The Legendary Heroes of Galar - Zacian and Zamazenta for Smash

[Cosmic77]

On the bright side...

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

Zacian is going to absolutely slay if it's Fairy/Steel.

Eternatus is Dragon/Poison, meaning it's weak to Steel x2 and both weak (Dragon) and strong (Poison) to Fairy. Zacian is part Fairy, so it'll be effective against Dragon.

 

[fogbadge]

On the bright side...

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

Zacian is going to absolutely slay if it's Fairy/Steel.

Eternatus is Dragon/Poison, meaning it's weak to Steel x2 and both weak (Dragon) and strong (Poison) to Fairy. Zacian is part Fairy, so it'll be effective against Dragon.

Spoiler

do you mean resistant to steel x2?

 

[Cosmic77]

Spoiler

do you mean resistant to steel x2?

Let me clarify.

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

Eternatus (Dragon/Poison):

Vs Zacian (Fairy/Steel):

• Strong against: Fairy (P)
• Weak against: Fairy (D), Steel (D), Steel (P)
• Resistant to: Fairy (P)
• Vulnerable to: Fairy (D)

Vs Zamazenta (Fighter/Steel):

• Strong against: N/A
• Weak against: Steel (D), Steel (P)
• Resistant to: Fighter (P)
• Vulnerable to: N/A

So yeah, ironically, the dog with the sword is more of a defensive nightmare for Eternatus than the one with the actual shield.

 

[fogbadge]

Let me clarify.

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

Eternatus (Dragon/Poison):

Vs Zacian (Fairy/Steel):

• Strong against: Fairy (P)
• Weak against: Fairy (D), Steel (D), Steel (P)
• Resistant to: Fairy (P)
• Vulnerable to: Fairy (D)

Vs Zamazenta (Fighter/Steel):

• Strong against: N/A
• Weak against: Steel (D), Steel (P)
• Resistant to: Fighter (P)
• Vulnerable to: N/A

So yeah, ironically, the dog with the sword is more of a defensive nightmare for Eternatus than the one with the actual shield.

Spoiler

well yeah if you boil it down to just those types theres still a tone of other stuff they resist

 

[Cosmic77]

Join Super #SmashBrosUltimate Director Masahiro Sakurai on 11/6 at 5am PT for a roughly 45-minute video livestream featuring an in-depth look at upcoming DLC Fighter, Terry Bogard from the FATAL FURY series! pic.twitter.com/MPKUp0lkJs

— Nintendo Versus (@NintendoVS) November 5, 2019

It's 45 minutes long, so there's a chance we might get some info on things to come.

If that's the case, I'd say this is where speculation officially begins (or Zacian and Zamazenta could be revealed as Pokeball Pokemon and speculation could die before it even starts, but let's not think of that possibility.)

 

[Guynamednelson]

or Zacian and Zamazenta could be revealed as Pokeball Pokemon and speculation could die before it even starts, but let's not think of that possibility.

I do think you should be concerned about how box legends are always Poke Balls if not hazards or bosses, but we're not getting Poke Ball DLC if we didn't get ATs with these new series.

 

[LukeRNG]

So from the leaked pokemon, which are your favorites from first impressions.

Spoiler: My opinions

Personally I'm in love with the pseudo Dragon/Ghost Dragapult & the Electric/Dragon fossil Dracozolt. Yamper's evolution is cute, the sir fox pokemon is cool, rolycoly final form is awesome (even if it's too similar to Aggron & Golem) and the Apple snake dragon is funny.
I really like most of the new pokemon but to have a definitive say I need to play the game first. My only gripes were the starters' final evolutions, aside from Sobble's.

And well...

During this livestream, there are no announcements regarding any unrevealed fighters.

— Nintendo Versus (@NintendoVS) November 5, 2019

If they aren't just saying that for the sake of lowering our expectations, just what is it that they'll show in 45 minutes?

 

[meleebrawler]

So from the leaked pokemon, which are your favorites from first impressions.

Spoiler: My opinions

Personally I'm in love with the pseudo Dragon/Ghost Dragapult & the Electric/Dragon fossil Dracozolt. Yamper's evolution is cute, the sir fox pokemon is cool, rolycoly final form is awesome (even if it's too similar to Aggron & Golem) and the Apple snake dragon is funny.
I really like most of the new pokemon but to have a definitive say I need to play the game first. My only gripes were the starters' final evolutions, aside from Sobble's.

And well...

During this livestream, there are no announcements regarding any unrevealed fighters.

— Nintendo Versus (@NintendoVS) November 5, 2019

If they aren't just saying that for the sake of lowering our expectations, just what is it that they'll show in 45 minutes?

Terry alone will probably have tons more moves to discuss if he uses the same light/heavy system the shotos do in addition to fighter inputs. Then there's the boatload of cameos on his stage, the costumes which will probably have some historical significance to them, music and spirits.

Spoiler

I'm partial the Centiscorch that I'll be calling Wilbur, Dragapult that I will Bazel, Grimmsnarl, Eletox, Hatterene and the new ladybug Pokemon (there's a lot of neat Bug types in Galar).

 

[fogbadge]

Spoiler

I'm partial the Centiscorch that I'll be calling Wilbur, Dragapult that I will Bazel, Grimmsnarl, Eletox, Hatterene and the new ladybug Pokemon (there's a lot of neat Bug types in Galar).

Spoiler

whats the reference with the centiscorch nick name? if there is one

 

[meleebrawler]

Spoiler

whats the reference with the centiscorch nick name? if there is one

Spoiler

Shantae: Half-Genie Hero boss.

 

[Cosmic77]

So from the leaked pokemon, which are your favorites from first impressions.

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

Aside from Cinderace and Zacian, I believe Dragapult would be a good choice. It would give me a Dragon type and a Ghost type in one mon. Might use Centiskorch in favor of Cinderace if its stats are good. I really want Flapple and a fossil Pokemon on my team because I like their designs, but I feel like that's too many dragons. The ice moth and the fox are also cool, but I might use Obstagoon over the latter. I also want a water type, but I haven't made a decision yet on who that will be.

Deciding on a team will be tough.

 

[Pokelego999]

So personally

Spoiler

If this is real, I'm definetly making the Rillaboom and Eiscue threads. Some of the best designs I've ever seen. Overall, Gen 4 having the most cuts is quite sad. And as well as that, more Charizard pampering. Overall though, I'm loving these new pokemon. They are some of the best I've seen compared to the other gens. Anyways, as for Terry, maybe there's some other new things they'll be talking about, maybe more other dlc stuff like spirits and maybe new pokemon and assist trophies. We'll just have to wait and see.

 

[Guynamednelson]

So personally

Spoiler

If this is real, I'm definetly making the Rillaboom and Eiscue threads. Some of the best designs I've ever seen. Overall, Gen 4 having the most cuts is quite sad. And as well as that, more Charizard pampering. Overall though, I'm loving these new pokemon. They are some of the best I've seen compared to the other gens. Anyways, as for Terry, maybe there's some other new things they'll be talking about, maybe more other dlc stuff like spirits and maybe new pokemon and assist trophies. We'll just have to wait and see.

Spoiler

You don't need to make a Rillaboom thread when plenty will mindlessly assume it HAS to be it.

 

[fogbadge]

Spoiler

Shantae: Half-Genie Hero boss.

Spoiler

ah, id go with a steven universe reference and call it nerphite

 

[Cosmic77]

I'm not expecting anything relevant to SwSh in tomorrow's presentation, and with the announcement that we won't get any info on new fighters, I doubt we'll even learn about the post-pass characters, let alone Fighter #5. I'm not in any rush though. For now, I'm more concerned about Spirits being added to tie in with SwSh's release.

Also, I forgot to mention this on the previous page, but we made it to 10 pages! Congrats, guys!

 

[LukeRNG]

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

Aside from Cinderace and Zacian, I believe Dragapult would be a good choice. It would give me a Dragon type and a Ghost type in one mon. Might use Centiskorch in favor of Cinderace if its stats are good. I really want Flapple and a fossil Pokemon on my team because I like their designs, but I feel like that's too many dragons. The ice moth and the fox are also cool, but I might use Obstagoon over the latter. I also want a water type, but I haven't made a decision yet on who that will be.

Deciding on a team will be tough.

Honestly i wouldn't mind having that many of the same type given how much i like them.

 

[meleebrawler]

Some more info on abilities and lore of the wolves:

Spoiler

(Based on Zamazenta dex entry, not certain if it applies to Zacian)

- Zamazenta slept as a statue for many years, until most people forgot it's existence (wow, another Okami-like thing. Also would make a good entrance animation)

- Zamazenta's ability boosts defence upon switching in. Presumably Zacian will be similar with attack.

They switch forms using a held item. Probably can only use signature moves while armoured, but it remains to be seen if there's stat tradeoffs.

 

[Cosmic77]

Some more info on abilities and lore of the wolves:

Spoiler

(Based on Zamazenta dex entry, not certain if it applies to Zacian)

- Zamazenta slept as a statue for many years, until most people forgot it's existence (wow, another Okami-like thing. Also would make a good entrance animation)

- Zamazenta's ability boosts defence upon switching in. Presumably Zacian will be similar with attack.

They switch forms using a held item. Probably can only use signature moves while armoured, but it remains to be seen if there's stat tradeoffs.

To add on to the lore...

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

It seems like the statue we saw behind Marnie is indeed connected to the plot with these two. Apparently, the Galarian royal family has been spreading a lie that one of their ancestors was the savior of Galar in a time of desperation. In reality, Zacian and Zamazenta were the real heroes who defended Galar, but everyone forgot they existed, allowing someone else to swoop in and steal the credit for their accomplishments.

I can't 100% confirm this because it's rarely been brought up in leak talk, but it does go together with what you said.

Also, Zacian and Zamazenta transform when you give them the held item Rusty Sword and Rusty Shield.

 

[meleebrawler]

To add on to the lore...

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

It seems like the statue we saw behind Marnie is indeed connected to the plot with these two. Apparently, the Galarian royal family has been spreading a lie that one of their ancestors was the savior of Galar in a time of desperation. In reality, Zacian and Zamazenta were the real heroes who defended Galar, but everyone forgot they existed, allowing someone else to swoop in and steal the credit for their accomplishments.

I can't 100% confirm this because it's rarely been brought up in leak talk, but it does go together with what you said.

Also, Zacian and Zamazenta transform when you give them the held item Rusty Sword and Rusty Shield.

Spoiler

Are Chairman Rose and his assistant connected to this royal family by any chance? Maybe trying to keep up appearances based on that false legend in exchange for BIG financial support?

It's kind of weird, the number of Nintendo games of late incorporating twisted histories in their plots. This, FE: Three Houses and possibly Breath Of The Wild 2.

 

[Cosmic77]

I got it.

Spoiler

 

[Perkilator]

#ThankYouGameFreak is trending on Twitter.

 

[fogbadge]

#ThankYouGameFreak is trending on Twitter.

i better take a look

 

[Pokelego999]

I got it.

Spoiler

View attachment 245845

Is it bundeled with a Sword/ Shield copy?

 

[Cosmic77]

Is it bundeled with a Sword/ Shield copy?

No. For whatever reason, this came out a week before SwSh.

I probably would've gotten this regardless of whether or not it had Zacian and Zamazenta on it. It's got a really nice gray and white design with a light blue and red color for the buttons (Sword and Shield's color respectively).

 

[Cosmic77]

New leaked video featuring Zacian. I know people are probably sick of spoilers by now, so if you don't want to see anything relevant to the story, don't click on the spoilers box below.

It's not much though. Just the beginning of the game confirming what reviewers were already hinting at.

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

Spoiler: Video

https://youtu.be/VErq8d6vH8o?t=18m50s

There's a good chance this video gets taken down before anyone even gets the chance to look at it, so here are a few screenshots too.

Spoiler: Pictures

 

[Perkilator]

New leaked video featuring Zacian. I know people are probably sick of spoilers by now, so if you don't want to see anything relevant to the story, don't click on the spoilers box below.

It's not much though. Just the beginning of the game confirming what reviewers were already hinting at.

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

Spoiler: Video

https://youtu.be/VErq8d6vH8o?t=18m50s

There's a good chance this video gets taken down before anyone even gets the chance to look at it, so here are a few screenshots too.

Spoiler: Pictures

View attachment 246113View attachment 246114View attachment 246115View attachment 246118View attachment 246116View attachment 246117

Spoiler: Whoa, what?!

You face the box legendary no less than half an hour in?

 

[meleebrawler]

Spoiler: Whoa, what?!

You face the box legendary no less than half an hour in?

Spoiler

Well, we technically meet the box legendary very early in the Sun & Moon games as well. Plus Tapu Koko.

Also, hey. Looks like we get to white out for real in this game.

 

[fogbadge]

well that's

Spoiler

runeigrigus and mr rhime

shown in a trailer so thats all you need to confirm the leaks are real if you still had any doubts

 

[Cosmic77]

Soooo... Yeah... Got some very "interesting" info on Zacian.

Spoiler

This Pokémon has slumbered for many years. Some say it’s Zamazenta’s elder sister—others say the two Pokémon are rivals.

Zacian is supposedly female. The fairy typing and ribbon fur makes so much more sense now.

 

[Perkilator]

Soooo... Yeah... Got some very "interesting" info on Zacian.

Spoiler

This Pokémon has slumbered for many years. Some say it’s Zamazenta’s elder sister—others say the two Pokémon are rivals.

Zacian is supposedly female. The fairy typing and ribbon fur makes so much more sense now.

Spoiler: So, basically…

Zacian is technically a literal b***h.

 

[Pokelego999]

Spoiler: So, basically…

Zacian is technically a literal b***h.

Ok, that makes sense, but does that mean

Spoiler: this

Zamazneta is a male? Is it gonna be a Latios Latias type thing, or will it be implied, like with Solgaleo and Lunala?

 

[Cosmic77]

Ok, that makes sense, but does that mean

Spoiler: this

Zamazneta is a male? Is it gonna be a Latios Latias type thing, or will it be implied, like with Solgaleo and Lunala?

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

I don't know if Zamazenta is male, but the Dex entry for Zacian explicitly refers to it as possibly being "Zamazenta's elder sister". Unless Zamazenta is female as well, I guess they're continuing the trend of designing one box art Legendary to be male and the other female, only this time it's officially stated.

I'm okay with this news, but it did surprise me, as I'm sure it surprised many others. I think I like Zacian's base form a whole lot more now that I know it's female.

Also, regarding how powerful Zacian and Zamazenta are...

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

Broken as heck. Both are stronger than Eternatus (assuming its boss form can't be used in battles, and they're tied with Arceus with a BST of 720.

 

[meleebrawler]

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

I don't know if Zamazenta is male, but the Dex entry for Zacian explicitly refers to it as possibly being "Zamazenta's elder sister". Unless Zamazenta is female as well, I guess they're continuing the trend of designing one box art Legendary to be male and the other female, only this time it's officially stated.

I'm okay with this news, but it did surprise me, as I'm sure it surprised many others. I think I like Zacian's base form a whole lot more now that I know it's female.

Also, regarding how powerful Zacian and Zamazenta are...

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

Broken as heck. Both are stronger than Eternatus (assuming its boss form can't be used in battles, and they're tied with Arceus with a BST of 720.

Spoiler

Sure, they sound really strong on paper, and they are simply due to being legendaries, but their peak BST hinges on their held item, limiting flexibility, and it also forcibly replaces one of their Steel moves with their signature, which could arguably be less useful in fights with no dynamaxing. There are trade-offs to their power, and not necessarily inconsequential ones like most Mega Evolutions.

 

[Cosmic77]

I'll have to change the first post. Apparently, this is their battle theme.

(Edit: Seems like this isn't it either. Might have to wait a little longer before we find out.)

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

Spoiler

Sure, they sound really strong on paper, and they are simply due to being legendaries, but their peak BST hinges on their held item, limiting flexibility, and it also forcibly replaces one of their Steel moves with their signature, which could arguably be less useful in fights with no dynamaxing. There are trade-offs to their power, and not necessarily inconsequential ones like most Mega Evolutions.

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

They're not perfect, but I still think their pros outweigh their cons. The held item does put some restrictions on them, but their stats are already impressive as is, so I don't consider it that much different from Megas.

Regarding the held item forcibly replacing one of their steel moves, you could argue it being both good and bad. Good because they'll almost always have an advantage in Dynamax battles, but bad because you have less control over what moves they can use.

 

[Pokelego999]

I'll have to change the first post. Apparently, this is their battle theme.

(Edit: Seems like this isn't it either. Might have to wait a little longer before we find out.)

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

Spoiler: Sword and Shield spoilers

They're not perfect, but I still think their pros outweigh their cons. The held item does put some restrictions on them, but their stats are already impressive as is, so I don't consider it that much different from Megas.

Regarding the held item forcibly replacing one of their steel moves, you could argue it being both good and bad. Good because they'll almost always have an advantage in Dynamax battles, but bad because you have less control over what moves they can use.

That theme sounds to cheerful for Eternatus

 

[fogbadge]

That theme sounds to cheerful for Eternatus

well now im curious

 

[Cosmic77]

That theme sounds to cheerful for Eternatus

It's the raid theme.

This is what you're looking for.

Spoiler: Eternatus's theme

And while I'm at it, here's Zacian and Zamazenta's REAL theme. Has a very heroic feel to it.

Spoiler: Zacian/Zamazenta theme

So far, I've counted five tracks for Zacian and Zamazenta. Can't remember the last time a pair of Legendaries got so much music.

 

[fogbadge]

Spoiler

So far, I've counted five tracks for Zacian and Zamazenta. Can't remember the last time a pair of Legendaries got so much music.

that defiantly counts as a spoiler

 

[Cosmic77]

It's a day late, but I thought I'd share this art someone made to count down the days till SwSh releases.

that defiantly counts as a spoiler

I guess, but I don't think many people care as long as the music itself is hidden. For your sake though, I'll put it behind spoilers.

Though you'll have to change your post as well. Even if I edit it, your post will still have it visible.

 

[LukeRNG]

Given that there's a few days left before release, what are your overall thoughts on Sword & Shield with everything we know outside of leaks? The good, the bad; the pokedex & graphics/animations controversies & the communication between Gamefreak & the fans.

These are easily the most controversial games to date and there all kinds of people: people who are outraged, people who aren't bothered, others who go out of their way to defend GF (sometimes blindly), others going to harrass the developers and people speaking positively about SwSh; and others who feel the need to boycott the games as a whole.

Can't say I fully agree with either GF or the community: they both have things that are right and others that are wrong/iffy. While i don't agree with some choices GF has made with these games (Masuda's statement in July was not needed as it made people even more angry and he didn't say anything), i also can't agree to bindly acussing them as lazy, greedy, etc. when there's no info. backing it up (though I have heard & seen that they struggle to program assets, models & other things efficiently).
I know the series can be better (holding the series to a low standard doesn't help either), but i've personally have not had any significant issues with the series. And i'm very much looking foward to playing Sword.