Q&A The official "Ask Your Questions" thread

[Soupeschleg]

I've known about the DK haxdash for a while. If it wasn't frame perfect I would probably use it more. I'll never be able to do this in an intense match, especially because you're literally pixels away from airdodging off the stage if you're doing it right. No thank you!

I remember back in PM 3.02, DK had a much easier fully invincible ledge stall. Fastfall off the edge, double jump and immediately do a frame 7 punch cancel (with no turn) and grab ledge. The frame 7 cancel makes DK's ledge grab boxes appear earlier than they would by waiting for the end of his double jump, and IIRC you have a whopping 2 frames of leniency on your input, which technically makes it twice as easy to perform as the haxdash. Kind of like Pichu's ledgestall. I don't know if it works in Melee. I would confirm it myself but I'm studying abroad in Spain for a month and so I'm away from my set-up. That's also why there won't be any new footage of me until mid september, most likely. Sorry guys.

whereabouts are you in Spain, if you don't mind me asking?
also PM is a mod

 

[CnB | Chandy]

I'm studying at the University of Granada. In Granada. Like, the city of Granada. Which is in Spain. The province of Andalusia. Which is in Spain. It's a country in Europe on the Iberian peninsula. Europe is a continent.

Did that answer your question?

 

[Hagrid]

lmao I know that grind. Also being able to turn around charge punch cancel as fast as possible so you're spinning all over the place when you're in the air

Lol yeah. How many spins do you reckon you could get in when dash jumping off pokemon stadium's mountain?

(These are the questions all DK mains should be asking)

 

[oukd]

yeah frame perfect haxdash is actually insane hard with dk lol. single haxdash still useful as a juke though since it usually makes people think youre going back onstage, and doesnt have to be frame perfect 99% of the time

 

[CnB | Chandy]

Hey, check out some cool stuff that I've done. Isn't that cool? I hope it's cool. Please tell me it's cool.

Try your best not to pop a semi-chub when you watch this combo:
http://gfycat.com/ParallelVigorousIcelandgull

Two 0-Deaths, 30 seconds, Zero DI:
http://www.gfycat.com/SkinnyHeavyAmurminnow
http://www.gfycat.com/BountifulVioletGavial

GET OUT OF MY HEAD, CHANDY! (Watch the playercam for bonus smug)
http://www.gfycat.com/DimwittedPleasedBabirusa

Always ban FD:
http://www.gfycat.com/HotHastyBillygoat

It's the year 20DK, and powershield Fsmash is a legitimate option:
http://www.gfycat.com/ConsciousPastArctichare

How to edgeguard the best Falco in Texas, ft. CIRCLE BUTTON:
http://www.gfycat.com/ShadowyUnsungBoa

That definitely aint Falco (Pillaring with DK 101):
http://www.gfycat.com/QuerulousIgnorantAndalusianhorse

 

[Hagrid]

Two 0-Deaths, 30 seconds, Zero DI:
http://www.gfycat.com/SkinnyHeavyAmurminnow
http://www.gfycat.com/BountifulVioletGavial

Ermehgerd that second one was bananas bro! Legendary stuff.

I finally did ok at a tournament using DK and got a couple of matches on stream! I really wanna post them here to get some feedback from all you DK playaz cos I definitely needa git gud.

 

[CnB | Chandy]

DK's nair is becoming my favorite move of his because it's so difficult to use correctly, but when you nail a set-up and it looks intelligent it just FEELS SO GOOD BRO it's like ugh I just want to stand up and spray my hot watery jism all over the CRT because it's so COOL. As a seasoned Madden player I have taken to exclaiming "CIRCLE BUTTON" loudly whenever I land it in friendlies. I would encourage all of you to do the same.

I wouldn't mind analyzing your DK at all. You've been such a sweetheart with the nice things you say about my footage so I'll try my best to give it the old Chandy rubdown. You might also like to know that I ended a set with your giant punch out of dash thing. Usually I only Giant Punch out a short hop if I want to do it raw (a bad habit of mine), so the guy didn't expect me to just run up and do it. You should name it something cool.

 

[Hagrid]

I call it the Ultra Secret Super Dash Smashing Dragon Monkey Knockout Punch of Unparalleled Destruction.

Or USSDSDMKPoUD for short.

Do you have a link to you using it in a real match? That's awesomeness

 

[JRad]

Some footage of my DK vs. an OG Falcon and apparently fox. I didn't realize he switched to Fox and he was just picking stage before I even chose a ban so thats what all that time in between was about. Didn't play my best since I haven't been using DK as much (been trying to learn some samus and haven't been as active) but feel free to critique, I'm always down to discuss my game play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ux5T_R8B7-A

 

[jonnobigz]

Some footage of my DK vs. an OG Falcon and apparently fox. I didn't realize he switched to Fox and he was just picking stage before I even chose a ban so thats what all that time in between was about. Didn't play my best since I haven't been using DK as much (been trying to learn some samus and haven't been as active) but feel free to critique, I'm always down to discuss my game play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ux5T_R8B7-A

I like your tech skill, just try to work on keeping track of unfavorable situations. Any time Falcon is off stage, go for an edgeguard. If I am near edge, I personally always either just throw off ledge, or dthrow off ledge because a Falcon edgeguard is basically guaranteed once you practice his options for recovery. If Falcon is hit off super far, you can generally just sit on stage and react to his recovery. If he DownB's though, just bair him out of it.

I also notice you kind of shut down during the second stock. It felt like you were trying to rely a whole lot on grabs and you didn't start even bairing until that stock. Dash into dtilt is a good move too, and if it hits, you can grab out of it most of the time.

Other than that, the Falcon match was solid gameplay, keep it up.

Against a campy Fox, just camp back. Charge your punch. Fullhop charge, then cancel it and jump again charge. Play around on platforms. Most Foxes give up the camping once you have one of the best moves in the game ready every encounter.

Also, I see a lot of people get too spooked to hit spacies out of their UpB's. Just go out and Bair them. Don't be scared.

Again, run up dtilt is very effective here.

I saw you start the second game how I would have, with the dthrow off stage. If you turn around bair, it covers the same option that you covered, and then the bair combos into strong hit upB and that's a stock. That's what I call the SFAT killer. Just another option.

Lots of questionable throws near the end there. Dthrow when you were between platforms was a bit odd, and I also don't understand the randy DownB attempts while Fox was in the air.

As a final note, don't forget about UpB oos! There are a couple times where Fox was pressuring you non-optimally and an upB would have put him in his place.

Keep up the dong. Take the opponent to Combo Jungle.

 

[CnB | Chandy]

Your punish game on Fox and Falcon is non optimal. Against any competent Fox you will be losing neutral constantly so, obviously, you will need to maximize your punishes and in general you are not doing that. But, you know this already. You know enough about the character as it is that it would be condescending for me to go into further detail.

In general, DK is not a character you can half-ass and still expect to find competitive success; he is too reliant on a precise punish game to be viable if he is rusty, as you appear to be in this video. Either practice him enough to maintain your consistency or don't play him in tournament anymore. That's some Chandy tough love right thur, but it's only because I'm invested in your success and you've been around long enough for me to expect more from you.

 

[CnB | Chandy]

LOLLLLLLLL jk can you believe if i actually talked to people like that?

good stuff dude!

 

[JRad]

Your punish game on Fox and Falcon is non optimal. Against any competent Fox you will be losing neutral constantly so, obviously, you will need to maximize your punishes and in general you are not doing that. But, you know this already. You know enough about the character as it is that it would be condescending for me to go into further detail.

In general, DK is not a character you can half-*** and still expect to find competitive success; he is too reliant on a precise punish game to be viable if he is rusty, as you appear to be in this video. Either practice him enough to maintain your consistency or don't play him in tournament anymore. That's some Chandy tough love right thur, but it's only because I'm invested in your success and you've been around long enough for me to expect more from you.

Nah you right boo <3.

And yeah there were definitely a few times where I should have grabbed ledge and I wasn't using running dtilt like I normally do.

 

[Green Ranger]

ne1 else like approaching with neutral b?

 

[Green Ranger]

**** is unsafe but rad as ****

 

[Soupeschleg]

sometimes you jump in and just throw the punch
sometimes you just charge it in their face like wassup
the penultimate mixup
thx GR

 

[Green Ranger]

best thing to a forward approach since grab bb :>

 

[CnB | Chandy]

http://youtu.be/SvbgZjXBwVk?t=380

@6:20 KILLEM

The uncharged 0-swing frame 7 punch is weak enough to jab reset with the shoulder hitbox. Only works on fatties like Ganon, Bowser, and Mewtwo though.

 

[Hagrid]

Some footage of my DK vs. an OG Falcon and apparently fox. I didn't realize he switched to Fox and he was just picking stage before I even chose a ban so thats what all that time in between was about. Didn't play my best since I haven't been using DK as much (been trying to learn some samus and haven't been as active) but feel free to critique, I'm always down to discuss my game play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ux5T_R8B7-A

Nice man! You pulled off some really interesting things here. In that first stock against fox you cargo down threw him offstage into an immediate onstage grounded up b?? Like WOW! Is that a thing???? Cos it looked really effective and if you hadn't dropped off ledge it would have been the stock. I think we need to workshop this.

Also I liked how you mixed up your approaches. You hit with more fair approaches in one set than I probably ever have ever. You even approached with down B which was awesome. I think you mixed these up just the right amount, using them more to surprise and catch your opponent off guard, as opposed to using them as a standard approach.

Personally I always try to grab ledge against falcon whenever possible. Your drop off ledge back air can cover some many options, even if falcon wants to try land on stage.

best thing to a forward approach since grab bb :>

AWWWW SHEEEET the ranger in green is back! This thread is quite literally, expanding dong.

You've been quiet GR. As the resident youtube stalker of all DK pros, I would know Please tell us you haven't given up on the DK. Your Kong is so strong it isn't funny. You could make a top tier cry out for mummy.

 

[JRad]

Nice man! You pulled off some really interesting things here. In that first stock against fox you cargo down threw him offstage into an immediate onstage grounded up b?? Like WOW! Is that a thing???? Cos it looked really effective and if you hadn't dropped off ledge it would have been the stock. I think we need to workshop this.

Also I liked how you mixed up your approaches. You hit with more fair approaches in one set than I probably ever have ever. You even approached with down B which was awesome. I think you mixed these up just the right amount, using them more to surprise and catch your opponent off guard, as opposed to using them as a standard approach.

Personally I always try to grab ledge against falcon whenever possible. Your drop off ledge back air can cover some many options, even if falcon wants to try land on stage.


AWWWW SHEEEET the ranger in green is back! This thread is quite literally, expanding dong.

You've been quiet GR. As the resident youtube stalker of all DK pros, I would know Please tell us you haven't given up on the DK. Your Kong is so strong it isn't funny. You could make a top tier cry out for mummy.

Thanks man, I try to keep it interesting. I think fair is definitely underrated. My edgeguarding and combo game was not on point and I think like Chandy said, I just have to keep playing him to keep it crisp. No worries my fellow apes, I will return back to my previous form soon .

 

[Soupeschleg]

Your Kong is so strong it isn't funny. You could make a top tier cry out for mummy.

come back after you've worked on your bars
that's a weak rhyme

 

[Hagrid]

come back after you've worked on your bars
that's a weak rhyme

Did you...... did you just call the DK Rap....... a 'weak rhyme'?

 

[Green Ranger]

Sacrilege! Sacrilege I say!

 

[Soupeschleg]

the dk rap doesn't define me
I'm a proud individual
and I have no respect for anyone that partakes in 'expand dong' memes
dk is not a joke
dk is serious business

 

[jonnobigz]

I personally expand dong in a serious way. Im a memer not because dk is just a meme to me, but a way of life. It is something we can all share. What can Mario mains share? Italian and plumber jokes? What about Captain Falcons? Knee jokes and manliness stuff? Be proud you are one of the Dongers.

We all expand dong to feature length together. We are all one dong.

 

[Hagrid]

Anyone else here really like how DKs model looks in Melee, but hates how it looks in Brawl, PM and smash4?

 

[jonnobigz]

Anyone else here really like how DKs model looks in Melee, but hates how it looks in Brawl, PM and smash4?

Yeah, Melee's is the best in my opinion. Sure, he has some funny proportions and some janky angular parts, but his face just feels the most dongy.

In Brawl, DK looks too fluffy and they changed his facial proportions just a little bit in the wrong way.

In Smash 4, DK is even fluffier, and his face is like a bad meme. I understand that he wanted to make it like a joke, but I feel like it loses a lot of the dong flavor.

Melee dong feels like he was taken straight from the Dongy Kong Country series. Still loves his bananas, knows how to have a good time, but still is the leader of the pack.

Brawl and Smash 4 dong feel like posers. I can't explain it any better than that.

PM dong is just a bastardized Brawl dong with a lot of broken animations. I can't cargo uthrow with him because it feels like people teleport out of my hands.

 

[Soupeschleg]

Anyone else here really like how DKs model looks in Melee, but hates how it looks in Brawl, PM and smash4?

Melee DK is the best
my ONLY gripe with this design is his hair squiggle. I think every official DK design has hair with a jimmy neutron-esque curl, but for some reason melee doesn't

spikey hair dk is whack

 

[Hagrid]

Glad I'm not the only one. Melee DK just looks the most badass especially with...

... dat toothy grin

 

[CnB | Chandy]

My only regret is that Black DK doesn't have a golden tie like in Brawl/PM. The royal blue tie is nice but that gold was so ****in classy. If I could do it all over again I would have started with blue DK because that pink tie is cute af, but now I'm an established black DK so it would be weird.

 

[Soupeschleg]

I **** with red DK 100%
His tie is West Virginia colors and his fur looks like the over saturated DKC gba ports that got me through hella traveling as a youngster

 

[Hagrid]

My only regret is that Black DK doesn't have a golden tie like in Brawl/PM. The royal blue tie is nice but that gold was so ****in classy. If I could do it all over again I would have started with blue DK because that pink tie is cute af, but now I'm an established black DK so it would be weird.

Good cos I'm the blue dk AKA blues clues AKA blonkey kong

 

[Hagrid]

On a more serious note, my city's very first major tournament is this weekend (In Australia - PAL DK ftw!) and I'm gonna be using DK all the way.

Any last minute tips you guys can give me so I don't bring total shame to the DK community?

 

[Soupeschleg]

On a more serious note, my city's very first major tournament is this weekend (In Australia - PAL DK ftw!) and I'm gonna be using DK all the way.

Any last minute tips you guys can give me so I don't bring total shame to the DK community?

Take your matches seriously. I see too many people play DK (or any other low tier) and approach tournaments with this fabricated "oh I don't care, I'm not serious" attitude to protect their ego. This is such a cop out. Give each opponent everything you've got and be ready to accept a loss for what it is. I promise it makes tournaments 100% more rewarding. Have fun!

 

[NJzFinest]

On a more serious note, my city's very first major tournament is this weekend (In Australia - PAL DK ftw!) and I'm gonna be using DK all the way.

Any last minute tips you guys can give me so I don't bring total shame to the DK community?

Dash shield pivot to move forward and have your back facing and use tilts

 

[CnB | Chandy]

That's some excellent advice, guys. At this point it's too late for in depth gameplay tips so I'll keep it to some general stuff I've learned as a tournament DK.

If you get on stream and the commentators end up being close to the TV, bring some earbuds and music just in case. If you're not used to playing a match with commentary, it can be distracting, and you don't want that to affect your play. Especially if they start talking smack about DK as a character, which a lot of commentators will do with any low tier. In my local scene people have learned to respect DK but when I travel it can still happen and it personally bugs me a lot.

Bring water. If you end up making it farther into bracket playing can start to get grueling, especially if you've been crammed in a venue with a bunch of sweaty dudes all day (this might be a Texan problem, but I would imagine it's hot as **** in Australia too). This is doubly true if you encounter slow struggle MUs like Samus, Jiggs, Peach, and ICs; these games will take a lot out of you and if you're not used to pushing your limits like this it will negatively affect your play.

Don't be afraid to ask for a minute or two between games to cool down and think about what's going on. If people start to figure out your strategies and tendencies (which is easier with DK than other characters with more options) it is important that you take that time to critically re-evaluate what improvements you need to make to win the set.

Nearly everyone in my state knows that I play DK now, but if you're not active/notable in your scene you may have the added benefit of people not knowing that about you. If this is the case, call a double blind pick for every match. I can't tell you how frustrating it is to arrive at the set-up, see that the other guy has selected Fox or Marth or whatever, and then once I pick DK he switches to Falco or Sheik or something. He's a dirtbag, but there's nothing you can do about it; you should have called double blind. If you're only going DK all tournament then you can only benefit from a double blind pick; even if your opponent has seen you play DK or otherwise knows he's your main, asking for a double blind may give him the impression that you'll pick someone else and he might switch off of a bad MU for you. And if they don't, then you're not any worse off than if you'd just sat down and picked DK from the start. If nothing else it can stop you from being unduly grimed into a bad MU.

Kind of a minor thing, but on Battlefield, Fountain, Yoshi's and Dreamland, it is always advantageous for you to start in the center of the stage and for your opponent to start on one of the side platforms. A lot of times you can start the match with a free up air on them before the word "Go!" even leaves the screen, which can lead into a gnarly punish on fastfallers or free stage position on floaties. These images indicate the spawn locations for each of the stage, so memorize them and use that information to your advantage. After stage striking, if your opponent has the port you want, ask him nicely if you can use that port. If he asks you why, just lie to him and say "Oh, I just really like how the <x port color> shield looks" or something like that. This spawn location stuff isn't common knowledge so in my experience they will almost always switch with you. If they refuse, then RPS them for the port you want. Technically you're supposed to settle any port selection disputes before stage striking occurs but this rule is also rarely enforced. If you lose the RPS or they cite that rule at you, ALWAYS ask for a neutral start to eliminate that advantage for them. Yes, this is a grimy trick, but screw them, you're playing DK and you need this help. Don't be afraid to switch ports in between games to maintain your advantage, either. Usually people won't say anything about it, but if they do, whatever, just switch back and be like "oh, I didn't know about that rule" even though YOU TOTALLY DID OMGGGGGGG DECEIT!!! On Battlefield and Dreamland P1 will always start on the bottom, and since these are the most common stages to strike to, try to get port 1 if at all possible to avoid any of this trickery. P2 never starts on the bottom, stay away from it.

As far as a quick gameplay tip that can help a lot, practice grabbing ledge out of a run by doing a short hop single-swing punch turnaround (optional fastfall depending on your height relative to the ledge). This is a fast way for DK to grab ledge out of a run and it will also add a swing to your punch for free, which is nice if you (like me) choose to use partial charge punch somewhat often. If you've been watching my footage then you've probably seen me do this a lot, but at 5:25 after the backthrow I demonstrate its utility as a fast way for DK to grab ledge when he is far from the edge of the stage and facing forward. Really easy to practice, very effective.

Good luck! No matter what happens, Chandy is proud of you.

 

[Hagrid]

Thanks guys! These are all really good tips! Makes me feel so cool to be part of this niche community of DK mains

I will play as serious as I can and hopefully learn a whole lot from the experience. There's definitely a lot more I can improve on, both in the technical sense and ability to perform under pressure. Should be great.

PAL DK never loses his giant punch so fingers crossed I can punch my way to a few victories

 

[Hagrid]

Came 13th! Was relatively happy with how I played, though theres definitely MUCH more I will need to perfect before I can compete with the guys at the top 10 level.

I had a great match off-stream where i caused a big upset against a shiek. But then followed up with an average match on stream against a fox where I failed to get anything going and copped a swift 2-0. Hopefully I can post some vids soon once they are on YouTube (small community here so vids can take a long time to be uploaded)

Cheers for all the pointers boys, they definitely helped out on the day.

 

[CnB | Chandy]

Did you lame anyone out with the spawn point trick? If you did it even once I'd still be proud. I mean 13th at your first big tournament is pretty dank anyway so I'm proud either way. I can't help but feel 110% responsible for all of your victories.

Hot DK Samus footage incoming, yall.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsrHSbEzvTE
https://youtu.be/446RLZ743t4

I don't think this match-up is that bad, but it's a soul-crushing grind if the Samus player is smart with their missiles and CC opportunities, the latter of which are especially annoying because Samus is heavy enough to eat bairs into her mid% and still have enough frame advantage to CC dsmash. Jab is annoying in microsituations but it's only one tool and you can always beat it with CC grab or (CC up-B if you're really close). If your bair spacing is on point and your edgeguarding is methodical you can make it very annoying for the Samus. Unlike the fastfaller MUs where DK's game plan is more like Marth's, you want to play the floaty MU's more in line with Sheik's game plan, where you stick to guaranteed follow-ups just to build percent and then attempt to use your spacing tools to win neutral over and over again. Then, exhibit patience and quick reactions at the ledge, making sure to continually abuse how slow and deliberate Samus' recovery and ledge options are by bairing her like the floaty mid-tier she is.

Once you see the tether come out, drop down to Samus' height and up-B her if she's close enough to ledge height that you can make it back, it feels so good and it will kill her early.

The standard floaty combos work on her but once again be careful of her weight, only the quick stuff like weak autocancel bair into strong bair and double uairs will work. Generally grab combos will be to build percent and maintain stage position, which is a very not fun way to play Donkey Kong but you knew what you were getting into with this character. Samus has a hard time coming down, with forward air being pretty slow and easily punishable and a slowish nair compared to Sheik and Luigi. Samuses (Sami?) like to nair as a panic button a lot, similar to Luigis, so bait that out after you've started a juggle with an up-air or two and punish with a well-timed uair, usmash, or up-B for some meaty percent. The aim is just to keep her above you. Example of a standard Samus string here, here, here and another here.

Up-B in general is safer on Samus and the other mega floaties because they get sent so far away and take so long to come down that they can't immediately be aggressive like Fox or Falcon. Use aerial up-B as a mix-up to beat out some of Samus' higher priority aerials like dair and bair, it looks dumb but it's fast and intangible so you might as well just throw that **** out sometimes if you see an attack coming. It always wins if timed correctly. Example here, here and another here.

Bair through missiles, but be conscious of your position relative to what options Samus can threaten, especially with the hitlag from missiles slowing DK down a bit. If you're about three DK-lengths away from Samus then you can bair a missile and she can't do anything about it. Closer than that and she can grab your landing, ftilt, fsmash or dash attack you. If you're close enough that you can hit Samus and her missile, then that's super sick and you should totally do it but be wary of that range in between. Example can be found right at the start of the video, but generally you want a stronger bair if she's at low percent.

Don't be afraid to just go out and poop on Samus if she starts doing her bomb jump shenanigans high up. DK's recovery prevents him from going deep on Samus, but he can go pretty far out and still make it back because of that nice horizontal distance. Bair and up-B will both kill Samus quite early if done that close to the blast zones, and she's pretty vulnerable during a lot of her recovery sequence. Example here.

Your main kill option other than edgeguarding will be cargo uthrow full jump double jump immediate uair, credit to NjZ for the execution. From the ground cargo uthrow, immediate fulljump, and then a few frames BEFORE the apex of your full jump, double jump and uair. This precise combination allows DK to cover the most vertical distance in the shortest time possible, which will be necessary to make this connect at kill %s on Samus, Jigglypuff, and Peach. See some examples here.

Any questions or suggestions, let me know. I'm back in the states now so expect more Chandy footage to come.

 

[Narr]

Does charged Giant Punch just disappear after a while, or am I doing something seriously wrong?