The Master of Unlocking, JILL, will survive in Smash!

Looma

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#41
Ooh movesets! I don't quite have a full moveset, but one thing of Jill's that I've been super fixated on is this thing:


I envision a cool side special in the grenade launcher. I'd like a move where inputting normally shoots out a regular grenade round, but you can also input slightly upwards for flame rounds or downwards for ice rounds instead.

Flame rounds would be the most damaging, but have less knockback.
Grenades have enough knockback to be a viable KO option.
Ice rounds would obviously freeze an opponent like how a PK Freeze would.

A somewhat unpredictable projectile game could suit Jill. Make approaching her tricky, reflecting how in RE you generally want to take out an enemy before they get too close and take a big bite out of you.
 

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#42
Problems with RE5 itself aside, I did like Jill’s gameplay in it or rather her melee moves, plus she had the faster stabby knife. Double knee drop I could see as a down throw or something, though not sure about the head grab where she jumps on and snaps the neck with her legs, but I liked it too. Since guns are pretty much on the table now, samurai edge is a must.

I’m glad the RE3 remake seems to be happening sooner than later, after how good the RE2 one was. An RE8 I think can wait awhile.
 
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#44
What if Jill took one move from her MvC2 appearance in the same way that Megaman took his uppercut from that game?
 

staindgrey

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#48
Here's a lil' thingy i put together for Jill.
I just wanted to note that your song selection is spot-on. Great choices.

The only things I'd want to add are more Mercenaries/Versus themes. I'd kill to Smash to Assault Fire:

 

praline

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#49
Well i’ll Post what I’ve thought up of Jill’s moveset. It might suck but whatevz.

B: Machine Gun
She pulls out the machine gun from re1 and starts firing it forward. If the b button is held you can use the control stick to change the direction of the bullets.

Side B: Flash Grenade
It works pretty similar to Snake’s grenade but stuns instead of dealing damage.

Down B: Grenade Change
changes the grenade from explosive rounds to acid rounds to flame rounds
Explosive Rounds have a smaller blast radius and are the weakest
Acid Rounds has a bigger blast radius and also deal added damage on anyone in the explosion for a short time afterwards
Flame Rounds has a bigger blast radius and deals more damage.
All 3 types have a limited supply and have icons above Jill’s icon and %, they restock after a certain amount of time. Explosive resupplying fastest, flame being the slowest.

Up B: Grenade Launcher
On the ground she shoots a grenade forward, does whatever grenade up you use.
In the air she shoots it downward and it explodes immediately launching Jill up. Flame Rounds launch you the highest.

Final Smash: Rocket Launcher
Jill pulls out the rocket launcher from re3 and yells “I’ll show you stars!”(Yes I know she doesn’t say that when she’s using the rocket launcher) Then shoots out 4 rockets directly in front of the direction she’s facing.
I’ll post the normals later when I think of them all.
 

OnyanRings

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#50
I just wanted to note that your song selection is spot-on. Great choices.

The only things I'd want to add are more Mercenaries/Versus themes. I'd kill to Smash to Assault Fire:

Thanks ! I really wanted to put a lot more but the boxs weird size was kinda difficult to work with.
 

Looma

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#51
Yo if we're going over some RE tunes

RE2make had some good ones that I'd like to have in Smash

Also, hearing SSBU's Parasite Queen remix has left me dying for a new Smash arrangement of Unstoppable Nemesis.
thanks for pointing me towards Atrocity too, I never thought that embarrassment of a game would have some good music in it
 

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#53
I hope that we don't get the version of UMvC3.

I prefer something closer to her MvC2 version by a mile.
You and the rest of the world.

I don't remember MvC3 Jill being well received anywhere. Part of that was due to being on-disc DLC. Part was her blonde brainwashed design. But the biggest offense was being a 'meh' moveset.

MvC2 Jill had loads more personality and closer matches Sakurai's typical desire to reflect a series's roots.
 

Kirbeh

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#55
I did up some potential Jill color varations.

What are all the references here? I'm guessing; Default, RPD Leon?, Ada or Claire, Chris or Rebecca, Krauser or Army Jill (REmake), Wesker, and maybe Sheva on the last one. I'm drawing a blank on the seventh color though.
 
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Oddball

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#56
What are all the references here? I'm guessing; Default, RPD Leon?, Ada or Claire, Chris or Rebecca, Krauser or Army Jill (REmake), Wesker, and maybe Sheva on the last one. I'm drawing a blank on the seventh color though.
Pretty good guess.

It's actually, default/Marvel vs Capcom, a more subdued Wii remake color scheme, Claire, Rebecca, Army Jill, a Resident Evil Archives Jill Action figure variant that I liked, Resident Evil: Apocalypse's Alice, and Sheva.

You were close though.

I was actually tempted to just agree with you and say you were right about "Wesker" rather than explaining the figure.
 

ninjahmos

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#57
I’m in! Also not only should Jill be in Smash, but I think we also need Chris and Leon for Smash. We also need music from Resident Evil (1996), Resident Evil (2002), Resident Evil 2 (1998), Resident Evil 2 (2019), Resident Evil 3: Nemesis, Resident Evil 4, Resident Evil 5, and Resident Evil: Code: Veronica (X) for Smash. Both originals and new remixes!

I’m in! Also not only should Jill be in Smash, but I think we also need Chris and Leon for Smash. We also need music from Resident Evil (1996), Resident Evil (2002), Resident Evil 2 (1998), Resident Evil 2 (2019), Resident Evil 3: Nemesis, Resident Evil 4, Resident Evil 5, and Resident Evil: Code: Veronica (X) for Smash. Both originals and new remixes!
Sorry for the double post, but I’d especially love to hear Masami Ueda do new remixes of music from these games.
 
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Ridley_Prime

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#59
While I generally prefer classic Jill too, UMvC3 Jill didn’t really bother me (DLC practice at the time aside), as she still felt fun to play as the others for me, just wasn’t as creative with the moveset. The arcade ending she had of teaming up with Blade was weird though, which made me wish I saw a MvC ending with classic Jill.
 

ninjahmos

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#61
Assuming you mean the basement theme from the Director's Cut.


Absolutely not.
Why would Capcom change the music in the DualShock version of the Director’s Cut?! What were they thinking?! The music wasn’t changed in the original Director’s Cut!

Well, the DualShock version’s music had its ups and downs, at least.
 
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Kirbeh

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#65
You know who’s another RE character that I think should also be playable for Smash? HUNK.
HUNK's cool, but if we got more than one RE rep then I do think some combination of Jill, Chris or Leon would fit best. I could see HUNK getting in as an assist. He could be like Gray Fox but with guns and an extraction point.
 

Kirbeh

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#67
Wait, who's HUNK again ?...
Searches HUNK on google
No, not THAT kind of HUNK !
Searches HUNK Resident Evil

Oh... That's one cool motherhugger.
But he is that kind of HUNK.

Anyway, fighters and assists aside, I think it's about time another third party series adds some items. Castlevania added Death's Scythe and Namco added in the Special Flag and Boss Galaga from Rally X and Galaxian respectively. 3 so far which isn't too bad, but I still think they could've pulled a few more from Sonic, Mega Man, Final Fantasy, etc.

Though I suppose if Mega Man added the E Tank and RE could potentially add the First Aid Spray, that might seem a bit redundant since they'd do the same thing.

However, a bit of an odd idea I had was adding in the Tactical Vest from RE4. It'd basically be temporary armor that reduces damage and increases knockback resistance. Plus it'd be another "wearable" item. The thought of Pikachu or Duck Hunt and the like in tactical vests seems like the sort of weird, but funny sort of thing that'd fit in Smash quite well.
 

staindgrey

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#68
Anyway, fighters and assists aside, I think it's about time another third party series adds some items. Castlevania added Death's Scythe and Namco added in the Special Flag and Boss Galaga from Rally X and Galaxian respectively. 3 so far which isn't too bad, but I still think they could've pulled a few more from Sonic, Mega Man, Final Fantasy, etc.

Though I suppose if Mega Man added the E Tank and RE could potentially add the First Aid Spray, that might seem a bit redundant since they'd do the same thing.

However, a bit of an odd idea I had was adding in the Tactical Vest from RE4. It'd basically be temporary armor that reduces damage and increases knockback resistance. Plus it'd be another "wearable" item. The thought of Pikachu or Duck Hunt and the like in tactical vests seems like the sort of weird, but funny sort of thing that'd fit in Smash quite well.
An item that could work would be Jill's taser from REmake.

While you hold onto it, any close range attack by your opponent you automatically counter by shoving the taser into 'em.
 

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#70
I like that idea for a move!
I'm torn on it as a move in a Jill moveset.

Pro: It's pulled directly from the game as a faithful representation of Jill.
Con: It's a counter, and in competitive play counters, like, barely get used.

But the taser is something that is very specific to Jill and Jill alone, so.
 

Kirbeh

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#71
An item that could work would be Jill's taser from REmake.

While you hold onto it, any close range attack by your opponent you automatically counter by shoving the taser into 'em.
Everybody gets a counter? Are you mad?!

Honestly though that's a really great idea. An item that gives characters a single use counter is both really unique and properly representative of the way the item works in the source material.

I could also see it being used in Jill's moveset like you brought up, and honestly I can decide where it'd work better. On the one hand it's a Jill specific defense item in Remake that makes for a good counter special, but as a concept for an item it works really well too and does something we haven't seen yet for an item.
 
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staindgrey

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#72
I could also see it being used in Jill's moveset like you brought up, and honestly I can decide where it'd work better. On the one hand it's a Jill specific defense item in Remake that makes for a good counter special, but as a concept for an item it works really well too and does something we haven't seen yet for an item.
With Jill's moveset, I have too many ideas for potential specials. Sticking to only neutral, side and down (because recovery probably won't be a weapon) is hard. And I kind of don't want to waste down special on a counter.

So I'd considered using taser is a super close range smash instead of as a counter, but putting that in as an item instead might be the best idea. I'm starting to like this.
 

Kirbeh

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#73
With Jill's moveset, I have too many ideas for potential specials. Sticking to only neutral, side and down (because recovery probably won't be a weapon) is hard. And I kind of don't want to waste down special on a counter.

So I'd considered using taser is a super close range smash instead of as a counter, but putting that in as an item instead might be the best idea. I'm starting to like this.
The Up Special is the thing that always stumps me. A long time ago, I came up with the idea that instead of a regular Up Special for getting back onto the stage, a potential RE character could have a different type of "recovery" via the herbs. Essentially an Up B that heals in order to avoid getting knocked off stage in the first place.

I posted that in the Leon thread actually, but most said they'd prefer something like firing the Rocket Launcher into the ground sort of how some shooters like TF2 have a rocket jump. I mean it's functional I guess, but the reason I came up with using herbs as a healing special in the first place was because I wasn't fond of the rocket jump idea. I get that some creative liberties can and sometimes need to be taken here and there but that idea just doesn't feel fitting for an RE character imo.

Going back to the Stun Gun tho, I honestly don't think it's a waste even though many would complain of another counter. If it fits the character then I think it's fine, I think the issue here is that we need more counters to have different properties. And sure, maybe less counters overall would benefit too (especially among the FE cast), but I don't think a perfectly fitting move should be shelved just because other characters have something similar. With as many characters as there are, some overlap is going to happen, and overlap in moves has been a thing since 64 even without addressing clone characters.

To make the Stun Gun stand out, how about a physical only counter like you said (so no tanking projectiles like Marth, etc.), but instead of launching opponents it stuns them like the Paralyzer/Dragon Fang Shot. Less damage and KO potential on it's own, but it gives you the opportunity to follow up with whatever you want.

edit: And since you mentioned it as a smash attack, I also funnily enough had it as Up Smash in my mock up for her, but it feels weird as a smash attack imo so that spots blank for now too...
 
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staindgrey

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#74
The Up Special is the thing that always stumps me. A long time ago, I came up with the idea that instead of a regular Up Special for getting back onto the stage, a potential RE character could have a different type of "recovery" via the herbs. Essentially an Up B that heals in order to avoid getting knocked off stage in the first place.

I posted that in the Leon thread actually, but most said they'd prefer something like firing the Rocket Launcher into the ground sort of how some shooters like TF2 have a rocket jump. I mean it's functional I guess, but the reason I came up with using herbs as a healing special in the first place was because I wasn't fond of the rocket jump idea. I get that some creative liberties can and sometimes need to be taken here and there but that idea just doesn't feel fitting for an RE character imo.

Going back to the Stun Gun tho, I honestly don't think it's a waste even though many would complain of another counter. If it fits the character then I think it's fine, I think the issue here is that we need more counters to have different properties. And sure, maybe less counters overall would benefit too (especially among the FE cast), but I don't think a perfectly fitting move should be shelved just because other characters have something similar. With as many characters as there are, some overlap is going to happen, and overlap in moves has been a thing since 64 even without addressing clone characters.

To make the Stun Gun stand out, how about a physical only counter like you said (so no tanking projectiles like Marth, etc.), but instead of launching opponents it stuns them like the Paralyzer/Dragon Fang Shot. Less damage and KO potential on it's own, but it gives you the opportunity to follow up with whatever you want.

edit: And since you mentioned it as a smash attack, I also funnily enough had it as Up Smash in my mock up for her, but it feels weird as a smash attack imo so that spots blank for now too...
When I had thought of it as a Smash, my idea was more similar to Ridley's downB than to ZSS's dsmash. But.

A big reason why I've gone against the idea of a downB taser counter is I'd prefer a downB variation of the zombie summon in MvC2. To me, incorporating BOWs as projectiles would actually be more unique as a franchise representation than a simple taser. And while you could attribute a BOW summon to sideB or neutralB, I really want her grenade launcher and magnum (preferably Barry's Colt Anaconda) incorporated, which leaves the taser counter the odd man out.

For her upB, I think your idea is unique; I just worry that it would be easy to abuse once you hold a stock lead, encouraging camping tactics to constantly heal yourself. I can see why people would be worried about it. In all honesty, I feel like a RE character would have limited mobility factored into their moveset to represent tank controls, and Jill/Leon/whoever would simply have a 'meh' shoryuken-esque recovery move, rather than a rocket jump.

For Jill specifically, you could try and incorporate her flip-jump-snap-their-neck-with-her-thighs move as a vertical/horizontal recovery, too, similar to ZSS's downB.



While I'd prefer to keep Jill's moveset fairly limited to RE1/RE3 representation, I think some of her acrobatics from RE5/Revelations wouldn't be completely out of place. Long as she isn't bouncing all over the place.

In fact, any of these RE5 melee moves could be used for smashes and tilts.
 

Kirbeh

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#75
When I had thought of it as a Smash, my idea was more similar to Ridley's downB than to ZSS's dsmash. But.

A big reason why I've gone against the idea of a downB taser counter is I'd prefer a downB variation of the zombie summon in MvC2. To me, incorporating BOWs as projectiles would actually be more unique as a franchise representation than a simple taser. And while you could attribute a BOW summon to sideB or neutralB, I really want her grenade launcher and magnum (preferably Barry's Colt Anaconda) incorporated, which leaves the taser counter the odd man out.

For her upB, I think your idea is unique; I just worry that it would be easy to abuse once you hold a stock lead, encouraging camping tactics to constantly heal yourself. I can see why people would be worried about it. In all honesty, I feel like a RE character would have limited mobility factored into their moveset to represent tank controls, and Jill/Leon/whoever would simply have a 'meh' shoryuken-esque recovery move, rather than a rocket jump.

For Jill specifically, you could try and incorporate her flip-jump-snap-their-neck-with-her-thighs move as a vertical/horizontal recovery, too, similar to ZSS's downB.



While I'd prefer to keep Jill's moveset fairly limited to RE1/RE3 representation, I think some of her acrobatics from RE5/Revelations wouldn't be completely out of place. Long as she isn't bouncing all over the place.

In fact, any of these RE5 melee moves could be used for smashes and tilts.
I had similar doubts and got similar feedback from the Leon thread regarding the herbs, but I still think it'd be doable. Just incredibly difficult to find the right balance in which case I suppose it might not be worth it after all.

However, limited mobility is kind of why I figured there's a chance it could work. It wouldn't heal too much, and an RE character would probably be outclassed in terms of movement options compared to most everyone else on the roster so it's more something to use sparingly when you manage to get some breathing room as opponents can close the distance quickly (or play keep away themselves) and likely juggle you (I figure an RE rep would probably be a bit on the heavier side and a fast faller.)

As for the Cerberus/Crow/Zombie move from MvC2, I'm actually kind of against the idea personally. BOWs are definitely important to RE, but I think they're a bit odd as moves for an RE character. It works well for someone like Frank West for example, but less so for RE (that's just me though, I know I'm probably in the minority on this one.)

MvC2 Jill was unique and interesting, but she honestly didn't feel like a good representation of RE imo. It was cool to see them incorporate BOWS in her moves, since she's actually noticing/dodging them when she "summons" them, but that along with Charging STARS, and some of her other normals and general portrayal felt like she was designed less to be accurate to RE and more to make RE fit in with the other MvC cast/design of MvC2.

And it does work there for what it is, but I think a slower, weapon/item management based moveset would fit better to represent how the classic RE games play. The BOWs however definitely need to be there, and the RE stage is where I think they could be used best. Afterall, unlike MvC2, Smash has the benefit of crazy stages with hazards and the like.

I know a lot people (myself included) have a lot of gripes with the really big stages like GCO and Palutena's Temple, but I think a large Resident Evil stage with lots of different BOWs that can spawn around the place would work really well. As stage hazards, all fighters, including Jill would have to be wary of them and at times even stop fighting each other to fend off or run away from them.

Then you could even incorporate the herbs/first aid spray there as items exclusive to the stage that you can find and heal yourself with. And if they really want to go all out, they could even include locked doors with keys to them scattered around the place.

In one stage you could have an arena that opens up as players fight/explore, enemies that attack all combatants, on-stage healing items, etc.
 
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#76
The Up Special is the thing that always stumps me. A long time ago, I came up with the idea that instead of a regular Up Special for getting back onto the stage, a potential RE character could have a different type of "recovery" via the herbs. Essentially an Up B that heals in order to avoid getting knocked off stage in the first place.
This is a really good idea. Having to get out of harm's way to heal feels very accurate to RE. It would require some tricky balancing, but if done it would be one of the best 'gimmicks' Smash has done.
When I had thought of it as a Smash, my idea was more similar to Ridley's downB than to ZSS's dsmash. But.

A big reason why I've gone against the idea of a downB taser counter is I'd prefer a downB variation of the zombie summon in MvC2. To me, incorporating BOWs as projectiles would actually be more unique as a franchise representation than a simple taser. And while you could attribute a BOW summon to sideB or neutralB, I really want her grenade launcher and magnum (preferably Barry's Colt Anaconda) incorporated, which leaves the taser counter the odd man out.

For her upB, I think your idea is unique; I just worry that it would be easy to abuse once you hold a stock lead, encouraging camping tactics to constantly heal yourself. I can see why people would be worried about it. In all honesty, I feel like a RE character would have limited mobility factored into their moveset to represent tank controls, and Jill/Leon/whoever would simply have a 'meh' shoryuken-esque recovery move, rather than a rocket jump.

For Jill specifically, you could try and incorporate her flip-jump-snap-their-neck-with-her-thighs move as a vertical/horizontal recovery, too, similar to ZSS's downB.



While I'd prefer to keep Jill's moveset fairly limited to RE1/RE3 representation, I think some of her acrobatics from RE5/Revelations wouldn't be completely out of place. Long as she isn't bouncing all over the place.

In fact, any of these RE5 melee moves could be used for smashes and tilts.
What is that GIF.

What did I just see.
 

staindgrey

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#77
What is that GIF.

What did I just see.
It's BSAA Jill in Mercenaries mode on The Mines, forward flipping into the air to land on a Majini's shoulders, snap his neck with her thighs just as a piece of thrown dynamite goes off in the background, resulting in a second, larger explosion of a nearby red barrel of gasoline just as she lunges forward off of the now dead body to gracefully flip through the air and land on her feet a couple yards ahead.

Duh.
 

Looma

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#78
As far as BOWs are concerned, I think incorporating them into a Resident Evil stage ala Dracula's Castle is the way to go. I'm not a fan of "summon" moves at all, I like Jill doing what Jill does.

I think a desolate part of Raccoon City would be the best possible location for a stage. Looking in the background, you would see the occasional shambling zombie in the distance. Lickers could be seen crawling out of windows and on walls. Drain Deimos could sometimes be seen in an alley. Stuff like that,

Very rarely on the stage, you would hear a loud crashing sound coming from the background. A few seconds later, a familiar "Stars..." can be heard, and you can catch a glimpse of the ole Pursuer prowling in the background. He leaves you alone, of course, he's just there to be big and scary. King Dedede doesn't exactly look like S.T.A.R.S. material to me (though this makes less sense if Jill is in play, we could just say he's looking for Brad or something I dunno). I like the idea of watching Nemesis on the hunt.
 
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#79
Kinda off-topic but I instantly thought about Jill when I saw this fan-art on Twitter.
 
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