Important The Ridley for SSB4 Thread - End of an Era

[PsychoIncarnate]

Ivysaur was seriously in your top 5 characters?

How many people even like the middle evolution more than the first or last?

 

[HylianHeroBigBoss]

I'm gonna guess it would be the Super Metroid/Brawl design. Ridley's Other M model would be very hard to fit in since it follows Other M's vastly different style. On top of that the game suffered from subpar sales and harsh criticism. Plus, the SM design is his most iconic and recognizable one, which is why they chose it in Brawl. Same goes for Samus, given that she never has the Varia Suit and big shoulders at the same time in ZM.

I dont see how other m's ridley design would be hard to fit it, they managed to mesh different styles in every smash bros game. I also doubt other m's critisim will keep it from being represented, sakurai and nintendo wouldnt ignore it for that, i mean we got DK barrel blast trophies last time for gods sake. Samus' design from brawl is lifted directly from zero mission, not super metroid.

 

[Neanderthal]

Ivysaur was seriously in your top 5 characters?

How many people even like the middle evolution more than the first or last?

I do....
Being on all fours give her a unique feel. It's just a shame her moveset is so incredibly terrible. Hopefully she's overpowered in Smash 4.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Ivysaur was seriously in your top 5 characters?

How many people even like the middle evolution more than the first or last?

It was actually just for any evolution of the Bulbasaur line, didn't really care what one of them it would be. Ivysaur is probably the best of the lot anyways, since I doubt Venusaur would look anything but silly when jumping, and Bulbasaur was too little.

I dont see how other m's ridley design would be hard to fit it, they managed to mesh different styles in every smash bros game. I also doubt other m's critisim will keep it from being represented, sakurai and nintendo wouldnt ignore it for that, i mean we got DK barrel blast trophies last time for gods sake. Samus' design from brawl is lifted directly from zero mission, not super metroid.

Other M's model has a bunch of small details and follow a graphical style that'd make it harder to fit in than just taking the Brawl model and editing it. It wouldn't be impossible if they're hell bent on using that model, but it'd take more time and get a worse reception than using the Brawl model. And Varia Suit Samus in Zero Mission doesn't have the big shoulders, she has the flat shoulders in that game, meaning that the design was lifted from Super Metroid, as was everything else Metroid-related in SSBB. I believe it was at Gamescon 07 or maybe E for All where a representive literally said that she was based off of Super Metroid, can't find the link right now though since I'm at work.

 

[HylianHeroBigBoss]

Other M's model has a bunch of small details and follow a graphical style that'd make it harder to fit in than just taking the Brawl model and editing it. It wouldn't be impossible if they're hell bent on using that model, but it'd take more time and get a worse reception than using the Brawl model. And Varia Suit Samus in Zero Mission doesn't have the big shoulders, she has the flat shoulders in that game, meaning that the design was lifted from Super Metroid, as was everything else Metroid-related in SSBB. I believe it was at Gamescon 07 or maybe E for All where a representive literally said that she was based off of Super Metroid, can't find the link right now though since I'm at work.

I dont think they plan on just taking brawls models and retrofitting them, every character has a finite amount of detail that will have to be done, and besides other m's ridley easily has the most muscular frame which might work better than his super thin other variants.

She had flat shoulders in zero mission when using her power suit, when it switched to varia and gravity it had the shoulders. You can tell the difference between the super metroid and zero mission designs based on the panel lining and lights of the suit, they definitely used the zero mission one, it makes sense since they were going with the version that brought us zero suit samus anyway.

 

[Starcutter]

How many people even like the middle evolution more than the first or last?

honestly, they are usually better, imo.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

I dont think they plan on just taking brawls models and retrofitting them, every character has a finite amount of detail that will have to be done, and besides other m's ridley easily has the most muscular frame which might work better than his super thin other variants.

She had flat shoulders in zero mission when using her power suit, when it switched to varia and gravity it had the shoulders. You can tell the difference between the super metroid and zero mission designs based on the panel lining and lights of the suit, they definitely used the zero mission one, it makes sense since they were going with the version that brought us zero suit samus anyway.

This is the Varia Suit, taken from the cutscene when she escapes from Zebes after Mother Brain's defeat. She also have the small flat shoulders in-game with the Varia Suit. It is but a more orange shade of her Power Suit in that game. Zero Mission and Fusion remain the only games where she doesn't get the big shoulders when acquiring the Varia Suit.

However, in Super Metroid she does lack the "eyes" on the chest piece of the suit that she has in Zero Mission on her Gravity Suit, and also the lights on her legs, so in reality Samus doesn't really appear in any of her games like she does in Brawl, closest would be Metroid Prime, but given that her Varia Suit from Prime has its own trophy it's most likely not based off of that. So it's more like her usual Super Metroid color scheme attached to the Zero Mission kind of model.

And the muscular form of the Other M Ridley model is exactly what might make it harder to animate and fit. The thin model has much more room to move in, where as when scaled down the Other M model would either need to be airborne or be in a very spread position before he would look right. The thin version of him would have a lot more freedom in that regard. Ridley's head in Other M is also smaller than in any of his other appearances, so they'd have to scale his proportions pretty heavily to make him fit, which is something they rarely do with characters. Using the Brawl model as a place to work from would be much more efficient and much easier than having to go through everything with the Other M model. Yes, it'd still need a change in proportions too, but it isn't as hard to do as it would be with the Other M model, again, because of the muscles. So unless Sakurai is hell bent on getting a model that's sure to get a lukewarm response then I don't see it happening

Yes, every character model is touched upon, some are mostly just texture edits, like with Mario and Sonic, others require a little more to fit in, like Bowser, but they still use the models from either previous Smash Bros games, or other games from the respective franchises, like how they used the Twilight Princess models for the LoZ characters. Some models are created from scratch, like Pit, but I think it's evident that if they can use a model from another game, they're going to do it.

Taking the Brawl models and updating them certainly isn't out of question, they did use some of the Melee models as a basis for the Brawl models, which can be seen with C. Falcon, Samus and Peach. I'd be surprised if they didn't do that with any of the characters this time around.

I think Other M will be represented with stages, music and trophies, exactly like Prime in Brawl. I find it hard to believe that it'll be represented on the characters too though. One of the reasons I think Prime probably wasn't represented so much was its subpar sales and reception in Japan, Other M is exactly in the same boat, except that it didn't even sell well or get good criticism outside of Japan either.

 

[Dark Phazon]

Did someone say 2nd Metroid rep? I would be beyond the moon if that ever happened!!!

Well Dark Phazon says it should be none other then pure CorrUptiOn itself.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Actually, putting Dark Samus in there along with Ridley could prove for an interesting storyline in Smash. I know Ridley and Samus absolutely hate each other, but Ganondorf sided with Link in Brawl at the end. Dark Samus could be a behind the scenes villain, and Ridley could be an anti-hero until the end, and side with the heroes to take Dark Samus down.

I seriously think there would be some great intros for other characters, but this is the Ridley thread, so I won't talk about those here.

 

[FalKoopa]

Dark Samus' colour scheme kinda reminds me of Tabuu.

 

[Dark Phazon]

Dark Samus could be way different and unique compared to Samus very easily. But i do agree that DS is not needed to complete the metroid series in representation.

 

[HylianHeroBigBoss]

This is the Varia Suit, taken from the cutscene when she escapes from Zebes after Mother Brain's defeat. She also have the small flat shoulders in-game with the Varia Suit. It is but a more orange shade of her Power Suit in that game. Zero Mission and Fusion remain the only games where she doesn't get the big shoulders when acquiring the Varia Suit.

However, in Super Metroid she does lack the "eyes" on the chest piece of the suit that she has in Zero Mission on her Gravity Suit, and also the lights on her legs, so in reality Samus doesn't really appear in any of her games like she does in Brawl, closest would be Metroid Prime, but given that her Varia Suit from Prime has its own trophy it's most likely not based off of that. So it's more like her usual Super Metroid color scheme attached to the Zero Mission kind of model.

And the muscular form of the Other M Ridley model is exactly what might make it harder to animate and fit. The thin model has much more room to move in, where as when scaled down the Other M model would either need to be airborne or be in a very spread position before he would look right. The thin version of him would have a lot more freedom in that regard. Ridley's head in Other M is also smaller than in any of his other appearances, so they'd have to scale his proportions pretty heavily to make him fit, which is something they rarely do with characters. Using the Brawl model as a place to work from would be much more efficient and much easier than having to go through everything with the Other M model. Yes, it'd still need a change in proportions too, but it isn't as hard to do as it would be with the Other M model, again, because of the muscles. So unless Sakurai is hell bent on getting a model that's sure to get a lukewarm response then I don't see it happening

Then it must have just been the gravity suit, because two pieces of art (incuding the one i posted earlier) for that games ending has it exactly as it is in brawl only with the varia suit colors. The design exists, it just didnt show up in cutscenes i guess.

I guess the skeleton like proportions of brawls ridley might work better when dealing with character model and joints on it, but i still think a more robust frame might be better for him. I dont think scaling him will be any problem either, the only issue could possibly be his tail which is far longer than the other versions. But either way it remains to be seen until we get a glimpse of him i suppose, and as i said before i doubt sakurai is going to base designs or what is represented based on a games reception.

Yes, every character model is touched upon, some are mostly just texture edits, like with Mario and Sonic, others require a little more to fit in, like Bowser, but they still use the models from either previous Smash Bros games, or other games from the respective franchises, like how they used the Twilight Princess models for the LoZ characters. Some models are created from scratch, like Pit, but I think it's evident that if they can use a model from another game, they're going to do it.

Taking the Brawl models and updating them certainly isn't out of question, they did use some of the Melee models as a basis for the Brawl models, which can be seen with C. Falcon, Samus and Peach. I'd be surprised if they didn't do that with any of the characters this time around.

I think Other M will be represented with stages, music and trophies, exactly like Prime in Brawl. I find it hard to believe that it'll be represented on the characters too though. One of the reasons I think Prime probably wasn't represented so much was its subpar sales and reception in Japan, Other M is exactly in the same boat, except that it didn't even sell well or get good criticism outside of Japan either.

Pretty sure other than trophies none of brawls playable character models were taken from other games (possibly melee though like you said), for the most part they were all made from scratch and based on existing designs or new ones made for the game that used in the new havok engine. The main reason is that lets say link from TP got brought over, but his character model is not made with brawl in mind, and has not been rigged for it to do anything he needs to and it would probably not even be suitable for what they need, so they had to create new ones for the zelda characters. It would be far easier to create their own, and thus thats what they did for everyone of them, new animations, etc and id say the same thing will probably happen again. But i wont rule out that they could use brawl assets as a base since from what we know it is the starting point.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

honestly, they are usually better, imo.

Better at what?

 

[Johnknight1]

You guys still talking about Ridley's appearance=???

Because the Melee/Braw/Super Metroid design with original Metroid color scheme should totally be how Ridley appears in Smash (as a default appearance).

He can have a red, orange, yellow, green, blue, silver, and gold alternate colors, and perhaps even an armor look to where's kinda sorta Meta Ridley. That is unless Meta Ridley is a boss, Assist Trophy character, or Ridley's Final Smash transformation.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

I'm not sure if I linked it in this thread but http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lxVkSaVgm1A I'm kind-of okay with this.

 

[Dark Phazon]

Sorry..we should have taken our Ridley talk to the Ridley thread...xD

(but its too BIG..and has 70+ pages/more than any other
Char thread xD)

 

[Johnknight1]

Sorry..we should have taken our Ridley talk to the Ridley thread...xD

(but its too BIG..and has 70+ pages/more than any other
Char thread xD)

I meant to say "Ridley appearance," but alas, Ridley discussions never get boring, especially since we can troll the hell out of the ignorant unpurged masses!!!

 

[Dark Phazon]

I meant to say "Ridley appearance," but alas, Ridley discussions never get boring, especially since we can troll the hell out of the ignorant unpurged masses!!!

Im secretly one of them xD

 

[Ultinarok]

Yeah right, you think sakurai is gonna lay two big guns down in the beginning, I dont think so.

If by BIG guns you mean....

TOO BIG for Smash 4.

 

[Starcutter]

Better at what?

at being my favorite out of their evolution chain. For example: Quilava, Bayleef, Grovyle, and Dewott are just a lot cooler then the other pokemon in their chain imo. (Quilava is debatable and for Dewott I might be biased because I like otters.)

If by BIG guns you mean....

TOO BIG for Smash 4.

I wish for a dislike button more than anything right now.

 

[Oasis_S]

Excuse me, but Charmeleon is probably the best starter ever.

 

[Curious Villager]

Ridley is too big.

Spoiler

...Of an iconic awesome dragon to not be in smash 4. Make it happen Sakurai!

 

[Starcutter]

Excuse me, but Charmeleon is probably the best starter ever.

I specifically left him and warturtle out because of all the charizard and squirtle/blastoise fans, but yeah. he's pretty cool.

 

[AnOkayDM]

Everything about Ridley's Other M design was atrocious.

Everything.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Excuse me, but Charmeleon is probably the best starter ever.

That's a funny way of spelling wartortle

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Everything about Ridley's Other M design was atrocious.

Everything.

Really? I like it.

Though for Smash I'd either want Red Ridley or Purple. Meta would be a nice costume.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Everything about Ridley's Other M design was atrocious.

Everything.

Well I for one appreciated that they got rid of his weird pencil neck. But in general I prefer his classic Super Metroid design.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Everything about Ridley's Other M design was atrocious.

Everything.

I like how he still looked managed to look badass when he was flying around in a room full of lava, but that's just generally Ridley, and not anything to do with the specific design. The choice to make his upper jaw smaller than his lower jaw is mind boggling, and his arms were too damn huge, not to mention that the pointy end of his tail was made into a razor blade instead of his regular tail. The design in itself looks very bad, it screws with his proportions, and it certainly pales in comparison to just about any of his other designs, maybe tieing with the weird vacuum-face design in the original Metroid manual.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

I didn't like how his OM design made him look more like a pterodactyl that a dragon. Or how beefy it made him look. I like my anaemic Ridley thank you very much.

Would really appreciate it if they got rid of that pencil/hinge neck of his though....

 

[Oasis_S]

Ridley's neck is beautiful what is wrong with you.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Ridley's neck is beautiful what is wrong with you.

I guess I'm just not Strong enough to see it's beauty....

 

[AnOkayDM]

Really? I like it.


Though for Smash I'd either want Red Ridley or Purple. Meta would be a nice costume.

What about it, may I ask? I think it looks awful. It barely looks like Ridley. >_<

Agreed that Meta should be a costume.

 

[IsmaR]

If anything, I think Other M Ridley looks closer to his original concept and artwork in the manga/games, maybe better even in terms of wingspan, specific things like his tail being visibly bone, and proportions. It's just the way the boss battle sizes him up and makes him look more bipedal than he is usually depicted as being (big hulking arms/torso, as seen in this and this. Yet not as much when he's crouched/in his "traditional" 2D Metroid flying position, like in this.). The only real things that bother me are, as Oasis pointed out earlier, his feet having 3 toes in place of 2 (which it has always been), and his lower jaw/lip being longer than his top one, and the way they curve outward rather than inward towards his teeth. Reminds me of this >

enemy from Kirby 64.

Either way, I'd prefer we see this in any way, shape or forme (prefer his Melee rendition, myself) rather than nothing. (or worse, just a boss again)

 

[MasterOfKnees]

If anything, I think Other M Ridley looks closer to his original concept and artwork in the manga/games,

The Zero Mission design fits the bill better for those 2 images than the Other M design does, because of the hunchback, the visible ribcage, the always awesome spaghetti neck, and of course there's the upper jaw which is the big giveaway. One of those links are in fact from the original Zero Mission website, so it makes sense.

I think it'd be sad if the Other M design got in over the Super Metroid, Zero Mission or even the Meta Ridley design, but Ridley is of course Ridley, and despite Other M being my least favorite design (maybe tied with Neo-Ridley,) it'd still be awesome.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

At this point I'm partly looking forward to a possible Ridley confirmation in a week just so I may not have to see as much of the usual Other M talk anymore. Sad that some seem to still only post here to express how much they hate things from one lousy game and not so much as to show support for the space pirate commander.

edit- @ Wariofan: Some would rather not have Ridley in the game at all than for them to use his Other M design.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

At this point I'm partly looking forward to a possible Ridley confirmation in a week just so I may not have to see as much of the usual Other M talk anymore. Sad that some still post here only to express how much they hate one lousy game and not so much as to show support for the space pirate commander.

edit- @ Wariofan: Some would rather not have Ridley in the game at all than for them to use his Other M design.

While I do dislike the Other M design, Ridley is still Ridley, and he's still my favorite video game character. Yes, he looks pretty silly compared to his other designs, but I'd much rather have the Other M design than nothing, because the worst case scenario is in fact Ridley not making it into SSB4. It is for pete's sake still a giant purple space dragon, he still looks cool, he still has the same moveset potential, so while I'd probably cringe a bit if his Other M design gets in, the joy of Ridley being playable in Smash Bros will no doubt still make me scream like a little girl. So while I obviously would prefer the Super Metroid design to get in, it really doesn't matter in the long run, it's just that the SM design would be the best case scenario.

I don't think we're literally talking about Other M, we're just discussing his most recent design which has a chance of being the design he is depicted with in Smash Bros. It's a good way to spend time, sure wouldn't help my hype if we went "holy **** I'm excited" for a week, my brain would probably melt from the immense hype. I'm already trying hard enough to contain myself as it is.

 

[ChozoBoy]

Given that MOM Ridley is a clone, I suspect the actual character Ridley has been undergoing body manipulation for combative purposes long before Metroid Prime. Either that, or he changes even further naturally as he ages. (Our Ridley has a beard and is somewhat emaciated and weathered.) He could be pretty old, having been in his iconic state while Samus was a child.

 

[AnOkayDM]

Of course I'd rather have his Other M design than nothing. I'd just rather have his Super Metroid design, or his Prime design, or his Brawl design...my favorite would be his Melee design though! Metroid larva and all.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

Same here, and my last comment wasn't directed so much here, but more-so other places.

@ ChozoBoy: That's pretty much what I was thinking too, or what we saw with Other M Ridley could've been some of the "genetic flaws" Gray Voice or someone was referring to here.

http://metroid.retropixel.net/comics/metroidmanga/chapter9/metroid_v2_ch9_04.jpg

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Trying to play through as many Metroid games featuring Ridley as I can before E3, let's just say I believe in lucky charms.

I completed both Metroid Fusion and Zero Mission in one sitting today. Finished Fusion at the time of 1:58, which isn't too shabby since it isn't one of the games I've completed that many times. Completed Zero Mission at the time of 1:13, which is pretty slow considering I normally complete it in under an hour, even without using shortcuts, but I wanted to enjoy the ride more this time instead of just rushing through it, which I ironically still ended up doing.

Super Metroid (aka the best game ever) is next, after that I'll probably try and play through the original Metroid just for the heck of it. Don't think I'll go through any of the Prime games considering how long they are, so I'll probably just finish the last two 2D sidescrollers, and then play some Brawl until the reveal.

The hype is through the roof.