Teleporting for Dummies: A New In-progress Ness Stage Guide

[PSI.kick]

alright movin along...
Castle Siege.
First section:
Pretty basic, nice platforms that you can do everything we just talked about on, a hill in the middle that you can do some fun stuff with (dash attack... O.o), and imo a pretty good "neutral" type stage. (when i say neutral i mean stages like fd, bf, and sv, where nothing really ever happens.)
Overall a pretty normal stage.

Second section:
Big.
Very big.
Generally this part of the stage is just waited out, but rushdown ness players can upset the norm. Approach, don't wait and have a perfectly good opportunity for a good fight to happen later.
Defensive players will probably either hug the sides/avoid you up on the platforms. Grab is awesome for this. you grab them right next to the side? mmmm fthrow=instadeath. Don't be stupid though, be extremely careful not to get grabbed by a chaingrabber/deathgrabber, walkoffs can be really bad for you too, and this situation will mean death.

The statues are amazing, while they halt us from really using pkt well, pkfire has some perks here. Pillaring the statues with pkf will stop approaches, and also escapes. Characters that like to stay away from you and camp can get screwed by this. Pkf the statues (or go for them and have it hit the statues, if you hit them instead, then hooray) and then go in with aerials from above, meaning they have to go under you or at you. I'd suggest full hopping a fair or nair, then follow up with a bair or something depending on what they do to get out of this.
They cower under you: ff the full hop (skip this if you short hopped) then rising or regular bair them. Another thing you can do is to dj and pkfire them (i can't remember if this is dj canceling or just jumping and pkfiring... but either way it's a good followup. Maybe a pk jump if you are good at doing it from a fall), then lag cancel it by using an aerial in their face or air dodging and grabbing them (or whatever pkf follow up you want to do.)
They cower in fear and try to run away through the statue: fh pk fire or pk jump the statue again and watch them yell at their faces getting handed to them by da ness.
They decide to go after you in the air: aerial them to smithereens. Or dj pk fire them again for more laughs xD
You're kinda on your own as to what you do with each situation, but I think the statues should be capitalized on in this section, they're one of the only interesting parts of it.

Third section:
tilts. hill in the middle. lava comes up and harvests your soul for the afterlife (wrong stage sorry). Nothin real special on this one.

I didn't really cover much, discussion is a group thing...

 

[M]

Sorry PSI.kick, don't quite think we've nailed all the points on BF thoroughly yet. =P

 

[Dajayman]

On the contrary I think we could wrap it up on BF, the more important things have been said.

I don't think we should talk about Castle Siege though. We should talk about either the other neutrals more or about the cps we use and the cps we should avoid.

 

[PSI.kick]

Im fine with that, i was just bored and trying to spice this thread up a bit. SV?

 

[Man of Popsicle]

Feel free to use my old thread as a resource.

 

[Dajayman]

We could spice it up with a bit of Brinstar or Delfino, I definitely don't mind discussing those.

 

[PSI.kick]

we need to discuss something that people end up bringing ness to often. SV would be very beneficial, brinstar maybe because we cp it, but delfino not yet.

 

[M]

Bang.


I'll update the OP with a lot of the BF info soon. As for now, Smashville!

 

[PSI.kick]

Alright. Basic stage type, a lot like FD, but has a platform slightly above. You know what this means! everything we just talked about involving platforms works here! sh/fh uair, nair, far, (dair... meh) all work against people on them.
PKT is amazing here! as is pkf (pk jump, fh pkf, turnaround pkf...) Use pkt like none other, juggle, loop, snake, swell surprise, everything you can think of! Do it! Get on a platform and mind games them to coming at you while you loop around yourself to pkt2 them! They'll be yelling **** and bloody murder in no time!
I would however suggest striking this after fd on mk, snake, and sometimes diddy, although you usually are going to want to strike somewhere else.
I like this one a lot, and it is usually the one that get's striked to. It's just a decent stage without much to it, the ledge shape doesn't screw your recovery up, nothing really interferes with your game at all. It's just a well rounded stage that isn't too bad for ness.

 

[Jiffyboob]

This might sound kind of weird but I think playing a Diddy on SV is harder than on FD. I know it has the moving platform and you can camp it, but Diddy has incredible stage control on SV.

Basically I'm just saying... I wouldn't take a Diddy to either of the places.

 

[Neon Ness]

This might sound kind of weird but I think playing a Diddy on SV is harder than on FD. I know it has the moving platform and you can camp it, but Diddy has incredible stage control on SV.

Basically I'm just saying... I wouldn't take a Diddy to either of the places.

Can you elaborate on "stage control"?

I'm not following what makes SV better for Diddy than Final D.

 

[PSI.kick]

Stage control is where diddy can control the stage extremely well, meaning that his banana usage/moves in general force you to wherever he wants you. This is something that all diddies want, it's a big part of their game (if im wrong on this then say so, that's just what i've thought it means.)

 

[Neon Ness]

No I know what it means, I was asking jiffy why Diddy's stage control was somehow augmented on Smashville as opposed to FD.

 

[Jiffyboob]

No I know what it means, I was asking jiffy why Diddy's stage control was somehow augmented on Smashville as opposed to FD.

PSI.kick kind of summed it up. I wouldn't go so far as to say it's augmented but the size of the stage is basically what I was talking about. If you removed the moving platform from SV, the stage would be his most ideal stage. The moving platform in general isn't that big of a deal for a Diddy player to overcome.

 

[M]

^ This is true, and given that platform won't really be where you want it 80% of the time, you can't abuse the platform very well against Diddy.

 

[Bartolon]

Platform cancel yay

 

[Dajayman]

I agree. SV to me has always been just another FD, just a but smaller and without the gay lips on the ledges.

The platform does come from time to time, but I should note that this platform is slightly higher than BF side platforms. This means sh nair won't work and sh fair doesn't poke out as much.

Basically you need to treat SV just like FD 80% of the time, and like BF the other 20%.

 

[M]

Platform cancel yay

Just like to point out that everyone else is able to platform cancel too, yeah?

 

[PSI.kick]

I actually don't know how to nor do i really even know what platform canceling is.
<--noob lol

but yeah sv isn't realy that complicated. The platform can be really nice though, gives you extra help when going offstage to kill sometimes, doesn't usually help your recovery, just gives us more options.

 

[Eagleye893]

Recovering from below the stage (meaning actually under the stage) is possible, unlike with BF or FD. That's my favorite part about this stage. I've yet to see if we can go under the stage and come up on the other side though.

 

[Neon Ness]

I actually don't know how to nor do i really even know what platform canceling is.
<--noob lol

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=276432 Barto explains it pretty good here. Platform canceling good. Just watch Mr. R videos lol.

I've never done it in actual matches so this is just theory. If I had to guess it would make Ness pressuring shields from below somewhat easier. Since you can jump > platform cancel > dash grab in a relatively short amount of time. Some people will sit on their shields when they're on a different elevation than you, since most characters can't grab through it while in the air (moves like Koopa Klaw, Bite, etc).

Does anyone know if SV is shorter than/the same length as FD? Something I've always wondered about when considering small step GRs.

One thing I do like about SV as opposed to FD is you can actually try to loop PKT under the stage to hit people there. For instance if Sonic were to try HA stall, not sure how often that's going to be happening though. Shrug.

Also, I could be wrong on this, but I thought I read somewhere that if Ness can air release MK on the moving platform, he can pull off an fsmash depending on which direction the platform's moving? I forgot exactly what it was, it was something like that. If that's true it might be worth looking into who else this could work on, or if it can even be done to Ness also.

 

[Dajayman]

Here's a few of my SV tricks:

My favorite trick is djing from the ledge to the platform. Ness' dj lands him perfectly on the platform with no air hangtime, meaning you can buffer a move right away. Extremely useful when being pressured on the ledge.

Platform canceling from a fh, Ness' fh height makes for such easy platform canceling.

 

[PSI.kick]

Neon im pretty sure it is smaller, and yeah i agree on the pkt under stage thing. I would choose sv over fd any day.
platform canceling, meh, i'll try it out and maybe get it into my game every once in a while. i do need to be abusing my grabs alot more though... *facepalm*

 

[Neon Ness]

Man, I keep forgetting about this thread.

Alright, so does anyone have any particular opinions on characters to fight against on Smashville?

All of that flat ground makes me nervous around D3. Since there's only the one platform it's harder not to be on the same elevation as he is, as opposed to like Battlefield or Brinstar. And of course flat ground = CG to the edge of the stage. It's... troublesome.

I dunno, though. I kind of feel like I don't know enough about this stage as a whole. I want to look into what kind of stuff air/ground release + moving platform can produce, for and against Ness.

 

[Dajayman]

None of the neutrals are good against DDD except maybe Lylat. They're all flat, and DDD has good platform abuse options so platform camping ain't too smart either.

Like I said, this stage is 80% like FD and 20% like BF. Most of the timr fighting here will be exactly like FD, so just avoid taking people here if you also don't like FD. The 20% BF part makes is slightly less worse than FD could be, but it would still be bad.

If an opponent would favor BF and you'd rather take them to FD but they banned it, then this stage is like a good, sneaky stage to go to in stage striking. I don't know why but most people think SV is 50/50 BF and FD when the truth is it plays like FD most of the time.

That's pretty much all the advice I can give here. To sum up my thoughts on SV:
• Play like it's FD a majoroty of the time.
• Abuse the platform when a good situation happens, and obviously avoid bad platform situations yourself.
• While not necessary, it's helpful if you learn platform canceling and other SV tricks. More options = good!

K, I think it's time for a new stage. Lylat now?
Also f***ing get active or I won't share my infinite wisdom anymore.

 

[Fuujin]

Why does this thread title sound like a guide on how to use Farore's Wind?

 

[Neon Ness]

Also f***ing get active or I won't share my infinite wisdom anymore.

Hey now, that's not fair. Without your infinite wisdom, this place would explode.

I'm on the fence about whether Smashville plays like FD "most of the time". I'm inclined to agree but at the same time, that platform moves pretty frequently. You can make use of it fairly often if you had a mind to, even if it's the only one there.

Also, as much as I hate to say it, we might have to consider giving the thread to someone who can update more frequently. I dunno if MM is really busy all of a sudden or something but it seems like it'd be easier to keep things going with some sort of schedule.

 

[Dajayman]

I'd be up for taking this over if I actually had a PC and not an iPod Touch. It'd be impossible for me to update this without the ability to use copypaste. :/

 

[Eagleye893]

Update to OS4?

Oh yeah... Forgot...

 

[Earthbound360]

Smashville is probably my favorite neutral stage. It was brought up that double jumping from the ledge offers a safe and quick getup to the floating platform with no hangtime. It's also easier to wallhug on this stage than other neutrals.

Idk why but I always try to poke PK Fires at the stage from the platform. a short hop into a PKF goes right down at the stage hitting at a modest angle, and the fact that it moves should keep you moderately safe.

You can also use PKT here with a bit more safety if you stay on that platform. With a few loops and tailwhips here and there you can get some nuisance going.

It is shorter than Final Destination, and certainly more narrow. It still has that weird lip at the edge for that yo-yo spike we all know and love, but the lip isnt so screwed up as to cause roof bounces on PKT2 X_X

Like I said, favorite neutral stage, but I still, have always, and always will hate Battlefield with a burning passion... so I might be a tad biased there.

 

[Eagleye893]

^ I agree with EB360.

I hate the lip of the ledge on FD and BF. I'm under BF and I get the perfect angle for recovery, then it randomly bounces me away. >.<

So positives of SV:
Platform canceling,
Pkt2 recovery is super easy,
Pkjump not restricted,
Platform in case of CG'ers,
I like dropthrough platform>uair. xD,
FH pkfire welltimed can land you on the platform for moving away,
More stuff...

Negatives:
Everyone likes this stage.

 

[Dajayman]

It randomly bounces you away on BF because you can't wallride on the right side of any stage. It's a coding error, so you can only wallride on the left side of any stage. That's probably what happened.

Idk why you hate BF, it's my favorite neutral. Only time I don't go there is when I have to play a Marth or MK and I'd prefer to take them to FD instead.

 

[Earthbound360]

The platforms greatly limit what Ness can do coming down from a full or double jump height. I often sh aerial dj and either aerial or akrdode on the way back down. You cant do this on battlefield because you cant drop thru platforms while airdodging or doing an attack. This puts me over the opponent,ready for a whoopin.

The platforms also say no to PK Jumps, which im still in love with. And pkt can be safeè or less at this stage, but i find it screwing me over more than helping my pkt. Its safer in the sense that the platforms may aid in preventing aerial punishment, but this is what bugs me about pkt on this level: should you miss, most cancelling maneuvers, if not all become dangerous or extra hard here. The stage is so short that if you blast away with pkt, youre prolly gonna fly off to ur death. Floorblasting is just stupid hard with a platform over you. And in gnereal, navigating pkt thru all of those platforms just irks me.

 

[Dajayman]

Ah, I see. I forgot you like using specials a lot (you bstick right?), that explains why you really don't like BF.

I don't mind BF because most of my playstyle is mostly sh aerials with some PK moves added as a mixup. BF platforms help me out with my sh aerial game. But I can understand why you would hate the platforms for interupting your high aerial and PK game, something I don't really use that much.

 

[Eagleye893]

I only like this about BF: slide off platform with psimag and breverse. It's better on sv though.

Pkjump is dead, pkfire sucks, pkt is difficult to do, pkflash is increased only a tiny bit.

 

[Dajayman]

PK Flash is obviously Ness' most used and most useful PK move so BF is the best since it helps only PK Flash.

 

[Eagleye893]

Dajay, your sarcasm is not at all obvious.

 

[Dajayman]

What sarcasm? I'm totally not being sarcastic, I don't even know what sarcasm is.

 

[Yink]

I want to bring this back. Can we talk about CPing for Ness?

Obviously most people you play are going to ban Brinstar so let's rule that out. What other stages do you guys prefer to CP for Ness?

 

[Dajayman]

I've been experimenting with various CPs. Of course we all know about how amazing Delfino is for us. I'm also thinking our next best stage is Castle Siege, the second transformation is just an amazing place for Ness (unless DDD brings his fat a** here... ).