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Legend of Zelda The Goddess Codex

Spire

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The Golden Goddesses

"Before time began, before spirits and life existed... Three golden goddesses descended upon the chaos that was Hyrule... Din, the Goddess of Power... Nayru, the Goddess of Wisdom... Farore, the Goddess of Courage... Din... With her strong flaming arms, she cultivated the land and created the red earth. Nayru... Poured her wisdom onto the earth and gave the spirit of law to the world. Farore... With her rich soul, produced all life forms who would uphold the law." — Great Deku Tree

"The three Goddesses hid the Triforce containing the power of the gods somewhere in Hyrule… the power to grant the wish of the one who holds the Triforce in his hands." — Princess Zelda

"Seven years ago, Ganondorf, the King of Thieves, used the door you opened in the Temple of Time and entered the Sacred Realm. But when he laid his hands on the Triforce, the legend came true. The Triforce separated into three parts. Only the Triforce of Power remained in Ganondorf's hand." — Sheik
Who are they? Why are they?

Let's look at our own world for reference. Throughout the development of the human world, countless religions have been formed by people in an attempt to come to terms with nature; to place faith in it for the sake of understanding how things work. Divine beings are created and upheld by the imaginations of people, inspired by nature and supernature and are thus assigned to different elements found within the aforementioned spectrums and within human emotions and thought. We know not the true origin of anything, so we place faith in the potential existence of higher beings who govern the recognized laws of the world. Religion developed as early man developed the ability of toolmaking and foresight, derivatives of bipedalism. As we discovered how to think, we discovered how to craft, and thus realized that just as we had the ability to govern objectism—and in application to the hunt—we could also control non-sentient life forms, and so we developed the first form of agriculture: pastoralism. As we herded and domesticated animals, we realized we could do the same with people, but how? Religion. Religion targets the innermost faith in nature and abstracts and metaphorically transforms it into a set of codes or ideas so people can follow it. In chiefdom societies, the Chieftains and Shamans uphold the religious law as they claim direct connection with nature, and subsequently the gods.

So apply this logic to Hyrule. From the games, we are told that the Goddesses created Hyrule, the Oocca, and the Hylians. They based the world around the laws of Power, Wisdom, and Courage, and upon ascending from the material plane, left three golden triangles representing the aforementioned trio of laws. So long as the Triforce can remain intact and the laws thus upheld by people, everything could thrive. But then Ganon appears from the outlying desert land and separates the Triforce, breaking the balance. Time and again would a hero named Link arise to fend off Ganon and restore the Triforce.

Now try to imagine if we were living in contemporary Hyrule where every country on the planet became aware of one another and such stories devolved into old world mythology. On our very Earth, we are currently in a transitory era where religion is phasing out and agnosticism/atheism and faith in science is becoming more prevalent. Apply this to the world that the Legends of Zelda derive from. You can't, because it's a fictional world. The world from which every Legend of Zelda comes from is our Earth. Zelda is contemporary mythology not to be confused with actual religion. It's purpose is to show what it's like to act out all of the abstractions, unrealism, and obvious fiction that circumvents and pervades every corner of mythology. Imagine playing a game that literally translates the text from Greek, Norse, or Egyptian mythology (or even the Torah, Bible, or Qur'an) to the screen with no attempt to make it historically real. You would have an incredible amount of fantasy and divine elements, ranging from characters to beasts to entire worlds (the original Clash of the Titans does a great job of showing a literally translated version of a Greek mythological tale to the screen).

Here is a brief forward for what's to come: I'd like to point out Christianity. This is a religion whose older Roman Catholic roots are based around a Holy Trinity: Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit. Each is individual, but all one in the same. The Triforce is one triangle comprised of three individual triangles.

The Triforce, the Goddess Codex

The Triforce is the holy religious symbol of the land of Hyrule. It is also a tangible relic that grants immense power. Its backstory suggests that three Goddesses—Din, Nayru, and Farore, who govern the attributes Power, Wisdom, and Courage respectively—created the land long ago and rule over it from the heavens. At the point of their departure from their crafted world formed the golden relic the Triforce, which represented an equilibrium of the aforementioned attributes, thus symbolizing that the world is upheld, balanced by, and abides by these forces. In most of the games based in Hyrule, we are surrounded by lore that supports this tale, yet never have we been given evidence of the Goddesses actually existing.

The Council of Nicaea & The King of Hyrule and the Ancient Sages

The First Council of Nicaea was an event in 325 CE where Constantine, Holy Roman Emperor of Byzantium gathered a large number of Europe's bishops to discuss the popular religion Christianity and how it should generally be viewed and accepted. The primary topic of discussion was whether to write Christianity in a unitarian or trinitarian view, meaning to worship only "God", or "God, the Son, and the Holy Spirit". The latter was settled on because the former seemed too revealing and broad for people to follow. So we have the Holy Trinity in the Christian faith. Where else do we see a Holy Trinity? In Zelda with the Triforce. The Christian Holy Trinity is comprised of God, the Son and the Holy Spirit, all of which are just God, just as the Triforce is comprised of the Triforce of Power, the Triforce of Wisdom, and the Triforce of Courage, all of which comprise the Triforce. Essentially, the Council of Nicaea created the real-world Triforce and the legend behind it, how God created the world and man in his image. Sound even more familiar? The legend of the Triforce tells of three Goddesses creating Hyrule, who later on created Hylians in their image. The Triforce is a lie and the Goddesses are false beings fabricated so that people have something to worship.

I'll take this moment to tell the events of the Council of Nicaea with Zelda terminology. The King of Hyrule and the Ancient Sages gathered to create a religion for all to follow. Since they knew of the Triforce as a relic, they decided to create a story behind it where three benevolent Goddesses created Hyrule and the Hylians (which suggests that the Hylians are the dominant race above all others). These men built the Temple of Time, and created the Master Sword and the Spiritual Stones as keys to the Triforce.

Islamic Conquest & Ganon and the Gerudo

Between 711 and 718 CE, Europe (particularly Hispania, reaching as northward as Poiters, France) was invaded by the Islamic Empire as the religion began to spread throughout the world. At this time, Mohammed was viewed by Christian Europe as "The Devil", and in a mistranslation stemming from Poiters ca. 1150 was named "Baphomet". Baphomet is an alternate name for the devil, so in the Christian's eye, Mohammed—the leader of Islam, a religion that continuously tried to spread its influence into Christian Europe—was The Devil. Mind you, the Islamic symbol is the crescent and star, so I'll translate this into Zelda terminology:

Hyrule is a land built religiously around the Triforce. Anything that opposes it is dubbed evil and sealed away. Ganondorf was a member of the desert tribe, the Gerudo. He was their prophecized leader and as such, very much led them to believe him to be a savior and hero.

Alien Origins

A very controversial subject, but many speculate that an alien species, be they extraterrestrial or extradimensional, have influenced humans throughout history—some even going so far as to believe that they tampered with Australopithicine's DNA, resulting in the development of Homo Erectus and thus Homo Sapien Sapien. In that vein, through years of experimentation they created the perfect species to do their bidding. Aliens serve as a potential origin for the gods of old world mythologies, often (if not always) described as "beings from above", either descending from the sky or the peak of the clouded Mount Olympus. Sumerians, Egyptians, and Mayans built pyramids/ziggurats as tributes to their gods, albeit with slightly different uses. The Sumerian ziggurat was built as a temple for tribune and housing for the gods, the Egyptian pyramid was built as a transportational tomb for the Ka of Pharaohs (demigods) to ascend to the heavens (the three great pyramids of Giza are perfectly aligned with Orion's belt), and the Mayan ziggurats were built as human sacrificial alters to satiate the gods' needs. If aliens instigated the development of man and thus the world of man, then the three goddesses are none other than highly intelligent aliens who bestowed upon the world of Hyrule an artifact with promising power, just as some believe this world has hidden alien artifacts, all gilded and extremely technologically advanced. Again, very controversial and probably fictional, but it's a belief that I have to address.

But I won't digress. In relevance to Zelda, we've seen a highly advanced alien species hold importance to the human world: the Oocca. They were here before man, introduced the early Hylia to advanced technology, and provided them with 'magical' artifacts.

In conclusion..

Make what you will of it. The three Golden Goddesses are real within the games because the games are literal translations of myth, but from our points of view: because we are controlling an individual within the game world, we are on the same plane as the Goddesses. Though I would like to know—what do you think of the Goddesses? Who are they to you? Are they Power, Wisdom, and Courage incarnate as higher sentient life forms? Or are they simply imagery used to depict 'gods' in place of three recognized and understood laws? Are they aliens? Are they members of a race predating both the Oocca and the Hylia?

The Triforce is the Goddess Codex. Perhaps it is a piece of technology bestowed upon the world as a codex by the goddesses so that upon studying, people will understand what the three laws are truly about. It is artificial intelligence. Upon being touched by an imbalanced individual, it is able to scan the world looking for two others fit to inherit the remaining two pieces based on who knows what—brain waves and capacity?

Let me know what you think.

[collapse=Some notes from a conversation I had with Firus:]Medieval setting = Kingdoms focused on
Termina = land based on science, astronomy, and observation
The Six Elder Sages = the Council of Nicaea
The Triforce = Father, Son, and Holy Spirit
Ganon = Islamic Conquest

The six elder sages as seen in ALttP and TP reflect the Holy Roman Council of Nicaea, those who fight against the Islamic Empire and keep it out of Europe in the desert countries.
Ganon is the embodiment of Islam.
Hence why the Gerudo originally had the crescent moon and star symbol.

Either the creators are trying to say that Islam is evil, or they're trying to create a retelling of our history ca. 715 CE (which is the central year between 711 and 718 CE when the Islam Empire invaded Europe), and which I think OoT is based on.
Ganon is not evil, he simply has different views.

He wants to conquer the Triforce (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit) so he can establish his own rule.
The Elder Sages ****ed everyone over by creating the tale of the Triforce and the Goddesses.
And Zelda, their leader, represents the Pope.
the King of Hyrule, the Holy Roman Empire
in some cases there is no King
and that's when Zelda is both Holy Roman Empire and Pope
such as Justinius of Russia, who was both
Rome (Hyrule) fell at one point and the capital moved elsewhere...
as it did in ST
across the ocean (Mediterranean & Great Sea) to a new land
Byzantium and the Lokomo Kingdom (New Hyrule)

While Istanbul was the capital of the Roman Empire, it was attacked by the Islamic Empire and taken over again, just as Ganon attacked Hyrule AGAIN in LoZ.
Take Ancient-Medieval Art History in college. You'll appreciate it.
Literally the whole semester, I was comparing things to Zelda.

I think Termina is based on the Maya Empire, for they worshiped astronomy and its correlation with time. Their calendar is crafted perfectly in alignment with the stars, as Termina is formed perfectly with the compass and the clock.
And their architecture? Mayan by far.
All of the wall paintings and such.
Man.

And dude, all of our "medieval epics" such as King Arthur and such are all based on Christianity, with Excalibur being a holy embodiment of the cross as a sword that only the chosen one who fought in the name of the Holy Trinity could draw. Sound familiar? Link is the chosen one by the "Gods" (aka the Triforce aka by the Holy Trinity) to draw Excalibur (Master Sword) to save the land from evil.

And it's quite obvious that Ganon is seen as the devil; as Muhammed (or mistranslated during the invasion in Poiters, France as "Baphomet", which later became known as a great Islamic demon leader).
It all makes sense now.
And dude, muslims don't eat pigs, so for the leader of the muslims aka Gerudo to be transformed into that which they don't eat...
surely an impetus to be hateful and spiteful

But in the wrong way.
They're making us fight against the Islamic Empire as if they're evil.
as if Christianity is superior...
That's why the Stone Tower Temple is the best, because it's built as a blaspheme against Christianity.

Science is advanced natural religion, as natural religion is when we put our faith in the observable, and science is nothing more than the study and analysis of all that is observable.

I think the healthiest thing we can do for Zelda is to destroy Hyrule.
Link truly is representative of Jesus Christ.
Ugh.
I just facepalmed.
"Jesus is the saviour who will always topple all opposing religions, particularly the evil from the desert.."

Likewise.
I really and truly hate the Triforce and sympathize with the Terminans, particularly the Ikana who might be the brightest people.
Also dude.

I think ancient Termina, particularly the Ikana hated the Triforce because those who represent it brought pain and suffering to their people, just as Hernan Cortes and the Spaniard conquistadors brought an end to the Aztecs and other ancient Mexican civilizations.
Because Cortes fought by the word of God and ****.
I mean, Termina is more of a stretch to analyze because we only have one game that it's featured or even mentioned in.
Link kind of represents the English coming over to spread the word of Christianity even more.
But even that is a stretch.
Like, MM could be the one game that has no real religious ties.
And dude, DUDE.
Talk about biblical
"Great flood"
*facepalm*[/collapse]

tl;dr = the Goddesses are real within the context of the Legend of Zelda world, but aren't from a pragmatic point of view.
 

Ganonsburg

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Well, as far as your Arthur comparison goes, legends such as are the result of two cultures/religions/ideologies meeting. The legends surrounding King Arthur very much have Biblical ties, but they also have many Celtic ties. The Bible has verses that speak against magic, which is something Arthurian legends have a lot of.

So rather than thinking of Zelda as this or that, I'd say it's probably a combination of various cultures and ideas.

Also, the presence of a giant flood is prevalent in almost every culture's religion, mythology, or passed-down history. So the presence of that in Zelda is probably not so much a result of Noah's Flood, but of one of Japan's legends.

But idk, Trinity -> Triforce makes sense.

:034:
 

Spire

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Oh certainly. The master sword also has Japanese origins (I forget the name of the sword, but it cuts grass and something else important). I am not well learned of Eastern lore, so I wasn't going to speak of such. While the bible speaks against magic, one can't help but ascertain divine miracles and such as 'magic' or at least the supernatural.
 

Masky

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Wow, I always like it when Spire relates Zelda to places or history in the real world :)

TP kind of contradicts the idea of the Godesses not really existing. Lanayru, the Spirit of Light, explicitly tells Link that the Goddesses themselves ordered the Spirits of Light to stop the Dark Interlopers. Also, Lanayru recited a condensed version of Hyrule's creation story involving the Gods, giving credence to it. Lanayru is an extremely reliable source, she is a Spirit of Light, I don't see how she would be conspiring with the King/Sages. There are other examples of the Gods communicating directly with people, such as in WW when the Gods command their chosen people to take refuge at the mountaintops, but Lanayru is the most credible of these.

The fact that the Goddesses can directly order spirits to do things implies that they are sentient life forms of some kind. Also I think in the LttP manual, it states that the Goddesses can judge between good and evil, supporting this.

On the other hand, in ST, we see an entirely separate religion and mythology based around the Spirits of Good. This could hint towards the Goddesses actually not being real, or it could be indicative of the fact that the Godesses only rule over Old Hyrule, and other areas of the world have different local gods/spirits that exist there instead.

I think SS will provide some answers to who/what exactly the Goddesses are. Hopefully.
 

Spire

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If the Goddesses are sentient life forms and can judge between good and evil, then they are inherently immortal. They are not omniscient, omnipresent, and infinitely benevolent. If I were to believe that the Goddesses did indeed exist rather than just being iconography and thus actually created Hyrule, then they did so as a testing ground to see how long their rule of three could stay in balance. Ganon, a 'glitch', arose and continued to upset the balance, hence why they intervene.

I feel a lot of sympathy for Ganondorf. He's just hardwired to destroy the balance because he simply has a different idea of how to order things. In a political view, he wants less socialism and more capitalism. The Triforce (rule of three) governs the land and ensures that all is balanced under its order, but Ganondorf is sick of that and maintains the idea that he can change that. He's depicted as evil, but really he's a revolutionary.
 

Phantom7

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The goddesses are definitely "real" in the games. Ganondorf actually encounters the Triforce, so if belief in the goddesses was based on myth and conspiracy, it simply wouldn't make sense.

Also, Ganondorf was not by any means a revolutionary. Hyrule was under the just rule of the goddesses and the Royal Family until Ganondorf intervened and attempted to obtain the Triforce through his dark, evil ambitions to satisfy his own power. He was tempted by the power of the Triforce and consumed by greed and selfishness to make it his own possession; he had no will for any type of political reform.

EDIT: Also, to tie this to religion, Ganondorf had a very deceptive, cunning manner of executing his plans to obtain the Triforce, which closely relates him to the Antichrist from the book of Revelation.
 

comboking

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Oh because every time (no Zelda reference intended) you seemed to bring up Christianity you seemed to mock it.
 

Phantom7

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Spire, I think what you're trying to say with all of this is that there are numerous religious and mythological inspirations that went towards the creation of Zelda. I thought that was pretty obvious. IMO nothing in Zelda represents anything religious, it's all simply inspired by the religious ties you mentioned. And, Zelda isn't just composed of religious inspiration but also inspiration from different fairy tales. Remember Link and Peter Pan?

 

Spire

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Oh because every time (no Zelda reference intended) you seemed to bring up Christianity you seemed to mock it.
Well honestly I kind of resent that religion.

But yes Phantom7, that's what I was going for. It draws influence from all things worldly (the chant in the Woodfall Temple music is called a—if I remember correctly—West African Death Chant. I went to a Ripley's Believe It Or Not museum this past summer and heard the EXACT same sound effect being played next to some African piece of art wherein a plaque hung on the wall describing the death chant.

But that wasn't my point really. I wanted to show how prevalent western religion/history plays a role in the foundation of the series because that is what I've studied the most.
 

Phantom7

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There really are a lot of interesting Zelda influences out there. But my point was that religion is only a part of it, and I was making sure you understood that.

I'm sorry to hear that you resent my religion. :( Granted, there are many people (especially in the Bible belt) that make Christianity out to be something it is not.
 

comboking

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Well honestly I kind of resent that religion.

But yes Phantom7, that's what I was going for. It draws influence from all things worldly (the chant in the Woodfall Temple music is called a—if I remember correctly—West African Death Chant. I went to a Ripley's Believe It Or Not museum this past summer and heard the EXACT same sound effect being played next to some African piece of art wherein a plaque hung on the wall describing the death chant.

But that wasn't my point really. I wanted to show how prevalent western religion/history plays a role in the foundation of the series because that is what I've studied the most.
Since you aren't religious I think you should keep your biased opinions to yourself. So you don't offend anyone.
 

Dragoon Fighter

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Since you aren't religious I think you should keep your biased opinions to yourself. So you don't offend anyone.
This is the internet, I doubt he is offending any one with Zelda theorizing (at least very few people in the world smash forums) and he is helping the Zelda community here with intelligent discussion. Also, when I showed a friend of mine Spires post he was not offended by spires post (The person in question was indeed religious).
 

comboking

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I thought about that. I just hoped that the piece he wrote would only be for information about Zelda not his opinion on religion. Just a suggestion.
 

Masky

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But yes Phantom7, that's what I was going for. It draws influence from all things worldly (the chant in the Woodfall Temple music is called a—if I remember correctly—West African Death Chant. I went to a Ripley's Believe It Or Not museum this past summer and heard the EXACT same sound effect being played next to some African piece of art wherein a plaque hung on the wall describing the death chant.
Really interested in the Death Chant thing. Was it related to this?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/nostri-imago/3282342148/
 

Spire

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Actually it may have been. It was definitely something like that.
 

GwJ

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Since you aren't religious I think you should keep your biased opinions to yourself. So you don't offend anyone.
His opinions and conclusions are just as valid as yours. Do not ask him not to post within the context of his thoughts.

Or shall I ask you to post without the context that YOU are religious?


Nice read though; it made Personal Finance class go by much better.
 

comboking

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His opinions and conclusions are just as valid as yours. Do not ask him not to post within the context of his thoughts.

Or shall I ask you to post without the context that YOU are religious?


Nice read though; it made Personal Finance class go by much better.
Fair enough. It was a good read.
 

AngryMoblyn1881

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Ok I like this theory. But correct me if im wrong, Didnt "Din" appear in the oracle of seasons and nayru in ages? For me, that debunks it right away. But even if there is an explanation for this. I would still have a hard time believing nintendo put that much thaught into a game. You have to remember that these are the same people who clearly dont have a timeline even to them selfs, and provide very little background about each of their games.

Unlikly but plausable theory. but epic read!
You have once again proven your quality of theorys and writing skills to me.
 

Spire

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Ok I like this theory. But correct me if im wrong, Didnt "Din" appear in the oracle of seasons and nayru in ages? For me, that debunks it right away. But even if there is an explanation for this. I would still have a hard time believing nintendo put that much thaught into a game. You have to remember that these are the same people who clearly dont have a timeline even to them selfs, and provide very little background about each of their games.

Unlikly but plausable theory. but epic read!
You have once again proven your quality of theorys and writing skills to me.
No, those were oracles named after the goddesses.
 

AngryMoblyn1881

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No, those were oracles named after the goddesses.
Do you your self follow this theory? Or are you just stating a possibility?

If this were to be true, I would want a game to come out that isnt about the legend but more about the current present day in which they are telling the tale from. But I think we can all agree that that wouldent work on many different levels.
 

GwJ

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It's fact. They're not the goddesses, just oracles named after the goddesses; the game tells you what they are.
 

Spire

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It's not so much a theory about the context in-game as it is a developmental and conceptual theory surrounding the workings behind the curtains, but yes I believe at least some of which I pinpointed in the OP is true.
 

etecoon

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interesting read, I think another possibility that could be considered is that the goddesses did exist and are now dead. it's something I think most people wouldn't consider because that idea is unthinkable in modern western theology, our concept of god is an all powerful being that could never die and is beyond any of the laws of reality, but in other cultures that is not always so. is it even possible that the triforce is what resulted from their deaths? it does say that it is left at the place where they left the world
 

AngryMoblyn1881

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interesting read, I think another possibility that could be considered is that the goddesses did exist and are now dead. it's something I think most people wouldn't consider because that idea is unthinkable in modern western theology, our concept of god is an all powerful being that could never die and is beyond any of the laws of reality, but in other cultures that is not always so. is it even possible that the triforce is what resulted from their deaths? it does say that it is left at the place where they left the world
I doubt this, although its a cool thought. But after all, they are gods and I dont think they would die that easly, and it seems like a pointless sacrifice on their behalf.
 

Masky

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interesting read, I think another possibility that could be considered is that the goddesses did exist and are now dead. it's something I think most people wouldn't consider because that idea is unthinkable in modern western theology, our concept of god is an all powerful being that could never die and is beyond any of the laws of reality, but in other cultures that is not always so. is it even possible that the triforce is what resulted from their deaths? it does say that it is left at the place where they left the world
Nope. The Godesses are at least still alive up until Wind Waker, since we're told in WW's backstory that the Goddesses themselves directly intervened in the world of Hyrule and even directly communicated with its people. Kind of hard to do that if they're dead.
 

Spire

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I doubt this, although its a cool thought. But after all, they are gods and I dont think they would die that easly, and it seems like a pointless sacrifice on their behalf.
What is a god? We've always been able to imagine these immortal, cross-dimensional beings, but do we have proof of their existence? No. Even believers in God can't prove that it exists, they simply have faith in it as a completely unknown entity, sourced only by "miracles" or "divinations" inacted through man or by nature.

@Masky - almost every culture and/or religion around our world has a story of a great flood of sorts. Be it encompassing the entire planet, or their known world at the time, they all believe that their god(s) caused it. Nature can exact great catastrophes on the world, always as a means of balance. Earthquakes, tornados, hurricanes, and tsunamis happen all the time, but only partially do they directly effect human beings. When they do, some believe it to be the act of a god(s). This is because people cannot truly comprehend why nature would want to destroy us, so we blame an anthropomorphisized form of nature aka "God". We apply a humanlike personality to that which is nothing more than nature. When natural disasters kill people, it can be interpreted as an act of restoring balance. When Ganon attacks Hyrule, a flood commences as an act of restoring balance. If the Goddesses actually existed and had complete sympathy for the people of Hyrule, they would have just destroyed Ganon and saved the lives of every Hyrulean. But that's not what happened. Instead, "they" flooded the world, sealing Ganon beneath the sea and killing numerous innocent civilians in the process. They do not take sides, they merely seek to restore balance and thus, are anthropomorphic aspects of nothing more than nature.
 

Masky

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Perhaps the Godesses for some reason don't have the power to directly kill Ganondorf. I guess you could say that they're not true gods with the ability to do whatever they want since they seemingly can't just kill Ganondorf or take the Triforce away from him.

I think the idea that the Godesses don't exist is attractive and interesting and might have been part of the original intent of OoT, but WW and TP have just contradicted that idea too much by showing the Godesses' direct intervention into the world of Hyrule. Unless if you think that King Daphnes and the Spirits of Light were lying when they talked about the Godesses directly intervening and directly communicating with less-godly beings.
 

Spire

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If the goddesses never existed then, where did the triforce come from?
It's a paradox. There is evidence suggesting the goddesses never existed, therefore obscuring the origin of the Triforce, but the Triforce itself suggests higher beings must have placed it there, for it is a perfectly balanced object which upholds the rule of the land.

By this accord, the only way that the goddesses could possibly exist is if they are partially mortal. If the goddesses were infinite, then they could do feasibly anything, but they are not. They set standards for the world and by having "shown" compassion for mankind, must also be human-like. If they were entirely apart from the denizens of Hyrule; beings biologically and conceptually completely different, then they would show no compassion for the "good".

Therefore the goddesses, whatever they may be: deity-like, alien, robots, or simply ideas, are like the Hylians. If they can speak in Hylian tongue, and if the Hylian's have pointy ears so they can hear the words of the goddesses, then it must be deduced to the plain and simple fact that they are similar biologically.

But alas, they are—like our own god—anthropomorphic interpretations of the rule of the world. In the case of Hyrule, the people happened to recognize the rule of three because of the Triforce, the paradox. It's something that just always is. It's the archetype of rules of the universe that just always are, unchanging, unyielding, and infinite. Like gravity and electromagnetism, but metaphysically incarnate as an artifact.
 

etecoon

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I doubt this, although its a cool thought. But after all, they are gods and I dont think they would die that easly, and it seems like a pointless sacrifice on their behalf.
like I said, a lot of people would struggle to understand this because the idea that a god can't die is central to the jewish/christian/islamic faith, it's entirely foreign to our modern western world. gods can and do die in many other mythologies

and I never said it was a sacrifice, who knows how it happened? they are entirely shrouded in mystery


Nope. The Godesses are at least still alive up until Wind Waker, since we're told in WW's backstory that the Goddesses themselves directly intervened in the world of Hyrule and even directly communicated with its people. Kind of hard to do that if they're dead.
and who is narrating the backstory? you can't just take it for granted that it's the word of the game developer, it should have someones perspective. every story has a story teller after all. the intro begins with the words "this is but one of the legends of which the people speak" and the flood story is later retold again by daphnes, who himself is just a man. the only things that are confirmably super natural about it are that hyrule was literally frozen in time/sealed, and that daphnes is still alive hundreds of years after the fact(and he's a boat...)...the latter isn't explained even with the gods intervention...

Perhaps the Godesses for some reason don't have the power to directly kill Ganondorf. I guess you could say that they're not true gods with the ability to do whatever they want since they seemingly can't just kill Ganondorf or take the Triforce away from him.
A) ganon possesses the triforce of power and is on more than one occasion described as possessing the power of the gods because of it, in short, ganon himself could be considered a god

B) why does not being all powerful not make them gods? again, this idea is central to our modern theology, it is not universal to all religions that have ever existed


I'm also curious if, unrevealed to us so far, there are more gods in the hyrulian religion than just the three goddesses. in much of the story dialogue, the word "gods" is used instead of "goddesses", it makes me wonder


another thing to consider, I'm sure everyone has read the article that implies MM strongly hints that termina is a doomed land because of it's rejection of the goddesses yes? where would that fit into a theory where the goddesses don't exist, the origin of majora's mask is also something that is very mysterious. then again link is knocked out twice before going to termina, it's also very possibly all in his head, I definitely get kind of a "bad dream" vibe from that game. it's kinda fun how you can go in circles with all of it, they make it so ambiguous that you can interpret it all so differently
 

Masky

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and who is narrating the backstory? you can't just take it for granted that it's the word of the game developer, it should have someones perspective. every story has a story teller after all. the intro begins with the words "this is but one of the legends of which the people speak" and the flood story is later retold again by daphnes, who himself is just a man. the only things that are confirmably super natural about it are that hyrule was literally frozen in time/sealed, and that daphnes is still alive hundreds of years after the fact(and he's a boat...)...the latter isn't explained even with the gods intervention...
"So, before the sealing of the kingdom, the gods chose those who would build a new country and commanded them to take refuge on the mountaintops." -King Daphnes

"My power alone could not stop the fiend, and our only choice was to leave the fate of the kingdom in the hands of the gods..." -King Daphnes

King Daphnes tells us that the Godesses flooded the world and that they told the people of Hyrule to take refuge on the mountaintops. There's nothing to suggest that he's lying. Unless if I missed something, everything else in the game agrees with what he says.

A) ganon possesses the triforce of power and is on more than one occasion described as possessing the power of the gods because of it, in short, ganon himself could be considered a god
No... Ganondorf is not a god. He is a man who possesses the Triforce of Power. In fact, in TP he fools Zant into thinking that he is a god, and the characters make a point of pointing out that Ganondorf is a false god.
 

etecoon

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king daphnes account isn't first hand, he never says he personally had any contact with the gods, his word could be pure speculation.
 

Masky

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Was reading the A Link to the Past manual and thought of this thread when I saw this sentence:

According to the Hylian scrolls, the mythical gods descended from a distant nebula to the world and created order and life.
However, this text was only present in the English manual, and the original Japanese manual says nothing of "distant nebulas".
 
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