Important The Ridley for SSB4 Thread - End of an Era

[Reila]

UltimateWario probably watched the video tape later on.

Fixed.

 

[Sehnsucht]

Great, now I have to change my pants.

When I hang out in this thread, I usually do so sitting naked on a bucket. It's less inconvenient that way.

 

[Arcanir]

We were just fantasying a threesome with Ridley, Bowser and Ganondorf earlier today.

No King K. Rool?

I'm quite disappointed.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Does anybody else think Mother Brain may have been the "enemy from Samus's past"??? Just a thought.

Also, another thought:

So you know how a lot of Ridley detractors complain that the Idea of changing Ridley's size would change the fact that he is intimidating? You know, so he can't be only a little bit taller than Samus? Take a look at this picture from Melee:

Peach is roughly the same height as Bowser. When has she EVER been that close to his height? Well, it wasn't Mario 64, nor any NSMB game, nor Galaxy 1 or 2, nor Mario Party, nor Mario Kart, nor Mario Golf...really none of that crap. Doesn't that look weird to a Mario fan? Being a lifelong fan, I'd have to say that when you compare that to Bowser's actual appearances, that no, that doesn't really match size wise. He still looks good.

Another point here too. Let's take a look at Angelglory's latest pic:

Here, we have the Other M Ridley, who is arguably more likely at this point assuming Sakurai continues with the Other M content.

Here is Smash 4 Bowser:

What we're looking at, is basically, a Bowser with a neck and wings. His build really isn't awkward anymore. It's just a skinnier, neckless, winged Bowser. That's all there is to it.

 

[Dark Phazon]

Think about this everyday...how it would be like...how it would play out..

Over
N
Over
N
Over......
Serious....not even Mewtwo has me going like Ridley does..just the thought...

 

[Luigi#1]

That's enough internet for 1 day...I'm having too big of an erection.

 

[False Sense]

Does anybody else think Mother Brain may have been the "enemy from Samus's past"??? Just a thought.

Also, another thought:

So you know how a lot of Ridley detractors complain that the Idea of changing Ridley's size would change the fact that he is intimidating? You know, so he can't be only a little bit taller than Samus? Take a look at this picture from Melee:

Peach is roughly the same height as Bowser. When has she EVER been that close to his height? Well, it wasn't Mario 64, nor any NSMB game, nor Galaxy 1 or 2, nor Mario Party, nor Mario Kart, nor Mario Golf...really none of that crap. Doesn't that look weird to a Mario fan? Being a lifelong fan, I'd have to say that when you compare that to Bowser's actual appearances, that no, that doesn't really match size wise. He still looks good.

Another point here too. Let's take a look at Angelglory's latest pic:

View attachment 8259

Here, we have the Other M Ridley, who is arguably more likely at this point assuming Sakurai continues with the Other M content.

Here is Smash 4 Bowser:

What we're looking at, is basically, a Bowser with a neck and wings. His build really isn't awkward anymore. It's just a skinnier, neckless, winged Bowser. That's all there is to it.

It might also be worth mentioning the complete lack of proper scaling in that Fourside level. I mean, Dr. Mario is the size of a door...

Also, this thread is starting to get creepy.

 

[Reila]

No King K. Rool?

I'm quite disappointed.

Rool was too busy making out with Mewtwo

 

[Empyrean]

Hey, I've only been here for like...50 of these pages. Maybe.

It's not my fault I get left out of all the cool conversations.

If you call yourself an avid Ridley supporter, it's your responsibility to go through all 383 pages of this thread. I did so before making an account here. If not, then I have no idea what you are still doing here. The hole is behind you, so do like Other M Ridley and please leave.

Spoiler

 

[Sehnsucht]

Rool was too busy making out with Mewtwo

We need a Villains Gone Wild VHS series, stat.

 

[Anomilus]

Okaay! I had some unexpected catching up to do in this topic. Quite the unexpected leap in posts!

Now my opinion...

Echoes >= Prime 1 > Prime 3!

Echoes had just about everything I like about Metroid (except Ridley... =/). Bosses? Way more than Prime 1, tougher, smarter, just all around great (and Quadraxis... if it had personality and a more dominant role in the series, I would like it as much as I do Ridley!). People love to claim Prime 1 was pretty much Super Metroid in 3D, but I personally give that honor to Echoes. I feel Prime 1 is more like Metroid 1 in 3D (but obviously better designed). I feel it's the level design that really attributes to this, and Echoes far better captures that maze-like cohesive quality world design that Super Metroid pioneered so long ago. Prime 1 was great, but two playthroughs later and you can navigate its world no problem. And it's not because of great game design. I mean it's great design, but it's also pretty easily memorized without trying. Not that getting lost is key to a great Metroid game, but...

Put it this way: With Prime 1 you can pretty much understand an entire room after the first or second time you've crossed through it. Occasionally you'll miss a detail here or there, but that's usually related to finding pick-ups. With Prime 2, you could think you have a room figured out. Then you get the right upgrade, return to that room, and it's like it's a whole different room now. You also could miss lesser details as well, but finding these things practicaly shifted the player's perspective so that they could never see the room the same way again. It's that "Oh wow, that passage way leads here?" experience, and Echoes had it in spades.

Echoes also had the best collection of power-ups, its world was much more alien than Prime 1's beautiful yet occasionally typical. Sanctuary Fortress. Yes, that alone is a valid bullet point.

Now having said all of that, yes Echoes ultimately took more risks than Prime 1 (outside the initial "3D Metroid" thing), and it didn't always pay off for every one. My issues with Echoes comes down to: Music was a downgrade from Prime 1, excluding most of the boss themes. I enjoy Echoes difficulty overall, but it was uneven at times. But Echoes biggest and ultimate fault is PACING, PACING PACING!! All I'll say is that how Prime 1 started its game and how Echoes started its game says it all. IMO Echoes' pacing is ultimately what drives the vast majority away from an otherwise AMAZING game.


Corruption? Still a great game and can stand with the other two. But its faults are many more than Echoes, and many of them are about as prominent as the pacing in Echoes. I'm not gonna go through it though and double the size of this post.

 

[Autumn ♫]

Hey guys! What's going on today in here?

We need a Villains Gone Wild VHS series, stat.

 

[Sehnsucht]

If you call yourself an avid Ridley supporter, it's your responsibility to go through all 383 pages of this thread. I did so before making an account here. If not, then I have no idea what you are still doing here. The hole is behind you, so do like Other M Ridley and please leave.

Spoiler

I don't even have Internet, let alone the time to scour 300+ pages.

 

[Dark Phazon]

The thing with Sakurai's quote for the Pyrosphere reveal is that it can accommodate all interpretations - background element, stage hazard, and playable character.

Hell, he might even just be referring to Pyrosphere's relevance to Other M. As such, the quote can serve to support any case, and thus serve none.

But Majority of People only see once side of it....hehe thats funny..nice post though.

 

[Xhampi]

So you know how a lot of Ridley detractors complain that the Idea of changing Ridley's size would change the fact that he is intimidating? You know, so he can't be only a little bit taller than Samus? Take a look at this picture from Melee:

Peach is roughly the same height as Bowser. When has she EVER been that close to his height?

It's funny when you know that Smash Bowser is smaller than Bowser Jr in Galaxy.

 

[Arcanir]

Rool was too busy making out with Mewtwo

Now we're talking.

The thing with Sakurai's quote for the Pyrosphere reveal is that it can accommodate all interpretations - background element, stage hazard, and playable character.

Hell, he might even just be referring to Pyrosphere's relevance to Other M. As such, the quote can serve to support any case, and thus serve none.

Pretty much, there's multiple ways to take that quote which is why it's a bit annoying that it's constantly used to support one side and only one side. It also doesn't help that Sakurai has made ambiguous quotes before that refer to potential characters ("The Goddess of Light watches the Battlefield" for Wii U's KI stage) and quotes that refer to the original game's events ("Epona help!" for Gerudo Valley) that are completely ignored.

 

[AndreaAC]

I must thank you again, Kamiko. I downloaded the program and Installed it....but unfortunately....it did not work....it showed something about a corrupt disc....and that windows' could not open it......oh well.....at least i tried.....

 

[Sehnsucht]

I must thank you again, Kamiko. I downloaded the program and Installed it....but unfortunately....it did not work....it showed something about a corrupt disc....and that windows' could not open it......oh well.....at least i tried.....

It's okay. We'll always have ZebesParis.

 

[Angelglory]

Guys, let's be honest with ourselves, Ridley is too smooth for Smash Bros.

 

[El Fonz0]

I can't wait for the day I just casually text my friend "ridley confirmed for smash 4"

 

[Sehnsucht]

Guys, let's be honest with ourselves, Ridley is too smooth for Smash Bros.

You're too slow!

 

[LiteTheIronMan]

Guys, let's be honest with ourselves, Ridley is too smooth for Smash Bros.

OH GOD PLAYBUNNY RIDLEY IS BACK

 

[AndreaAC]

Guys, let's be honest with ourselves, Ridley is too smooth for Smash Bros.

I owe you one.....I started to feel sad that i couldnt view the Omega Ridley model....and then this suddently apeared....it REALLY cheered me up...! I wish i had your skills...

 

[SchAlternate]

Guys, let's be honest with ourselves, Ridley is too smooth for Smash Bros.

Wasn't there also a pic you made that had Ridley inside a shoe?

 

[Ridley_Prime]

I really, really want that too. If only to be a giant middle finger to some certain Ridley-haters, hehe.

@Crocovile
Could also work. ^^ But Ridley and Party doesn't sound well together. I mean, imagen Ridley at a children's party. Hehe.

I dunno. Have this kind of Ridley act like a clown at a kid's birthday party, and I doubt it would scare them anymore than an actual clown would.

Or better, a Bowser/Ridley/Ganondorf threesome. Needs to happen!

Anyway, Ridley-bros and sis, how disappointed would you be if the second Metroid rep isn't Ridley, but some other character like Dark Samus, Rundas or... Adam Malkovich?

Ironically, most of those other characters you have in mind would be easier for me to stomach than zero suit Samus getting in over Ridley which has already happened.

Prime 3 was the only game in the trilogy I found to be a sub-par Metroid game in general actually. I don't like the motion controls, but I feel I've ranted enough about that in the past. Besides that I hate how there's beam stacking instead of beam switching, as that's one of the general gimmicks of the Prime games, and I also dislike how there's only 1 extra visor. The game also gives in to its 3 main gimmicks way too much: The ship, Hypermode and the Grapple Swing. I hate getting upgrades like Ship Grapple, Hyper Grapple, Hyper Ball, Ship Missile Expansion, etc, their only function is to advance in otherwise blocked passages, you don't use them in gameplay other than when the game tells you to. I also dislike travelling from planet to planet, makes the zones feel disconnected. Probably one of the biggest bummers was also the Hypermode, it was waaaaay too overpowered, it completely ruined otherwise great battles like Omega Ridley and Rundas who were shot down in so few seconds once the Hypermode was activated. Finally, I feel the items weren't hidden very well, I got 100% on my first run, I think that says quite a lot. Oh, and the final boss was super lame compared to the last two games too.

It's the only game in the trilogy which really has such glaring flaws, and it's a shame since it does the other things well. If they focused less on the game's new gimmicks and instead just built the game like they did the previous two, it'd have been great, but as is it's just mediocre.

All in my opinion of course.

I agree that Prime 3 should've stuck to the beam switching (save the beam stacking for the sidescrollers and such), as I would've liked to see how the Nova Beam was on its own without the Plasma Beam, etc. backing it up. Disagree on the ship stuff though. Things like the ship missiles and ship grapple I actually liked. Was pretty fresh seeing one of her ships given additional gameplay like that and hope to see other options incorporated with her ships in the future like maybe flying one manually. One of the small things I feel would help the player feel more like an actual bounty hunter. Also didn't really have a problem traveling from planet to planet, like I did repeatedly traveling back and forth between the 'dark world' and 'light world' of Aether.

I missed at least a couple of the extra fuel cells and missile expansions on my first playthough. Felt some of the collectables like on Bryyo were hidden well enough, though there could've been more like that. As for Prime 3's final boss, that goes without saying but I agree (my thoughts on how it should've been done here).

Okaay! I had some unexpected catching up to do in this topic. Quite the unexpected leap in posts!

Now my opinion...

Echoes >= Prime 1 > Prime 3!

Echoes had just about everything I like about Metroid (except Ridley... =/). Bosses? Way more than Prime 1, tougher, smarter, just all around great (and Quadraxis... if it had personality and a more dominant role in the series, I would like it as much as I do Ridley!). People love to claim Prime 1 was pretty much Super Metroid in 3D, but I personally give that honor to Echoes. I feel Prime 1 is more like Metroid 1 in 3D (but obviously better designed). I feel it's the level design that really attributes to this, and Echoes far better captures that maze-like cohesive quality world design that Super Metroid pioneered so long ago. Prime 1 was great, but two playthroughs later and you can navigate its world no problem. And it's not because of great game design. I mean it's great design, but it's also pretty easily memorized without trying. Not that getting lost is key to a great Metroid game, but...

Put it this way: With Prime 1 you can pretty much understand an entire room after the first or second time you've crossed through it. Occasionally you'll miss a detail here or there, but that's usually related to finding pick-ups. With Prime 2, you could think you have a room figured out. Then you get the right upgrade, return to that room, and it's like it's a whole different room now. You also could miss lesser details as well, but finding these things practicaly shifted the player's perspective so that they could never see the room the same way again. It's that "Oh wow, that passage way leads here?" experience, and Echoes had it in spades.

Echoes also had the best collection of power-ups, its world was much more alien than Prime 1's beautiful yet occasionally typical. Sanctuary Fortress. Yes, that alone is a valid bullet point.

Now having said all of that, yes Echoes ultimately took more risks than Prime 1 (outside the initial "3D Metroid" thing), and it didn't always pay off for every one. My issues with Echoes comes down to: Music was a downgrade from Prime 1, excluding most of the boss themes. I enjoy Echoes difficulty overall, but it was uneven at times. But Echoes biggest and ultimate fault is PACING, PACING PACING!! All I'll say is that how Prime 1 started its game and how Echoes started its game says it all. IMO Echoes' pacing is ultimately what drives the vast majority away from an otherwise AMAZING game.


Corruption? Still a great game and can stand with the other two. But its faults are many more than Echoes, and many of them are about as prominent as the pacing in Echoes. I'm not gonna go through it though and double the size of this post.

Even though I prefer Prime 1 over Echoes as a whole, I think I kinda have to agree on Prime 1 being the 3D Metroid 1 with Echoes being the 3D Super Metroid (environment-wise), strangely enough. The underwater sections of Torvus Bog was the closest thing we got to Maridia, for instance. Likewise though, the wrecked Frigate Orpheon was more or less equally akin to Super Metroid's Wrecked Ship.

And wow Andrea, you surprise me. I know you said you had practiced drawing Ridley some before, but damn. Nice work.

 

[Angelglory]

"People still think I'm too big?"​

 

[UltimateWario]

"People still think I'm too big?"​

No, Baby, you're just fine. Don't ever change.

 

[AndreaAC]

Thank you Ridley_Prime, glad you liked it! and yeah, like i said before, i draw Ridley WAY too much...but it is because before he did not came out like i wanted....and i tried multiple times, even when i was stressed out....and im really looking foward on be able to sculpt his main forms, i may start with the Brawl one, later Meta Ridley, and lastly the most detailed, Omega Ridley......I even have a proyect to make a comic about Ridley......Yeah....I like him THAT much....oh, and the other reason is that nintendo does not care about Metroid merchandise....the first 4 figures are awesome.....but none of them is Ridley, so I will have to make them myself one day.....

And yeah....I may also paint this into my wall.....this sketch is pretty rough....i hope it comes out better later....

 

[UltimateWario]

Holy HELL. Those are amazing.

 

[AndreaAC]

Holy HELL. Those are amazing.

:3 thank you! glad you all liked it! One day im gonna be able to to all my Ridley proyects.....

 

[iam8bit]

Damn, Ridley's just horrible in Other M. Did that game get ANYTHING right?

Anywho, does anyone have the literal Japanese translation from the "enemy from Samus' past" Miiverse post? I read somewhere that it references Samus' "trauma" instead, which makes it obviously about Ridley, as opposed to the vague official English translation.

I know that might be old, but it was news to me.

 

[Anomilus]

Nice AndreaAC! :o


Hey, just a thought... It's almost sort of funny, but the 2nd worst thing that could happen to us as we wait for Smash is for Sakurai to simply say one single word:


"Ridley"

Obvious the #1 worst thing is for him to appear as not playable. But considering what happened to Viridi, as well as Brawl Ridley when his remixed theme was revealed (before we knew that was a bad thing), it's funnily and sadly all he needs to do to nuke our dreams into dust. =/



Sakurai - "..."
Us - "...?"
Sakurai - "...Ridley."
Us - "NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!"
Sakurai - (laughs)

 

[JediLink]

The thing with Prime 2 is that it starts out crappy but gets better the further you go. Each area is better than the last one (i.e. Sanctuary Fortress > Torvus Bog > Agon Wastes), and also getting the Dark Suit and then later the Light Suit makes Dark Aether much more bearable.

 

[SchAlternate]

Thank you Ridley_Prime, glad you liked it! and yeah, like i said before, i draw Ridley WAY too much...but it is because before he did not came out like i wanted....and i tried multiple times, even when i was stressed out....and im really looking foward on be able to sculpt his main forms, i may start with the Brawl one, later Meta Ridley, and lastly the most detailed, Omega Ridley......I even have a proyect to make a comic about Ridley......Yeah....I like him THAT much....oh, and the other reason is that nintendo does not care about Metroid merchandise....the first 4 figures are awesome.....but none of them is Ridley, so I will have to make them myself one day.....

View attachment 8270

And yeah....I may also paint this into my wall.....this sketch is pretty rough....i hope it comes out better later....

****, that looks awesome.

 

[AnOkayDM]

The thing with Prime 2 is that it starts out crappy but gets better the further you go. Each area is better than the last one (i.e. Sanctuary Fortress > Torvus Bog > Agon Wastes), and also getting the Dark Suit and then later the Light Suit makes Dark Aether much more bearable.

Dunno about Sanctuary, but Torvus Bog is basically the worst area I've ever played through in my life. The Wastes are fine, but I despise water levels in general, and especially that one. Again, I've yet to play Sanctuary, but I like Tallon IV considerably more than Aether. And as much as I adore light and dark worlds in some games, like Zelda, it always just seemed dumb to me in Prime. The dark world is such a silly idea in a series that generally takes itself very seriously and is rooted in, while made-up, decently faked science. The Prime games especially go into a lot of detail about how a lot of the science of the galaxy works, and having a dark world just doesn't seem to fit in to me. Then toss in the fact that it hurts you and it makes me dislike it actively. The Boost Guardian is one of my least favorite bosses I've ever fought. >_<

 

[Staarih]

Seeing you talk about the Metroid games made me realize that I have NEVER played a Metroid game. Quite sad huh? I think Smash Bros was the first to introduce me to the franchise via Samus really, but it seems like an interesting bunch of games, and I've really grown to like Samus (and Ridley now). I've been thinking on maybe trying a game out, so what would you guys suggest would be the first Metroid game I give a shot at?

 

[Reila]

Seeing you talk about the Metroid games made me realize that I have NEVER played a Metroid game. Quite sad huh? I think Smash Bros was the first to introduce me to the franchise via Samus really, but it seems like an interesting bunch of games, and I've really grown to like Samus (and Ridley now). I've been thinking on maybe trying a game out, so what would you guys suggest would be the first Metroid game I give a shot at?

Super Metroid would be the best starting point, since it is the most praised game in the franchise. Fusion could be a good start if you are looking for an easier and more linear experience; Or you could start with Zero Mission, the remake of the first game. Metroid Prime is a good start too, especially if you prefer 3D games. It is up to you. Just don't start with Metroid Prime 2 or 3 and avoid Other and Metroid Prime Hunters.

 

[JediLink]

Seeing you talk about the Metroid games made me realize that I have NEVER played a Metroid game. Quite sad huh? I think Smash Bros was the first to introduce me to the franchise via Samus really, but it seems like an interesting bunch of games, and I've really grown to like Samus (and Ridley now). I've been thinking on maybe trying a game out, so what would you guys suggest would be the first Metroid game I give a shot at?

I'd say Zero Mission. It is canonically the first game in the series, after all.

EDIT: Super Metroid or Prime 1 also work.

 

[UltimateWario]

Torvus Bog is basically the worst area I've ever played through in my life

...I...

...but...

...dat music, tho.

...dat ambience, tho.

...dat mysterious beauty, tho.

...dat Chykka, tho.

 

[Anomilus]

The thing with Prime 2 is that it starts out crappy but gets better the further you go. Each area is better than the last one (i.e. Sanctuary Fortress > Torvus Bog > Agon Wastes), and also getting the Dark Suit and then later the Light Suit makes Dark Aether much more bearable.

True it definitely gets better, but the game still has pacing problems.

Things honestly don't get really interesting until halfway through Agon Wastes. Until then, the game just doesn't have that hook like Prime 1 did. It's a lot of figuring out what's happening on Aether. The world is definitely more alien, which I enjoy. But then again, I look for that stuff. It's not hard to imagine people entering the dry, arid, barren wasteland with that faint oppressive ambient music that never really picks up, and just getting bored waiting for something to seriously stand out. I'm not trying to be negative about it. Keep in mind that Echoes has the player searching for keys as well, so getting the game to pick up also depends on the player's searching skills. If the environment doesn't immediately capture them, there's gonna be a problem.

Now while things do pick up at Torvus, it's not clear sailing. The game picks up, but now there's an issue with item pacing. Mainly how the game occasionally requires the player to just leave the main area they're in. Here's where a couple of lessons could have been learned from Super Metroid. When that game placed a required item in a different area, it often first created an impression in the player's mind of the kind of obstacles they would need to clear to proceed further. Then the player finds the right item and they're like "Oh, this would be great for that place!" This isn't done as well in Echoes, and it can be tough to recall certain areas where a newly gained item can be applied.

Echoes Spoilers:

Spoiler

The worst instance of this in the game is the Power Bombs. I must have spent a good 5 HOURS in-game time trying to find them! See, when you gain that Hover Pack power up in Torvus Bog's Underwater Temple that lets Samus move better underwater, you may or may not notice a long flashing strip that goes up along the wall in one of the corners of this huge room. You might be too busy enjoying your new power-up! So much later, you acquired the Screw Attack and then the Spider Ball. Now it may soon be clear you require the Power Bombs, 'cause the yellow door that requires it is right in front of where you get the Spider Ball. What may not be clear is that you have to go ALL THE WAY back to that room and use the Spider Ball to climb up the flashing strip, which is a Spider Ball track!

...Keep in mind however that the graphics used for the Spider Ball tracks in Torvus doesn't exactly resemble the ones you might find in Sanctuary Fortress, the place where you initially got the Spider Ball track and was trained to use it on it's differently designed tracks!

EDIT - I got the Screw Attack requirement and Spider Ball requirement mixed up. The Screw Attack is actually necessary in that same area, but for a different reason.

Dunno about Sanctuary, but Torvus Bog is basically the worst area I've ever played through in my life. The Wastes are fine, but I despise water levels in general, and especially that one. Again, I've yet to play Sanctuary

Fix this.

Note that you eventually get an item that lets you move as freely underwater as you do out of it, and it even comes with a hover feature while underwater. You have got to experience Sanctuary Fortress at least once.

Don't let what I've said above deter you!