The Removal of Dr. Mario

[Kashakunaki]

Alright peeps, listen up. Whenever cloning, character removal, or discussion of almost anything character related comes up in regards to Brawl, someone ends up saying, "because Dr. Mario has a high chance of being removed from Brawl," or, "Because Dr. Mario should be removed from Brawl," or something else of the sort.

And you know what I noticed? No one ever, and I mean ever, supports their reasoning. Why? That's what I ask all of you. Why? What are you reasons, beliefs, ideas, or excuses? Why should Dr. Mario be removed from Brawl? No, I'm going behind that, too. Why does he have this mysterious "high percentage" of being removed from Brawl? Care to inform the oh so ignorant one?

 

[Jossy]

take the doctor out of dr. mario and you have ur answer.... duh

 

[tirkaro]

because he was just a useless filler clone. he is definetly going to be taken out and have his stats fused with normal mario

 

[Wizzlecroff]

I'm not necessarily on this side of the argument, but the reasons are mostly because he is too like mario and that he is the same exact character as mario... so pretty much they don't want 2 mario characters in the game which is a stupid reason. I can understand that Dr. Mario is one of the closer clones to the original, but just because he is mario is not a reason to remove him.

 

[Jazzy Jinx]

Dr. Mario is Mario in a doctor's outfit. I never liked the idea of different forms of the same charcter like Y. Link and Pichu. Plus he would work just as good as an alternate costume with his stats changed to his when you pick it. I don't support removing him but majority rules so I just decided to roll with it.

Tirkaro, you must not play as Mario that often. Fusing their stats is a stupid idea because they play differently. Maybe it is not the hugest difference but it is still different. Mario should retain all of his stats and only change them when he puts on Dr. Mario's costume.

 

[DroxSorcerer]

Most likely the reason is that they have practically no differences. Only an expert could give you a difference. I have heared that Mario is faster but weaker, but theese differeces are so small that it makes them the same.

 

[Shark X]

I prefer Dr. Mario use Dr. Mario and Tetris based moves, but I was actually happy to see a classic, well known character.

Pichu is the one character we know for sure will be removed. Young Link can easily have a different move set, because Link has always had potential for a large moveset. Dr. Mario can easily have a different moveset if they base his moves off of Dr. Mario and Tetris.

Roy...don't have a clue. Falco, I honestly don't care anymore. Rather have Wolf anyway. Ganon is the one clone who has the best chance of staying.

 

[LukeFonFabre]

Another question would be, why should Dr Mario return? As nice as it would be to have all charcters return, Sakurai has already said that not all will be returning. Therefore, a characters right to returning would be based off their importance and their uniqueness, of which Dr Mario has neither (let's face it, even Pichu and Young Link could be made more unique than the Doc). As others have Said, Dr Mario is incredibly similair to Mario and has little to seperate himself as an individual, so he doesn't really deserve a whole character slot to himself IMO.

If it hadn't been said that some characters won't return, then I doubt many people would be saying that Doc won't return. However, because most people know now, they see Dr.Mario as being one of (if not the) most logical choice to be cut.

 

[Kashakunaki]

take the doctor out of dr. mario and you have ur answer.... duh

This is the ignorance I am referring to.

because he was just a useless filler clone. he is definetly going to be taken out and have his stats fused with normal mario

If he was truly a useless filler clone when the Smash team have taken the time to program? Wouldn't they have rather taken time avoiding clones such as Falco and Ganondorf? Seems logical, correct? Obviously he wasn't a pointless filler clone. They had a large back catalog of characters they could've chosen over Dr. Mario, so they chose him for an obvious reason.

I'm not necessarily on this side of the argument, but the reasons are mostly because he is too like mario and that he is the same exact character as mario...

Similar to Mario, yes. But then again, isn't Ganondorf similar to Captain Falcon, Falco to Fox, Young Link to Link? Clones are, obviously, like each other. Also, just because he is the same person as Mario doesn't mean that he is the exact same.

so pretty much they don't want 2 mario characters in the game which is a stupid reason.

Mmm hmm. So, would people perfer the same person that are completely different, or two different people who play the exact same?

I can understand that Dr. Mario is one of the closer clones to the original, but just because he is mario is not a reason to remove him.

Agreed. I liked your arguement overall, even though you aren't for removing him. Plus rep for you.

Dr. Mario is Mario in a doctor's outfit.

Literally, yes. Otherwise, you couldn't be further from the bulls eye.

I never liked the idea of different forms of the same charcter like Y. Link and Pichu.

That's your own opinion. So there's nothing I can say other than, I know what you mean.

Plus he would work just as good as an alternate costume with his stats changed to his when you pick it.

I hate it when people say this. No, no, no. For starters, costumes are COSTUMES. They aren't biologically enhanced suits. And Dr. Mario and Mario, despite being the same person, are completely different characters in two different worlds.

I don't support removing him but majority rules so I just decided to roll with it.

You should believe and argue for what you think, not what others think.

Most likely the reason is that they have practically no differences.

Though, that being the general observation, it's entirely untrue. As I've already said multiple times, they are two completely different personas in two completely different worlds.

Only an expert could give you a difference.

*With a little bit of research, exaimination, and knowledge could tell you the difference.
Fixed.

I have heared that Mario is faster but weaker, but theese differeces are so small that it makes them the same.

If we're talking game specfici, yes, that is one of their minor differences. But, they play completely differently. You don't play Fox like Falco or vise versa. You'd fail, more or less, if you tried. Same in regards to the Marios.

 

[BloodTide]

Just take Dr. mario out along with all the other similar characters. Now i understand perfectly how the characters are different but they arent different enough to their clone to stay in the **** game. Make room for better more unique characters from nintendo . For example if i had to choose to would take out dr mario to put in like sonic or something i would do it. But if they must stay at least change their **** move set totally different from their clone.

 

[Eaode]

Kasha, your logic fails. He IS a pointless filler clone. They didn't choose him specifically for any reason other than time restrictions. He has the SAME collision boxes as Mario, and the same voice. All they needed to do was change the models, and make a few minor changes (walljump, fair, pills). Yeah, that's ALOT less than you need to do to get a completely new character in. He is just a filler.


And please don't bring up the "Seperate worlds" argument because that whole logic is a bunch of bull****. It's a videogame. You don't need to find some transdimensional theory to get closure on why in one particular game he happens to have a PhD.

 

[Super_Cool]

Dr. Mario is Mario with different stats. oh yeah, instead of fireballs, he shoots pills. Wooptie-freaken-doo.

He was put in because they didn't have time to put in more original characters. To save time, they added characters with the same attacks but different stats to add more characters to the roster with little effort put into them. Dr. Mario is one of them. He is a slower but stronger Mario. Yes, there are other clones, but he just is too similar to Mario. Pichu still has the #1 requests for leaving, because not only is he a clone, he's hard to use. I'd rather have that little rat go than the doctor.

And Dr. Mario and Mario come from different universes. That is such bull. Mario had to stop an outbreak of viruses in the Mushroom Kingdomso he put on a doctor's outfit, and ta da! SAME PERSON. Mario stoped the viruses in a doctor's outfit. What should we call him now? How about Dr. Mario! lololol. Same person, same universe.

 

[Kashakunaki]

I prefer Dr. Mario use Dr. Mario and Tetris based moves, but I was actually happy to see a classic, well known character.

Me, too. I didn't even play a Dr. Mario game until after I played Melee. ^_^

Pichu is the one character we know for sure will be removed.

While there is a vast amount of Pokemon that could replace him (Replace is a key word in this arguement) that still is only speculation.

Young Link can easily have a different move set, because Link has always had potential for a large moveset. Dr. Mario can easily have a different moveset if they base his moves off of Dr. Mario and Tetris.

Mmm hmm. Yep yep.

Roy...don't have a clue.

From what I've learned (And don't quote me on this, because I've only played Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance) Roy doesn't even use his respective sword. He doesn't even have the same fighting style as Marth in their respective games... and I just realized I could use that in a Wolf vs. arguement. Sweet. Anyways, back on topic. Yeah, Roy can easily be decloned, and as a matter of fact, any character can be easily decloned.

Falco, I honestly don't care anymore. Rather have Wolf anyway.

Rofl, me too.

Ganon is the one clone who has the best chance of staying

I'll agree with you on that one.

Another question would be, why should Dr Mario return?

Don't answer a qusetion with a question. It just shows a lack of confidence and is down right silly. Plus, you defused your entire arguement by saying it was your own opinion, and besides, I had already argued against most of your points in previous quotes.

 

[Bowserlick]

Was Dr. Mario a filler character? The way to possibly answer this is to ask the question,"If it wasn't for the time constraints, would Dr. Mario still be picked by Sakurai to battle in Melee and given his own moveset?" I would say definately not. Dr. Mario is such a minor character.

But I do not think all clones will be removed. "If it wasn't for time constraints, would Gannondorf still be picked by Sakurai to battle in Melee and given his own moveset?" I would say yes. He is one of the best Nintendo villains.

Using this philosophy I would say out of all the clones, only Gannondorf and possibly Falco will return.

 

[Shark X]

Possibly Falco, yes. I really have no problem with him. The thing is, two things about Melee made me dislike Falco for that game.

1. Japanese voice. Honestly, they gave both him and Both US voices in the game's Story mode, so why didn't they give these two actual voices so we could know what they are saying. The Japanese voices sounds nothing like the Falco we know, thus feeling like a totally different character to me.

2. Moveset. He's just too **** fast for me to control. This is also why I dislike Falcon.

 

[Kashakunaki]

They didn't choose him specifically for any reason other than time restrictions.

Read that again and I dare you to tell me that makes sense. They wouldn't have put him in in the first place because of time restrictions.

He has the SAME collision boxes as Mario, and the same voice.

...Maybe... just maybe it's because he is Mario, smart one. Why would they have a different voice or collion box? He has the same vocal cords and stature as Mario.

All they needed to do was change the models, and make a few minor changes (walljump, fair, pills). Yeah, that's ALOT less than you need to do to get a completely new character in. He is just a filler.

If that arguement were to hold water, that would mean EVERY clone is a filler. And you certainly wouldn't agree with that. Plus, a lot is two different words. Sorry, that just bugs me.

And please don't bring up the "Seperate worlds" argument because that whole logic is a bunch of bull****. It's a videogame. You don't need to find some transdimensional theory to get closure on why in one particular game he happens to have a PhD.

Lmao, well put. And I was hardly basing my arguement on that. If that's all I had to base my arguement on I wouldn't even be argueing in the favor of Dr. Mario. But as for it being plainly bull crap, that's not true. You see, they are the same person, yes. But that doesn't mean every aspect of them is similar. It's called a spin-off. Again, would you perfer two different characters that played the exact same or two of the same character that plays completely different?

And I'll tell you what arguement is bull crap. The clone arguement. I find myself constantly argueing about this in regards to Wolf, so don't even try me. Dr. Mario can easily be altered with a completely unique moveset.

 

[DroxSorcerer]

If we're talking game specfici, yes, that is one of their minor differences. But, they play completely differently. You don't play Fox like Falco or vise versa. You'd fail, more or less, if you tried. Same in regards to the Marios.

Hmm...that post convinced me to get off my lazy butt and turn on the Gamecube. Anyway, I just got done with two battles. One with Mario and another with Dr. Mario. I fought a level 5 Bowser both times. I played the same way, and I got the same outcome, finishing him off on my last life. (Yeah, I'm not so good with the plumber or Doctor.) See my point?

 

[Bowserlick]

But I am pretty sure Dr. Mario wouldn't even make it to the Smash world if clones were not added to generate a larger character roster in a short period of time.

I am pretty sure that Pichu, Roy, and Young Link would not be added either.

Sakurai would pick characters more vital to Nintendo history.

 

[Kashakunaki]

Was Dr. Mario a filler character? The way to possibly answer this is to ask the question,"If it wasn't for the time constraints, would Dr. Mario still be picked by Sakurai to battle in Melee and given his own moveset?" I would say definately not. Dr. Mario is such a minor character.

But I do not think all clones will be removed. "If it wasn't for time constraints, would Gannondorf still be picked by Sakurai to battle in Melee and given his own moveset?" I would say yes. He is one of the best Nintendo villains.

Using this philosophy I would say out of all the clones, only Gannondorf and possibly Falco will return.

You're such a brilliant character, Bowserlick. I can't see why you continue to fight for Andross' sake, haha. But alas, that is a different thread. Very valid point and good reasoning. But, that works on both sides of the spectrum. If the time constraints were as tight as people reason, the doctor most likely wouldn't have been put in to begin with. Why would they push themselves to fit in another character?

Hmm...that post convinced me to get off my lazy butt and turn on the Gamecube. Anyway, I just got done with two battles. One with Mario and another with Dr. Mario. I fought a level 5 Bowser both times. I played the same way, and I got the same outcome, finishing him off on my last life. (Yeah, I'm not so good with the plumber or Doctor.) See my point?

......................... ................................ ................................I don't even know how to respond to that.

EDIT: Also, Bowser. I entirely disagree with your clone arguement. Every character's moveset is being reworked from the ground up. While this doesn't mean every character is getting a new moveset ('Cause that would be plain silly) it does mean every character is getting a close examination. Sakurai also stated he is highly objective to clones. Ergo, they'd simply be given new movesets. Doesn't mean you have to go with the nuclear option.

 

[LukeFonFabre]

I'm simply asking why you think Dr Mario deserves to return when Sakurai said that not all characters will. If you can't argue why he should stay, then there's no reason for everyone to explain why he should go. And of course it's opinion, I don't decide who goes and who stays, but in my eyes, Dr Mario is the most logical person to go, but everyone has a different view on things as you believe that he has some reasons to stay. And you haven't argued against my points, as you haven't argued his importance to Nintendo or his uniqueness.

The thing is, Dr Mario was most likely added on at the last second, and is the least different of the clones. He is pretty much just Mario, and holds little importance to Nintendo and the Mario franchise compared to other characters. He's just one of the many different forms of Mario that just so happened to catch Sakurai's eye as a potential character for a Mario clone (I believe the reason was because he wanted to use the music, i'm not sure on this). There are other Mario characters that should be in his place, and overall he just isn't an important enough character.

 

[commonyoshi]

Doesn't anyone besides me want mario out, but the Doc in? Doc was higher on the teir list and had a better projectile and combo ability.

 

[Bowserlick]

The theory is that with the time left, the team could either alter Mario's costume and stats, therefore creating a different character or could not add a clone and be down an otherwise extra character. That is why Dr. Mario was able to squeeze himself in. They already had Mario's model and moves they just had to alter the equations for damage and knockback and all that stuff.

Plus Sakurai did say characters would go. I think most people would rather the minor characters to go then the more original, perhaps more popular ones.

Of course if the team really did feel like Dr. Mario was an integral part of Nintendo history, they could make a moveset for him. But why struggle for an original moveset for a minor character when there are much cooler, much more popular, and much more interesting characters out there?

If six characters from the Melee roster had to go, which ones would you pick?

 

[Eaode]

Read that again and I dare you to tell me that makes sense. They wouldn't have put him in in the first place because of time restrictions.



...Maybe... just maybe it's because he is Mario, smart one. Why would they have a different voice or collion box? He has the same vocal cords and stature as Mario.



If that arguement were to hold water, that would mean EVERY clone is a filler. And you certainly wouldn't agree with that. Plus, a lot is two different words. Sorry, that just bugs me.



Lmao, well put. And I was hardly basing my arguement on that. If that's all I had to base my arguement on I wouldn't even be argueing in the favor of Dr. Mario. But as for it being plainly bull crap, that's not true. You see, they are the same person, yes. But that doesn't mean every aspect of them is similar. It's called a spin-off. Again, would you perfer two different characters that played the exact same or two of the same character that plays completely different?

And I'll tell you what arguement is bull crap. The clone arguement. I find myself constantly argueing about this in regards to Wolf, so don't even try me. Dr. Mario can easily be altered with a completely unique moveset.

1. Yes that does make sense because if they chose someone original (Which if they had time, they would) it would take more TIME, DEVELOPMENT, and WORK

2. that point was there simply to clarify that there is a lot (Happy?) less work put into him. And wouldn't that argument work against him?

3. Again, just clarification that there wasn't much work.

4. ROFL!!!! Yes, you could make Doc original. But you could do the same for about 10 versions of samus, and 5 different marios. I didn't say anything against wolf, just to let you know.

If you want to take everything I say out of context and basic comprehension, go right ahead

 

[Kabyk-Greenmyst]

Don't worry about his clone status. That doesn't matter!
Don't worry about his PhD and the fact Mario was out of character. That doesn't matter!
Don't worry about his ....anything!

Doctor Mario was an extremely random and not thought-out TETRIS game. I'm sure it did horribly [although I don't have any facts] in sales. Mario is a platforming plumber. He had/has no place in the Puzzle genre. The game is not worthy of representation.
That is what matters.

 

[Eaode]

Kabyk-Greenmyst wins the thread.

 

[Kashakunaki]

I'm simply asking why you think Dr Mario deserves to return when Sakurai said that not all characters will. If you can't argue why he should stay, then there's no reason for everyone to explain why he should go.

My argueing against all the points thrown at me I AM argueing why he should stay. I thought that was obvious.

And of course it's opinion, I don't decide who goes and who stays

I know, never said you did. But you can make an arguement based on more than just opinion.

but in my eyes, Dr Mario is the most logical person to go, but everyone has a different view on things as you believe that he has some reasons to stay.

Yes, I agree.

And you haven't argued against my points, as you haven't argued his importance to Nintendo or his uniqueness.

I'm argueing against your pointsn ow.
Importance: He's even sold more than Star Fox.
Uniqueness: It's one of the few Tetris spin-offs.
BAM!

The thing is, Dr Mario was most likely added on at the last second,

Am I the only one who seems to think this doesn't make any sense? They wouldn't have added him on at the last second if it was the last second! What motive would they have for increasing the roster just one more character? None. They could've spent the development time tweaking other things.

and is the least different of the clones.

Not true. I'd have to say Young Link or Pichu, but I don't know for a fact, so don't hold me to that.

He is pretty much just Mario, and holds little importance to Nintendo and the Mario franchise compared to other characters.

I can agree with that.

He's just one of the many different forms of Mario that just so happened to catch Sakurai's eye as a potential character for a Mario clone (I believe the reason was because he wanted to use the music, i'm not sure on this). There are other Mario characters that should be in his place, and overall he just isn't an important enough character.

Speculation and opinion.

 

[commonyoshi]

I though Doc came out beofre Tetris did. I know it did sell well, though. But yeah, the game was lame.

 

[Eaode]

He was added at the end as a filler character because they wanted more character's to even out the roster! It wasn't literally the Last SECOND. So what your saying is that they were pressed for time so why did they make ANY clones. the reason is so they'd have 26 characters instead of 20!!!

 

[GoldenGlove]

I'm not arguing either for or against Dr. Mario, just thought I'd clear up a few things.

Kabyk: I'm pretty sure the game did reasonably well in sales. Google is yielding nothing useful, so I'd have to to dig up an old issue of Nintendo Power to get exact numbers.

Commonyoshi: Tetris came out first

Kash: There's many more than a "few" tetris spin-offs

 

[commonyoshi]

Ok, thanks. The game certainly did well or else it wouldn't have been re-released in that classics collection for the GameBoy.

 

[Thrillhouse-vh.]

Ok, thanks. The game certainly did well or else it wouldn't have been re-released in that classics collection for the GameBoy.

AND there was a Dr. Mario 64 AND it was in Animal Crossing AND it was on the Gamecube it the Japanse only Nintendo Puzzle collection, AND it's so darn fun

 

[Jazzy Jinx]

There will definitely be character cuts. If they honestly did put all the characters in Melee for a reason other than time restricitions then they would not cut any of them out for Brawl. But Sakurai has stated that there will be character cuts. Why is this? To add new more deserving characters. Of all the clones who stands the best chances of staying? Nobody knows for sure but if I was a developer I wouldn't cut Ganondorf for Doc or Falco for Doc. Just my opinions and I know they don't hold water. But take into consideration why they would cut any characters at all if they put them all in for specific reasons in Melee.

 

[Kashakunaki]

The theory is that with the time left, the team could either alter Mario's costume and stats, therefore creating a different character or could not add a clone and be down an otherwise extra character. That is why Dr. Mario was able to squeeze himself in. They already had Mario's model and moves they just had to alter the equations for damage and knockback and all that stuff.

A theory is something that is backed by an abundence of evidence and facts and is a widely accepted ideal. However, what you've told me is nothing more than speculation.

Of course if the team really did feel like Dr. Mario was an integral part of Nintendo history, they could make a moveset for him. But why struggle for an original moveset for a minor character when there are much cooler, much more popular, and much more interesting characters out there?

Opinion.

If six characters from the Melee roster had to go, which ones would you pick?

Mmm, that is a toughy. Though, I'd want all characters to stay, if I had to choose six it would be, in no particular order.:
Mr. Game and Watch
Pichu
Young Link
Ness
Captain Falcon
Mewtwo

I personally think it is blatantly obvious that the original twelve will stay, so my other six would be:
Pichu
Mewtwo
Young Link
Dr. Mario
Game and Watch
Marth/Roy

1. Yes that does make sense because if they chose someone original (Which if they had time, they would) it would take more TIME, DEVELOPMENT, and WORK

2. that point was there simply to clarify that there is a lot (Happy?) less work put into him. And wouldn't that argument work against him?

3. Again, just clarification that there wasn't much work.

4. ROFL!!!! Yes, you could make Doc original. But you could do the same for about 10 versions of samus, and 5 different marios. I didn't say anything against wolf, just to let you know.

If you want to take everything I say out of context and basic comprehension, go right ahead

1. You missed my point. They wouldn't choose someone ata ll.
2. Don't worry, I agree. He did take very, very little work. I'm not going to be ignorant about it, and stay is unbiased as possible. And no, that arguement wouldn't necessarily work against him.
3. Again, I agree.
4. You're helping my side of the arguement ^_^ And I know you didn't say anything about Wolf.

Sorry if I take it out of context. Correct me if I do because I don't mean to.

Doctor Mario was an extremely random and not thought-out TETRIS game. I'm sure it did horribly [although I don't have any facts] in sales. Mario is a platforming plumber. He had/has no place in the Puzzle genre. The game is not worthy of representation.
That is what matters.

Eaode, how can you say that wins this thread? More than 75 percent of what's typed there is opinion. Spin-offs do tend to be random and not very thoroughly planned. No argueing there. It actually did exceedingly well. Opinion. Opinion. And Opinion.

Are we through here? Good, let's move on.

He was added at the end as a filler character because they wanted more character's to even out the roster!

We can only guess and assume at that. Unless, of course, you were on the developement team.

It wasn't literally the Last SECOND.

...No crap, really?

So what your saying is that they were pressed for time so why did they make ANY clones.

No, that's what you're saying. What I'm saying is that if they were pressed for time they wouldn't push themselves to squeeze in one last character. Development time could've been put elsewhere.

the reason is so they'd have 26 characters instead of 20

That extra six characters worth of developement time could have been put anywhere for all you know. Instead of six clones they could've had 22 completely different characters, or maybe even 24 original characters. You nor I have any idea. Maybe they would've added a whole new stage. It's anybodys guess.

EDIT:

There will definitely be character cuts. If they honestly did put all the characters in Melee for a reason other than time restricitions then they would not cut any of them out for Brawl. But Sakurai has stated that there will be character cuts. Why is this? To add new more deserving characters. Of all the clones who stands the best chances of staying? Nobody knows for sure but if I was a developer I wouldn't cut Ganondorf for Doc or Falco for Doc. Just my opinions and I know they don't hold water. But take into consideration why they would cut any characters at all if they put them all in for specific reasons in Melee.

I see your point and where you're coming from, even if it is opinion. To be honest, I wouldn't in hell cut Ganondorf for Doc or Falco for Doc. No way. But I do think he is more deserving than other characters. We'll just have to wait and see.

EDIT 2: I need to do chores and homework. Try not to **** me with pages of counter points before I get back o.o

 

[Eaode]

Is that the post that i said wins? I don't recall, maybe he edited.

And in no way could they use the dev. time from 6 slightly altered clones to make more than one original character. And why did they choose to make that one last character squeeze in instead of a new stage? You'd have to ask them, it's their choice. And you made it sound like you thought it WAS literally the last second

How is saying that Just because he could be original but that doesn't mean he should get in- help your argument? 'Cause that's what I meant, I just didn't feel like typing exactly that because I have so many times already.

 

[Kashakunaki]

My point was that we don't know what they could've done with the development time, and we'd just end up making pointless speculations.
And I might have made it sound like I thought it was literally the last second. When I type really fast I make all sorts of crazy word errors and stuff.

Also,

How is saying that Just because he could be original but that doesn't mean he should get in- help your argument?

Huh? Where'd I say that. I'm confused.

 

[xianfeng]

Well let's see he plays very similar like extroidnarly similar any Mario could pick up Dr Mario and be pro they play the same pretty much becuase their stats are different by the tiniest bit. The only moves that are different are that his fireballs are pills instead and his cape is longer (or is it the other way areound?) also they are the exact same Mario except one is in a doctors suit and doesn't deserve to be a character and one is in a classic suit and is Mr. Nintendo.

So If Dr. Mario stays then that means that FLUDD mario, Light Suit Samus, Vaccum Luigi, Super Peach, Classic Wario etc. deserve to be added too because they are all just variations of an already exsisting character.

 

[Shark X]

Well you have Samus and Zero Suit Samus already O.o

 

[Mud Buddha]

Again, why does everyone have this ******** idea that characters should be removed to "save space"? These are DVDs we're talking about. Not floppies.

 

[Jazzy Jinx]

I just realized that this thread is going to be closed because they have that "Who is going to return" thread and it is a sticky. Oh well.

 

[Kabyk-Greenmyst]

First off, I said I had no facts supporting my thoughts on it's sales.
Second, I really think it's a fact that Mario has no place in the Puzzle genre. Who REALLY thinks they need to slow down progress on platforming, action/adventure Mario games for Puzzle games that will just be rip-offs of games like Tetris and Snood-style?

Smash is about All-Star characters. Some may say that Doc's game was good, was it really deserve to stand with Link, Kirby, and Samus? Not many can, and Doc is not one of the few.