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True, but the republicans are much better at taking advantage of this than the democrats are.It's not so much that Republican's are political "geniuses" as that the media and general public are terrible at fact checking and critical thinking.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/08/17/earlyshow/health/main5246940.shtmlCreating a vaccine is a lot different than creating a new drug, there are several processes to follow, and most of the vaccine ingredients aside from the attenuated or deactivated virus are the same even in different vaccines. So essentially, its no more dangerous than any other vaccine using an attenuated virus would be.
Even if it is rare, I'd rather take my chances with the Flu. =|(CBS) Many are concerned about whether a H1N1 vaccine will be safe. But now reports are out that a swine flu vaccine could cause GBS or Guillian-Barre Syndrome, a brain disorder.
I don't get normal flu shots, the flu can mutate pretty quickly so to me getting the vaccine is pretty much pointless. Since it will protect you from that strain of flu.Do you get the normal, seasonal flu shot? Since the ingredients are essentially the same, seasonal flu shots carry the same risks as the H1N1 vaccine. If you're not worried about side effects from the normal flu vaccine, I wouldn't be worried about potential side effects of the H1N1 vaccine either.
http://www.cdc.gov/FLU/about/qa/flushot.htm
http://www.cdc.gov/h1n1flu/vaccination/gbs_qa.htm
http://www.cdc.gov/flu/professionals/vaccination/virusqa.htmI don't get normal flu shots, the flu can mutate pretty quickly so to me getting the vaccine is pretty much pointless. Since it will protect you from that strain of flu.
Also I'm not against vaccines, I'm just against vaccines that haven't been tested thoroughly. The fact that so many health professions are even against this gives me an uneasy feeling about the whole thing in general.
I've never had the flu in my entire life, generally around this time of year I get one cold and that's it. Even then that's very rare, so yeah I'm not worried. If you're someone who gets the flu a lot then getting this vaccine is probably worth the risk. I'm just glad they're not making it mandatory.
Yeah see my opposition comes from the fact that not every vaccine is safe. Gerald Fords little mishap in the 70's should have made this obvious. Or how about the Anthrax Vaccine which turned out to be a health concern for the Military?http://www.cdc.gov/flu/professionals/vaccination/virusqa.htm
This will answer all questions about flu vaccine effectiveness.
The seasonal flu shot is trivalent; it has three strains in it. These strains are based on data collected by hundreds of epidemiologists and institutes around the world, analyzed by the WHO, and the FDA and CDC. They decide which strains to use based on forecasting data that predicts which strains will be most prevalent that year/season. Most of the time, a good match increases protection among the population by 70-90%.
Also, Reaver is right: generally, the flu strains are so similar that even in a "mismatched" year when the actual strains differ from the vaccine strains, there is still a significant reduction in infection:
For example, in a study among persons 50-64 years of age during the 2003-04 season, when the vaccine strains were not optimally matched, inactivated influenza vaccine effectiveness against laboratory-confirmed influenza was 60% among persons without high-risk conditions, and 48% among those with high risk conditions, but it was 90% against laboratory-confirmed influenza hospitalization (Herrera, et al Vaccine 2006). A study in children during the same year found vaccine effectiveness of about 50% against medically diagnosed influenza and pneumonia without laboratory confirmation (Ritzwoller, Pediatrics 2005).
A vaccine isn't a miracle substance. It isn't the only way to prevent getting the flu. Practicing good health, and preventative medicine is actually still effective believe it or not. So the argument that I'm risking everyone else is loaded especially considering my health history.Reaver's also right about health risks for others. By not getting the vaccine, you're putting at risk anybody who is at higher risk (children, the elderly, and the immunocompromised). You don't even have to come into direct contact with them; you might leave germs on a surface you touch, like a doorknob or table (depending on the surface, flu virus can survive up to 48 hours outside a host).
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/infectious-disease/AN01238
http://www.slate.com/id/2091774/
I strongly suggest you read my links. Regular flu vaccine can also cause GBS. Like Reaver said, both vaccines are pretty much exactly the same; the only difference is the flu strain. They carry the same risks. Current vaccines have not been associated with any increase in the rate of GBS. The vaccine in '76 was a one-time deal, in regard to flu shots. Moreover:A vaccine should always be tested, I wouldn't care if it had the same effects as the regular flu vaccine. But the fact that this one could potentially cause GBS is enough to take a step back and look at it deeper.
Practicing good health definitely helps. It is not the same as an immunization. You are far more likely to get sick without the vaccine than with it. Your health history is just that: history. Unless you can predict the future, you have no way of knowing whether or not you will get sick. Maybe you are less likely to get sick, but you are not immune.A vaccine isn't a miracle substance. It isn't the only way to prevent getting the flu. Practicing good health, and preventative medicine is actually still effective believe it or not. So the argument that I'm risking everyone else is loaded especially considering my health history.
I have, you're not arguing with a PGer right now.I strongly suggest you read my links.
.Regular flu vaccine can also cause GBS. Like Reaver said, both vaccines are pretty much exactly the same; the only difference is the flu strain. They carry the same risks. Current vaccines have not been associated with any increase in the rate of GBS. The vaccine in '76 was a one-time deal, in regard to flu shots
Yes I know, I'm not saying it does or doesn't I'm saying that they need to look into that further before they give it the okay for public usage. This is especially the case for medical professionals since in some states it's mandatory. What if this turns out to be another 76 incident? If you think health reform is hard to pass imagine if that happened.Moreover:
Is the 2009 H1N1 flu shot expected to be associated with Guillain-Barre Syndrome (GBS)?
In 1976, an earlier type of swine flu vaccine was associated with cases of a severe paralytic illness called Guillain-Barre Syndrome (GBS) at a rate of approximately 1 case of GBS per 100,000 persons vaccinated. Some studies done since 1976 have shown a small risk of GBS in persons who received the seasonal influenza vaccine. This risk is estimated to be no more than 1 case of GBS per 1 million persons vaccinated. Pregnant women should tell the person giving the shots if they have ever had GBS.
http://www.cdc.gov/H1N1flu/vaccination/pregnant_qa.htm
How common is GBS, and how common is it after people are vaccinated for seasonal influenza?
GBS is rare. Each year, about 3,000 to 6,000 people in the United States develop GBS whether or not they received a vaccination – that’s 1 to 2 people out of every 100,000 people. This is referred to as the background rate.
In 1976, there was a small risk of GBS following influenza (swine flu) vaccination (approximately 1 additional case per 100,000 people who received the swine flu vaccine). That number of GBS cases was slightly higher than the background rate for GBS. Since then, numerous studies have been done to evaluate if other flu vaccines were associated with GBS. In most studies, no association was found, but two studies suggested that approximately 1 additional person out of 1 million vaccinated people may be at risk for GBS associated with the seasonal influenza vaccine. It is important to keep in mind that severe illness and possible death can be associated with influenza, and vaccination is the best way to prevent influenza infection and its complications.
What happened in 1976 with GBS and the swine flu vaccine?
Scientists first reported a suspected link between GBS and vaccinations in 1976, during a national campaign to vaccinate people against a swine flu virus. The investigation found that vaccine recipients had a higher risk for GBS than those who were not vaccinated (about 1 additional case occurred per 100,000 people vaccinated). Given this association, and the fact that the swine flu disease was limited, the vaccination program was stopped.
Since then, numerous studies have been done to evaluate if other flu vaccines were associated with GBS. In most studies, no association was found, but two studies suggested that approximately 1 additional person out of 1 million vaccinated people may be at risk for GBS associated with the seasonal influenza vaccine.
http://www.cdc.gov/h1n1flu/vaccination/gbs_qa.htm
I obviously am far more at risk, but that doesn't really say much. Maybe if I lived in any other state I would get vaccinated every year, but my state is pretty good at keeping those instances localized.Practicing good health definitely helps. It is not the same as an immunization. You are far more likely to get sick without the vaccine than with it. Your health history is just that: history. Unless you can predict the future, you have no way of knowing whether or not you will get sick. Maybe you are less likely to get sick, but you are not immune.
Until I actually get the flu I'll stick to what I've been doing. Practicing good health.And if you do get sick with the flu, you are putting others at risk, even if you stay at home (remember that there is an incubation period before you see symptoms, during which time you are contagious).
As you can see from my posts I'm not afraid of it, my concern is this is going to turn into a 76 incident which is why I'm saying it's foolish for the FDA to approve the drug without extensive testing. I understand the Government want's to take charge of this and show it's not incompetent.Aesir, what specifically are you fears about this vaccine? Do you expect it to be somehow different in its side effects than other flu vaccines?
Then I ran across this and realized how much of a fraud the Intelligent Design movement really is."Evolution is cleverer than you are."
Orgel's Second Rule is intended as a rejoinder to the argument by lack of imagination. In general, this rule expresses the sometimes experienced fact that "trial and error" strategies are better than centralized intelligent human planning.
Orgel's rule can also be used to counter creationist arguments in which often the hidden and non-provable presumption is suggested, that human intelligent planning is in general superior to trial and error strategies used by evolution.
The same principle has been given as an analogy to software developed in an evolutionary sense by group collaboration, as opposed to software built to a pre-ordained design that was created without reference to previous implementation. Although, the development is not claimed to be of the same random nature as is by evolutionary genetics.
I read in my local paper a few days ago, that in the entire nation, only 109 minors are sentenced to life terms without parole for crimes other than murder. Of those 109, 77 of them resided in Florida, and over 80% of them were black.I was thinking of making a new thread on how age should factor in to jail sentences.
(Recently in the news a 13 year old boy was sentenced to life in prison without possiblity of parole. His attorney argued that “To say to any child of 13 that you are only fit to die in prison is cruel”.)
Anyone interested in this debate? If so, I'll go write it up.
Alright, I'll probably post it by the weekend.Krazy, I think you should make the thread. I'm very interested in seeing the information you have and hearing the sides of the issue.
Yup, 77 in Florida, and 17 in Louisiana; 84% are black.manhunter098 said:I read in my local paper a few days ago, that in the entire nation, only 109 minors are sentenced to life terms without parole for crimes other than murder. Of those 109, 77 of them resided in Florida, and over 80% of them were black.
Did the GoP of smashboards spark this interest?Alright, I think I've thought of a way to get more activity in here. Would any of you be interested in helping lead the fight against anti-science and anti-intellectualism?
I'm going to make a new thread soon where we can discuss the ramifications of the above in greater detail.