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The Sassy Princess of Sarasaland: Daisy Discussion

Dandelionel

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Why did they change Daisy's run animation from Peach's, but not her walking? How random.
I feel like their walking animation is perfect for both of them, plus most of the time people are either running or in the air so it's better to change her running animation
 

Meru.

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Actually Dark Samus seems to be only aesthetically different for the most part as well. Even her float-roll has the same amount of frames; it's just a different animation.

Also, is it just me or is Daisy's voice when she says "Aoww!" new?
In one of those introductory character tweet, Nintendo confirmed Dark Samus has slightly different physics. She is either floatier or less floaty, I dont remember exactly, but Im 100% sure her physics are different. She seemed to be quite different from Samus in general. Simon and Richter on the other hand only seem to have different animations, or at least that's what they told us.

Peach vs Daisy differences seem to subtle but there might be some. Probably not in their frame data, but maybe in their knockback strength or angles?
 

Luxent

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CONFIRMED: Peach's and Daisy's Fsmash are the same and both can be angled for Pan/Club/Racket


YOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

That's major!
 

StarCrystal20

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In one of those introductory character tweet, Nintendo confirmed Dark Samus has slightly different physics. She is either floatier or less floaty, I dont remember exactly, but Im 100% sure her physics are different. She seemed to be quite different from Samus in general. Simon and Richter on the other hand only seem to have different animations, or at least that's what they told us.

Peach vs Daisy differences seem to subtle but there might be some. Probably not in their frame data, but maybe in their knockback strength or angles?
Yeah. Perhaps not in frame data like I hoped. Oh well, at least she looks cool!

Also unrelated- I think the common voice pack someone made for Daisy in Smash 4 was way better. Lots of attacking voices like my favorite "WHOA!" This one in Ultimate pales in comparison.
 
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DaisyandRosalina

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Yeah. Perhaps not in frame data like I hoped. Oh well, at least she looks cool!

Also unrelated- I think the common voice pack someone made for Daisy in Smash 4 was way better. Lots of attacking voices like my favorite "WHOA!" This one in Ultimate pales in comparison.
Tbh I like Daisy's voice in Ultimate more, yes it's less loud but it fits better, hear her screaming during the whole match would be annoying.
 

Meru.

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SSBBDaisy

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Sorry, but have you played Brawl competitively? Peach is in a much better position in Smash4, where she's considered a solid high tier, than in Brawl where she was more around top of mid, MAYBE bottom of high. If Ultimate Peach/Daisy are as good as Peach is in Smash4 relative to the rest of the cast, which is a high tier character, we will have a good time.

Every character got their frame data nerfed from Brawl to Smash4. Similarly every character is getting their frame data buffed in Ultimate.
I played both games mainly brawl at a competitive level. SlayerZ, Samsora, Crow, and other Peaches had long agreed with me that peach was much better in brawl than smash 4. They took an insane amount of her options from brawl to smash 4 because the overall game got a slow down which in turn adjusted her position on "the tier list" but if you were to put brawl peach against smash 4 peach Brawl Peach would win everytime in the hands of a competent peach user.

You want facts:
Fair no longer auto canceled at a good frameand received a ton of lag.
LIFT got nerfed
Back air got a hitbox size reduction and active frame nerf
Jab received an end lag increase
Nair got a hitbox reduction and active frame nerf
Free pull removed
No glide tossing
Float cancel movement severly nerfed due to jump squat lag increase

Smash 4 buffs
Fair has kill power
Dash attack can kill
Float cancel fast fall (a nerfed version from brawl)
Dtilt footstool and turnip footstool

I can go on and on because I know both Peaches very well. She is my main so I took the time to learn all of that.

You want to argue with those facts. Learn them and test them for yourself and you will see Peach has an insane amount of opportunity in Brawl than she does in Smash 4. Constant nerf after nerf from Brawl to Smash 4. It was very sad. Hopefully it gets better in Ultimate which it looks like it kind of is. At least a foot in the right direction.
 
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Meru.

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I played both games mainly brawl at a competitive level. SlayerZ, Samsora, Crow, and other Peaches had long agreed with me that peach was much better in brawl than smash 4. They took an insane amount of her options from brawl to smash 4 because the overall game got a slow down which in turn adjusted her position on "the tier list" but if you were to put brawl peach against smash 4 peach Brawl Peach would win everytime in the hands of a competent peach user.

You want facts:
Fair no longer auto canceled at a good frameand received a ton of lag.
LIFT got nerfed
Back air got a hitbox size reduction and active frame nerf
Jab received an end lag increase
Nair got a hitbox reduction and active frame nerf
Free pull removed
No glide tossing
Float cancel movement severly nerfed due to jump squat lag increase

Smash 4 buffs
Fair has kill power
Dash attack can kill
Float cancel fast fall (a nerfed version from brawl)
Dtilt footstool and turnip footstool

I can go on and on because I know both Peaches very well. She is my main so I took the time to learn all of that.

You want to argue with those facts. Learn them and test them for yourself and you will see Peach has an insane amount of opportunity in Brawl than she does in Smash 4. Constant nerf after nerf from Brawl to Smash 4. It was very sad. Hopefully it gets better in Ultimate which it looks like it kind of is. At least a foot in the right direction.
I dont think you understand my post at all. I'm not even disagreeing they took away many of her tools (which is what you called "nerfed") and I'm not disagreeing that if you put Brawl Peach against Smash4 Peach Brawl will win almost always. But there's one basic concept, which was what my post was about, that you seem to ignore all the time:

A character's strength is based on their strength compared to other characters in the same game (NOT compared to the previous version if a character).

Since you seem to like giving lists of facts, here you have a relevant one:
- It makes no sense to determine whether they nerfed or buffed Peach by comparing SSB4 Peach to Brawl Peach in a vacuum.
- Sure, they gave SSB4 a lot of "nerfs" but EVERY character a loooot of nerfs and what happens if everyone gets nerfed harder than Peach? She will come out stronger than the rest and because her matchups against the rest are better (she isnt better "because the game slowed down", I have no idea what that even means)
- In fact, at least 95% of the Brawl character will destroy their Smash4 counterpart. Even Smash4 Mario, who's top tier, will likely be destroyed by Brawl Mario if you put Brawl Mario is Smash4. That doesn't mean they "nerfed" Mario.
- Also, this means that even if Peach seems "buffed" in Ultimate right now, she could still be worse in Ultimate if all characters are buffed more. Currently, all characters seem to have gotten many buffs. Even characters that were already powerful such as Pikachu and Ryu. Peach is looking fine based on the limited info we have but it's still too early to celebrate.
(- Also, her jumpsquat never got increased. They only changed the minimun float height, but that had no consequences to the start-up of her ground float aerials.)

Either way based on the changes you have listed you mostly seem to miss how flexible Brawl Peach was compared to SSB4 Peach due to landing lag increases, so if that's the case, then Ultimate Paisy (and Ultimate in general) will be more for you. Ending lag has been decreased across the board and the game has been sped up from SSB4.
 

ε Epsilon ε

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All of Daisy's colors confirmed! Default orage, crimson red, deep green, light blue (NES Open reference?), pastel purple (Mario Tennis reference or lol Waluigi), pastel pink, white and blackyellow! No OG Daisy colors sadly, but they all look beautiful! Peach's Daisy costume is replaced with a wholly gold flashy alt!

Her second victory pose (we saw the first one on her trailer) is stretching then holding out an L-sign.
 

SSBBDaisy

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I understood. Peach got the nerfs she did because the game got a nerf. That is why i refferred to Smash 4 as Trash 4. Im so glad you understand that because so many people dont and think Smash 4 is an improvement from Brawl. All that potential was taken out of Brawl. Anyways you are right too that I cant wait for Daisy
 

Almand

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I kinda wish they would've given Daisy an alt with her tan, a Peach alt, Rosa alt, Pauline alt, etc., but I suppose those were longshots anyway. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Just thought they would've been fun, but what we got isn't half-bad! Here's the alts, all credit goes to the WeAreAllDaisy Tumblr:



I personally LOVE the red and pink alts. They're all pastel and colorful, and I honestly like all of them! Notice, too, that the jewel on her crown/chest also changes color! Not even Peach's jewels do that, which you can see here, also credited to WeAreAllDaisy:



The exact color are a bit hard to see, but I believe the default, blue, and white colors have green jewels, green and pink have purple jewels, red and black have orange-brown jewels, and purple might have red jewels (?).
 

flapjackwars

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lots of good footage at the spanish invitational, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Pg8Sqw2XOY , this dude Hikotsu was playing Daisy really well, and the quality is a lot better. Double jump looks different, turnips move faster than i'm used to, I was worried float lasted less but you can see her float for at least 2 seconds during rob's final smash, dair looks to link into nair or second jump fair depending on percent, and she seems really speedy and fluid overall. i'm excited to play her
 
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ffdgh

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lots of good footage at the spanish invitational, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Pg8Sqw2XOY , this dude Hikotsu was playing Daisy really well, and the quality is a lot better. Double jump looks different, turnips move faster than i'm used to, I was worried float lasted less but you can see her float for at least 2 seconds during rob's final smash, dair looks to link into nair or second jump fair depending on percent, and she seems really speedy and fluid overall. i'm excited to play her
Nice. Peach and Daisy are going to be great. Also time stamps for all 7 matches.

1:36
5:12
33:12
37:48
1:55:35
1:59:33
2:02:50
 

Nabbitnator

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I like how Peach and Daisy can farm with turnips a bit better and throw further.
 

DaisyandRosalina

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lots of good footage at the spanish invitational, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Pg8Sqw2XOY , this dude Hikotsu was playing Daisy really well, and the quality is a lot better. Double jump looks different, turnips move faster than i'm used to, I was worried float lasted less but you can see her float for at least 2 seconds during rob's final smash, dair looks to link into nair or second jump fair depending on percent, and she seems really speedy and fluid overall. i'm excited to play her
Oh my god they did amazing!
Also with this video we can analize Daisy's moveset by ourselfs.
 
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~ Valkyrie ~

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Watching that stream... gaah! I can't believe I'm actually finding her implementation less intrusive as is. She's just so adorable and spunky in action!



I can bit live with her being in the game for now, but I sure hope they let her grow on her own over time. Nevertheless, has any people yet discovered any significant differences between Daisy and Peach?
 
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StarCrystal20

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 27, 2014
Messages
506
In-game the alts actually look really pretty. Loving the green, red, white, and black.

Her 3 winposes are amazing, but I dislike the voice samples used for them :(
No "I'm the best", "Yahoooo I did it", or "I'm the winner!" just woohoo.

Just a small nitpick
 

DaisyandRosalina

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In-game the alts actually look really pretty. Loving the green, red, white, and black.

Her 3 winposes are amazing, but I dislike the voice samples used for them :(
No "I'm the best", "Yahoooo I did it", or "I'm the winner!" just woohoo.

Just a small nitpick
What's the third win pose? I only remember the e3 one and the stretching one.
 

Dandelionel

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In-game the alts actually look really pretty. Loving the green, red, white, and black.

Her 3 winposes are amazing, but I dislike the voice samples used for them :(
No "I'm the best", "Yahoooo I did it", or "I'm the winner!" just woohoo.

Just a small nitpick
At least when she is sent out of the screen flying she shouts her iconic "NOOOOOO!" so it could be worse.

Also two things that I noticed from the Spanish Tournament
1: Both winners in the doubles and individual tournaments played as Daisy only. And she looks pretty strong. So yay.
2 and most importantly: Daisy was in like a third of the matches or more. Peach had 0 appearences. One could argue that it's simply because they like Daisy more (good taste) but maybe they know something about them that we don't.
 

ε Epsilon ε

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In-game the alts actually look really pretty. Loving the green, red, white, and black.

Her 3 winposes are amazing, but I dislike the voice samples used for them :(
No "I'm the best", "Yahoooo I did it", or "I'm the winner!" just woohoo.

Just a small nitpick
I can't find her victory poses anywhere, I've been waiting for someone to post them since she's playable in the demo, but nothing...

Got a link? :)
 
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z00ted

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I'm Illmatic (name changed to z00ted going into Ultimate), not going to go into too much detail or pan out frame data and I firmly believe Peach is far worse in Smash 4 due to a lot of the reasons SSBBDaisy listed, but mainly just due to removal of tech and lack of mobility / movement options. In Brawl, she felt to be designed for oppressive and aggressive play - constant shield stabbing and quick aerial rushdowns. In Smash 4 she's kind of just meant to be tanky and defensive, hitting like a truck when she eventually gets some type of momentum going. I mean tier list placement is subjective and definitely only relevant to the game the character resides in, the most oppressive meta defining characters, etc.. but I do feel with Metaknight out of the picture, Peach was better than Smash 4. I hope she's good in Ultimate. I just want to be able to move properly and glide toss how I used to.

Naturally, I had close ties to all top level Peach players from Brawl (Leon, Nicole, SlayerZ, lloD) and I don't think any one of them enjoyed her Smash 4 iteration. We all kinda just fell off from the game itself or chose another character. Peach is the hidden sleeper technical monster of a character. It looks like a lot of the landing lag reductions and turnip pull buff on speed will help her a ton. Very happy to read what's going on with fair and her Peach bomber. Hopefully they don't water her down any more than they already have.
 

Nabbitnator

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Meru.

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I'm Illmatic (name changed to z00ted going into Ultimate), not going to go into too much detail or pan out frame data and I firmly believe Peach is far worse in Smash 4 due to a lot of the reasons SSBBDaisy listed, but mainly just due to removal of tech and lack of mobility / movement options. In Brawl, she felt to be designed for oppressive and aggressive play - constant shield stabbing and quick aerial rushdowns. In Smash 4 she's kind of just meant to be tanky and defensive, hitting like a truck when she eventually gets some type of momentum going. I mean tier list placement is subjective and definitely only relevant to the game the character resides in, the most oppressive meta defining characters, etc.. but I do feel with Metaknight out of the picture, Peach was better than Smash 4. I hope she's good in Ultimate. I just want to be able to move properly and glide toss how I used to.

Naturally, I had close ties to all top level Peach players from Brawl (Leon, Nicole, SlayerZ, lloD) and I don't think any one of them enjoyed her Smash 4 iteration. We all kinda just fell off from the game itself or chose another character. Peach is the hidden sleeper technical monster of a character. It looks like a lot of the landing lag reductions and turnip pull buff on speed will help her a ton. Very happy to read what's going on with fair and her Peach bomber. Hopefully they don't water her down any more than they already have.
Yes, I still remember. You were the green Peach from Texas. We were quite active on Smashboards at the same time (my tag was Yaaay back then, I dont believe you'll remember though).

With Brawl MK I believe Smash4 Peach is DEFINITELY better, without Brawl MK I still believe Smash4 is still better than Brawl Peach, although slightly. Smash4 Peach was difficult but she was a VERY solid character and she has good tournament results to support it. Popular opinion about Brawl Peach was a high mid char (some might say low), on Smash4 Peach almost all agree on high tier. She's considered a top 15, sometimes top 20 character (but closer to 15 than 20).

That said most Brawl Peaches disliked Smash4Peach because of how sluggish she felt. Current Peach and Daisy seem to mix the best of both worlds of Brawl and Smash4: she's much more flexible thanks to landing lag reductions (Nair is a low as 6 frames and Fair only 12, see the other thread for details) while still keeping her powerful kill moves such as Fair and Dash Attack, so I'm sure Brawl Peaches will like this version better. There's some footage of Daisy in the other thread where you can see some of her changes.
 

StarCrystal20

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I can't find her victory poses anywhere, I've been waiting for someone to post them since she's playable in the demo, but nothing...

Got a link? :)
Here it is. Sorry for the late reply!


Team battle with Daisy in her red dress. I think she looks really awesome and gothic in it.
 
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z00ted

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I do remember you, Yaaay! :)
And fair enough. I'm sure Smash 4 Peach did things lol. I just didn't wanna be bothered with it :p

Here's to hoping it's even better in this game.
 

Sean Wheeler

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So Daisy's running animation was changed to match Super Mario Party? Yes! She doesn't have to hold her dress anymore, so there's no problem getting her sports alt in, right? Oh... We got all the costumes. And Daisy just has different colored dresses. Oh well, I shouldn't be liking girls just for their clothes because that is creepy. But I think I'll still use Daisy as my main.
 

Musha4DaWin

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All three of the tools used in the f-smashes appear to be back! Peach and Daisy have both been previously seen with the golf club and the tennis racket, but now I've FINALLY seen the pan. See for yourselves!
1541387917056.png
1541387971627.png
 
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Luxent

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All three of the tools used in the f-smashes appear to be back! Peach and Daisy have both been previously seen with the golf club and the tennis racket, but now I've FINALLY seen the pan. See for yourselves!View attachment 175791
You may be a tiiiny bit late, but Spanish players also confirmed being able to choose which of the three side smashes you want by tilting the C-stick!
Side-Up is Frying pan.
Side is golf club
Side-down is tennis racket. :)
 

Dandelionel

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How hard is it to figure out if she has a "Hi I'm Daisy" taunt? It shouldn't be this hard.
Hikkotsu, the Spanish pro player that played her in the doubles tournament said that she doesn't have it. According to reddit at least.
 
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