The Forest Master Rises! Sceptile for Smash Bros! Over 100 supporters!!!

[Overtaken]

I wonder if it will be some rediculously powerful attack that can only be used once per battle

 

[pupNapoleon]

I am starting to believe if there is one spot left, it is going to sceptile.
I still think there is a very likely two spots left, but I'm considering that it is one, and Sceptiles, with a likely DLC spot for Mewtwo.

 

[jigglover]

Sakurai confirmed at E3 that the roster was decided completely at the start of the game's development time. Before you say "OMG GRENINJA", he made that character out of beta drawings etc. which is why there aren't that many Pokémon moves in its moveset besides Water Shuriken. I somehow doubt that ORAS was really a serious thing whilst GF were still developing XY, so this hurts Sceptile's chances a lot.

 

[Overtaken]

Sakurai confirmed at E3 that the roster was decided completely at the start of the game's development time. Before you say "OMG GRENINJA", he made that character out of beta drawings etc. which is why there aren't that many Pokémon moves in its moveset besides Water Shuriken. I somehow doubt that ORAS was really a serious thing whilst GF were still developing XY, so this hurts Sceptile's chances a lot.

But think of it this way: that statement seems to prove that Sakurai will actually consider, and indeed include, a character from a game that hasn't started development, or is in preliminary development. This runs counter to what most people have assumed, and this very assumption has been exactly the biggest foil against Sceptile in so many people's eyes. Hell, he even began working Greninja into the roster before GF had even finalized his design! This means Sceptile's chances are strengthened I argue, as all Sakurai would need to hear from GF is 'hey, we're going to be doing Hoenn remakes after this X/Y thing, just so you know', and viola! Sceptile could be in as easy as that, considering he's a ten year old character and all.

Now, I also have to believe that video game development schedules are planned out in pretty well advance. Especially, of all possible things I could imagine, a Pokemon remake title. As I recall, the first sounds of Smash 4 that we heard of, for example, was Sakurai confirming that he would be developing it after he finished KI:U, obviously confirming that video games are scheduled out while other titles are still being worked upon.

Oh, and check this out too:

HG/SS: Sep. 2009
B/W: Sep. 2010
B2/W2: Jun. 2012
X/Y: Oct. 2013
OR/AS: Aug. 2014

Gamefreak has clearly gotten Pokemon games down to an exact science. I don't think there would have been any problems or uncertainty in the matter of including Sceptile to represent a future project that would (how beautifully) coincide nearly perfectly with Smash's release.

 

[jigglover]

But think of it this way: that statement seems to prove that Sakurai will actually consider, and indeed include, a character from a game that hasn't started development, or is in preliminary development. This runs counter to what most people have assumed, and this very assumption has been exactly the biggest foil against Sceptile in so many people's eyes. Hell, he even began working Greninja into the roster before GF had even finalized his design! This means Sceptile's chances are strengthened I argue, as all Sakurai would need to hear from GF is 'hey, we're going to be doing Hoenn remakes after this X/Y thing, just so you know', and viola! Sceptile could be in as easy as that, considering he's a ten year old character and all.

Now, I also have to believe that video game development schedules are planned out in pretty well advance. Especially, of all possible things I could imagine, a Pokemon remake title. As I recall, the first sounds of Smash 4 that we heard of, for example, was Sakurai confirming that he would be developing it after he finished KI:U, obviously confirming that video games are scheduled out while other titles are still being worked upon.

Oh, and check this out too:

HG/SS: Sep. 2009
B/W: Sep. 2010
B2/W2: Jun. 2012
X/Y: Oct. 2013
OR/AS: Aug. 2014

Gamefreak has clearly gotten Pokemon games down to an exact science. I don't think there would have been any problems or uncertainty in the matter of including Sceptile to represent a future project that would (how beautifully) coincide nearly perfectly with Smash's release.

However, according to the interview Sakurai was in, he worded it very succinctly. He said something along the lines of "GameFreak just told me here you go, a mascot for Pokémon X and Y when I asked for a rep for the new Pokémon game" or something along those lines. Basically, Sakurai asked for a Pokémon rep from a new game and in return he got Greninja. Sceptile, while from a new game now, was clearly not given to Sakurai at the start.

 

[Overtaken]

However, according to the interview Sakurai was in, he worded it very succinctly. He said something along the lines of "GameFreak just told me here you go, a mascot for Pokémon X and Y when I asked for a rep for the new Pokémon game" or something along those lines. Basically, Sakurai asked for a Pokémon rep from a new game and in return he got Greninja. Sceptile, while from a new game now, was clearly not given to Sakurai at the start.

Where is this quote and how is it 'clear' that it was only Greninja (or at least definitly preclusive of Sceptile)?

 

[Autumn ♫]

One of the larger reasons I support Sceptile (besides the fact that he was my first Pokemon, and one of my favorite's at that) is so then we can hear this in Smash 4. I definitely think Nintendo would be able to make a good remix of the song.

 

[jigglover]

Where is this quote and how is it 'clear' that it was only Greninja (or at least definitly preclusive of Sceptile)?

I'm on my iPad so I can't link directly, but it's in this post. Sakurai designed Greninja personally in one night's time (WOW)

I can't remeber where in the video it is exactly, but I think just after or before 50:00

 

[pupNapoleon]

Sakurai also seems to be a big fan of spiritual successors.
So, Sceptile in, for Trainer.

What is this based on? Very little that is not already said. Just tired of supporting my arguments.

 

[Overtaken]

I'm on my iPad so I can't link directly, but it's in this post. Sakurai designed Greninja personally in one night's time (WOW)

I can't remeber where in the video it is exactly, but I think just after or before 50:00

Thanks for sharing the clip, I've been wanting to hear it. I'm afraid I don't see how anything said even implicitly eliminates Sceptile though. He just tells the story of how he worked on Greninja specifically.

 

[Makaronileo]

I was hoping they would turn sceptile more Fysical than special with his new mega, but that dosn't seem to be the case. And shooting away that Christmas tree... I don't know... Still best design and typing tho. D=

 

[Hot Uncle Sparky]

Refresh my on memory; when was the roster finalized? This is speculation on my part, but I'm guessing ORAS was officially decided by GF around late 2012.

 

[pupNapoleon]

I could see Greninja being decided on BECAUSE of sceptile.
"Oh, well we have Charizard. I am making a new starter trio; I've got sceptile, a popular grass final. What about.... oh, this water guy looks cool Got it."

 

[Makaronileo]

Hoping 4 a Groudon vs Kyogre Stage 4 wiiU. Think about all the music remixes!

 

[Masonomace]

Oh man the weather clashing. Drizzle and Drought would affect the stage somehow with transitions or just visual weather and Drought would give Sceptile solar power? Solar Beam charge anyone?!

Edit, 1:44 P.M. CST: Just realized maybe if Type Effectiveness carries over in Sm4sh this weather clashing stage Maka talked about would have the intense sun rays strengthening & Sceptile while decreasing 's water moves. Thoughts?!

P.S. Thank you Makaronileo. Was a great idea

 

[TCT~Phantom]

Ok, I honestly think we are getting 6 pokemon. And I have to say, I think Sceptile will be one of them.

1. Starter trio: This is a big one. Perhaps the main challenge for Charizard was the idea on not emphasizing one section of the starter trio over any other section. With pokemon trainer, you got an emphasis on the Fire Water Grass triangle and the evolutionary circle to boot. Now, we have a fire and water starter, both fully evolved, so who could our grass starter be? I'd personally exclude 1st gen (seeing Ivy cut 90% sure, and that Venu is least popular Kanto starter, Zard), and 6th gen(Greninja, Chespin Pokeball), so what gens are left? The only grass starter that would be easy to work and is popular is Sceptile.

2. Hoenn Confirmed: To many, the idea of Hoenn remakes was a large hype tool post HGSS. We knew it would happen, we just did not know when. Now, we know that it is coming right near Smash's launch, making it easy to push Sceptile. All of Hoenn's starters are popular, but the trio above makes Sceptile seem easier to hype up.

3. Mega Evolution: To Show off new Megas in ORAS, they show off what? The remaining Hoenn starters. Having a mega makes it so much easier to reason pushing Sceptile, seeing as not only are many kids going to use it, like Greninja and Charizard, but it also is going to be one of the most powerful mons in the game, cementing its impression on people.

4. Anime popularity?: This might be a more off topic point, but out of Ash's starters, Sceptile is one of the most empathized with. It is only second to Charizard in popularity. I see it as likely to empathize ORAS, they will bring Sceptile back in the anime.

5. Gamefreak calls the shots to a degree with pokemon: We should all know this. Sakurai even told us this. For the first time, Gamefreak can promote two pokemon games at once that kids will pick up. Remakes were either too far off with HGSS or too far back with FRLG to promote to a high degree (though arguably FRLG was promoted with PT, though it could be said this was more to show of PKMN in general). Now, they have the option to show off two pokemon games, why won't they take it? The game was delayed...

I know many want Mewtwo, and that Sceptile getting in hurts him. I doubt we will get 7 pokemon, and now in this scenario, Mewtwo must compete with 3 time vet Jiggs again, and we all know how that went when Brawl was delayed. I see Sceptile extremely likely. Call me on a hype train, but I see it as I am just analyzing facts. I hope you all like these points towards our forest master...

 

[Masonomace]

That I do, I come to your agreement TCT~P. Said so already but again, approves of this. It's too late for me to bring up anything about other grass starters despite approving for any of them. The forest master calls to us!

Edit: If Sceptile gets returning mechanics added from PKMN Trainer in Brawl please Please PLEASE don't have Stamina/Fatigue. That being said, If Type Effectiveness becomes a returning mechanic for Sm4sh, will it be exclusive towards only PKMN vs. PKMN (I'd like this) or all PKMN be affected by anyone's moves against them? (Hopefully not this but If it had to be in...so be it)
Note: In brawl , , & all had only one elemental weakness so we might have multiple elemental weaknesses for Sm4sh PKMN. Super Effective meant 10% more knock-back (not sure about damage) while Not Very Effective meant receiving 10% less knock-back.

Sceptile would deal 10% more knock-back to:

1. Ground
2. Rock (?) = Charizard's rock smash...but that's a fighting move in PKMN games
3. Water = Greninja

Sceptile would deal 10% less knock-back to:

1. Bug
2. Dragon = Mega Charizard X? (Double Mega Sceptile ditto?? Would be impossible hackless but sick to see)
3. Fire = Charizard
4. Flying = Charizard
5. Grass = vs. himself
6. Poison
7. Steel = Lucario IF we're considering his PKMN steel/fighting dual type but revolves mostly around aura mechanic

Sceptile would resist 10% less knock-back from:

1. Electric = Pikachu
2. Grass = vs. himself
3. Ground (some characters might have ground attacks)
4. Water = Greninja

Sceptile would receive 10% more knock-back from:

1. Bug
2. Fire = Charizard
3. Flying = Charizard
4. Ice (some characters might have Ice attacks)
5. Poison

If Type Effectiveness stayed true to it's own mechanic, then Charizard would be resisting 4x a.k.a. resist 20% (made-up %) less % from his dual typing Fire/Flying. Thoughts?

 

[Makaronileo]

Was a great idea

Thank you.
Ur idea seems also very awesome.
In this stage, i imagine you standing on a rock in the ocean, with groudon and kyogre fighting in the backround, causing sun and rain to fly everywhere. Sometimes Rayquaza comes down from the skies stoping the fight. Then becomes a boss like Yellow Devil.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Guys....

Jiggs is out.

 

[Jmacz]

Sceptile would so awesome his moveset basically makes it self. I'll keep damage guessing to a minimum because I'm not going to act like I know what I'm talking about there. But I do know Pokemon moves lol.

Spoiler

Sceptile would be what I would assume the middle ground between Charizard and Greninja. Charizard would logically be the slowest of the trio (though he isn't very slow), but hit the hardest. Greninja the quickest of the bunch, but the weakest (though by reports he is actually quite strong) Sceptile would be the balance between the two. As far as his moveset goes, the Leaf Blades are meant to be able to hit very quickly, be easy to combo, but have little to no K-O power. His best K.O moves would be the final spike from Leaf Storm (B), Frenzy Plant (D-Smash), SolarBeam (D-Throw), and to a degree X-Scissor (F-Air). Sceptile would have above average speed, above average jump, average power and average defense.

Spoiler

B: Leaf Storm - Sceptile is surrounded by a tornado of leaves, that spin around him for a small amount of time (this does very small DOT) the leaves then shoot upwards and anyone directly above Sceptile takes a large amount of damage. This sounds similar to MetaKnights tornado, but you would have no control over where you go, where ever you press it, so if you are jumping you would continue to fall as if you weren't touching the control stick.
Side B: Energy Ball - Automatically charges to the same size and damage, can be used about once per second.
Down B: Grass Knot - Sceptile creates something similar to a grass trip wire, the heavier the opponent the more damage.
Up B: Acrobatics - Sceptile bounces very high into the air, both the dismount and landing do damage.

Final Smash: Mega Sceptile - Same or similar to Mega Lucario/Charizard X

A: Furry Cutter - If you are able to combo it, each hit does an addition 1% damage like in the games.
Dash: Dragon Claw- Sceptile thrusts forward, flailing his arms in a scratching motion as his claws glow.

U-Tilt: Back hand Leaf Blade
F-Tilt: Upwards slashing Leaf Blade
D-Tilt: Low Sweep

U-Smash: Leaf Blade upper cut
F-Smash: Leaf Blade punch
D-Smash: Frenzy Plant - Sceptile punches the ground, causing tree roots and branches to emerge from the ground.

U-Air: Aerial Ace - Sceptile thrusts upwards, very easy to hit low damage.
F-Air: X-Scissor - Sceptile's arms glow as he he makes an X with his arms and spikes his opponent downwards.
B-Air: 180 Leaf Blade
D- Air: Dragon Tail - Sceptile front flips and thrusts downward tail first.

Grab Attack: Absorb - Sceptile gains 1 or 2% health

U-Throw: Strength - Sceptile grabs his opponent and throws them upward
F-Throw: Strength - Sceptile bounces his opponent off the ground in front of him, as if you were bouncing a basket ball really hard.
B-Throw: Strength - Same as above, but backwards
D-Throw: Solar Beam - Sceptile throws his opponent on the ground, puts his foot on them, and hits them with his solar beam. High damage spike.[/spoilers]



Created an account just do that This Smash had me so excited I came here and saw this I just had to sign up. Could of sword I made an account here before, must of been somewhere else.

 

[Deleted member]

Guys....

Jiggs is out.

What are you talking about?

 

[andimidna]

Guys....

Jiggs is out.

What? Is this about that Gematsu Leak cuts/DLC thing I keep hearing about?

 

[Overtaken]

Is there a new sal leak? I can't find it if that is true.

 

[Diddy Kong]

How the **** is Jigglypuff out?

 

[Xenorange]

How the **** is Jigglypuff out?

It's fairly logical to assume that she's out when you think about it. She was initially going to be cut in Brawl but was salvaged at the last second and she was wildly unpopular in Brawl.

 

[Overtaken]

It's fairly logical to assume that she's out when you think about it. She was initially going to be cut in Brawl but was salvaged at the last second and she was wildly unpopular in Brawl.

Assumption is one thing, but I'm curious as to why Duke just flat out declared "Jiggs is out", as if it's now a fact. I feel like the whole boards, and at very minimum the Jigglypuff thread, would be blowing up by now if it was true, but I don't see anything. Must be a mistake of some sort.

 

[Rebellious Treecko]

How the **** is Jigglypuff out?

She was on the chopping block in Brawl, and a lot of people just seem to have a silly bias against her. Jigglypuff was never liked very much overall, despite her top-tier status in Melee and new fairy type.
I think (hope, rather) Sakurai will still make an attempt to include her, though.

----

 

[Overtaken]

Guys....

Jiggs is out.

http://smashboards.com/threads/replacing-jigglypuff.358427/

Ah, just speculation. Had me excited for a moment.

 

[Diddy Kong]

She was on the chopping block in Brawl, and a lot of people just seem to have a silly bias against her. Jigglypuff was never liked very much overall, despite her top-tier status in Melee and new fairy type. I think Sakurai will still make an attempt to include her, though.

----

She got in cause she's just very, very easy to create. Which is why she could be low priority for Brawl, as well... She's literally a character that can be made last minute. I doubt there's much more work to Jigglypuff than there could be to clone-ish characters! In Smash 64 she was a full clone of Kirby outside her 3 Specials. I doubt she's going anywhere but I actually wouldn't mind seeing her gone, especially not if it gives us Mewtwo and Sceptile. Ice Climbers can leave as well.

 

[Hot Uncle Sparky]

Guys....

Jiggs is out.

Made my heart stop for a second.
10/10

 

[Masonomace]

I thought for a moment jiggs could be out because of my gullible nature (btw new pokemon nature hype) and because of Rest being melee status (lol). But yeah fairy type would freshen up Jiggs just great. Still gotta have 7 pokemon (please)

 

[Reality_Ciak]

Since Jigglypuff has always been the last minute slap on, if Sceptile were both considered and worked on, I could see them either making it in and Jigglypuff being retired for a total of 6 Pokemon, or Jiggs being slapped on on top of them for 7, or one of them being scrapped and Jiggs taking their spot for 6, in no scenario do I expect only 5 Pokemon. Mewtwo seems to be the more demanded character, Sceptile seems to be a more game-balancing and promotional for Game Freak. I also don't see us getting any more Pokemon reps outside those 3. RIP Meowth/Team Rocket... And way back before Rosalina was announced, I wanted a Wes/ Michael and Eeveelution puppeteer character where each color swap was a different Eeveelution and they fought along side Wes/Michael. But that's never happening...

 

[Makaronileo]

So what do u think about Mega sceptile?
Exept looking badass?

 

[ultimatekoopa]

I don't want to troll or being a jerk but if Sakurai puts the most popular pkmn in the game, then the ruby and saphire rep (if we get one, i'm sure mewtwo and sadly puff would get over any of them) it would go for blaziken, I just want to debate about that

 

[Hot Uncle Sparky]

Since Jigglypuff has always been the last minute slap on

It only happened once... supposedly.

I don't want to troll or being a jerk but if Sakurai puts the most popular pkmn in the game, then the ruby and saphire rep (if we get one, i'm sure mewtwo and sadly puff would get over any of them) it would go for blaziken, I just want to debate about that

Popularity isn't the only thing they factor in, most of the thing Blaziken would bring to the game have already been done, I can already see Blaziken playing almost exactly like Captain Falcon. Blaziken is very unlikely to me.

 

[ultimatekoopa]

It only happened once... supposedly.



Popularity isn't the only thing they factor in, most of the thing Blaziken would bring to the game have already been done, I can already see Blaziken playing almost exactly like Captain Falcon.

Sakurai made a moveset to wii fit trainer, falcon, little mac, greninja and people said the same thing about pac man, also this is not true, blaziken can learn a lot of moves
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Blaziken_(Pokémon)
I will improvise a moveset in 1 minute
neutral b: Power up punch. Blaziken punches somebody, if he manages to hit, then he gets a short power up that would make his attacks stronger, blaziken must rest a little between each attack
side b: Fire kick: Blaziken starts doing a series of fire kicks
up b: brave bird: a powerful recovery that does recoil damage
down b: counter, blaziken takes damage and then does a powerful kick that would deal 2x the damage he received
FS: Mega evolution

 

[Hot Uncle Sparky]

Sakurai made a moveset to wii fit trainer, falcon, little mac, greninja and people said the same thing about pac man, also this is not true, blaziken can learn a lot of moves
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Blaziken_(Pokémon)
I will improvise a moveset in 1 minute
neutral b: Power up punch. Blaziken punches somebody, if he manages to hit, then he gets a short power up that would make his attacks stronger, blaziken must rest a little between each attack
side b: Fire kick: Blaziken starts doing a series of fire kicks
up b: brave bird: a powerful recovery that does recoil damage
down b: counter, blaziken takes damage and then does a powerful kick that would deal 2x the damage he received
FS: Mega evolution

Other than the side and down B, I can't imagine any of that working or being used, but if you say so.

 

[ultimatekoopa]

Other than the side and down B, I can't imagine any of that working or being used, but if you say so.

They are moves, blaziken easily has a lot of moveset potential left, that's why I think that he would get over sceptile

 

[Makaronileo]

Sakurai made a moveset to wii fit trainer, falcon, little mac, greninja and people said the same thing about pac man, also this is not true, blaziken can learn a lot of moves
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Blaziken_(Pokémon)
I will improvise a moveset in 1 minute
neutral b: Power up punch. Blaziken punches somebody, if he manages to hit, then he gets a short power up that would make his attacks stronger, blaziken must rest a little between each attack
side b: Fire kick: Blaziken starts doing a series of fire kicks
up b: brave bird: a powerful recovery that does recoil damage
down b: counter, blaziken takes damage and then does a powerful kick that would deal 2x the damage he received
FS: Mega evolution

Sceptile has a more recent mega witch makes it more popular than blaziken for the moment. More people will choose treecko than torchic on there first Oras run.
And charizard is alredy a fire pokemon.
That said, even if i want sceptile over Blaziken in smash, he would be awesome.

 

[ultimatekoopa]

Sceptile has a more recent mega witch makes it more popular than blaziken for the moment. More people will choose treecko than torchic on there firs Oras play.
And charizard is alredy a fire pokemon.

Sorry but this is not a good argument, Can you prove that Sceptile is more popular than Blaziken? By this logic sableye is more popular than Lucario, mewtwo, venasaur and sceptile, Can you prove that more people will pick treecko over sceptile? This didn't happened back in the original ruby and sapphire, that's why blaziken was the winner of that generation, we got pikachu and pichu in melee so there is no problem in having two pkmn of the same type