The Official Waluigi Thread

[GenG]

Waluigi doesn't lack a backstory, not a storyline. Waluigi lacks a purpose, a role. A mysterious lost brother who has been training secretly all his life for a tennis match? He lacks game career, nostalgia, moves, popularity, impact, representation. Just compare what made Pit, Wario o Metaknight appareances "epic" and compare them with Waluigi: He is just plain in comparison, there are dozens of character who "are first" from many franchises, like Toad or Birdo.

And yes, blame Nintendo. He keeps appearing in games like Mario Kart DS, Mario Party 8, etc. but they maybe don't want to make him go alone because the game won't be successfull? Whatever, right now, Waluigi isn't at that level yet. Doc, Young Link and Pichu weren't either.

 

[Red_Maniac]

Waluigi doesn't lack a backstory, not a storyline. Waluigi lacks a purpose, a role. A mysterious lost brother who has been training secretly all his life for a tennis match? He lacks game career, nostalgia, moves, popularity, impact, representation. Just compare what made Pit, Wario o Metaknight appareances "epic" and compare them with Waluigi: He is just plain in comparison, there are dozens of character who "are first" from many franchises, like Toad or Birdo.

And yes, blame Nintendo. He keeps appearing in games like Mario Kart DS, Mario Party 8, etc. but they maybe don't want to make him go alone because the game won't be successfull? Whatever, right now, Waluigi isn't at that level yet. Doc, Young Link and Pichu weren't either.

...

*headSMACK*

None of you have yet to answered my question that I've been asking for the past two pages. Why must you be in an important role to be in Brawl? It doesn't matter what game you first appear in.

If Waluigi had no fans, wouldn't this disscussion be, you know, over? And what exactly do you mean by epic?

Yes, Waluigi has only appeared in spin-off games. But remember how long it took for Luigi to have Luigi's Mansion. Nintendo can do a lot with Waluigi. They just haven't done it yet.

 

[GenG]

None of you have yet to answered my question that I've been asking for the past two pages. Why must you be in an important role to be in Brawl? It doesn't matter what game you first appear in.

It's simple.

Smash Bros. has a limited roster. That's why people like Toad, Daisy, Petey Piranha, Baby Bowser and the Koopalings will never likely to happen. Has a roster made of LEGENDS. Except some of the clones in Melee, the characters are the cream of Nintendo and even videogame history.

But remember how long it took for Luigi to have Luigi's Mansion.

You don't get it. You talk like Luigi's Mansion being the first Luigi game. But Luigi was born with the Mario franchise. Do you remember Mario Bros.? The game with the turtles coming out from the pipes. Yes, that was the first Mario Bros. game, in ****ing 1983, who featured the Mario Bros., and since then both brothers have been despicted together in games like Super Mario Bros., Super Mario Bros. 2, Super Mario Bros. 3, Super Mario Kart... Luigi is Super Mario, because he stars the Mario games too. He even starred OVAs and tv series with Mario, appeared in all the spinoffs games since Super Mario Kart.

In short, Luigi was born with the Mario franchise, while Waluigi is rather a prescindible character.

Seriously, people should stop bringing Luigi in these debates because it's just stupid. Luigi was the second character made for the Mario franchise, appeared in ALMOST every game and has a symbolic meaning about the underrated overshadowed sidekicks in videogames, yet he is very popular.

 

[Red_Maniac]

It's simple.

Smash Bros. has a limited roster. That's why people like Toad, Daisy, Petey Piranha, Baby Bowser and the Koopalings will never likely to happen. Has a roster made of LEGENDS. Except some of the clones in Melee, the characters are the cream of Nintendo and even videogame history.

And what do you think is a "legend?" Look around this board. There have been many, many character suggestions here, and most characters are popular, but are not "legends." There's a huge difference. And here are characters suggested in the Japanese poll:

King Dedede(5)
Diddy Kong(4)
Geno(4)
Ike(4)
Ridley(4)
Captain Olimar & Pikmin(3)
Krystal(3)
Takamaru(3)
Windwaker Link(3)
Animal Crossing MC(2)
Claus(2)
Demiru(2)
Isaac(2)
Jeff(2)
Kawasima(2)
King K.Rool(2)
Lip(2)
Lucas(2)
Mega Man(2)
Oguma(2)
Ouendan(2)
Sukapon(2)

Would you consider any of them to be "legends?" Why do you think that the poll was created? Were they just bored? The point is that Nintendo doesn't just say, "Hey! That guy has been in a bunch of games! Let's put him in!" They actually listen to our suggestions. Toad is a very popular character, so he has a chance to be in the game. Waluigi is popular, and has a chance to be in the game.

You don't get it. You talk like Luigi's Mansion being the first Luigi game. But Luigi was born with the Mario franchise. Do you remember Mario Bros.? The game with the turtles coming out from the pipes. Yes, that was the first Mario Bros. game, in ****ing 1983, who featured the Mario Bros., and since then both brothers have been despicted together in games like Super Mario Bros., Super Mario Bros. 2, Super Mario Bros. 3, Super Mario Kart... Luigi is Super Mario, because he stars the Mario games too. He even starred OVAs and tv series with Mario, appeared in all the spinoffs games since Super Mario Kart.

In short, Luigi was born with the Mario franchise, while Waluigi is rather a prescindible character.

Seriously, people should stop bringing Luigi in these debates because it's just stupid. Luigi was the second character made for the Mario franchise, appeared in ALMOST every game and has a symbolic meaning about the underrated overshadowed sidekicks in videogames, yet he is very popular.

Dude, relax. All I'm saying is that Luigi started out as an unoriginal character, but in time, he appeared in many games, and even had his own games. I'm saying that Nintendo can make Waluigi more important, but they just haven't yet.

 

[GenG]

Sorry if that sounded a bit offensive, but I've read the Luigi argument so many times that I'm a bit tired about it.

Let's see.

And what do you think is a "legend?" Look around this board. There have been many, many character suggestions here, and most characters are popular, but are not "legends." There's a huge difference. And here are characters suggested in the Japanese poll:

King Dedede(5)
Diddy Kong(4)
Geno(4)
Ike(4)
Ridley(4)
Captain Olimar & Pikmin(3)
Krystal(3)
Takamaru(3)
Windwaker Link(3)
Animal Crossing MC(2)
Claus(2)
Demiru(2)
Isaac(2)
Jeff(2)
Kawasima(2)
King K.Rool(2)
Lip(2)
Lucas(2)
Mega Man(2)
Oguma(2)
Ouendan(2)
Sukapon(2)

Would you consider any of them to be "legends?" Why do you think that the poll was created? Were they just bored? The point is that Nintendo doesn't just say, "Hey! That guy has been in a bunch of games! Let's put him in!" They actually listen to our suggestions. Toad is a very popular character, so he has a chance to be in the game. Waluigi is popular, and has a chance to be in the game.

Ok, most of these characters are legends or important characters for Nintendo and its respective franchises somehow. Sukapon is a sort of obscure and cult legend, but legend nonetheless. Kawashima is the mascot of the new line of successful Training products. Ouendan is one of the best bemani games and it's regarded as a complete success in Japan and overseas. Dedede is legendary, as Geno, Ike, Ridley, Takamaru, Olimar, Lip... all of them.
Waluigi can't be proud of anything: "I'm the skinny guy that appears in each party game with Wario". Toad, Toadette, Petey Piranha, King Boo the babies, Birdo, Bowser Jr and even the Koopa Troopas can say that too. That's not a feat.

Someone said that Brawl could be Waluigi's trampoline to the fame: He will get a solid background and the acceptance from participating in such an important game, but Smash Bros. should be the place for the characters to show what they've done through their career, not to start. Yes, Roy appeared in Melee before his own game, but his role in the Fire Emblem was decided beforehand and the Fire emblem franchise was in its lowest: An advertisement for the upcoming game was needed and some say that Roy appareance in Melee was what boosted the sales and popularity of Fuuin no Tsurugi and the resurrection of the franchise as a final goal.

Even Tingle, who has its own game, won't get in Brawl. Tingle have gone through a lot and finally he got recognition, yet he has a long path to walk before making it to the next Smash Bros. (if there's even one). Waluigi hasn't done any of that. It's because Nintendo, but this is what he has right now.

Even WARIO didn't appeared in Melee, having many games, appareances and popularity (I was really upset as a Wario fan), and they waited to him . Waluigi won't get this time, he lacks many of the traits of other Smashers.

 

[Red_Maniac]

Sorry if that sounded a bit offensive, but I've read the Luigi argument so many times that I'm a bit tired about it.

Let's see.

No prob.

Ok, most of these characters are legends or important characters for Nintendo and its respective franchises somehow. Sukapon is a sort of obscure and cult legend, but legend nonetheless. Kawashima is the mascot of the new line of successful Training products. Ouendan is one of the best bemani games and it's regarded as a complete success in Japan and overseas. Dedede is legendary, as Geno, Ike, Ridley, Takamaru, Olimar, Lip... all of them.
Waluigi can't be proud of anything: "I'm the skinny guy that appears in each party game with Wario". Toad, Toadette, Petey Piranha, King Boo the babies, Birdo, Bowser Jr and even the Koopa Troopas can say that too. That's not a feat.

How is Geno legendary? He only appeared in one game (and made a cameo in Mario and Luigi)

What do those characters have to be proud of? What about Dedede? He's...a fat penquin with a big hammer? What about Captain Olimar? So if anyone has their own game, they are automatically a legend?

Someone said that Brawl could be Waluigi's trampoline to the fame: He will get a solid background and the acceptance from participating in such an important game, but Smash Bros. should be the place for the characters to show what they've done through their career, not to start.

Answer me one question: What do they have to do with Waluigi for him to have a "career?" To have a major role in a Wario or Mario game?

Yes, Roy appeared in Melee before his own game, but his role in the Fire Emblem was decided beforehand and the Fire emblem franchise was in its lowest: An advertisement for the upcoming game was needed and some say that Roy appareance in Melee was what boosted the sales and popularity of Fuuin no Tsurugi and the resurrection of the franchise as a final goal.

That's why Waluigi in Brawl or in any smash game after that would be good. Melee made Roy popular, Fire Emblem popular, and as you said, "resurrected the franchise."

Even Tingle, who has its own game, won't get in Brawl. Tingle have gone through a lot and finally he got recognition, yet he has a long path to walk before making it to the next Smash Bros. (if there's even one). Waluigi hasn't done any of that. It's because Nintendo, but this is what he has right now.

What exactly is this "long path?"

Even WARIO didn't appeared in Melee, having many games, appareances and popularity (I was really upset as a Wario fan), and they waited to him . Waluigi won't get this time, he lacks many of the traits of other Smashers.

I'm sure that they wanted to add Wario, but there were too many Mario characters, they only had about less than two years, and they added filler and clone characters. If Wario was added, what if he was a clone or just had a really bad moveset?

Also, you haven't exactly said what the "traits of other smashers" are.

 

[El HP]

You guys mention waluigi has no personality or a deep backstory but rememeber characters like mario or link completely lack a personality so that is not a good argument.

About the spin-off games we are seeing references from these games in brawl like the mario kart stage so that argument is not valid.

Waluigi would never be a luigi clone they are vastly different how is waluigi going to throw fireball and super jump?

 

[Red_Maniac]

You guys mention waluigi has no personality or a deep backstory but rememeber characters like mario or link completely lack a personality so that is not a good argument.

Waluigi has no personality.

Are you FREAKING kidding me? Waluigi is rude, innappropriate, cocky, he always cheats, hates pretty much everyone but Wario, rude, arrogant, impatient and greedy. Mario's personality? Umm...he's a plumber who jumps on things.

About the spin-off games we are seeing references from these games in brawl like the mario kart stage so that argument is not valid.

Hmm, I never thought of that. Nice job!

Waluigi would never be a luigi clone they are vastly different how is waluigi going to throw fireball and super jump?

Well, there's a possibility that Waluigi can do that, but you're right that Waluigi will NEVER be a Luigi clone. Mainly because they are different physically.

 

[digifreak642]

I'm saying that Nintendo can make Waluigi more important, but they just haven't yet.

Exactly. He isn't important. So he shouldn't be in Brawl. Maybe AFTER they make him importnat.

Also, The Mario Kart stage doesn't single Waluigi out as good---Toad and a few other characters could be boosted... But the stage itself will not do much.

 

[K4M1K4Z3]

despite what everybody else thinks i say the more chars the better

 

[digifreak642]

There are limited spots for characters, and Waluigi isn't as deserving as others.

 

[X-x-Dyce-x-X]

Waluigi definitely takes a back seat to many other Mario characters: Toad, Bowser Jr., Birdo, etc., even Daisy deserves a spot over him and I don't feel she even belongs (just leave her as an alternate Peach costume). IF Waluigi were to be in the game, I would accept it, no big deal, but I'd have to look down a bit on Sakurai for neglecting all the other more deserving Mario candidates (unless they were put in too).

 

[Red_Maniac]

Exactly. He isn't important. So he shouldn't be in Brawl. Maybe AFTER they make him importnat.

Also, The Mario Kart stage doesn't single Waluigi out as good---Toad and a few other characters could be boosted... But the stage itself will not do much.

Well, I wouldn't mind if Waluigi appears as a cameo or a NPC. I just hope that he will be playable in any Smash game in the future.

It would be great if Waluigi was playable in Brawl though. Although some people here don't agree with that at all.

despite what everybody else thinks i say the more chars the better

Not too many, of course.

There are limited spots for characters, and Waluigi isn't as deserving as others.

He still has a chance.

Waluigi definitely takes a back seat to many other Mario characters: Toad, Bowser Jr., Birdo, etc., even Daisy deserves a spot over him and I don't feel she even belongs (just leave her as an alternate Peach costume). IF Waluigi were to be in the game, I would accept it, no big deal, but I'd have to look down a bit on Sakurai for neglecting all the other more deserving Mario candidates (unless they were put in too).

Toad, I would like, but I can't imagine what his moves would be like. Bowser Jr...I just hate him. Birdo...eh...maybe. And Daisy? Many people will not agree with what I'm about to say, but I think that Daisy is even LESS deserving than Waluigi. I know, I knkow, I sound like a crazy, psychotic person, but Daisy appeared in one main Mario character, but she was just like a replacement for Peach. She was almost exactly like her, but had a different colored dress, hair, and a different name. And like Waluigi, she appeared in nearly every Mario spin-off game, but unlike Waluigi, she has develoved NO personality or traits, and never appears without Peach. Waluigi has actually appeared in one or two games without Wario.

 

[digifreak642]

I think neither Daisy nor Waluigi should be in...

Toad and Geno have top spots...

Though Geno might be 3rd party...

 

[X-x-Dyce-x-X]

Geno falls somewhere on the same spectrum as Waluigi. Geno was developed by a 3rd party company too (I think), and he was in far less games than Waluigi, but he was in a game with a plot and he was a major character. This part honestly depends on who created Geno? Nintendo or Square?

 

[Red_Maniac]

Square. Nintendo's a first party.

 

[digifreak642]

Well, lets not get too off topic. The bottom line is, Waluigi isn't a good character for Brawl, but he could be better for a later game... If he gets a big role in a game.


Discussion over.

 

[Red_Maniac]

It's not over until the characters are revealed.

Waluigi still has a chance and has support and fans.

 

[Numa Dude]

The way I see it it's like this.

Bowser Jr. has the most chance of a new Mario character he is the second most important villain after his dad and already is the main baddy of two games. Second is Waluigi because of reasons already posted on this thread. Third and worst idea for a Mario character Toad. He is a generic character race but he still has a chance because he has been in so many Mario games as a playable character.

To sum it up Bowser jr. > Waluigi >>>>>>>>>> Toad.

 

[digifreak642]

Ummm....

Welll...

I think Toad should be at the top. He has had his own game (Wario's Woods) there is a specific Toad that is in games (large role in SMB2) and he was part of the original big 8.

 

[X-x-Dyce-x-X]

Well, lets not get too off topic. The bottom line is, Waluigi isn't a good character for Brawl, but he could be better for a later game... If he gets a big role in a game.


Discussion over.

Lol. Yea, discussion over in the thread all about this specific discussion. Sorry Digi, as much as I'm on your side on the Waluigi debate, you can't just end it like that. It's impossible.

And just because Toad is a generic race and never really specified to be a specific character, he could still be in. Yoshi isn't necessarily one specific character either, there's a whole race of them that look exactly the same. However, I don't think we COULD see Toad in Brawl, due to the fact that Peach uses him as a shield.

 

[Tiamat]

Square created Geno. Nintendo wouldn't have had to say Geno was a trademark of Square in Mario & Luigi if it were the other way around.

Also, Waluigi was created by Camelot, but Camelot was (at the time) a 2nd Party owned by Nintendo, not a 3rd Party like Square was. By that time, Nintendo had become quite savvy on the importance of character ownership, due to a nasty fiasco with Rare where Rare almost kept Diddy and possibly even Donkey Kong. I'm sure that pissed Nintendo off, because after that, Nintendo started including a LOT more trademark disclaimers about various characters being Nintendo's property, so after Camelot became independent, Nintendo made sure to hold onto all the licenses that Camelot made while Camelot was still owned by Nintendo.

Waluigi obviously is one of these (Golden Sun being another).

Geno, being made by a third party (not second party, which Camelot was) and also being before Nintendo got extremely protective of its character ownership (Square broke off with Nintendo long before the Rare fiasco), is obviously a different case.

(BTW, I'm 100% sure there was a character rights ownership battle with Rare when Rare was let go by Nintendo. THere were several articles and more in various gaming magazines around the time talking about it)

Also, Toad being a generic (which is debateable because at least in the past, there were Toads and then there was THE Toad) means absolutely nothing. Yoshi is just as generic (and in fact, Yoshi's genericness is even celebrated in Smash Bros. Melee. Note the Yoshi ARMY in both the intro and that you fight in Adventure Mode).

 

[GenG]

Toad is not generic, unlike people tend to believe due to NOA mistranlations. In Japan, Kinopio is the closest Toad (or Mushroom People) to the Princess, and it's the one we've seeing in Super Mario Bros. 2, Super Mario Kart, etc.

NOA just puts Toad as Toad, so there isn't any way to tell which is "the one". So I don't think he is generic.

 

[digifreak642]

Yeah, I agree that The Toad is not generic.

 

[Numa Dude]

You can't say Yoshi is a generic race so other generic race characters like Toad can get in. Yoshi is there to rep the Yoshi island franchise and who else can rep that but a Yoshi. The Mario series has characters that are way more important than toad like Bowser jr. and even Waluigi so toad while he does have a chance has a small one compared to bowser jr. and waluigi.

 

[X-x-Dyce-x-X]

THE Toad deserves to get in more than Waluigi, but once again, Peach's B would have to change to fit him in. They would either have to make her put her parasol out in front of her, or change the look of the Toad (Mushroom Person?... is there like a one word name for their race of people? Things will just get annoying because of this.) in her hands. Maybe make that one Toadsworth.

 

[digifreak642]

Yeah, Toadsworth or Perry would do fine replacing Toad as Peach's B-move.

 

[Numa Dude]

Bowser jr. and Waluigi are both more important to the Mario series than Toad generic race or not.

 

[Red_Maniac]

^ While I still support Waluigi, I would have to disagree...and also agree with that statement.

<_<

All toad has done is say "THANK YOU MARIO! BUT ARE PRINCESS IS IN ANOTHER CASTLE!" and instruct Mario on what to do. Not very important.

BUT Toad has been a playable character in SMB2. AND...that's all can think of.

Also, I despise Bowser Jr.

 

[X-x-Dyce-x-X]

Yea, I'm not much for Bowser Jr. either. And I don't like the idea of making his movesets from Super Mario Sunshine. Yea it was a good game, but I don't want his moves to revolve around a paintbrush that only appeared in one game. Also, I hate the idea of him turning into Shadow Mario. Honestly, one Mario is enough. No offense Mario. However I think I have to contradict myself, IMO, only Baby Mario hits the loophole on that one and could be put in.

 

[El HP]

What has Toad ever done? he appeared in SMB2 because nintendo got lazy and simply replaced the Doki Doki Panic characters with mario characters besides that Toad has had minor roles he is basically an NPC in Mario 64, Luigi's Mansion, Paper Mario games, Mario & Luigi etc. He doesn't even appear in Mario Sunshine, Super Mario World, Yoshi's Island , Power Tennis, some Mario Party games(as a playable character) among others Toadsworth is like a replacement for Toad this guy has no business in brawl.

 

[GenG]

What has Toad ever done? he appeared in SMB2 because nintendo got lazy and simply replaced the Doki Doki Panic characters with mario characters besides that Toad has had minor roles he is basically an NPC in Mario 64, Luigi's Mansion, Paper Mario games, Mario & Luigi etc. He doesn't even appear in Mario Sunshine, Super Mario World, Yoshi's Island , Power Tennis, some Mario Party games(as a playable character) among others Toadsworth is like a replacement for Toad this guy has no business in brawl.

Toad has more business in Brawl than Waluigi will ever have. He is more prominent to the Mario franchise.

 

[X-x-Dyce-x-X]

*Cough* Waluigi wasn't in those games either *Cough*

Toad has been a part of the franchise way longer than Wally. And just because Toad was an NPC in most of those games, doesn't excuse the fact that he was playable in a major role game and Waluigi hasn't been in any major game. Toad's face is tied to the Mario series way stronger than Wally's. Walugi NOT for Brawl.

 

[El HP]

Toad has more business in Brawl than Waluigi will ever have. He is more prominent to the Mario franchise.

Why is he is more prominent to the mario series then why he was replaced by a new character?

*Cough* Waluigi wasn't in those games either *Cough*

Toad has been a part of the franchise way longer than Wally. And just because Toad was an NPC in most of those games, doesn't excuse the fact that he was playable in a major role game and Waluigi hasn't been in any major game. Toad's face is tied to the Mario series way stronger than Wally's. Walugi NOT for Brawl.

Then why he never appeared in a major role again like peach did? just because he is been longer time doesn't mean anything Yoshi appeared in Mario World and he is the star of his own series something toad will never be.

 

[GenG]

Toad/Kinopio hasn't been replaced by Toadsworth.

 

[El HP]

Yes he was replaced Toadsworth is peach personal assistant as proven in Mario Sunshine and Mario&Luigi.

 

[GenG]

Maybe, but that doesn't mean that Toad has been replaced as a character. He keeps appearing in games (unlike Toadsworth, he doesn't appear in all of the recent ones) and even got Toadette as a sidekick.

However, the point is that Toad (like Birdo, the babies, Bowser Jr, etc.) has done much more than Waluigi for the Mario franchise.

 

[digifreak642]

toad was PLAYABLE for the beginning of Mario and Luigi.

 

[Tiamat]

Maybe he's talking about Mario & Luigi Partners in Time. Although it's pretty darn obvious once you think about it why they HAD to use Toadsworth in that game instead of Toad. Toad wouldn't have been able to fit the time travel has-a-younger-self Peach's fatherly caretaker role at all.

 

[eskimojo]

I think it would be interesting to see both toad and waluigi in brawl simply for the fact that their movesets would be very different. However, if Toad were in brawl, most likely he would end up low-tier, similar to the way Kirby was in Melee.