazing. Much respect to all of you wizards

I really hope it turns out being like Counterstrike in terms of people playing it and stuff, it deserves the spot-light

 

[Jolteon]

 

[kibago]

I really love Project M. The real issue I have with it was brought up by a friend of mine who's a playtester for it, and basically his thought, and mine too now is that with all characters being viable, learning all the matchups, especially with the increasingly large cast, is very difficult.
That being said I love playing it casually. I've never been to a tournament where it was played for money though

 

[GHNeko]

You guys deserve respect from the community, never, never in 1 googol years would I ever imagine being able to play with all the neat Brawl character, graphics, worlds, etc. with my beloved Melee engine, it's just so amazing. Much respect to all of you wizards

I really hope it turns out being like Counterstrike in terms of people playing it and stuff, it deserves the spot-light

 

[standardtoaster]

who's your friend kibago?

 

[Xzax Kasrani]

Project M is a bad game, I will admit its fun but it's just another smash clone.

 

[GHNeko]

Project M is a bad game, I will admit its fun but it's just another smash clone.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vqlTUe_Unc

 

[Xzax Kasrani]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vqlTUe_Unc

The truth hurts.

 

[ELI-mination]

http://youtu.be/qMiVOKc8Awo?t=25s

 

[Dantarion]

I think Project M is pretty legit.
In the end its always going to be 'just' a mod of Brawl, but its pretty good yo.

 

[traffic.]

I'm actually mostly curious as to what P:M means to the people developing it. While it is a great improvement to the smash franchise, it will always fall victim to the drawbacks of requiring a modded wii, the obvious copyright problems, and being a "different" version of something people already like.

The direction I'm headed is that the best thing for Smash's credibility in the fighting game world would be for another (read: new) franchise to show success from the engine mechanics, the attention to picking apart the smash games for their strengths is the perfect predecessor to this idea. A new fighter that holds true to the ideas of knockback and environment zoning in the same way as the smash franchise would be the proof people need that the game itself is solid, while also removing the stigma of cartoony nintendo characters from the face.

While game mods are easy to collaborate over the internet and collectively develop, do you (the developers) think that you've gained experience and knowledge in the field of designing these engines, or has the modding process left you specifically confined to the tools and programming of vBrawl?

Alternatively, how many of you plan on taking the game development path after P:M is "finished" and otherwise continuing your work in spirit?



For myself, P:M is the only thing in the smash franchise I really play. I played brawl for 3 weeks, immediately saw some real inconsistencies and weaknesses (and of course the good stuff) and have picked up Melee after seeing the differences in P:M, however now Melee feels incomplete with the additional content of P:M. I don't have nearly the same interest in either of the originals, but instead have a game I enjoy, a quality neither game has for me. For that, I applaud the ingenuity of the development team, and hope that the experience of developing P:M leads to the development of a new and exciting game in the future.

 

[Greenpoe]

P:M doesn't need a hacked Wii, hence the "hackless" codeset. That said, I'd like to applaud the PMBR for having the foresight to, even from the very first edition, to make sure that the codeset could not be edited (for those who didn't play Brawl+, they released new builds literally daily, and anyone could add or remove the codes they didn't like). It makes it so much more credible than "just a hack" because we can't easily edit it ourselves, as it should be. That said, I think CounterStrike started out as just a mod, too, and look at it now!

 

[Vashimus]

Yep, a mod of the original Half-Life, but Valve soon bought the rights to develop the game. Now if Nintendo came to the PMBR and paid them for the rights....

 

[Forlorn Penguin]

Yep, a mod of the original Half-Life, but Valve soon bought the rights to develop the game. Now if Nintendo came to the PMBR and paid them for the rights....

That would be nice. I'd love for Smash 4 to basically just be an improved P:M developed by the PMBR instead of HAL.

 

[Burning Boom]

I'm just still amazed at how awesome P:M and what an amazing job they've done. I was a huge melee player and when brawl came out it just felt like a slap in the face. Let's take the most unique, in-depth fighter game and see how much we can dumb it down. Ooo I know! Lets make the characters just randomly trip!

I'd like to think they'd go back the way of techincal with Smash 4, but I'm not getting my hopes up again...

P:M deserves to be the next smash game, it deserves MLG tournaments, that's how good it is and how good these developers are. They actually made what I had hoped brawl was going to be the entire time.

Well, with Namco working on Smash 4 I'm cautiously optimistic. These are the guys who made Teken and Soul Calibur, they can make Smash more technical than ever if they so choose.

 

[shinhed-echi]

I really wish more people would open up to the idea of Project M.

Most of the community from where I live in brush it off as a "cheap mod that tries to be Melee". What do these noobs know anyway..?

But get this, it's JUST for the fact that it's a mod. *sigh*

But no matter... when I return, I'll get into the P:M online competitive scene and post at leats one gameplay video every week to see if I slowly start winning them over.


Right now, I'm excited. Can't wait to see how the full game will turn out, but just from what we have right now, I'm more than pleased. Can't wait for P.S. Samus to make her debut. Would love her missiles to regain the power from Melee, or at least turn them into Freeze Missiles from Fusion if they were to retain their Brawl power.

 

[TheTTimeLives]

I mean Sakurai ultimately runs the show for SSB4 but since he's letting teams balance test the game and because it's Namco and Tekken has advanced maneuvers like wavedashing (though it's not really the same thing as in Smash), it's really a toss up for me whether or not those things will return.

 

[Mithost]

I really wish more people would open up to the idea of Project M.

Most of the community from where I live in brush it off as a "cheap mod that tries to be Melee". What do these noobs know anyway..?

But get this, it's JUST for the fact that it's a mod. *sigh*

The problem with that logic is that it isn't TRYING to be melee, it already got to that point a while ago. It's becoming MORE than melee. It's Melee + Content + Graphics + Customization + Balance. It seems like the PMBR are as dedicated as the melee fanbase is to keep the melee spirit alive. Force your friends to play a few rounds as new and old characters on new and old stages. They will start to enjoy it no matter how stubborn they want to be.

Well, with Namco working on Smash 4 I'm cautiously optimistic. These are the guys who made Teken and Soul Calibur, they can make Smash more technical than ever if they so choose.

My mind exploded with glee when they announced namco was working on SSB4. Why, might you ask?

THIS GUY

Spoiler

Honestly he does have a pretty good chance of getting in. Symphonia was the best selling Tales game and it was sold on the Gamecube exclusively (until a PS2 version came out in japan, but that didn't stop snake or sonic). I would think namco would be reluctant to add one of their soul calibur/tekken characters to SSB4, but Lloyd would fit right in. They made a Tales of VS (platform fighter for tales series) game for the PSP last year and Namco is pushing hard to translate the most recent tales games to english for us.

I want him innn

 

[SunJester]

I bought Brawl when it came out, after not having played Melee in years (Granted I did play Melee for probably 2-3 years straight when it first came out). I enjoyed Brawl but something...something was missing from it, and I really couldn't place my finger on it. All we ended up doing was creating really stupidly "cave of life" stages in stage builder and just put items on max and just laugh. I always had fun playing Brawl but getting down and dirty in a 1v1 just seemed like a complete afterthought.

So I stopped playing it.

Then I see Project M being advertised on IGN, it looked pretty neato, but it was a hack and there's no way that anyone could put enough effort into it to actually finish it, or actually make it professional enough. Then when 2.1 was released I saw the Skyloft stage, and I was blown away. It looked incredibly professional. I lurked around on the boards and saw the complete dedication to making the very best game they could, I was sold. The next day I went out and grabbed an SD card from EB games and installed the mod.

All my friends and my brother's friends absolutely adore the game. I figured out what was missing, Brawl had been slow. I hadn't realized it because I wasn't into the Smash scene at the time, and I hadn't played Melee in years. Project M felt fast, and I felt in control; in short, it felt good. Every Smash game before this had been fairly unbalanced. On this game though we could pick any character and have a really good chance at winning with them. Even at our really "semi-casual" level (we can L cancel, that's about it) we still can feel how very balanced the game is. No character felt underpowered. Now with the inclusion of each character having a place in the game, not to mention some new stages that I adored (Skyloft and Dracula's Castle) I was a complete fan of this game, and I've been pushing it on any of my friends that like the Smash series.

Thank you Project M for reminding me why I absolutely love the Smash Bros series.

 

[GaretHax]

I first heard of PM back when I followed Brawl+. After taking a break for quite some time I stumbled upon the initial teaser and became pretty confident the PMBR of the time were up to something amazing. I've since read essentially every post, gotten giddy at every new prospect, and found my wildest expectations to pale in comparison to the PMBR's achievements. I remember watching the early videos of M2K vs Silentspectre or DSW when he was a playtester and daydreaming about the insane prospect of joining the Brawl and Melee communities. Some of my favorites were of early lucario builds. Anyway I have high hopes for PM and for the Smash series, and look forward to many years of Melee and hopefully, eventually, a smash scene dominated by PM. You guys are making something even better out of my favorite game (Melee). In my opinion this being a community project makes it stronger, better, and more special than an official release could ever be. You guys care more about the community, the game, and staying true to what makes Melee great than any developer ever could. Imo its no coincidence that you are also making something far more enjoyable, I don't have high hopes for Smash 4, but I have very high hopes for PM. Keep it up guys you rock.

Honestly my only fear is that PM may end up being more defensive than Melee, I pray that you all do not let this happen. Melee's metagame is moving more towards defense and while I feel this is temporary, (we tried a defensive game guys its the one being modded), I sincerely hope you guys can find a way to tip the scales just slightly more in favor of offensive play than in melee. Though I love PM to death and will play it regardless XD

 

[Supreme Dirt]

This part isn't even true though. Melee has literally been growing constantly since Brawl was released.

Average Brawl tourney attendance here... 20ish
Average Melee tourney attendance here... 40ish

No no he's clearly right Melee is dying and Brawl is going strong :D

 

[traffic.]

If it is anything, Brawl is a great introduction to the depth of Melee/PM for young/new players. I think if properly embraced, PM makes a really solid avenue to share the knowledge gained over the years by melee players and Brawl players who make the change will bring new and exciting janks. Updates and changes to the engine in PM provide a great new direction for the knock-around fighter to grow as a genre. The traditional 2d has explored a variety of techs and mechanics through different franchises, but Melee's depth hasn't had a chance to grow in the same way because it has had no core successor until now. I hope to see things streamline towards consolidating scenes into PM over the coming year, because while the original releases have their place, the exploration of new ideas and systems will always be where my passion for the growth of a video game lies.

Honestly my only fear is that PM may end up being more defensive than Melee, I pray that you all do not let this happen. Melee's metagame is moving more towards defense and while I feel this is temporary, (we tried a defensive game guys its the one being modded), I sincerely hope you guys can find a way to tip the scales just slightly more in favor of offensive play than in melee. Though I love PM to death and will play it regardless XD

I think the biggest thing this sentiment brings to mind is that you are encountering things you have never seen in Melee, and that defensive style is the intial hestitation new things invokes. All of the additions from Brawl creates a real void in the meta game because there is a lot of new cars on that lot that nobody's figured out how to drive yet. It's easy to pick up Falcon and play Melee Falcon or pillar people with Falco, but to break the habits of 10 years of melee to approach new playstyles is going to definitely cause a delay in meta-evolution.

 

[GaretHax]

I think the biggest thing this sentiment brings to mind is that you are encountering things you have never seen in Melee, and that defensive style is the intial hestitation new things invokes. All of the additions from Brawl creates a real void in the meta game because there is a lot of new cars on that lot that nobody's figured out how to drive yet. It's easy to pick up Falcon and play Melee Falcon or pillar people with Falco, but to break the habits of 10 years of melee to approach new playstyles is going to definitely cause a delay in meta-evolution.

Absolutely, but i wasn't saying PM is defensive. It is way too soon for things like that, though d3, ivy, and zelda certainly have the potential to be annoying lol. I was simply hoping PM doesn't become defensive, especially given the influx of defensive characters and players, but rather makes offensive play even more viable than it was in Melee.

 

[NightShadow6]

Been playing PM since demo 1.

Lets just keep this amazing thing going.