Team Star Fox call in Krystal for Smash!

[Smokey21]

I was reading an interview with Imamura and Cuthbert both, Imamura mentioned something about people not liking how much fur they had in adventures/assault. I can understand adventures but Assault didn't have any advanced fur rendering, though that doesn't really explain the style.

Interesting... I can't recall if I've read that one before! I better see if I can find it naow!
*starts wandering aimlessly*

 

[ryuu seika]

The ears are, unfortunately, simply down to what I would describe as inept art-direction. Whoever was responsible didn't seem to be aware that this is not how canids should look - the configuration of Fox and Krystal's faces is somewhere between rodents and cats.

It's pretty sad that they decided back then that this horrifying elongated-noggins look should remain because it's "unique", and to date, it has indeed stuck around. It looks marginally better in Star Fox Zero's promotional art, but at the end of the day it still looks weird*.

*It might just be me, but I find that this removes some of the series' appeal. Reason being, the previous art-direction gave a feeling of a star system where life had evolved differently, whereas the current art-direction seems to be trying to combine the look of animals with the look of stereotypical massive-headed sci-fi grey aliens.

I was reading an interview with Imamura and Cuthbert both, Imamura mentioned something about people not liking how much fur they had in adventures/assault. I can understand adventures but Assault didn't have any advanced fur rendering, though that doesn't really explain the style.

Solution: Give all the fur to slippy (people hate him anyway) and turn Fox's, Peppy's and Wolf's into feathers. Falco can have scales and Leon gets the best deal out of everyone with a shockingly magenta mohawk to show of his oddly human skin and hair configuration.

 

[TheCynicalCdr]

So hey, when watching Johnnys video on Skyward Sword, I just happened to notice something.

The Shield Meter has the same appearance of the Magic Meter in Adventures

 

[Smokey21]

Solution: Give all the fur to slippy (people hate him anyway) and turn Fox's, Peppy's and Wolf's into feathers. Falco can have scales and Leon gets the best deal out of everyone with a shockingly magenta mohawk to show of his oddly human skin and hair configuration.

Somebody get this man a raise! I think he's onto something! On a serious note that's one of the scariest things I have ever seen and will probably have nightmares now. I'll probably be trying to get that image out of my head over the next few weeks. Lol

So hey, when watching Johnnys video on Skyward Sword, I just happened to notice something.

The Shield Meter has the same appearance of the Magic Meter in Adventures

View attachment 128809View attachment 128810

You may be right that the gauge was reused and had that shield added to the left of it instead of the staff base. I'll do some looking around for other gauges in other Games. That would be funny though if they really did reuse that gauge.

 

[Gagnetar]

So hey, when watching Johnnys video on Skyward Sword, I just happened to notice something.

The Shield Meter has the same appearance of the Magic Meter in Adventures

View attachment 128809View attachment 128810

sounds like a false positive to me, just a similiar design.

In any case i'm pretty curious if we'll actually get smash news during the e3, i can't imagine they'll leave us without anything related to smash with those amiibos coming out, questioning would get even more feverish but you never know with Nintendo.
I also didn't know that Miyamoto works a supervisor for Smash nowadays, with this interest in Starfox and the obvious power of Smash to bring attention to characters maybe he'll ask for a starfox character. I think it'd edge towards Krystal if for some reason if they had to choose, I'm pretty convinced at this point that both Wolf and Krystal will appear together if there's plenty of characters added.

 

[Altais]

Hmm, some of the replies in this thread got me thinking: I think it would be interesting if Krystal got her own game, the story of which picks up where the "Kursed" ending of Star Fox Command left off. The game could be very dark in tone, with Kursed and her crew hunting criminals. The real story could begin when she encounters Fox--after which greater evils arise. At some point, Fox could be kidnapped by said evils, and Kursed/Krystal's goal from then on could be rescuing Fox. During this adventure, she slowly pulls herself from the darkness and restores her image.

[Shrugs] Eh, maybe not a good idea.

 

[Gagnetar]

Hmm, some of the replies in this thread got me thinking: I think it would be interesting if Krystal got her own game, the story of which picks up where the "Kursed" ending of Star Fox Command left off. The game could be very dark in tone, with Kursed and her crew hunting criminals. The real story could begin when she encounters Fox--after which greater evils arise. At some point, Fox could be kidnapped by said evils, and Kursed/Krystal's goal from then on could be rescuing Fox. During this adventure, she slowly pulls herself from the darkness and restores her image.

[Shrugs] Eh, maybe not a good idea.

I think the series should avoid heavy drama as much as possible, it's very unfitting. Krystal does have enough for a potential side campaign depending on how much development goes into the next Starfox title, despite not seeing something like that before in the games, Starfox again is quite an experimental series and can go in unpredictable ways. With the ballot assuring she still has considerable popularity she might get more attention even if we get only a regular campaign. If she did get an extra campaign i think exploring more of what happened in her past rather than exploring that hideous proposed future would be the way to go. Gameplay could be something akin to a metroidvania emphasizing upgrades to both her ship and her staff for some more fleshed out flying segments and more polished primary ground exploration following krystal as she gets psychic recordings of the past of Cerinia. Considering the planet was only "doomed" and not destroyed per say it could even take place on it following a fairly short campaign fighting mysterious magical entities and what not on a seemingly lifeless planet.

 

[Smokey21]

sounds like a false positive to me, just a similiar design.

In any case i'm pretty curious if we'll actually get smash news during the e3, i can't imagine they'll leave us without anything related to smash with those amiibos coming out, questioning would get even more feverish but you never know with Nintendo.
I also didn't know that Miyamoto works a supervisor for Smash nowadays, with this interest in Starfox and the obvious power of Smash to bring attention to characters maybe he'll ask for a starfox character. I think it'd edge towards Krystal if for some reason if they had to choose, I'm pretty convinced at this point that both Wolf and Krystal will appear together if there's plenty of characters added.

When I was watching the switch reveal the only thing that was said more than "where's smash?" Was "where's mother 3?" So I'm positive that we're going to get something in terms of a smash reveal. Coupled with Reggie saying that this E3 is going to be big this year and addressing at least one of each major franchise per platform. I'd be surprised if Nintendo didn't say anything about smash at E3 this year. Now the question is... are we going to get a port or a full game. Being that we could possibly get a port early in the switches lifetime with 5-8 characters and more stages etc, or are we going to get a new smash title with 11-13 characters as every game after the original has added 11-13 characters on average, then smash 4 broke the mold with 11 initially then 7-8ish dlc I don't remember exactly. Coupled with what you said about Miyamoto having a supervisory roll as well now I think Krystal may have a pretty solid chance this time around... regardless of whether we have a port or new game. Assuming Miyamoto wants to raise star fox popularity.

Hmm, some of the replies in this thread got me thinking: I think it would be interesting if Krystal got her own game, the story of which picks up where the "Kursed" ending of Star Fox Command left off. The game could be very dark in tone, with Kursed and her crew hunting criminals. The real story could begin when she encounters Fox--after which greater evils arise. At some point, Fox could be kidnapped by said evils, and Kursed/Krystal's goal from then on could be rescuing Fox. During this adventure, she slowly pulls herself from the darkness and restores her image.

[Shrugs] Eh, maybe not a good idea.

Although that is a cool idea and possibility and I would still be delighted if we got something along those lines... I think I'd also like that continuity ignored as there were so many things done with it that felt so wrong.

I think the series should avoid heavy drama as much as possible, it's very unfitting. Krystal does have enough for a potential side campaign depending on how much development goes into the next Starfox title, despite not seeing something like that before in the games, Starfox again is quite an experimental series and can go in unpredictable ways. With the ballot assuring she still has considerable popularity she might get more attention even if we get only a regular campaign. If she did get an extra campaign i think exploring more of what happened in her past rather than exploring that hideous proposed future would be the way to go. Gameplay could be something akin to a metroidvania emphasizing upgrades to both her ship and her staff for some more fleshed out flying segments and more polished primary ground exploration following krystal as she gets psychic recordings of the past of Cerinia. Considering the planet was only "doomed" and not destroyed per say it could even take place on it following a fairly short campaign fighting mysterious magical entities and what not on a seemingly lifeless planet.

I agree that the game currently has more drama than it needs especially following the command story and I think that we could all just do without its continuity at this point(way too many characters weren't themselves, especially Krystal). I would die if we got a metroidvania styled game about Krystal trying to discover what happened on Cerinia. And that is correct it did say doomed not destroyed so it totally could be spun that way and turned into a game that would play out that way in a sense.

 

[Altais]

Totally forgot about Cerinia. Now that I've rethought it, I think a solo Krystal game would be better off centred on that planet. Also, I'll have to agree about the heavy drama statement. In terms of tone, the Star Fox series is better off with a "Sci-Fi, but silly" vibe.

I've heard a saying: Star Fox is Nintendo's Sonic. The old games are phenomenal, but the newer games were terrible. Looking back, I think Shadow the Hedgehog and Sonic 2006 just tried way too hard to be serious--and nowadays, I feel the same way about Dinosaur Planet and Assault.

 

[Smokey21]

Totally forgot about Cerinia. Now that I've rethought it, I think a solo Krystal game would be better off centred on that planet. Also, I'll have to agree about the heavy drama statement. In terms of tone, the Star Fox series is better off with a "Sci-Fi, but silly" vibe.

I've heard a saying: Star Fox is Nintendo's Sonic. The old games are phenomenal, but the newer games were terrible. Looking back, I think Shadow the Hedgehog and Sonic 2006 just tried way too hard to be serious--and nowadays, I feel the same way about Dinosaur Planet and Assault.

Well I don't know if we should say that the game should be restricted to the "sci-fi" or "silly" because that is still restricting the game a little too much. Assault was a more serious title, but I loved it more than Star Fox 64 and SNES combined. But mostly because I just really enjoyed playing star fox with friends in more than just a landmaster or arwing.

Calling Star Fox nintendo's sonic is kinda harsh ! And I also enjoyed the newer star fox games(as did a lot of people that are just less vocal). Command doesn't exist to me though so let's get that off the record now. lol

 

[ryuu seika]

Assault was a more serious title, but I loved it more than Star Fox 64 and SNES combined. But mostly because I just really enjoyed playing star fox with friends in more than just a landmaster or arwing.

Technically, 64 had on foot multiplayer but it was awkward to unlock and the environments were practically barren. Assault did have the best multiplayer of the series.

 

[Smokey21]

Technically, 64 had on foot multiplayer but it was awkward to unlock and the environments were practically barren. Assault did have the best multiplayer of the series.

Ahh yeah I remember that! It was as awkward to play as it was to unlock if I remember correctly. Hahaha. And yeah it's been so long since I played it as well. I did buy it for the Wii U though so that is a possibility.

 

[Gagnetar]

Ahh yeah I remember that! It was as awkward to play as it was to unlock if I remember correctly. Hahaha. And yeah it's been so long since I played it as well. I did buy it for the Wii U though so that is a possibility.

I vaguely remember unlocking the pilot unlock for multiplayer on my copy of 64 and then i tripped over it because I used a gameshark because i sucked at videogames which broke the silicon board, I didn't even know you could break those old cartridges Atleast i'm pretty good at games now lol. Speaking of cartridges I'm really glad that the switch brought those back, I hate CDs, they are so fragile and prone to damage, whereas my DS games have been through the washer and they still work.

 

[Smokey21]

Ahh yes everyone has to be super careful with the CD's of today for all their games. By now everyone should be experienced CD handlers! I think Nintendo's move to cartridges is a good idea, the one problem being that they could be easier to lose if you don't have a good storage setup for them, but that's not hard to work around. Also everyone that has tried developing games for switch says that it has been super easy to do and is said to be as easy as pushing a button to make the game a switch port.

Also, this is two years old but I don't know if you guys have seen it yet and I figure you might like it. It's an interview with the top smash players at the time about who they wanted to see in smash. Anyways I hope you all like it!

Edit - the only one I'm not sure about having possibly from there is conker who is clearly now owned by Microsoft, though Nintendo has shown to be friendly with Microsoft, Nintendo's gains would be questionable.

 

[Gagnetar]

Ahh yes everyone has to be super careful with the CD's of today for all their games. By now everyone should be experienced CD handlers! I think Nintendo's move to cartridges is a good idea, the one problem being that they could be easier to lose if you don't have a good storage setup for them, but that's not hard to work around. Also everyone that has tried developing games for switch says that it has been super easy to do and is said to be as easy as pushing a button to make the game a switch port.

Also, this is two years old but I don't know if you guys have seen it yet and I figure you might like it. It's an interview with the top smash players at the time about who they wanted to see in smash. Anyways I hope you all like it!

Edit - the only one I'm not sure about having possibly from there is conker who is clearly now owned by Microsoft, though Nintendo has shown to be friendly with Microsoft, Nintendo's gains would be questionable.

Conker would be terrifying, good thing that's not a realistic option for several reasons. This shows that competitive players like unique kit potential and that's still Krystal's biggest hitter, She's just got to be remembered, Fighters are chosen pretty quickly which I think keeps her memory a little fresher. ZeRo thinking Krystal being a good choice is great news, I don't follow the scene but I know he's popular, It'd be nice to know if they are reaching out towards big members because their opinions will likely matter a good bit now with the new competitive scene focus.

 

[Tortilla Noggin]

It'd be nice to know if they are reaching out towards big members because their opinions will likely matter a good bit now with the new competitive scene focus.

I'm pretty sure that a focus on promoting games via competitive events doesn't equate to soliciting opinions from a tiny handful of people who aren't game-designers, and allowing that to dictate game-design that will affect a product that multiple millions of people will buy.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

I wish we knew what the other choices on the Ballot were. There's an echo chamber effect in the Smash community but I have no idea how strong.

 

[Gagnetar]

I wish we knew what the other choices on the Ballot were. There's an echo chamber effect in the Smash community but I have no idea how strong.

It's hard to tell for sure, the best way to is to look around at other large pool polls on the net. The issue is they tend to be dated. I complied a small list of fighters based on perceived popularity across multiple polls, kit potential and viability of obtainment.

Edit: there's no particular order of inclusion chances merely a numbered list

Spoiler

1. Inkling (gender swap palettes) --due to splatoon's popularity
2. Mipha --due to breath of the wild's runaway success
3. Bomberman --3rd party representation, due to bombermanR and popularity
4. Wolf --returning vet, new starfox title? SF 25th anniversary and low effort character
5. Krystal (adventures/assault swap palettes) --unique and popular request, new starfox title? SF 25 anniversary
6. Ice Climbers --shouldn't have been cut to begin with
7. Blaziken --popular pokemon from the most popular pokemon generation can contrast better in the roster than Sceptile and more marketable due to Pokken tournament
8. Sora --older request with moderate popularity, with help from Square and thanks to his rather high kit potential somehow contrasting him with the rest of the swordsmen
9. Geno ---Square Enix now collaborating with nintendo along with sakurai's interest and fan popularity
10. Bandana Dee --in celebration of Kirby's 25th anniversary, popular ballot request
11. Tails --due to sonic returning post 25th anniversary, unique fighter and somewhat popular ballot request
12. King K Rool --despite irrelevance and uncertainy of donkey kongs future his extremely high popularity coupled with a fairly interesting kit see him a spot
13. Shantae --indie rep, due to possible switch port and the possibility of new DLC with it's popularity and most importantly her dynamic kit

 

[Tortilla Noggin]

It's hard to tell for sure, the best way to is to look around at other large pool polls on the net. The issue is they tend to be dated. I complied a small list of fighters based on perceived popularity across multiple polls, kit potential and viability of obtainment.

Spoiler

1. Inkling (gender swap palettes) --due to splatoon's popularity
2. Mipha --due to breath of the wild's runaway success
3. Bomberman --3rd party representation, due to bombermanR and popularity
4. Wolf --returning vet, new starfox title? SF 25th anniversary and low effort character
5. Krystal (adventures/assault swap palettes) --unique and popular request, new starfox title? SF 25 anniversary
6. Ice Climbers --shouldn't have been cut to begin with
7. Blaziken --popular pokemon from the most popular pokemon generation can contrast better in the roster than Sceptile and more marketable due to Pokken tournament
8. Sora --older request with moderate popularity, with help from Square and thanks to his rather high kit potential somehow contrasting him with the rest of the swordsmen
9. Geno ---Square Enix now collaborating with nintendo along with sakurai's interest and fan popularity
10. Bandana Dee --in celebration of Kirby's 25th anniversary, popular ballot request
11. Tails --due to sonic returning post 25th anniversary, unique fighter and somewhat popular ballot request
12. King K Rool --despite irrelevance and uncertainy of donkey kongs future his extremely high popularity coupled with a fairly interesting kit see him a spot
13. Shantae --indie rep, due to possible switch port and the possibility of new DLC with it's popularity and most importantly her dynamic kit

Though I would like to see her added to Smash, I don't feel that Krystal would place so highly considering the current circumstances - those being that the Star Fox series has been rebooted to focus only on the characters that Shigeru Miyamoto created, and Krystal has been removed from it. And this being after only three appearances in the first place - Adventures, Assault, and Command, with most people other than me only counting the first two of those.

As an aside, I must speak up and mention that I don't personally like seeing characters and series seemingly being dismissed as "irrelevant" considering the above facts (similar was happening earlier in the thread, too, with the Inklings) - Krystal herself is unfortunately not especially relevant at this point either, and the Star Fox series is not in good shape and has not been for decades. It could come off looking like other characters are being dismissed in order to big up Krystal, though I'm sure that that's not the intended meaning.

 

[Gagnetar]

Though I would like to see her added to Smash, I don't feel that Krystal would place so highly considering the current circumstances - those being that the Star Fox series has been rebooted to focus only on the characters that Shigeru Miyamoto created, and Krystal has been removed from it. And this being after only three appearances in the first place - Adventures, Assault, and Command, with most people other than me only counting the first two of those.

As an aside, I must speak up and mention that I don't personally like seeing characters and series seemingly being dismissed as "irrelevant" considering the above facts (similar was happening earlier in the thread, too, with the Inklings) - Krystal herself is unfortunately not especially relevant at this point either, and the Star Fox series is not in good shape and has not been for decades. It could come off looking like other characters are being dismissed in order to big up Krystal, though I'm sure that that's not the intended meaning.

the list has no order, perhaps i should mention that. You don't think very highly of me do you? That aside character bashing is unecessary and for clarification i'm not bashing characters? Some characters are irrelevant, some characters aren't popular some don't have comparitively interesting kits those are merely facts. Liking or disliking the truth changes nothing. An offhand truthful comment is no reason to accuse me of such pettiness. Yes Krystal is irrelevant, but she might not be for long.

 

[Tortilla Noggin]

the list has no order, perhaps i should mention that.

Ahh, ok! I thought that the numbers suggested an order.

You don't think very highly of me do you?

Er, what?

I actually think your posts are very interesting, not to mention that you contribute a lot of well-thought-out posts to give this thread active discussions. I sincerely apologise for any misunderstanding - that certainly wasn't my intent.

That aside character bashing is unecessary and for clarification i'm not bashing characters?

I didn't think you were. I was concerned as to how it could appear, hence why I mentioned I was sure it wasn't actually intended to be so. Reason being, I've seen other threads and groups pinpointed for similar before because it wrongly looked that way from the outside. It'd be a pity to see it happen anywhere else.

Some characters are irrelevant, some characters aren't popular some don't have comparitively interesting kits those are merely facts. Liking or disliking the truth changes nothing. An offhand truthful comment is no reason to accuse me of such pettiness. Yes Krystal is irrelevant, but she might not be for long.

Don't worry, I didn't accuse you of anything. And I'm with you on that - I'm hoping Krystal will be relevant again, too, as she's a good character who just got the short end of the stick a few times*. I honestly want to see the Star Fox series treated way better than it has been - the decline hasn't been fun to watch.

*How, I don't know. The whole "magic" thing works just fine in the context of the Jedis in Star Wars, and it's not like Star Fox doesn't already borrow liberally from that as it is. I don't get how they fouled that up...

 

[Gagnetar]

Ahh, ok! I thought that the numbers suggested an order.


Er, what?

I actually think your posts are very interesting, not to mention that you contribute a lot of well-thought-out posts to give this thread active discussions. I sincerely apologise for any misunderstanding - that certainly wasn't my intent.


I didn't think you were. I was concerned as to how it could appear, hence why I mentioned I was sure it wasn't actually intended to be so. Reason being, I've seen other threads and groups pinpointed for similar before because it wrongly looked that way from the outside. It'd be a pity to see it happen anywhere else.


Don't worry, I didn't accuse you of anything. And I'm with you on that - I'm hoping Krystal will be relevant again, too, as she's a good character who just got the short end of the stick a few times*. I honestly want to see the Star Fox series treated way better than it has been - the decline hasn't been fun to watch.

*How, I don't know. The whole "magic" thing works just fine in the context of the Jedis in Star Wars, and it's not like Star Fox doesn't already borrow liberally from that as it is. I don't get how they fouled that up...

Felt like a personal attack to me, regardless I want to keep focused. I've been talking to Dylan Cuthbert again he's told me Q-games isn't currently working on a sequel nor is he aware of a sequel being currently made. This leads either to the obvious of there not being one currently in the works or that they simply have already decided on who to work on the title/ already are.

Speaking of relevance he told me he'd mention Krystal to Imamura who seems to be her biggest threat for a likable character design. Let's hope it's a good word.

Adventures wasn't a Starfox game, it's what put people off. They really should have considered harder to make Krystal a bigger focus, You can keep sex-appeal and badassery together, it's one of the most beloved fusions for nerds everywhere. I think in all they simply needed more time on the game, converting the game to a completely new console and a new intellectual property was a big gambit, not to mention there was likely drama at some point during the end of the game (am not really sure when all the stuff happened with rare and nintendo) The Force itself always felt psychic to me as they seem to be mind powers, I haven't really seen people complain about the thing being about magic but then again i'm not real deep into peoples opinions about each game or the franchise as a whole. Magic itself simply means unexplained force and becomes scientific once given some kind of explanation. But who knows how often people will consider that.

 

[Tortilla Noggin]

Felt like a personal attack to me, regardless I want to keep focused.

Certainly not. My apologies again if it seemed that way. I'd never dream of such a thing, and I've never understood why folks do that - especially not in a place like this where we're all here for the same reasons!

I've been talking to Dylan Cuthbert again he's told me Q-games isn't currently working on a sequel nor is he aware of a sequel being currently made. This leads either to the obvious of there not being one currently in the works or that they simply have already decided on who to work on the title/ already are.

I must admit, I'm fond of Q-Games, since Dylan Cuthbert and some of its crew worked on the original SNES Star Fox titles, so that's disappointing news...

Still, I'd rather look at that in a glass-half-full way, with Miyamoto's recent comments in mind, and hope that they're simply working with someone else who they felt was an appropriate choice (I'd always hoped that it'd be Retro, as they've got a good track-record with reviving franchises that originated from Nintendo's old British development partners, but I doubt it would be them, unfortunately). E3 is only about a month away, now, so if they're going to mark the 25th anniversary, I imagine we'll know then, since the anniversary would fall before E3 2018.

Speaking of relevance he told me he'd mention Krystal to Imamura who seems to be her biggest threat for a likable character design. Let's hope it's a good word.

If they absolutely must stick with Imamura's giant-elongated-head designs for another game, I at least hope that they further improve upon them, as was done for Star Fox Zero. At least they're starting to look passable, now.

Adventures wasn't a Starfox game, it's what put people off.

I actually don't like the game, but that's purely because I don't enjoy the genre. It's still obviously a good game, and I've never understood the flack it gets. But then again, I've never had any issues with the fact that it began life as something else - as far as I'm concerned, it's a Star Fox game, because that's what it was released as (much like how everyone completely naturally equates Conker with Conker's Bad Fur Day, and not the unreleased Twelve Tales: Conker 64, or the released-but-forgotten Conker's Pocket Tales).

They really should have considered harder to make Krystal a bigger focus, You can keep sex-appeal and badassery together, it's one of the most beloved fusions for nerds everywhere. I think in all they simply needed more time on the game, converting the game to a completely new console and a new intellectual property was a big gambit, not to mention there was likely drama at some point during the end of the game (am not really sure when all the stuff happened with rare and nintendo)

If you have the time to do so, it's well worth taking a while to look at how the original Dinosaur Planet was shaping up.

I think that the strangest thing about the conversion to Star Fox Adventures was how Krystal was pretty much cut out of it, whereas in the original Dinosaur Planet, Krystal was playable alongside Sabre (the guy that Fox replaced), and she was actually the primary character of the two, and the one who it fell to to save the day at the end. At the end, time-travel became involved, when a particular artifact had to be retrieved from different timelines before it ceased to exist, and Krystal had to prevent a bad future outcome after Sabre had been killed as a result of trying to stop the same thing.

There's a wealth of info on it here;

https://tcrf.net/Star_Fox_Adventures/Dinosaur_Planet_Leftovers
https://tcrf.net/Proto:Star_Fox_Adventures/Dinosaur_Planet_Leftovers

These, and the old trade-show footage that I posted earlier in the thread.

Ironically, most of it was recovered from various builds of Star Fox Adventures, because the refit was carried out in such a short span of time that a lot of it was left on the disc.

It's definitely for the better that Krystal didn't end up as Microsoft IP, looking at how they've handled what they got out of the buyout, though it's also a pity about how much was lost in the conversion between the two games.

Still, what's been retrieved is a good look into what Krystal was originally intended to do. I think it also highlights how they could have altered the darker later chapters of the game (since they probably didn't want to be depicting a future scenario in which Fox was killed*) and kept more the same than they did, I think.

*Even though that's actually a really cool sci-fi element...

As far as drama due to the companies parting ways goes, though I'm sure that there definitely was some drama, there was probably a lot more upheaval, stress, and pressure. What happened was that Rare was owned by the Stamper brothers, and Nintendo also held a controlling stake in the company for many years. Then the Stamper brothers (not Nintendo, as is often stated) chose to sell the company, and to cut a very long story short, there were some prospective purchasers who probably would have kept Rare in the same co-ownership situation, but they weren't who the Stampers sold to, so Nintendo sold their stake in the company as well. After that, time was limited for Rare to get their final Nintendo projects out. It's lucky that they managed to do what they did with Star Fox Adventures, as far as I can see.

The Force itself always felt psychic to me as they seem to be mind powers, I haven't really seen people complain about the thing being about magic but then again i'm not real deep into peoples opinions about each game or the franchise as a whole. Magic itself simply means unexplained force and becomes scientific once given some kind of explanation. But who knows how often people will consider that.

Oh, yeah, it's most definitely about psychic powers - I was just thinking of how Han Solo refers to The Force as being "magical" in The Force Awakens, there.

 

[PF9]

Krystal has been at the top of my wish list for years.

I think Star Fox overall has the potential to be as big a name in sci-fi as Star Wars and Star Trek - it all depends on what Nintendo does with the franchise (like make movie adaptations, etc.).

 

[Smokey21]

Krystal has been at the top of my wish list for years.

I think Star Fox overall has the potential to be as big a name in sci-fi as Star Wars and Star Trek - it all depends on what Nintendo does with the franchise (like make movie adaptations, etc.).

Oh yeah and that battle begins short was a good start to the movie adaptations. I love all the comments under the videos saying that Nintendo should make more Star Fox movies in that vein(and I agree I think the short was awesome). I am still of the belief that Nintendo still doesn't know what to do with Krystal as a character. Maybe they will re-write her in with more of an explanation on her powers this time around or maybe we will just get a continuation of assault with more explanation of her powers/abilities(it's clear that she had less powers every new iteration of her character and I don't know why her staff just disappears entirely after adventures for being her trademark thing ya know?). Either way I suppose we will see what Nintendo plans to do with her over the next few months or years... xD

 

[Gagnetar]

Certainly not. My apologies again if it seemed that way. I'd never dream of such a thing, and I've never understood why folks do that - especially not in a place like this where we're all here for the same reasons!


I must admit, I'm fond of Q-Games, since Dylan Cuthbert and some of its crew worked on the original SNES Star Fox titles, so that's disappointing news...

Still, I'd rather look at that in a glass-half-full way, with Miyamoto's recent comments in mind, and hope that they're simply working with someone else who they felt was an appropriate choice (I'd always hoped that it'd be Retro, as they've got a good track-record with reviving franchises that originated from Nintendo's old British development partners, but I doubt it would be them, unfortunately). E3 is only about a month away, now, so if they're going to mark the 25th anniversary, I imagine we'll know then, since the anniversary would fall before E3 2018.


If they absolutely must stick with Imamura's giant-elongated-head designs for another game, I at least hope that they further improve upon them, as was done for Star Fox Zero. At least they're starting to look passable, now.


I actually don't like the game, but that's purely because I don't enjoy the genre. It's still obviously a good game, and I've never understood the flack it gets. But then again, I've never had any issues with the fact that it began life as something else - as far as I'm concerned, it's a Star Fox game, because that's what it was released as (much like how everyone completely naturally equates Conker with Conker's Bad Fur Day, and not the unreleased Twelve Tales: Conker 64, or the released-but-forgotten Conker's Pocket Tales).


If you have the time to do so, it's well worth taking a while to look at how the original Dinosaur Planet was shaping up.

I think that the strangest thing about the conversion to Star Fox Adventures was how Krystal was pretty much cut out of it, whereas in the original Dinosaur Planet, Krystal was playable alongside Sabre (the guy that Fox replaced), and she was actually the primary character of the two, and the one who it fell to to save the day at the end. At the end, time-travel became involved, when a particular artifact had to be retrieved from different timelines before it ceased to exist, and Krystal had to prevent a bad future outcome after Sabre had been killed as a result of trying to stop the same thing.

There's a wealth of info on it here;

https://tcrf.net/Star_Fox_Adventures/Dinosaur_Planet_Leftovers
https://tcrf.net/Proto:Star_Fox_Adventures/Dinosaur_Planet_Leftovers

These, and the old trade-show footage that I posted earlier in the thread.

Ironically, most of it was recovered from various builds of Star Fox Adventures, because the refit was carried out in such a short span of time that a lot of it was left on the disc.

It's definitely for the better that Krystal didn't end up as Microsoft IP, looking at how they've handled what they got out of the buyout, though it's also a pity about how much was lost in the conversion between the two games.

Still, what's been retrieved is a good look into what Krystal was originally intended to do. I think it also highlights how they could have altered the darker later chapters of the game (since they probably didn't want to be depicting a future scenario in which Fox was killed*) and kept more the same than they did, I think.

*Even though that's actually a really cool sci-fi element...

As far as drama due to the companies parting ways goes, though I'm sure that there definitely was some drama, there was probably a lot more upheaval, stress, and pressure. What happened was that Rare was owned by the Stamper brothers, and Nintendo also held a controlling stake in the company for many years. Then the Stamper brothers (not Nintendo, as is often stated) chose to sell the company, and to cut a very long story short, there were some prospective purchasers who probably would have kept Rare in the same co-ownership situation, but they weren't who the Stampers sold to, so Nintendo sold their stake in the company as well. After that, time was limited for Rare to get their final Nintendo projects out. It's lucky that they managed to do what they did with Star Fox Adventures, as far as I can see.


Oh, yeah, it's most definitely about psychic powers - I was just thinking of how Han Solo refers to The Force as being "magical" in The Force Awakens, there.

I'll take that apology lol.
To be honest my hatred for how Krystal was treated in Command seems revenge worthy and I put it squarely at Q-Games. Now that I know that it was Imamura who was responsible it's kind of interesting information. The game Starfox Command was pretty great so I can't put any flack on the team for the games mechanics and how it plays, Same with Other M which I often compare. I played through every ending in Starfox Command and gave the game a few more playthroughs after, Other M was the first metroid I 100% and I enjoyed the action-packed gameplay. The character treatment is viciously appalling, Speaking of metroid Cuthbert himself is actually friends with Sakamoto since he did something for Metroid 2. Amusing connections abound with Krystal and Samus, same voice actor in the smash realm, blue-heavy orphaned characters whose home worlds even are both possibly completely destroyed. Krystal is telepathic and Samus was raised by telepaths and they both featured in a game with good gameplay but extremely questionable personality choices with them being a primary hated point. But I digress.

Star Fox had established itself as a rail-shooter and people had that as their expectations, me included. So coming into it being an action-adventure was kind of awkward, They really needed more time but I don't think it was realistically possible given everything mentioned.

I'm familiar with the expressly mentioned tidbits regarding Dinosaur Planet though i figured they were equal in story importance (Krystal and Sabre) It's just all the more reason to have had her do more, With more time Fox could have really used his blaster for ranged heavy combat and have Krystal with more melee heavy combat but alas that is not what we got. If we got that Krystal would likely have been in Brawl but that's the past. We must look to the future for her hope, which we have good reasons to do so.

Retro Studios making a Starfox game would be strange given their expertise is in that action-adventure genre, I think Platinum Games is a good studio for the high-octane combat that Starfox seems to shoot for, Though that's just an assumption from Bayonetta. I never got the chance to play it even though I sure it was fun. Now if they took a more exploration focus with Starfox Retro would be an excellent choice imo, We have to wait to E3 to see what good ol Retro has in store for us.

My guess is this new girl showing up Fox's skill would be a bit strong, even though I'd personally find it hilarious. But it's hard to judge their choices because as mentioned there was quite of a lot of things going on.

There's quite a lot possible for Krystal's future and a considerable amount realistically possible. There's little reason to lose hope yet for any who might feel that way.

Thanks for the info, I had no more knowledge about the issues pertaining to that event with Rare other than there were simply issues that led to them being owned by Microsoft.

Lol maybe Disney just wanted it to be addressed as a magic or something no real idea.

Krystal has been at the top of my wish list for years.

I think Star Fox overall has the potential to be as big a name in sci-fi as Star Wars and Star Trek - it all depends on what Nintendo does with the franchise (like make movie adaptations, etc.).

That's rather optimistic, But I'd certainly enjoy an animated series for Star Fox, i've had multiple dreams where I was watching one, even after I woke up I thought it was real for a while. Could you imagine how many furries would be created if it was as big as Star Wars? that'd be hilarious. It'd bring them out of obscurity and create a kind of social movement of sorts.

Oh yeah and that battle begins short was a good start to the movie adaptations. I love all the comments under the videos saying that Nintendo should make more Star Fox movies in that vein(and I agree I think the short was awesome). I am still of the belief that Nintendo still doesn't know what to do with Krystal as a character. Maybe they will re-write her in with more of an explanation on her powers this time around or maybe we will just get a continuation of assault with more explanation of her powers/abilities(it's clear that she had less powers every new iteration of her character and I don't know why her staff just disappears entirely after adventures for being her trademark thing ya know?). Either way I suppose we will see what Nintendo plans to do with her over the next few months or years... xD

It could be that the team really just doesn't see or care about the potential Krystal has, There could be any number of reasons or people guiding their hands. I think there's a decent interest in the game having ground segments from the teams who have worked on the series. The chickenwalker was actually developed as a way to have ground segments so if they emphasize it they could bring back Krystal's Staff for the new title which would keep people from being disappointed when they get SFA only for Krystal to lose it instantly lol. It'd help to know her popularity on the Ballot but I think we'll never see the actual results, I feel like we would have seen them by now if we were going too.

 

[Tortilla Noggin]

I'll take that apology lol.

Glad to hear it.

I'm familiar with the expressly mentioned tidbits regarding Dinosaur Planet though i figured they were equal in story importance (Krystal and Sabre) It's just all the more reason to have had her do more,

I actually think that it's fair to say that Dinosaur Planet was a bit more Krystal's game than Sabre's.

This is actually somewhat ironic, as at one point very early on, Sabre was the main character - but that was right after Dinosaur Planet was converted from a Diddy Kong Racing spin-off platformer starring Timber the Tiger and Tricky the Triceratops (something reported by a magazine or two at the time, and later confirmed by datamining files later on, to find that some Dinosaur Planet files refer to Timber instead of Sabre), and Sabre's status probably changed just as quickly as the game changed direction. The game had a really convoluted history.

My guess is this new girl showing up Fox's skill would be a bit strong, even though I'd personally find it hilarious. But it's hard to judge their choices because as mentioned there was quite of a lot of things going on.

Yeah, and we'll most likely never know, unfortunately, since the industry as a whole was generally more secretive back then, and Nintendo was even more-so. (And folks think that they're highly secretive now! )

They probably did want to avoid the "new character shows up the long-established ones" thing, though. I never thought of that.

Lol maybe Disney just wanted it to be addressed as a magic or something no real idea.

Maybe. I think it was a callback to a quote in the first movie, but having said that, I can't quite remember the line that I'm trying to think of, off of the top of my head...

 

[Gagnetar]

This is actually somewhat ironic, as at one point very early on, Sabre was the main character - but that was right after Dinosaur Planet was converted from a Diddy Kong Racing spin-off platformer starring Timber the Tiger and Tricky the Triceratops (something reported by a magazine or two at the time, and later confirmed by datamining files later on, to find that some Dinosaur Planet files refer to Timber instead of Sabre), and Sabre's status probably changed just as quickly as the game changed direction. The game had a really convoluted history.

Now there's something I didn't know, this rabbit hole is deeper than I thought. Why were they so set on Tricky anyway? he's like the Slippy of Sauria, and Slippy was in SFA even.

 

[Tortilla Noggin]

Now there's something I didn't know, this rabbit hole is deeper than I thought.

It's insane. I do wish that there was more to know about it, though. I actually remember the reports about Timber's game, from way back when (although there were never any pictures, unfortunately), and I really wanted to see it back then. Then it just faded away, never to be heard of again until the aforementioned datamining proved that it became Dinosaur Planet.

Why were they so set on Tricky anyway? he's like the Slippy of Sauria, and Slippy was in SFA even.

Diddy Kong Racing's interation of Tricky was very different to the one in Star Fox Adventures. Accordingly, I can only assume that the dynamic in Timber's game was quite different, since, in Diddy Kong Racing, Timber was just a kid, and Tricky was a much larger triceratops whose voice and mannerisms were somewhat reminscent of those of Marty Crane from the sitcom, Frasier.

If they hadn't already changed Tricky into a youngster that early on in development, or gone with a "Tricky Jr.", I can only imagine that having to deal with a grumpy middle-aged Tricky throughout the game would've been hilarious.

 

[ryuu seika]

Note that there is president for recurring, cross-series side characters originating in Diddy Kong Racing in the form of Tiptup and the same attitude to their characters has been seen from Playtonic. Given Banjo Kazooie's Tiptup choir and Tooie's female version, however, I don't think they have much regard for continuity. Keeping the relative ages the same would not have been a concern but, while clearly inspired by him, I also doubt that the prince f dinosaur planet is DKR's tricky.

 

[Tortilla Noggin]

As you guys might know, the toy company Jakks Pacific currently holds the Western license to produce Star Fox toys as part of their World of Nintendo toy line. To date, they've created Star Fox 64 3D-based action figures of Fox, Falco, Slippy, and Peppy, and have created plushes of Fox, Falco, and Peppy, with Slippy due to be released in a future wave sometime this year.

Unfortunately, according to an article written by a fan who attended a panel that Jakks Pacific ran at a recent convention in the US, there's a bit of a disconnect between which characters Jakks Pacific considers to be "older, more obscure" ones that they can't work on, and which ones fans would consider to be that. They're also apparently required to keep character representation relatively current in order to promote more recent games (as evidenced by a Super Mario Sunshine-styled variant action figure of Bowser Jr. not being approved for production).

Before reading on, please think of a Nintendo character that you would consider to be an "older, more obscure" character. Get that fixed in your mind. Got one? Good. I'll assume that it's someone like Mr. Stevenson or Foreman Spike. Now read on...

...

According to an answer given at the panel, they consider Ganondorf from The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time to be an "older, more obscure" character.

No joke! Basically, it seems that this may be the definition given to any character without current appearances.

Anyway, in spite of this, there's actually some good news: Apparently, in North America, GameStop will be carrying some sort of exclusive World of Nintendo toys in 2018, that fall under Jakks Pacific's definition of "older, more obscure" characters. Considering that they've already created action figures and plushes of Fox, Falco, Peppy, and Slippy, it really doesn't seem beyond the realms of possibility for Krystal to end up being one of these exclusives, to complete the group.

As of right now, it's unknown what GameStop will be carrying, since this is some way off yet, but this is pretty recent news, so I figured that it might be worth a mention.

Note that there is president for recurring, cross-series side characters originating in Diddy Kong Racing in the form of Tiptup and the same attitude to their characters has been seen from Playtonic. Given Banjo Kazooie's Tiptup choir and Tooie's female version, however, I don't think they have much regard for continuity. Keeping the relative ages the same would not have been a concern but, while clearly inspired by him, I also doubt that the prince f dinosaur planet is DKR's tricky.

Yeah, he definitely isn't the same one. But at the point when the game was a direct spin-off of/sequel to Diddy Kong Racing, he easily could've been, which, if nothing else, is funny to think about.

 

[ryuu seika]

Wouldn't it be great to have a large plush Andross head?
Krystal would be cool too, of course, but she lacks the same comedy value. She's also the only non-current Starfox character who I wouldn't consider obscure though, so she clearly has that going for her.

Ganondorf though? He's in two recent releases, one of which (Hyrule Warriors) is on a current console and the other of which (Smash itself) is one of Nintendo's biggest series of all time, with appeal far more widespread than that of any single other franchise. Sure, he's not in the latest main series release but the presence of Ganon means his name still kind of lives on even there.
That's ridiculous!

 

[Smokey21]

Gah I seem to have missed the party... So to speak. Lousy work and having to sleep at normal times! I should be home for the most part for the next 2 days so yay for days off! Anyways, down to business!

I'll take that apology lol.
To be honest my hatred for how Krystal was treated in Command seems revenge worthy and I put it squarely at Q-Games. Now that I know that it was Imamura who was responsible it's kind of interesting information. The game Starfox Command was pretty great so I can't put any flack on the team for the games mechanics and how it plays, Same with Other M which I often compare. I played through every ending in Starfox Command and gave the game a few more playthroughs after, Other M was the first metroid I 100% and I enjoyed the action-packed gameplay. The character treatment is viciously appalling, Speaking of metroid Cuthbert himself is actually friends with Sakamoto since he did something for Metroid 2. Amusing connections abound with Krystal and Samus, same voice actor in the smash realm, blue-heavy orphaned characters whose home worlds even are both possibly completely destroyed. Krystal is telepathic and Samus was raised by telepaths and they both featured in a game with good gameplay but extremely questionable personality choices with them being a primary hated point. But I digress.

Star Fox had established itself as a rail-shooter and people had that as their expectations, me included. So coming into it being an action-adventure was kind of awkward, They really needed more time but I don't think it was realistically possible given everything mentioned.

I'm familiar with the expressly mentioned tidbits regarding Dinosaur Planet though i figured they were equal in story importance (Krystal and Sabre) It's just all the more reason to have had her do more, With more time Fox could have really used his blaster for ranged heavy combat and have Krystal with more melee heavy combat but alas that is not what we got. If we got that Krystal would likely have been in Brawl but that's the past. We must look to the future for her hope, which we have good reasons to do so.

Retro Studios making a Starfox game would be strange given their expertise is in that action-adventure genre, I think Platinum Games is a good studio for the high-octane combat that Starfox seems to shoot for, Though that's just an assumption from Bayonetta. I never got the chance to play it even though I sure it was fun. Now if they took a more exploration focus with Starfox Retro would be an excellent choice imo, We have to wait to E3 to see what good ol Retro has in store for us.

My guess is this new girl showing up Fox's skill would be a bit strong, even though I'd personally find it hilarious. But it's hard to judge their choices because as mentioned there was quite of a lot of things going on.

There's quite a lot possible for Krystal's future and a considerable amount realistically possible. There's little reason to lose hope yet for any who might feel that way.

Thanks for the info, I had no more knowledge about the issues pertaining to that event with Rare other than there were simply issues that led to them being owned by Microsoft.

Lol maybe Disney just wanted it to be addressed as a magic or something no real idea.



That's rather optimistic, But I'd certainly enjoy an animated series for Star Fox, i've had multiple dreams where I was watching one, even after I woke up I thought it was real for a while. Could you imagine how many furries would be created if it was as big as Star Wars? that'd be hilarious. It'd bring them out of obscurity and create a kind of social movement of sorts.



It could be that the team really just doesn't see or care about the potential Krystal has, There could be any number of reasons or people guiding their hands. I think there's a decent interest in the game having ground segments from the teams who have worked on the series. The chickenwalker was actually developed as a way to have ground segments so if they emphasize it they could bring back Krystal's Staff for the new title which would keep people from being disappointed when they get SFA only for Krystal to lose it instantly lol. It'd help to know her popularity on the Ballot but I think we'll never see the actual results, I feel like we would have seen them by now if we were going too.

It's ok! I own command and still haven't played it because I read the script for it and was like, "what is this trash?" So yeah... I'm with you there. I think Imamura knows that he messed up the characters in there, I am sure he hasn't heard the end of it from the fans, or Dylan telling him what the fans are saying... .I never thought about those connections between Krystal and Samus, but that is a very interesting(or amusing ) take on it.

I personally think that everyone is getting tired of the on-rails experience of Star Fox. I think it needs more to stay fresh for everyone. There's probably a lot of factors to the series downfall(a lot of people like to play the "let's blame Krystal" card. But one of the major factors is that the same games are being redone over and over again with "flame decals" painted on them to make it looks a little different. All they're doing is making the same game again with minute changes. I think an open world Star Fox game of BoTW is asking a bit much atm with the current status of the series, but something in between would work wonders for the franchise.

Gotta address that point though... A retro Star Fox game similar to Metroid would be pretty cool haha. Although I think Platinum or Q games currently may be the best thing for the character since Platinum has stated that they want to work with the character in a future game and you have been talking to Dylan about the franchise in general, so I think only good can come of another game from them.

Also girls showing up maincast men is the norm these days! Don't you watch any movies or TV shows or play any games for that matter!

The team not caring about Krystal's character's potential is a sad realization. But that just means that we should be more intent on keeping her relevant as fans! That is an interesting thought as well that the chickenwalker was a way to implement ground play and see how it had an effect on the overall experience for the players. Overall I think that the chickenwalker was positive by just going around and looking at these reviews, its mostly about the controls being wonky that no one liked. As for the ballot results I am sure a lot of people would be upset if they showed them, Nintendo did the right thing to not show it imo. We just have to hope that she was significant on it, although I am hopeful that she did do well.

I actually think that it's fair to say that Dinosaur Planet was a bit more Krystal's game than Sabre's.

This is actually somewhat ironic, as at one point very early on, Sabre was the main character - but that was right after Dinosaur Planet was converted from a Diddy Kong Racing spin-off platformer starring Timber the Tiger and Tricky the Triceratops (something reported by a magazine or two at the time, and later confirmed by datamining files later on, to find that some Dinosaur Planet files refer to Timber instead of Sabre), and Sabre's status probably changed just as quickly as the game changed direction. The game had a really convoluted history.

Oh yeah it totally was more Krystal's game. They also removed a RIDICULOUS amount of story elements when they moved it to Star Fox Adventures. That story is just so convoluted after the fact that you see many of the flaws just by playing the game. Especially towards the end of it where it just feels rushed with not fighting scales at all, which was a big cop out and a lot of people didn't like the game simply because of that fact. I remember reading an article from a reviewer of the game where he said those exact words, I will find it for you later thought and put it in here in the form of an edit as I am super busy and have to be somewhere soon!

As you guys might know, the toy company Jakks Pacific currently holds the Western license to produce Star Fox toys as part of their World of Nintendo toy line. To date, they've created Star Fox 64 3D-based action figures of Fox, Falco, Slippy, and Peppy, and have created plushes of Fox, Falco, and Peppy, with Slippy due to be released in a future wave sometime this year.

Unfortunately, according to an article written by a fan who attended a panel that Jakks Pacific ran at a recent convention in the US, there's a bit of a disconnect between which characters Jakks Pacific considers to be "older, more obscure" ones that they can't work on, and which ones fans would consider to be that. They're also apparently required to keep character representation relatively current in order to promote more recent games (as evidenced by a Super Mario Sunshine-styled variant action figure of Bowser Jr. not being approved for production).

Before reading on, please think of a Nintendo character that you would consider to be an "older, more obscure" character. Get that fixed in your mind. Got one? Good. I'll assume that it's someone like Mr. Stevenson or Foreman Spike. Now read on...

...

According to an answer given at the panel, they consider Ganondorf from The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time to be an "older, more obscure" character.

No joke! Basically, it seems that this may be the definition given to any character without current appearances.

Anyway, in spite of this, there's actually some good news: Apparently, in North America, GameStop will be carrying some sort of exclusive World of Nintendo toys in 2018, that fall under Jakks Pacific's definition of "older, more obscure" characters. Considering that they've already created action figures and plushes of Fox, Falco, Peppy, and Slippy, it really doesn't seem beyond the realms of possibility for Krystal to end up being one of these exclusives, to complete the group.

As of right now, it's unknown what GameStop will be carrying, since this is some way off yet, but this is pretty recent news, so I figured that it might be worth a mention.


Yeah, he definitely isn't the same one. But at the point when the game was a direct spin-off of/sequel to Diddy Kong Racing, he easily could've been, which, if nothing else, is funny to think about.

Incredible... I never saw this article. I am looking at Nintendo news every day -_-. That was a good read, better than most Nintendo news these days. That is ******** that Ganondorf(ocarina) is considered outdated even though his character looks pretty similar in every iteration of it. I dont understand the logic there with them saying that.

As for the Possible Krystal plushie/figures... My wallet is ready... see you all 2018!

Wouldn't it be great to have a large plush Andross head?
Krystal would be cool too, of course, but she lacks the same comedy value. She's also the only non-current Starfox character who I wouldn't consider obscure though, so she clearly has that going for her.

Ganondorf though? He's in two recent releases, one of which (Hyrule Warriors) is on a current console and the other of which (Smash itself) is one of Nintendo's biggest series of all time, with appeal far more widespread than that of any single other franchise. Sure, he's not in the latest main series release but the presence of Ganon means his name still kind of lives on even there.
That's ridiculous!

I would totally get a large plush Andross head. That would just be the most awesomest thing(besides more Krystal stuff). I already give people money if they know all the characters that I have on my desk. lol

 

[Gagnetar]

Gah I seem to have missed the party... So to speak. Lousy work and having to sleep at normal times! I should be home for the most part for the next 2 days so yay for days off! Anyways, down to business!

It's ok! I own command and still haven't played it because I read the script for it and was like, "what is this trash?" So yeah... I'm with you there. I think Imamura knows that he messed up the characters in there, I am sure he hasn't heard the end of it from the fans, or Dylan telling him what the fans are saying... .I never thought about those connections between Krystal and Samus, but that is a very interesting(or amusing ) take on it.

I personally think that everyone is getting tired of the on-rails experience of Star Fox. I think it needs more to stay fresh for everyone. There's probably a lot of factors to the series downfall(a lot of people like to play the "let's blame Krystal" card. But one of the major factors is that the same games are being redone over and over again with "flame decals" painted on them to make it looks a little different. All they're doing is making the same game again with minute changes. I think an open world Star Fox game of BoTW is asking a bit much atm with the current status of the series, but something in between would work wonders for the franchise.

Gotta address that point though... A retro Star Fox game similar to Metroid would be pretty cool haha. Although I think Platinum or Q games currently may be the best thing for the character since Platinum has stated that they want to work with the character in a future game and you have been talking to Dylan about the franchise in general, so I think only good can come of another game from them.

Also girls showing up maincast men is the norm these days! Don't you watch any movies or TV shows or play any games for that matter!

The team not caring about Krystal's character's potential is a sad realization. But that just means that we should be more intent on keeping her relevant as fans! That is an interesting thought as well that the chickenwalker was a way to implement ground play and see how it had an effect on the overall experience for the players. Overall I think that the chickenwalker was positive by just going around and looking at these reviews, its mostly about the controls being wonky that no one liked. As for the ballot results I am sure a lot of people would be upset if they showed them, Nintendo did the right thing to not show it imo. We just have to hope that she was significant on it, although I am hopeful that she did do well.


Oh yeah it totally was more Krystal's game. They also removed a RIDICULOUS amount of story elements when they moved it to Star Fox Adventures. That story is just so convoluted after the fact that you see many of the flaws just by playing the game. Especially towards the end of it where it just feels rushed with not fighting scales at all, which was a big cop out and a lot of people didn't like the game simply because of that fact. I remember reading an article from a reviewer of the game where he said those exact words, I will find it for you later thought and put it in here in the form of an edit as I am super busy and have to be somewhere soon!


Incredible... I never saw this article. I am looking at Nintendo news every day -_-. That was a good read, better than most Nintendo news these days. That is ******** that Ganondorf(ocarina) is considered outdated even though his character looks pretty similar in every iteration of it. I dont understand the logic there with them saying that.

As for the Possible Krystal plushie/figures... My wallet is ready... see you all 2018!


I would totally get a large plush Andross head. That would just be the most awesomest thing(besides more Krystal stuff). I already give people money if they know all the characters that I have on my desk. lol

I do enjoy the on-rails action still personally but aslong as the game keeps very fast, high action gameplay i'll likely enjoy it. Honestly I'd rather know the results of the ballot so I can form a more accurate chance for inclusions of characters as it is it just makes people antsy and even getting an expected character doesn't really tell if they were popular choices. I'm still curious how popular Bayonetta actually was and if she really topped the european poll. I bet Krystal did well on the Japanese poll and probably all right on the western poll, haven't a clue about the euro poll. I suppose there's more discontent to be had if a popular pick on the net is actually popular from the ballot's pool and they don't make it in for X reason.

We know that we have atleast 1 company interested in a Starfox sequel and potentially 2 with Platinum games, I don't feel like Retro would be interested in the property but having metroid and starfox together sounds pretty awesome on paper, the gameplay differences I think is the biggest reason to avoid such a crossover .

Yea Dylan was saying on his AMA that the walker was used in that manner and that apparently what they learned went into Super Mario 64 which is pretty amusing. The controls ingame were much cooler in concept than in practice, it should feel like an extension of yourself not an inhibition.

Yea I never read that either, though i'm not really fond of useless figurines Krystal being recognized is always nice, A smash amiibo is what we all need lol. Is 2018 the year of Krystal? let's wait and see...

 

[TheCynicalCdr]

I mentioned some ideas before, but tort of to update this is what I think should be done to try to help.

• Keep mentioning the idea of a port or remake of either Star Fox Adventures and Star Fox Assault to Nintendo. I noticed Nintendo of Europes Twitter tends to be more responsive as opposed to Nintendo of America and my guess, Japan, but you can still try it with them
• Also mention DLC of Fox and Krystal if it calls for it, you can mention Falco and Wolf too but it's best to try to not make it sound greedy. An example of this is when Nintendo asked a question to get that as an answer. I would mention something about Mario Maker, but considering how long it's been now it isnt really worth it unless they announce a Switch version
• Only if it really calls for it, mention something like it on some developer Twitters. Examples include Platinum, Marvelous, Sora, NamcoBandai, Cyberconnect2, etc
• Show demand for the Star Fox comic Archie wants to make. That might not look like much (though that's from one of the artists), but there are articles of them showing interest in this, even with a few other Nintendo IPs such as Metroid, Mario, Kirby, and DK. The fact Archie's been making a Sonic comic for years and has also been making a Megaman comic series on top of the Sonic Megaman crossover kind of begs the question.

 

[Tortilla Noggin]

That is an interesting thought as well that the chickenwalker was a way to implement ground play and see how it had an effect on the overall experience for the players. Overall I think that the chickenwalker was positive by just going around and looking at these reviews, its mostly about the controls being wonky that no one liked.

I think the problem with the walker is that they pulled it from a very old unreleased game to make it appear that a nod was being given to the series' history, without seeming to have considered the reason that the walker originally existed: To provide ground-based gameplay in an era when the 3D technology of the time - an on-cartridge chip that augmented the abilities of a 16-bit console that, itself, only handled some scaling and rotation natively - did not allow for recognisable models of the characters to be used for that. (As Gagnetar mentioned above, this amounted to "research" that also later contributed to games running on hardware that could handle this.)

By the time Star Fox Zero was made, Adventures and Assault had already done on-foot gameplay to varying degrees, and the walker seemed like a bit of a step backwards.

Especially towards the end of it where it just feels rushed with not fighting scales at all, which was a big cop out and a lot of people didn't like the game simply because of that fact.

To be fair here, this was probably only partly due to the conversion between Dinosaur Planet and Star Fox Adventures. Though we know a little about Dinosaur Planet's endgame, that's all there is - it's said that the ending hadn't been fully fleshed-out before the conversion began, and coupled with the time-pressure, Adventures' endgame was the result.

 

[Gagnetar]

I think the problem with the walker is that they pulled it from a very old unreleased game to make it appear that a nod was being given to the series' history, without seeming to have considered the reason that the walker originally existed: To provide ground-based gameplay in an era when the 3D technology of the time - an on-cartridge chip that augmented the abilities of a 16-bit console that, itself, only handled some scaling and rotation natively - did not allow for recognisable models of the characters to be used for that. (As Gagnetar mentioned above, this amounted to "research" that also later contributed to games running on hardware that could handle this.)

By the time Star Fox Zero was made, Adventures and Assault had already done on-foot gameplay to varying degrees, and the walker seemed like a bit of a step backwards.


To be fair here, this was probably only partly due to the conversion between Dinosaur Planet and Star Fox Adventures. Though we know a little about Dinosaur Planet's endgame, that's all there is - it's said that the ending hadn't been fully fleshed-out before the conversion began, and coupled with the time-pressure, Adventures' endgame was the result.

That's something I hadn't considered, My guess is perhaps Miyamoto is very nostalgic and really liked Starfox 1 and had some considerable drive to make sure Starfox 2 saw the light of day in some form, hence why it's mechanics show up in Command and us seeing so many remakes of the first one along with the walker in Zero. I'm sure they understand it's time to move forward by now.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

One thing still confusing me about the ballot, Bayonetta was the highest voted negotiable and realisable character. What does that mean?

She was no. 1 in Europe and among the top 5 in America so I'm taking that to mean that characters above her were too tricky to implement as DLC (Inkling with paint mechanics for example), that only Snake came out ahead and Konami was still in their "friendship ended with videogames, Pachinko is my best friend now" phase, or Japan and America filled the top with rubbish like Goku and Shrek.

I guess the only way we'll have any idea is when the next game comes out and who the first characters revealed are.

Though looking at the other games, Melee's reveal played the game's intro making Peach and Bowser the first reveals (and confusing people who thought Ridley and Wolf were in), Brawl had Meta Knight (followed by Pit, Zamus, Wario & Snake) and 3DS/WiiU had the Villager and Mega Man.

I'd like for Krystal to be one of the first (just to get the salt done with up front) but logically a Splatoon character would be the first reveal for 4 Deluxe or 5.

 

[Luminario]

One thing still confusing me about the ballot, Bayonetta was the highest voted negotiable and realisable character. What does that mean?

She was no. 1 in Europe and among the top 5 in America so I'm taking that to mean that characters above her were too tricky to implement as DLC (Inkling with paint mechanics for example), that only Snake came out ahead and Konami was still in their "friendship ended with videogames, Pachinko is my best friend now" phase, or Japan and America filled the top with rubbish like Goku and Shrek.

I guess the only way we'll have any idea is when the next game comes out and who the first characters revealed are.

Though looking at the other games, Melee's reveal played the game's intro making Peach and Bowser the first reveals (and confusing people who thought Ridley and Wolf were in), Brawl had Meta Knight (followed by Pit, Zamus, Wario & Snake) and 3DS/WiiU had the Villager and Mega Man.

I'd like for Krystal to be one of the first (just to get the salt done with up front) but logically a Splatoon character would be the first reveal for 4 Deluxe or 5.

Indeed, Inklings are likely to be the Villager of the next Smash, being the first newcomer reveal that's a highly requested rep.
If they go down the same route as Smash 4 with the Nintendo Direct reveals, then Krystal would probably be one of the middle newcomers revealed, likely with a Starfox themed trailer complete with the return of Wolf like what was mentioned a few pages back. Her and Wolf wouldn't generate extreme hype that the first few or last few characters would, but she's popular enough to not have to be revealed after the release like Bowser Jr or DHD was.
And Bayo was popular, easy to implement into the game while staying true to her gameplay, and easy to get the rights to thanks to Bayo 2 being a Wii U exclusive and good Platinum Games relations. I can't say for certain who America had voted above Bayo due to the fact I have no idea who's popular over there, but characters such as Snake and Wolf might have gotten more votes but were passed due to being Brawl veterans and they wanted a completely new fighter to introduce, and Inklings were saved for the next Smash instead of being the last DLC.

 

[Gagnetar]

One thing still confusing me about the ballot, Bayonetta was the highest voted negotiable and realisable character. What does that mean?

I'd like for Krystal to be one of the first (just to get the salt done with up front) but logically a Splatoon character would be the first reveal for 4 Deluxe or 5.

that could be mean a few things, negotiable clearly means that within that time table that they could obtain them and implement from a company in a quick fashion, Plat was more than pleased i'm sure to get Bayo into smash. I'd say nintendo having a perceived love affair with Plat helped that choice aswell. Realizable does infact mean excluding obvious ****ty joke picks with shrek and goku, it also includes anything not originating from a game or 3rd party characters that might not have been able to be legally obtained quickly enough like Banjo within that time table. It probably also includes but is not directly mentioned that the fighter has an interesting kit. I know that Bayo did well but I want hard numbers to show that she feels a little too convenient but i guess that's just what those would mean, I'd say that Krystal is atleast top 13 in america and atleast top 8 in japan but that's just a gut guess, she wins over plenty of other fighters thanks to ease of obtainment and natural kit potential with her kit vision already existing. Wouldn't it be crazy if Krystal came and Wolf didn't return? the internet would explode. I'd laugh my ass off but I see no reason not to have them both, over-representing other series is a moot point with how many we get from FE which based on my research doesn't even outsell starfox and I'd personally enjoy both as Wolf was quite fun in Brawl. E3 is only a month away so I hope they tease something that more serious nintendo fans would be interested in like Metroid or Smash.

Oh interesting bit of information, do you guys remember that pro-fighters chart that Smokey posted? well the two fighters who expressed interest in Krystal (ZeRo and Nakat) are apart of the Back Room here which apparently is a type of board that determines tournament rules and they are on the smash 4 team, according the wikia would make about 33% of the board between the two. If they are interested in the smash tournament scene I'd imagine they'd be aware of the smashboards then, so keeping Krystal up and popular on this board may actually be a worthwhile investment even if they completely decided the roster before this thread, the brawl thread is quite popular and this thread being popular could just add to her chances if for some reason she isn't in the base game and comes up as DLC later.