Q&A The 'Mains' Advice Thread

[Justinian]

I'm looking for a character that kinda fits the glass canon archetype

The best options for this are , and kind of .

Fox is a more "pure" glass cannon: amazing mobility, one of the best advantage states in the game, lose neutral two-three times and you die. Takes HARD advantage of vertical and horizontal stage control with the best juggling in the game and top 5 ledgetrapping. Watch Larry Lurr's aggression, Megafox's neutral game, and Nakat's patience to see how the top Foxes play., and also Skarfelt's YouTube channel for combos, movement, and other Fox stuff.

Roy, like Fox, has a great advantage state, with powerful tech chases and good reward off grabs at most percentages, but is a midweight fastfaller with a bad recovery, meaning he's free to combo and has poor endurance. His ledgetrapping is almost as scary as Fox's, so he's pretty good at keeping the opponent in disadvantage. The only thing about him is that he's got decent, but not spectacular mobility and an unreliable neutral game (mostly focused on mixups). Definitely worth trying out if you're into glass cannons. Watch HyperKirby to see Roy played at the highest level.

Mewtwo looks like a glass cannon from a stats perspective, but his playstyle is actually fairly defensive. He does have a really easy time getting kills and a strong advantage state in general though. In my opinion, he's more of a lightning bruiser, but worth looking at since his aggression and pressure is relatively safe if you play right. Check out Abadango, Rich Brown and KillerJawz (the last of whom is basically the Skarfelt of Mewtwos) for high and top level Mewtwo play.

 

[DeltaForce]

Check a few pages back we discussed this earlier

https://smashboards.com/threads/the-mains-advice-thread.393398/page-80

 

[IAteYourLastChip]

Hey I'm wondering if anyone can help me find my main for competitive melee I'm just getting started

- I'm I tend to be "aggressive" at times I guess you can say by nature
- I like combos and edgeguarding gives me that satisfying feel when I do it successfully
- I don't hate like projectiles but I don't like them to death either

- I would like to be or but I'm new to the game so I don't think I'm ready for those to yet not mention I cant press buttons very fast no matter how much I try nor can I think quick

 

[KniteBlargh]

I IAteYourLastChip This question really belongs somewhere in the Melee forums; this thread is meant for finding Smash Wii U/3DS mains.

However, since you're here, I'll make a couple quick suggestions for you. It's important to note that learning to be watchful/mindful of your opponent's reactions is always a good thing, so full-on aggression is generally something you want to keep in its place.
: Obviously with skill he's amazing, but he's fun for newer players as well due to his ridiculous sword range, grab, and not requiring the quickest of inputs (though you'll get benefits from your hands getting quicker with experience, which is basically true of any character). There is some pacing to his attacks that could end up feeling just about the right speed for you.
: Sheik gets a lot of good out of tech chasing, which can be a good teaching aid when it comes to being more watchful like I mentioned above, but she's another good one in my opinion for newer players. In Melee, her fair is actually a kill move and can combo from a down throw. Down throw has a lot of follow-up options to look into, some being more character specific. Borp is a Melee Sheik main notorious for getting decent results without much tech skill at all, so be sure to look him up! (In case you don't already know, you can start a match as Sheik by holding the A button on the character select screen until the match begins.)

Each character's respective forum will give you more information, but there's a starting point, at least.

 

[DietDrKelp]

Hey all!
Despite the profile picture, I have been on a main search for quite some time and have played many characters trying to figure out who exactly I like. I'm looking for a character that can be played optimally at low and high level that demands respect in neutral. The people I play with have adapted to my habits to make it where it is hard to gauge whether or not I'm doing well with a character. I started from Cloud and played him for most of my smash 4 career, only to change to Mario, then to Lucario and stuck with Lucario for a while. Following this, I realized I liked the way Lucario played, but was feeling burnt out, so I picked up Mewtwo to cover matchups. So obviously by this point, I had been all over the board. After about a month of practice at my University, I attended a tournament again and went 2-2, which left a very dissatisfied taste in my mouth as I usually place at least top 13 in my locals. I was bummed and proceeded to take a break from the game for my own sake. Recently, I have come back with a new mindset for the game and have been playing a character that I believe to have a strong neutral, Corrin.
However, Corrin is a character that suffers against faster characters and can have trouble landing and getting in. I, in my humble opinon, have a decent knowledge for the game and neutral as well as what each character can do.
All of this to say, I need help.
I like characters with good combo game and strong neutral. Something that can convert hard off of stray hits that demands respect at the low and high level. I know that's a lot to ask, but I saw this thread and figured why not. If you have any input, I'd love to hear it! Thanks so much!

 

[KniteBlargh]

DietDrKelp I'll chip in a little, hopefully it'll be of some use to you (much of this is just my opinion and from my own experience, so take it all with a grain of salt).
was a good choice, but he's not super big on combos, more about stringing his giant hit-boxes together depending on your opponent's habits/actions (Tweek's playstyle is a good example of what I'm trying to get across here). However, I don't know of another character who screams both low and high level threat more than he does. Even without limit, a good read from Cloud can be terrifying.
has amazing combos, but his neutral falls flat compared to some of the other top tiers; his limbs are on the short side, and fireball really doesn't offer much in the way of stage control. FLUDD can do some cool stuff, but eh, not so much in the neutral.
is a tricky one. He's always a threat with rage and aura, but his neutral isn't too threatening; he does seem to rely quite a bit on slip-ups from the opponent aside from aura sphere charging being a great ledge trap. He has some cool combos, definitely, but they change more drastically depending both on his own and his opponent's damage % than in the case of many other characters, so low level play tends to fall short in that respect.
I think his neutral is pretty decent, combo/string potential is great. He is a glass cannon, and a giant hurt-box for that matter, which means you end up having to watch out for yourself quite a bit; matches can swing out of your favour rather easily without enough focus. His interesting movement mechanics/options and optimal throw damage tend not to be utilized much at a lower level, and I feel they both have a sizable share in his success.
/ I may be missing something here, but you sound as though you're pretty set on the idea of playing Corrin along with another character? Not sure. I'll skip this one and let someone else chime in if needed.

So, have you considered trying ? He has quite a bit of tech to consider while progressing as well as some tricky recovery issues (even Zero hits the ledge in just the wrong way on occasion, which causes Diddy's jet pack to blow up and renders him helpless). However, his neutral is very strong, he has lots of combos to choose from, amazing ledge options with banana peel, and is even pretty decent at lower levels of play. At low levels, I'd still say and are more optimal, but since they didn't seem to click for you, playing him could help you figure out what you like best.

 

[DietDrKelp]

KniteBlargh Sadly, where I am from is full of Diddy mains and it makes it hard to want to play him. It's the main reason I over looked him when I was trying to think of characters with above average neutral.

 

[Nice_FZPSC.42]

So I've decided to pick up as my secondary for . Which leaves only 2 tough matchups I need to get covered, . I wanna have a 3rd character to help deal with them but don't know who. I've tried and had no luck. Any other suggestions for characters?

 

[DarkAuraful]

Haven't been on SSB4 lately for a while, but I am currently interested in two new characters.

One in particular, I'm looking for a rush-down oriented character. I've been thinking about if she counts as an example (which I'm pretty sure she is) because I like her aerials. But I'm also open to other options.

The second character is . Been thinking how strong this character's become lately. Anyone wanna fill me in on him? From a perspective of fighting Bowser, he's a bait and punish character you should be careful of. He also has a dangerous side-b that ones I've faced used to interrupt my aerial spacing with .

 

[Nice_FZPSC.42]

Haven't been on SSB4 lately for a while, but I am currently interested in two new characters.

One in particular, I'm looking for a rush-down oriented character. I've been thinking about if she counts as an example (which I'm pretty sure she is) because I like her aerials. But I'm also open to other options.

The second character is . Been thinking how strong this character's become lately. Anyone wanna fill me in on him? From a perspective of fighting Bowser, he's a bait and punish character you should be careful of. He also has a dangerous side-b that ones I've faced used to interrupt my aerial spacing with .

You could easily use both. Bowser has proven good against Diddy kings after nairo 3-0d zinoto. Which just leaves pikachu as a tough mu. Bowser is yeah a bait and punish grappler who is devastatingly strong and fast. He's the character who will live until he's at max rage consistently. As long as you're ok with being combo good bowser is a great character. He doesn't struggle with sword characters and can handle Diddy so paired with ZSS is a good plan. Both get a lot of reward off of grabs, great kill power, amazing recoveries, and dominating presences. Nick Riddle uses this duo so check him out.

 

[IAteYourLastChip]

I IAteYourLastChip This question really belongs somewhere in the Melee forums; this thread is meant for finding Smash Wii U/3DS mains.

However, since you're here, I'll make a couple quick suggestions for you. It's important to note that learning to be watchful/mindful of your opponent's reactions is always a good thing, so full-on aggression is generally something you want to keep in its place.
: Obviously with skill he's amazing, but he's fun for newer players as well due to his ridiculous sword range, grab, and not requiring the quickest of inputs (though you'll get benefits from your hands getting quicker with experience, which is basically true of any character). There is some pacing to his attacks that could end up feeling just about the right speed for you.
: Sheik gets a lot of good out of tech chasing, which can be a good teaching aid when it comes to being more watchful like I mentioned above, but she's another good one in my opinion for newer players. In Melee, her fair is actually a kill move and can combo from a down throw. Down throw has a lot of follow-up options to look into, some being more character specific. Borp is a Melee Sheik main notorious for getting decent results without much tech skill at all, so be sure to look him up! (In case you don't already know, you can start a match as Sheik by holding the A button on the character select screen until the match begins.)

Each character's respective forum will give you more information, but there's a starting point, at least.

ok and since this is a Wii u /3ds thread who would you say for smash 4 is best for me?

 

[DarkAuraful]

Okay... I was expecting more replies for my Q but there aren't going to be more. So what can I say to the one I got?

You could easily use both. Bowser has proven good against Diddy kings after nairo 3-0d zinoto. Which just leaves pikachu as a tough mu. Bowser is yeah a bait and punish grappler who is devastatingly strong and fast. He's the character who will live until he's at max rage consistently. As long as you're ok with being combo good bowser is a great character. He doesn't struggle with sword characters and can handle Diddy so paired with ZSS is a good plan. Both get a lot of reward off of grabs, great kill power, amazing recoveries, and dominating presences. Nick Riddle uses this duo so check him out.

Hm okay. I was actually thinking of using Bowser as a serious secondary. Ideally he won't cover all my bad match-ups but he'll be good enough for overwhelming swordsmen players.

Looks like Nario's not the only player that uses that duo, but I suppose also that means they see something inside Bowser if he compliments ZSS.

Thank you for the reply.

ok and since this is a Wii u /3ds thread who would you say for smash 4 is best for me?

For aggressive and combo-oriented characters, the characters I think I would recommend (no personal knowledge except for Ryu and maybe Falcon; just popular opinion) are . Someone might come up with a better list of characters but that's what I can think of in terms of aggressive nature and combo potential.

 

[Nice_FZPSC.42]

Aggressive combo character you missed are . You've got a wide variety. If you pick Roy then talk to me I'll help you out with him.

For me of course I've got and now and finally my last addition is to help with and other characters and just be a clutch character too with tippers.

With the I just forgot about Nairo haha but yeah if you wanna use the two it's been proven to work so check out nairo and nick riddle.

 

[IAteYourLastChip]

Id like to

Aggressive combo character you missed are . You've got a wide variety. If you pick Roy then talk to me I'll help you out with him.

For me of course I've got and now and finally my last addition is to help with and other characters and just be a clutch character too with tippers.

With the I just forgot about Nairo haha but yeah if you wanna use the two it's been proven to work so check out nairo and nick riddle.

I would like help with roy

 

[Nice_FZPSC.42]

Id like to

I would like help with roy

Alright here's my Roy help:
Step 1: don't approach. Ever.
Step 2: save your double jump. Always.
Step 3: go on YouTube and watch izaws video art of Roy, my smash corners video of Roy combos, zeros most recent video analysis on Roy, and pretty soon I'll finish my Roy guide which talks about stage pick and bad matchups.
Step 4: have a solid secondary he is not solo main viable.

We could do a training session some time if you want. To have more hands on help.

 

[IAteYourLastChip]

Alright here's my Roy help:
Step 1: don't approach. Ever.
Step 2: save your double jump. Always.
Step 3: go on YouTube and watch izaws video art of Roy, my smash corners video of Roy combos, zeros most recent video analysis on Roy, and pretty soon I'll finish my Roy guide which talks about stage pick and bad matchups.
Step 4: have a solid secondary he is not solo main viable.

We could do a training session some time if you want. To have more hands on help.

That would be rad

 

[DarkAuraful]

@Nice_FZPSC.42
You're developing a Roy guide? Interesting. It takes a thorough analysis and dedication of maining the character to create something like that, but I would like to keep in touch of the progress account with knowledge from the Art of Roy.

Roy's a character I've been interested in. Whenever I see some pro Roy players compete, I take interest in but the sad part is he's looked down upon in terms of his individual competitive viability as a popular opinion. I would like to see how it goes nonetheless.

 

[5ilas]

Hey guys.
So i'm trying to choose a secondary...
Although my signature says I main Bowser, Bowser Jr. and Captain Falcon, I usually don't choose Bowser for more serious matches yet... I need more practice with him.
But I'm looking for a secondary that fills any gaps that both Bowser Jr. and Captain Falcon have.
For example, Both of them have a great air game but not necessarily the best ground game... both of them have good mobility (Bowser Jr. has his kart dash to get around the stage) but both are also very predictable in their approaches.

My signature lists a bunch of characters I'm considering for fun or for training. But I wanted to see your thoughts on who I should pick up. Whether it's someone in my sig or someone else I didn't consider.

Ike main? MY MAN!!!

 

[IAteYourLastChip]

Alright here's my Roy help:
Step 1: don't approach. Ever.
Step 2: save your double jump. Always.
Step 3: go on YouTube and watch izaws video art of Roy, my smash corners video of Roy combos, zeros most recent video analysis on Roy, and pretty soon I'll finish my Roy guide which talks about stage pick and bad matchups.
Step 4: have a solid secondary he is not solo main viable.

We could do a training session some time if you want. To have more hands on help.

when would you like to train

 

[Nice_FZPSC.42]

when would you like to train

Idc.

Secondary's are herd to find lol. Are the two best feeling characters to me so I'll use the two. I have had a super bad time with recently, sane start as what happened to my . It sucks. Anyway with this FE duo I've got some tough matchups. . What characters cover these mus? I've currently got as some characters I do pretty well with.

 

[DJBor]

So out of nowhere I discovered and now I have a new main. Well that was interesting. And my already competent covers all of my bad matchups... except for . To smite all of the Cloud players out there, should I learn JUST THE DITTO or pick up another character exclusively for the Cloud matchup, or just tough it out with Yoshi?

 

[Nice_FZPSC.42]

So out of nowhere I discovered and now I have a new main. Well that was interesting. And my already competent covers all of my bad matchups... except for . To smite all of the Cloud players out there, should I learn JUST THE DITTO or pick up another character exclusively for the Cloud matchup, or just tough it out with Yoshi?

Since it's only 1 mu I'd say tough it out but I get how you feel with it being hard so picking a third wouldn't be a bad idea. Don't do the ditto, the mains will know it better than you. Instead try to beat him. They all do good or beat him and are fine as a pocket.

 

[IAteYourLastChip]

Idc.

Secondary's are herd to find lol. Are the two best feeling characters to me so I'll use the two. I have had a super bad time with recently, sane start as what happened to my . It sucks. Anyway with this FE duo I've got some tough matchups. . What characters cover these mus? I've currently got as some characters I do pretty well with.

My personal recommendations are Pikachu, for his abikity to make campy characters cry, or Shiek because she will remain the best character for the foreseeable future. Zero Suit Samus is also fun to use against Roy's problem matchups,

 

[Justinian]

Idc.

Secondary's are herd to find lol. Are the two best feeling characters to me so I'll use the two. I have had a super bad time with recently, sane start as what happened to my . It sucks. Anyway with this FE duo I've got some tough matchups. . What characters cover these mus? I've currently got as some characters I do pretty well with.

Fox beats every one of those characters by +0.5- or +1 except for Pika, which is dead even but not hard for Fox. Fox / Marth is also a really good duo in general, since Marth dunks on almost every MU Fox has any trouble with.

 

[DietDrKelp]

Nice_FZPSC.42 DJBor
Honestly, and I speak out of experience, having any more than two characters truly limits the amount that you can learn with a character. When you main a character, you should want to play them so bad that you begin to play their bad matchups. A friend of mine who is on the PR here in Alabama plays Ness and goes by the tag Pudd. He has to play the rosa matchup all the time (Rosa Ness is arguably the most lopsided matchup in the game) and has figured out all the tricks he can pull in the matchup to the point that he rarely loses it anymore to both of the PR'd Rosa players in Alabama. He sat down and talked to me about how important it is to know so much about your character that you're able to problem solve mid-game or mid-set to adapt to anything. He also pointed out that playing more than one character can truly hold you back from doing your best with the character you love. However, he also pointed out how there are special cases where a secondary may be required (for instance, maining a character below probably D tier). In this case, a lot of the time it's okay to get a secondary, but that should be where you stop. Pudd had tried to play pikachu and cloud for the matchup but finally realized he was spending more time playing those characters than the character he was best at and wanted to play the most.

All of this to say, I believe Roy Marth covers all of the matchups you have listed as Marth has a good matchup vs all the characters you have listed except maybe pikachu which you can play roy into and probably see better results. It's just about having the will to learn the matchups that exist and looking to higher play to understand the nuances of those matchups.

As with Yoshi Villager, we have a PR'd solo yoshi main (who also made number one for the top 10 Yoshi plays video) and he believes Yoshi is a viable solo main. the only matchup he does struggle with is the cloud matchup, and even he has learned to destroy clouds who don't know what they're doing. I believe you have about every single matchup covered with both of those characters and any matchup seen as unfavorable for either character can be learned.

I've done a lot of searching and research this week with a lot of the better players from around the state and even got to talk to a lot of dedicated solo mains and many people with secondaries or even tri-mains. It's one thing to say you play a character and another to say they're your main. VoiD plays Sheik in every matchup but plays three characters on his stream. He isn't considered a tri main. My point is, play who you feel is fun, but in a tournament environment, if you have more than 2 tournament ready characters with one being better than the other, then your tournament standards are probably too low. People are far more impressed by dedicated mains like Nicco who learn every matchup for their character regardless of tier and see great results because they put more effort into learning the matchups rather than try to pick into favorable matchups that your opponent may know more than you about. Because chances are, if it's a bad matchup you're trying to put them in, they probably know more about it than you do because they weren't the one having to switch character, if that makes sense.

Anyhow, just thought I'd give my opinion and this is exactly why I'm not even getting a secondary for my Corrin which was my entire reason for coming to this thread. Let me know your thoughts!

 

[DJBor]

Yeah, Yoshi is solo main viable. And even at that, I have a Villager that I don't need to work on, so it's a secondary that I don't need to focus on at all. I guess I should stop worrying about Cloud and just deal with it using Yoshi.

My opinion on the above- every character has bad matchups, but most are not that bad. The majority of the cast is solo main viable. Then there are matchups like Rosalina-Ness or Sonic-Little Mac where it's justified to have a secondary prepared. And in the case where you happen to play a character that covers almost all of your main's bad matchups, they're good to secondary. But for most characters, you never need a secondary, it's just good to have one.

UPDATE: Cloud Ditto idea is genius. Played a decent amount of them tonight, and it totally works.

 

[Heracr055]

^I'm going to disagree with Yoshi being solo viable. Yoshi has too many bad spreads against the high and top tiers. The discussion about this was fairly recent in the competitive impressions thread. I also disagree on many characters being solo viable- this game has so many threats and is very geared towards counter-picking.
Anyways, I main Ryu and love using him because of his comeback factor. I've been less satisfied with his linear movement options and meh projectile. I started using Greninja about a month ago and really appreciate his movement. I'm going to continue exploring this character and look forward to where we end up.
Also @ DietDrKelp, being 'all over the board' is just part of the process. I never thought I'd be using the chars I currently use, and it took a lot of sifting to end up here!

 

[Nice_FZPSC.42]

picking a secondary is hard. are in consideration for me. Just gonna go off who I do best with.

 

[Olyiis]

Hey guys!

So I'm relatively new to SSB (played Brawl when I was 12) but my friend allowed me to borrow his Wii U for 3 months. Though I'm having trouble picking a main. Specifically one that could kick a Corrin main's ass in 3 months time.

I've always liked control mages, I love Absa in Rivals of Aether, but I haven't found a parallel in SSB4 yet. Ultimately, I'd prefer a control mage with the following traits:
- bi-directional down smash
- multi-hit aerial with a suction effect (Rosalina's F-air, for example)
- one or more aerials with sweetspots

So far, the characters that have some of these traits that I've found are:
- Rosalina
- Mewtwo
- Palutena

Palutena fits my playstyle the most, and passes point 1 of the competative main guide (https://smashboards.com/threads/how-you-should-choose-your-competitive-main-in-smash-4.369829/)
With Rosalina feeling really hard to learn and Mewtwo feeling a bit sloppy.
But Palutena is an F tier (therefore failing at point 3) and her moves take a long time to execute.

I don't wanna go competative or anything, I just wanna be able to annihialate my friends, specifically the Corrin main.

What do? Should I pick one of the 3 mages above? Is there one I missed? Should I just stay with Sheik? (which is who I've been using until now) And how can I kick a Corrin main's ass?

I realise it's a really long post, but I appreciate any and all feedback!

Thanks in advance!

 

[DJBor]

*clears throat* ...You mean Zelda?

Yeah, I know, I'm suggesting an evidently bottom tier character. But if you're not competitive and just want a character that will wow your friends, then pick Zelda. And the Corrin matchup isn't terrible either. Zelda and Corrin aren't too far apart in terms of movement speed, and that's a big deal since it makes it less of a challenge for Zelda to approach (which is the reason Zelda is bottom tier in the first place- bad projectiles and requires reads to start combos.)

HOWEVER, as much as Zelda perfectly describes the character you are describing above, she is miles more difficult to learn than Palutena. If you find trouble doing anything with Zelda, don't be discouraged from simply swapping back to good old Palu. And if all else fails, there's still Lucas- who fits your "control mage" archetype closely, though not to a T.

 

[Heracr055]

@ Olyiis:

Agreeing with Zelda as a potential candidate, she's definitely got those traits you listed.
I'd also suggest Robin. DSmash hits on both sides, Nair and aerial ArcFire are technically multihit aerials, and Robin has sick sweetspots on Fair and Bair.

 

[Olyiis]

Thanks for the replies guys!

I'll give Zelda and Robin a shot as well

Just to be clear, as long as I'm not playing competatively there's no harm in picking a bottom tier character?

 

[Linkip]

I'm having a little bit of trouble with my secondary's. I've been switching my secondary's and pockets quite frequently and I've dropped quite a few also. I would like a character that has a similar defensive play style like Mewtwo but still feels a bit different, for an example Bowser and Mewtwo are very, very different i would like someone at least a little bit like Mewtwo. And of course, i want them to cover Mewtwo's bad MUs. I know it's a pretty tall order but i would like to hear.

 

[DietDrKelp]

^I'm going to disagree with Yoshi being solo viable. Yoshi has too many bad spreads against the high and top tiers. The discussion about this was fairly recent in the competitive impressions thread. I also disagree on many characters being solo viable- this game has so many threats and is very geared towards counter-picking.
....
Also @ DietDrKelp, being 'all over the board' is just part of the process. I never thought I'd be using the chars I currently use, and it took a lot of sifting to end up here!

I'd like to hear more about why you disagree, as if you do have more knowledge than your opponent in a matchup, you can win any matchup.
But yeah, I've related it to the fact that I had trouble figuring out who I was for a very long time. But for now, I've been sticking with Corrin and she/he has been working for me and feels a lot better than other characters.

Linkip
So the matchups Mewtwo has trouble with according to Aba are as follows: Diddy, Bayo, Corrin (even), Meta Knight, Cloud and Ryu. Some even say Fox and Link. Looking at this, you need someone who has a strong demanding neutral that can deal with rushdown pressure and/or doesn't die as early. With that, characters like DK and Bowser are good, they just get combo'd a lot. You said you want someone who plays defensively like M2, so let's look at the things that make him defensive. Watching top M2's, you see: shadow ball, down tilt, spaced fair on shield. Knowing this, there are a few characters with charge projectiles that have strong tilts to use in neutral like: Samus, Corrin, even Lucario. From there, characters with similar strong aerials and charge abilities that forced the enemy to approach are: Robin, Cloud. Even Marth has a combination of strong tilts and strong aerials that are safe on shield. ANy of those might be good to give a shot.

 

[KniteBlargh]

Just to be clear, as long as I'm not playing competatively there's no harm in picking a bottom tier character?

Not that I'm some outstanding example to follow, but I've been a cursed Jigglypuff main from day one of Smash 4's release and play as competitively as I can in the extremely small local scene. No matter how hard I try to show other players in the area otherwise, they are convinced Jigglypuff is near broken just because I'm our top player (as ridiculous as that is). I have also taken out many a good Mario, Cloud, and Ness online, a scene which highly favours the other characters not only because of them being horrible MUs for Jiggs, but also because lag favours their options. I've also had to deal with ridicule in the community for continuing to play the character I love most.

So my point is, in your case, definitely don't rule out low tiers if one of them winds up being that one character that feels great to play. If you find that you have to work extra hard for the win, and it's not appealing, keep moving through the various suggestions till you reach El Dorado. LOL Hope you have lots of fun, dude.

 

[Olyiis]

Not that I'm some outstanding example to follow, but I've been a cursed Jigglypuff main from day one of Smash 4's release and play as competitively as I can in the extremely small local scene. No matter how hard I try to show other players in the area otherwise, they are convinced Jigglypuff is near broken just because I'm our top player (as ridiculous as that is). I have also taken out many a good Mario, Cloud, and Ness online, a scene which highly favours the other characters not only because of them being horrible MUs for Jiggs, but also because lag favours their options. I've also had to deal with ridicule in the community for continuing to play the character I love most.

So my point is, in your case, definitely don't rule out low tiers if one of them winds up being that one character that feels great to play. If you find that you have to work extra hard for the win, and it's not appealing, keep moving through the various suggestions till you reach El Dorado. LOL Hope you have lots of fun, dude.

Aah perfect, that's a load of my shoulders
Decided to go with palutena for the moment, down throw into nair is just way too satisfying
Thanks again o/

 

[Agitato]

Just curious, what do you guys think of Ike as he currently stands? I played him a lot in PM, but obviously he resembles Brawl Ike more in terms of playstyle and tier placement. It seems like the faster pace of this game coupled with his bad frame data means that he can't really Nair through stuff mindlessly without getting punished hard for it. I'm guessing a secondary Mario or Cloud is pretty much a requirement, too.

 

[DJBor]

Ike... He fights for his friends.
One of the most heavily debated characters in the game, Ike is thought by many to be a low tier character, almost reaching the bottom. Yet, there are just as many people who think Ike has high tier potential. So here's all I can say: Ike will not be a top tier, not for a long time. But do not discount him as bad. My personal opinion is that Ike is the weakest character that doesn't have a clear flaw. (In other words, the weakest character that does not need a buff to be solo viable.) But that could all change with a little metagame improvement, which so far Ike doesn't have much of.

So go for it. If you like Ike, there's no problem in maining him. I'd rather not see a 20FF Cloud win the fight for Ike's friends anyway.
(If you want a secondary, I'd suggest someone like Fox. Someone who can ramp up the speed of gameplay and not be held back by frame data whatsoever.)

 

[Agitato]

Ike... He fights for his friends.
One of the most heavily debated characters in the game, Ike is thought by many to be a low tier character, almost reaching the bottom. Yet, there are just as many people who think Ike has high tier potential. So here's all I can say: Ike will not be a top tier, not for a long time. But do not discount him as bad. My personal opinion is that Ike is the weakest character that doesn't have a clear flaw. (In other words, the weakest character that does not need a buff to be solo viable.) But that could all change with a little metagame improvement, which so far Ike doesn't have much of.

So go for it. If you like Ike, there's no problem in maining him. I'd rather not see a 20FF Cloud win the fight for Ike's friends anyway.
(If you want a secondary, I'd suggest someone like Fox. Someone who can ramp up the speed of gameplay and not be held back by frame data whatsoever.)

It's true that his metagame has gotten stagnant, and Ikes haven't been placing much lately. Maybe I can change that.

Thanks for the reply.

 

[KniteBlargh]

It's true that his metagame has gotten stagnant, and Ikes haven't been placing much lately. Maybe I can change that.

Most of the notable Ike mains have seemingly switched to maining Corrin instead, and it's funny, because while he/she may be a better character, I feel like their results haven't necessarily been improved all that much. It's a shame, though, because it's so fun to see a really good Ike in action.

I think when it comes to Ike, it's absolutely essential to keep his quickest/safest attacks in mind. His down tilt has deceivingly decent range, and it's something I've seen players like Ryo get a lot of use from in the past; bonus points for the fact that it launches opponents vertically. His counter helps when dealing with rushdown types or people who play aggressively (obviously not something to abuse, but still, it's there for when the need arises). Neutral special has nice ledge option coverage with proper spacing, even hitting quite a distance below the ledge. Also, the fact that he actually has a 50/50 off a grab now can't be ignored. Overall, Ike is quite overlooked, but he has plenty to offer besides what I've mentioned, and he needs more friends to fight for.