The First Party general support thread

Arthur97

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Okay, to dig up an old issue, who was going around saying Xenoblade Chronicles X had no spirits? Not only does it have Elma, it actually has quite a few. Guess, I probably should have checked during the debate there.
 

Calamitas

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Okay, to dig up an old issue, who was going around saying Xenoblade Chronicles X had no spirits? Not only does it have Elma, it actually has quite a few. Guess, I probably should have checked during the debate there.
You're misremembering my argument. I only ever said that none of these Spirits appeared in World of Light, not that there aren't any at all. And I wouldn't really call five "quite a few".
 

Arthur97

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You're misremembering my argument. I only ever said that none of these Spirits appeared in World of Light, not that there aren't any at all. And I wouldn't really call five "quite a few".
If that was your argument, it was a pretty weak one. Not being in the adventure mode was your case that X would be the first party DLC? What difference does it make if they appear in story mode or not?
 

fogbadge

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Meowth & Team Rocket

They definitely have recognizability in spades and they are perpetually relevant, and now they are relevant in the latest games, and they can be fun to play.

Jessie and James can be a Pokémon Trainer tag team. Meowth can be the main Pokémon. Arbok and Weezing (or Ekans and Koffing) can take turns as Meowth’s tag team partner. That cannot be unfun to play!
How bout victribel and lickitung?
 

Mamboo07

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I'll add it as an attatchment if it does not come for people, and the joke here was that Mudman is a playable character in SNK's World Heroes.
Yes, I'll be back to first party too.

What first party would be the most ideal to finish off Fighter Pass 5?
Shake King from Wario Land, he's so underrated and would be awesome to play as him in Smash. (Or either Bandana Dee or Poochy.)
 

Arcadenik

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How bout victribel and lickitung?
I would say yes if they were part of Team Rocket in Pokémon Let’s Go.

As far as Pokémon games are concerned, only Meowth, Arbok, and Weezing as Team Rocket members are canon.

I am so thankful that Jessie and James are finally canon in Pokémon games, not just the anime.

If you watched Sakurai’s Terry Bogard presentation today... when he was talking about Terry’s recolors he mentioned that some of them were from the anime.

So... it’s okay to include anime stuff in Smash as long as the anime is from a video game franchise. It’s okay to have Jessie and James in Smash since the anime is from a video game franchise, especially when said franchise is owned by Nintendo.

We already have anime stuff in Smash like Ash-Greninja Final Smash in Ultimate, Misty trophy in Melee, and Team Rocket Meowth trophy in Melee.
 

fogbadge

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I would say yes if they were part of Team Rocket in Pokémon Let’s Go.

As far as Pokémon games are concerned, only Meowth, Arbok, and Weezing as Team Rocket members are canon.

I am so thankful that Jessie and James are finally canon in Pokémon games, not just the anime.

If you watched Sakurai’s Terry Bogard presentation today... when he was talking about Terry’s recolors he mentioned that some of them were from the anime.

So... it’s okay to include anime stuff in Smash as long as the anime is from a video game franchise. It’s okay to have Jessie and James in Smash since the anime is from a video game franchise, especially when said franchise is owned by Nintendo.

We already have anime stuff in Smash like Ash-Greninja Final Smash in Ultimate, Misty trophy in Melee, and Team Rocket Meowth trophy in Melee.
it would seem weird for them not to have wobuffet i feel, maybe as a taunt

well the misty trophy was just her design and the meowth one was based on an techo demo that never became a full game
 
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Quillion

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I am so thankful that Jessie and James are finally canon in Pokémon games, not just the anime.
They were canon in Yellow, weren't they? Not sure why you're saying finally.

Anyway, it's hilarious that an iconic anime trio gets to be main series canon before spinoff filler Waluigi or spinoff one-shot Geno.
 
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I mean Smash Bros already takes influence from Jesse and James, no way the Star KO isn't inspired by them. (TEAM ROCKETS BLASTING OF AGAIN)

Also my ideal moveset involves actually playing as them, and their Pokemon would be used for the attacks. I don't want just Arbok and Weezing. Seviper feels more important to Jesse honestly. And Wobbuffet is necessary. Cacnea would be Great. And Inkay too! Honestly Arbok and Weezing are probably the least interesting Pokemon owned by the trio.

Meowth I picture would be part of a unique grab. He stands on the shoulders of who you're playing as and attacks with the grab button lashing out in front of them. Grabbing onto whoever is in front, functioning differently from other grabs, he doesn't bring them back to the fighter.
 
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Meowth I picture would be part of a unique grab. He stands on the shoulders of who you're playing as and attacks with the grab button lashing out in front of them. Grabbing onto whoever is in front, functioning differently from other grabs, he doesn't bring them back to the fighter.
Please, no. I don't want both my long running wants from Smash 64 to be stuck as someone else's grab animation. It's a fate worse than assist trophy.

Also, heck Meowth is Team Rocket. It's a trio not a duo. I'd rather all three just use their various traps and mechs to fight together than have Meowth sidelined to a single button press.
 
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Please, no. I don't want both my long running wants from Smash 64 to be stuck as someone else's grab animation. It's a fate worse than assist trophy.

Also, heck Meowth is Team Rocket. It's a trio not a duo. I'd rather all three just use their various traps and mechs to fight together than have Meowth sidelined to a single button press.
I had pictured Meowth as a bit more involved than Toad, and always present (and talking), I just figured if you make moveset involving all of Team Rockets Pokemon. A unique Grab to himself would be best, and he'd probably be the one to summon the Meowth themed Final Smash.
 
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I mean Smash Bros already takes influence from Jesse and James, no way the Star KO isn't inspired by them. (TEAM ROCKETS BLASTING OF AGAIN)

Also my ideal moveset involves actually playing as them, and their Pokemon would be used for the attacks. I don't want just Arbok and Weezing. Seviper feels more important to Jesse honestly. And Wobbuffet is necessary. Cacnea would be Great. And Inkay too! Honestly Arbok and Weezing are probably the least interesting Pokemon owned by the trio.

Meowth I picture would be part of a unique grab. He stands on the shoulders of who you're playing as and attacks with the grab button lashing out in front of them. Grabbing onto whoever is in front, functioning differently from other grabs, he doesn't bring them back to the fighter.
Star KOs have actually been pretty recurring within Japanese animations as a gag.
However Melee's adventure/classic mode does directly reference them with an extra bonus called "Rocket KO".

I still would like Meowth to mainly fight like a regular Meowth would (Tyson's Meowth in the anime provides a great example), and even letting him use coins for a few moves like Pay Day and maybe a nair like his Pokeball animation from Smash 64. But I'd like to see him do a few things normal Pokemon wouldn't do like: Pitfall for a down smash and choosing between Pokemon like Wobbuffet, Arbok or Weezing for a down special per say.

I know the TR Meowth doesn't usually fight directly, but I really want him to be the main controllable character of them given how he's used as the (un)official mascot of them (look through marketing, Pikachu shorts ect) especially when it's Pokemon only focused, though with support from them. And it'd just feel a lot more smooth to me.
 
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View attachment 245637

Thanks to Evil Trapezium Evil Trapezium for making this for me!
This is my ideal 10 Nintendo DLC characters (don't forget Piranha Plant!).
Nice, I’d add Ribbon Girl to go along with Spring Man and Toadette to go with Toad, because in both of those cases I don’t think one would get in without the other.
This is amazing. The only characters I’d add is Andy from Advance Wars and Skull Kid.
I’d add both Andy and Sami in my ideal world. Maybe Midna as well.
 
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UserKev

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Shy Guy doesn't deserve to be dismissed as another "mook". Its moveset it has to pull from is too great and It'd literally complete the enemy trio in Smash.

On the topic of King Boo, he's very merited but is in the same "He doesn't have a body" argument with Andross even. Unless he's placed into some type of mecha, it'd take extreme work to make him function-able.
 

Sebas22

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Shy Guy doesn't deserve to be dismissed as another "mook". Its moveset it has to pull from is too great and It'd literally complete the enemy trio in Smash.

On the topic of King Boo, he's very merited but is in the same "He doesn't have a body" argument with Andross even. Unless he's placed into some type of mecha, it'd take extreme work to make him function-able.
King Boo floats. That's the character gimmick. Instead of power up meters or RNG, you can't reach him with low attacks. Tiny characters mains be afraid!... He only floats as long as there's floor below him and there's a fixed distance between him and the floor. He still has to jump around like the other fighters.
 

fogbadge

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Shy Guy doesn't deserve to be dismissed as another "mook". Its moveset it has to pull from is too great and It'd literally complete the enemy trio in Smash.

On the topic of King Boo, he's very merited but is in the same "He doesn't have a body" argument with Andross even. Unless he's placed into some type of mecha, it'd take extreme work to make him function-able.
i fail to see the problem, he can float just as easily as mewtwo, hes got his arms to grab stuff, why would he need a mecha?

I love Sakurai's desire for unique and fun characters <3
sure unless he considers your most wanted boring
 

Arthur97

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Shy Guy doesn't deserve to be dismissed as another "mook". Its moveset it has to pull from is too great and It'd literally complete the enemy trio in Smash.

On the topic of King Boo, he's very merited but is in the same "He doesn't have a body" argument with Andross even. Unless he's placed into some type of mecha, it'd take extreme work to make him function-able.
Trio? Did I miss a surprise announcement?
 

Arthur97

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Shame is, I have at least one want that would be pretty unique. Could potentially even have two gimmicks. But, no, let's throw in Terry with a back special and a comeback mechanic because people love those.
 

AceAttorney9000

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Shame is, I have at least one want that would be pretty unique. Could potentially even have two gimmicks. But, no, let's throw in Terry with a back special and a comeback mechanic because people love those.
Remember that post I made a while back about thinking this thread was just an excuse to bash third-parties? I'm starting to sway more towards that really being the case.

Seriously, I get wanting more first-parties, but are the potshots at third-parties really necessary?
 
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fogbadge

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God, you just love to argue, huh? Saying that King Boo's potentially invincible floaty gimmick is likely not to happen doesn't mean I know anything.
how does him floating make him potentially invincible? i dont follow your logic

i dont mean to be argumentative I’m just trying to understand your reasoning
 
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Arthur97

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Remember that post I made a while back about thinking this thread was just an excuse to bash third-parties? I'm starting to sway more towards that really being the case.

Seriously, I get wanting more first-parties, but are the potshots at third-parties really necessary?
Can you seriously defend more comeback mechanics? Especially after Arsene went over so well. Or Terry getting a back special. Something no one else has? Can you honestly tell me no other fighters could provide a back special? But, no, the third party gets special treatment.
 

Kold Pizza

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Man.

Right now I’m trying to find any statement from Nintendo’s inner circle that would be an affirmation of first party characters finally getting a chance at DLC.

I’ll take any kind of statement at this point, even if it’s a just a hint, or even a rumor.

Right now, I’m just browsing around social media and see if I find anything on it, even if it’s a little thing on this matter.

Doing my best to stay positive right now.
 

AceAttorney9000

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Can you seriously defend more comeback mechanics? Especially after Arsene went over so well. Or Terry getting a back special. Something no one else has? Can you honestly tell me no other fighters could provide a back special? But, no, the third party gets special treatment.
Yes, I can defend more comeback mechanics, because it makes sense for Terry to have one since he comes from a fighting game series that has comeback mechanics as a general rule.

Terry gets a back special because 1) he has the same "auto-facing" mechanic as Ryu and Ken, and the back special is taking advantage of that, and 2) Terry has multiple special moves in his home series and Sakurai wanted to incorporate at least most of them into his Smash moveset.
 

Lenidem

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Plus I would argue that Terry having this back special is probably due to his downloadable status and has nothing to due with him being third party.
 
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Count me in. I'd love to see more first party characters like Rex & Pyra, Ashley, Urbosa, Edelgard, Pauline, Grookey's final evo, etc. I hope that when Sakurai said he wanted to bring more game worlds to Smash, he wasn't solely talking about more third parties.
 
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If we need a gimmick, I'm sure that Rhythm Heaven could offer timed input moves and such for such a character *assuming no other choice takes that like Grookey's final evolution or something which would make me just... Beyond words of negative feelings*. Don't know if they'd be FP5 if it's truly a TGA reveal that may need Joker-levels of hype behind it but it wouldn't be the first time a set of Smash fighters ended on a character that people found underwhelming (Olimar, Corrin, Incineroar).

The many worlds of gaming brought together as possible statement may be looked down on Rhythm because they already have spirits and music representing them in the game already, but that's still a whole new world represented battlefield-visually-wise, a whole new franchise in fighter and stage to be added in. And even ignoring how there was kinda a Shin Megami Tensei character from Tokyo Mirage Sessions ♯FE already repped in Smash through a Spirit before Persona came in (???), if people can want and speculate Geno despite him and his game already being repped in the base game, why not at least one franchise new to the fighters specifically that can properly bring its world to the battlefield and expand the crossover that way?

Like, maybe there could be at least one or two "already repped crossover-wise" characters throughout the entire DLC process, unless we take "expanding the crossover as much as possible" to an extreme literal degree and imagine that "there can't be at least one or two of those characters at all nope not a single one to squeeze through nope they all need to expand the crossover even though we expect Geno".
 
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