Team Rocket Mafia from the Disco Room: DGames Reject Copy

[Purple]

'generally'

 

[Purple]

Okay, so here's my think, i don't like pressuring people unless i know for a fact there's something wrong with their previous actions.

For example, voting someone who's town, clearly asking for something that's anti-town (Day 1 eh? Who here's cop.) Things of that sort.

With that being said, all of this pressuring on people who are asking questions about the game, and how it should work, is kind of silly on D1. It's like a pre-game conversation, nothing generally happens, the players aren't even on the field yet doing their thing. (i don't think you should be on the team because i FEEL you're going to play badly on the field from what you're saying.)

 

[DZLE]

What's up everyone! I'm back and active. Good thing I ordered my laptop cord express. After much boredom and stress because my postal service is ********, my laptop is back in action.
Heres a small return-post:

And I'm just going to go ahead and Vote: Junglefever but only for right now I could easily change it, it just seems silly to only FoS when you are the first to vote on that person.

I tried this before and It doesnt really work. Saying that you vote but of course you can change it is just like going "I'm just gonna put this right here, but don't worry, I can take it back if you don't like it"
Around this time was when I decided to follow through on my FoS and Vote: Mattnumbers

Alrighty...

As it's standing, while my initial suspicions of Frown are still there, more and more, it's seeming that someone is taking a very frontal, and offensive role. While last time I made this statement it led to Vanila, I'm quite confident in saying

UNVOTE
VOTE: JUNGLEFEVER

Why is being up front and offensive such a problem?

You may have answered it a little here and there, but let me ask you: (@Fragbait)
In detail, what in the world is wrong with being offensive? I'll go ahead and say Jungle has moved this game forward, shoveling coal into the flames so the train steadily chugs forward. Mafia needs this. Without things moving forward, we get nowhere. No info.
And don't think i'm protecting Jungle, I do have my own thoughts on him.

I wouldn't vote for Junglefever. He has been helping town quite a lot and it would be bad to lose our most experienced player.

Well, I don't vote for Jungle because I trust him the most at the moment. Then why SHOULD I vote for him?

You really think you should already be trusting people? Trust anyone D1 and admitting it is going to get you killed.

I'd liek this answered from my voters.

Anyway, it's not like i'm pushing someone's lynch on nothing, or really even pushing a lynch. I'm pushign you guys to be PROactive instead of REactive. We're goign to lose this game if we just keep waiting around for **** to happen. I'm not giving out commands or telling you to do something other than to use your heads.

We shouldn't have enough to know exactly what to do? Of course I have no idea if I'm going to find scum or not when i raise suspicion, but does that mean we should just do nothing and be passive about everything? Even investigative roles need to be looked at twice because how do you know if someone's lying? The fact of the matter is that town needs to proactively look for scum and not rely on night actions and kills to do ti for you. Guys guess what, you can frame someone with the mafia kill! Connections can be made everywhere, even today. What if mafia uses one of those to their advantage?

tl;dr, you can't play passive and pussyfoot around and expect to win.

A couple smart posts imo, compared to most.

You can on D1, because being aggressive when you know next to nothing doesn't really change anything.

That's false. Being aggressive can change a lot. Look at how its changing everyone opinions and reactions towards Jungle? It got you to say something about it as well.

'generally'

Confirming HeatStroke is Roxy. I was confused

tl;dr
I follow through on my FoS andVote: Mattnumbers.
My laptop is now fixed and i'll be as active as I wished to be.
I didnt mean to be catagorized as a bystander because I want to keep adding to the pot, so I'll answer anything/everything directed toward me/catches my eye now. Good to be back.

 

[DZLE]

Also, Roxy, you edited the post at the top of this page. It's probably nothing important but nonetheless, what did you edit?

 

[Purple]

funny, i didn't edit anything, i just realized i shouldn't edit to add that information, so i made another post.

 

[Purple]

Hey DZLE, this is the first time i can actually talk to you :D

First off, being offensive is high-risk, OR high-reward. highly offensive mafia can take advantage and start killing townie one by one. Pro-town might help town to the point where we have an easy ride to victory. However, we don't know who one another are, regardless of cop claims, and so on and so forth, nothing is certain.

It only changes what's going on with Junglefever, with some random votes here and there.

Looks familiar, (read : me leading D1 and us doing a nl anyways lol).

Things naturally move forward, when concrete information is given, it's just how fast do you guys want to move?

With hasty movement, comes mistakes (POSSIBLY, not always)

 

[DZLE]

funny, i didn't edit anything, i just realized i shouldn't edit to add that information, so i made another post.

weird, in your one word post it says "Last edited by heatstroke at blah blah"

Things naturally move forward, when concrete information is given, it's just how fast do you guys want to move?

With hasty movement, comes mistakes (POSSIBLY, not always)

Naturally moving forward is the best way to go, but imo, since the very start Jugnlefever has played the way he has. So imo it's natural, with him as a player, for it to be going as it is.

Also yes, being hasty with CARE can benefit, because if you're hasty people may make mistakes in their haste to get back to you, no?

 

[DtJ Jungle]

My play D1 and your play d1 of my game are completely different. You cherry picked one thing that we SORT of are doing the same and are calling it a scum tell. I haven't been hasty. I stuck to lythium early as a joke vote and to get her moving, there was never any suspicion. I'm currently stuck between Matt and Ndayday now and I don't see that changing.

Also, what is concrete information. What do you know to be 100% true in this game other than who was killed? Roxy, think about what you're saying. if you all just wait for things to happen you're going to get caught with your tail between your legs in a bad situation. You have to actively find scum, because they sure as hell aren't oging to come to you.

 

[Purple]

oh no, i pressed the edit button, i just didn't edit anything.

Junglefever does this every game, so i understand why he does it, i'm just saying we don't have to always follow him. Because he won't always be town. Just saying. (not saying i feel he's scummy, because i'm generally not getting scum vibes from him, just a thought)

__

this is my edit

I usually start getting the ball rolling day 2, that's just me..

 

[DtJ Jungle]

Oh, okay. I misinterpreted what you said.

But yeah a couple of well thought out posts =/= town.

 

[ndayday]

Eh. Have to say that the only person that I see as possible scum is Matt atm.
I want a vote count before I do anything though.

And I guess I didn't realize Jungle was that worried about me. My inactivity earlier on probably contributed?

 

[DtJ Jungle]

It's not the inactivity. It's the fact you are really just sort of nudging at things and piping in and picking what looks like comfortable lynches. You nudged frown and roxy but put conditional statements on your thoughts there, kinda looks like a bad job of covering tracks.

 

[ohaiduhg]

Mattnumber is suspicious to me for going after you for being proactive.

But night actions give you some actual solid evidence to base things off of, before that everything is theoretical

Do you really want town to start playing after a townie has been killed off? Wasn't this covered that Mafia could pick off a lurker and we would still be in the dark about everything the next day? You have gone from the "I'm just going to wait for someone to act suspicious" to "we shouldn't do anything until mafia kills someone" stance. Which is basically the same thing. Both strategies help Mafia.

 

[Mattnumbers]

No, I'm saying that since there is a complete lack of evidence for anything right now, acting as if one way is 100% going to be the right decision seems scummy, since the only real positive of vouching that hard for one side in an ambiguous situation is to be able to say "I told you so" if that happens to be correct, even if it was pure luck.

Also, DLZE's return post looks really scummy to me, and it's not just because he voted for me. Right now I think both him AND Junglefever are scum, but for now I'll focus on Jungle since he posts a lot. If you guys lynch me (I'm a regular townie so at least it won't be horrible) be sure to heed this post and check the both of them out.....and possibly lythium too because he didn't even explain why he voted for me at all, seems kinda like mafia trying to start a bandwagon to me.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

Hey guys can we stop claiming for no reason? Claiming gives mafia aim. knock it off.

 

[:034:]

..and possibly lythium too because he didn't even explain why he voted for me at all, seems kinda like mafia trying to start a bandwagon to me.

She.

Matt, you're not being bandwagoned because there are mafia wagoning you. People are voting for you because the things you say are flawed. Well, my vote's already on you, I believe, so I have nothing more to say about that.

 

[Mattnumbers]

I mentioned I saw scumminess in DZLE's post but forgot to explain.

What's up everyone! I'm back and active. Good thing I ordered my laptop cord express. After much boredom and stress because my postal service is ********, my laptop is back in action.
Heres a small return-post:

I tried this before and It doesnt really work. Saying that you vote but of course you can change it is just like going "I'm just gonna put this right here, but don't worry, I can take it back if you don't like it"
Around this time was when I decided to follow through on my FoS and Vote: Mattnumbers

Exactly, I said I'm just changing it to a vote because a single vote for someone and a FoS on someone are essentially the exact same thing.
And then, right after saying that AND saying that you have tried it before without it working, you do the exact same thing?

You may have answered it a little here and there, but let me ask you: (@Fragbait)
In detail, what in the world is wrong with being offensive? I'll go ahead and say Jungle has moved this game forward, shoveling coal into the flames so the train steadily chugs forward. Mafia needs this. Without things moving forward, we get nowhere. No info.
And don't think i'm protecting Jungle, I do have my own thoughts on him.

Well, first of all:

Mafia needs this.

That REALLY seems like an accidental slip-up to me, not just a small mistake
I would like to know what these "thoughts" you have on Jungle are exactly, because anyone can add something like that at the end of a paragraph to make them seem less scummy.

You really think you should already be trusting people? Trust anyone D1 and admitting it is going to get you killed.

You're saying this immediately after you express your trust in Junglefever due to him keeping the townie train "steadily chugging forward"? I'm seeing numerous contradictions, all this post is doing is making me more suspicious of both of you.

That's false. Being aggressive can change a lot. Look at how its changing everyone opinions and reactions towards Jungle? It got you to say something about it as well.

Opinions are completely subjective notions, I'm talking about generating REAL evidence. Opinions can be lead wrong easily if there is no physical evidence whatsoever to contradict what someone says. The only evidence it leaves in my opinion is that the person might be scum, due to the fact that being aggressive isn't very productive or helpful for town D1 but makes you APPEAR to be a productive member of the good guys.

This doesn't mean that if we do lynch Jungle and he turns out scum, I'm going to vote for you automatically, because this EXACT same situation happened in the last game except I was in your position defending Roxy for being helpful since he was aggressive D1. He got lynched anyways and was scum! I'm sure had I not been killed that night I would have been speculated closely as well.

 

[Mattnumbers]

She.

Matt, you're not being bandwagoned because there are mafia wagoning you. People are voting for you because the things you say are flawed. Well, my vote's already on you, I believe, so I have nothing more to say about that.

I'd like you to point out these flaws so that I can address them, everything I have seen so far has simply been a difference of opinion, not an actual error in my logic.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

Can you guys like stop comparing Roxy and I day 1 in this game vs my game? I have no idea how you guys are getting that at all. It seems like you are cherry picking small things out of it and syaing 'look they are playing the same' which isn't true at all.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

Scum can present cases without logical flaws. There's more to building a case than that. Their case can be logical, but not be good at the same time (Same goes for town). Also, i really don't see the problem with starting with conjecture and filling in the pieces, if they fit. there's no such thing as hard evidence int hsi game, get that through your head.

 

[Mattnumbers]

Night Phazes produce evidence that is stronger by far than any we can come up with D1 barring someone doing something stupid.

And I'm not saying "because roxy did this you must be the exact same", I'm saying "Because this would be an adequate strategy for scum during D1, and in the past I've seen scum using said strategy, I think that you could easily be scum as well"

I'm not comparing you to players in previous games, I'm comparing you to playstyles shown in previous games, since they reoccur very often in this game.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

People can change playstyle on a whim, especially if it's brough to their attention.

And you either can't read or are totally scimming what I'm saying. You are totally asusming that a)anyhting we get from the night is real (other than the kill) and b) that we have PR's at all. b isn't likely but why should we rely on them anyway if we aren't sure we can trust the investigations? There are plenty of roles that are DESIGNED so that players can't just follow investigations. Also, remember that mafia can make a kill taht draws false connections to another player. So is that any more reliable?

 

[rPSIvysaur]

Vote Count:
-Rei-: ()
Fragbait: ()
DZLE: ()
Mattnumbers: Junglefever, DZLE, Lythium, :034 : (

)
Ndayday: ()
Ohaiduhg: ()
Roxy: ()
Spire: ()
Lythium: ()
Vrael: ()
:034 :: ()
Frown: Ohaiduhg(

)
Junglefever: Fragbait, Mattnumbers(

)
Not Voting: Roxy, -Rei-, Ndayday, Spire, Frown, Vrael(

)

With 13 it takes 7 to lynch​

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

No, I'm saying that since there is a complete lack of evidence for anything right now, acting as if one way is 100% going to be the right decision seems scummy, since the only real positive of vouching that hard for one side in an ambiguous situation is to be able to say "I told you so" if that happens to be correct, even if it was pure luck.

Also, DLZE's return post looks really scummy to me, and it's not just because he voted for me. Right now I think both him AND Junglefever are scum, but for now I'll focus on Jungle since he posts a lot. If you guys lynch me (I'm a regular townie so at least it won't be horrible) be sure to heed this post and check the both of them out.....and possibly lythium too because he didn't even explain why he voted for me at all, seems kinda like mafia trying to start a bandwagon to me.

You're scummy because you're throwing suspicion on people that vote for you. Also you're saying Lythium is scummy for starting your bandwagon? You tried to start one on Jungle!

I'm going to Vote: Mattnumbers.

 

[DZLE]

I mentioned I saw scumminess in DZLE's post but forgot to explain.


Exactly, I said I'm just changing it to a vote because a single vote for someone and a FoS on someone are essentially the exact same thing.
And then, right after saying that AND saying that you have tried it before without it working, you do the exact same thing?
We went over this. Someone else earlier said a FoS and Vote are essentially the same thing but it was disproved. Sure they are both used to prod for info, but a vote is a VOTE. IT KILLS. You can't pull the trigger with a FoS. If you FoS then have to irl for the day, it doesnt contribute. If you Vote and have to irl for the day, that vote is there. And will count towards the person when a lynch is or is not being decided. First part of you sounding desperate to lash out at those who have voted you.
Well, first of all:

That REALLY seems like an accidental slip-up to me, not just a small mistake
I would like to know what these "thoughts" you have on Jungle are exactly, because anyone can add something like that at the end of a paragraph to make them seem less scummy.
First of all when I said "Mafia needs this", I didnt mean the Mafia. I meant the game we are playing. It's called mafia. The game needs this. I wasnt mentioning scum. And at this point it'd be redundant to say what I think about Jungle. Because people have already said many of the same things i'm thinking. Aggressive, getting the ball rolling, suspicions, questions, etc.

You're saying this immediately after you express your trust in Junglefever due to him keeping the townie train "steadily chugging forward"? I'm seeing numerous contradictions, all this post is doing is making me more suspicious of both of you.
No where in any of my posts have I admitted trust in ANYONE. Stop grasping at straws. Leave me out of your desperate cries.


Opinions are completely subjective notions, I'm talking about generating REAL evidence. Opinions can be lead wrong easily if there is no physical evidence whatsoever to contradict what someone says. The only evidence it leaves in my opinion is that the person might be scum, due to the fact that being aggressive isn't very productive or helpful for town D1 but makes you APPEAR to be a productive member of the good guys.

This doesn't mean that if we do lynch Jungle and he turns out scum, I'm going to vote for you automatically, because this EXACT same situation happened in the last game except I was in your position defending Roxy for being helpful since he was aggressive D1. He got lynched anyways and was scum! I'm sure had I not been killed that night I would have been speculated closely as well.

Theres no such thing as solid, inevitable proof and evidence til we see a body. Even if someone roleclaims and even has a point here or there to back it up, everything could be a lie. No proof til a body. That's why we have to use our wits and our intellect to found out what we believe is the best course of action. We can't sit around and "wait" as you posted at the beginning for "proof" because you won't find it til a lynch has or has not been made and the night is over.

Can you guys like stop comparing Roxy and I day 1 in this game vs my game? I have no idea how you guys are getting that at all. It seems like you are cherry picking small things out of it and syaing 'look they are playing the same' which isn't true at all.

Night Phazes produce evidence that is stronger by far than any we can come up with D1 barring someone doing something stupid.

And I'm not saying "because roxy did this you must be the exact same", I'm saying "Because this would be an adequate strategy for scum during D1, and in the past I've seen scum using said strategy, I think that you could easily be scum as well"

I'm not comparing you to players in previous games, I'm comparing you to playstyles shown in previous games, since they reoccur very often in this game.

Looking at playstyles from previous games and pointing out that a person could be using that same type of playstyle is pointless. They could just change their style in the blink of an eye. There is always another option that is possible as to why someone is acting the way they are than originally thought. ALWAYS another option.

 

[Purple]

Mattnumber's vote had no reason, i agree (at least, none that he explained) however i would(my edit: would not) automatically assume he was trying to start a bandwagon. (matt's isn't even a band wagon honestly, he's L-3). However the reasons he has are pretty bad.

Matt, i want a big post on how you feel about the entire cast of players, (at least those who have posted).

until then, you are not at L-2

vote: Mattnumbers

(considering you soft-claimed, it would be a good idea to kill you anyways, mafia doesn't need a guaranteed person to not kill to find a PR)

 

[Purple]

no one else vote for mattnumbers until he responds

 

[:034:]

I'd like you to point out these flaws so that I can address them, everything I have seen so far has simply been a difference of opinion, not an actual error in my logic.

Why would I if I believe you are scum?

Does the day end here if the lynch is achieved? IF SO, I'd like for one or two people to unvote so that we can still get the most out of this day. Letting the day end now would be a waste.

 

[Frown]

Letting the day end now would be a waste.

I don't like this at all. Basically, we shouldn't lynch Mattnumbers because it would "be a waste"?

I'm thiiiiis close from voting for Mattnumbers. But instead, I will

Vote:

 

[:034:]

I don't like this at all. Basically, we shouldn't lynch Mattnumbers because it would "be a waste"?

I'm thiiiiis close from voting for Mattnumbers. But instead, I will

Vote:

You misunderstand. I'm happy with a Mattnumbers lynch, but I am unhappy with letting the day end. We can use the extra time to interrogate and search for more information. Letting that time slip away from us would be a waste.

If I thought lynching Mattnumbers would be a waste, I wouldn't have voted for him in the first place!

 

[ndayday]

Matt seems like desperate town to me.
With his roleclaim, I think it might be a good idea to get rid of him despite him possibly being town, like Roxy said.

But alas, we shall await his post.

 

[Mattnumbers]

So, I need a post with my opinion about each person? I'll get working on it this afternoon, I would appreciate it if you guys would back off a vote so I can write it without possibly having to delete it all due to being dead.

For now, I'm just going to ask, how did I start a bandwagon on Jungle? I was the second person to vote for him, and no one voted for him following me.

And yet:

I wouldn't vote for Junglefever. He has been helping town quite a lot and it would be bad to lose our most experienced player.

I've been saying this, too, but there are still two votes on him.
Vote: Mattnumbers

I thought I already had a vote on somebody? Well, it might've gotten lost in a 502 somewhere. :/

vote: Mattnumbers 'Sup, boi?

All aboard the Matt wagon??

unvote vote: matt

Vote: Mattnumbers

4 votes within 6 hours? One with absolutely no explanation (lythium), and two of which simultaneously defended the person I was trying to call scum? In a game where there are expected to be 3-4 mafia members?

So I'm apparently scum and yet my fellow scum not only didn't board my "bandwagon", but they didn't even defend me when I got a large amount of votes?

Additionally, you guys would believe I'm lying and I'm scum but you wouldn't believe that I'm lying about being a regular townie? Survival is the first priority of ANY person (barring certain PRs), and if I'm seen as an automatic "No NK", just as was said earlier, not only would I survive for my own sake but I would also be able to help town providing I'm not a cop.

Also, if I DO get lynched, consider the fact that no one was lying in wait waiting to hammer me like a mafia would normally have had they not ALL ALREADY VOTED FOR ME.

On a side note this game is great for studying group dynamics, although it makes me dislike them even more than I have previously.

 

[fragbait]

Really sucks that you are the target of this wagon, Numbers. I don't have much of a suspicion on you. However, Jungle made it very clear that he wanted to start a Wagon. My vote stays.

 

[Purple]

Well mattnumbers, i can't explain lythium's vote entirely, however i do know that with lythium saying 'sup boi?' she generally wants your opinion on things going on, lythium more than likely didn't want a bandwagon, but hey, here it is.

Don't worry about defending yourself as much as about getting good information seen to town, care more about the team, then about yourself. It sounds dumb, but understand that town doesn't instantly lose when you die, infact, town gets information because of how your flip comes out.

You pro-town? People who voted for you early and with no general reason, are just a tad bit scummier.

You Scum? People who voted for you later, or not at all, are just a bit scummier. Everything done in this game is information.

The best option for mafia is to generally choose to counter claim townie. I'm not sure if you understand that, but let's put it this way.

Mafia would never claim mafia lol.

So by claiming something like doctor, and someone says "LOL NO I'M DOCTOR" that leaves town with this (lynch one doctor claim based off scumminess, if we get a mafia, we're fine, if we don't, lynch the other doc claim). You claiming townie means nothing honestly.

also i'm not sure if you heard me say this earlier, but let's assume that you aren't mafia. And mafia sees your townie claim. (unless you're clearly outsmarting us) mafia would think "hey, let's not kill mattnumbers, they already are scummy on him, plus he's just a townie, let's leave him to be lynched tomorrow". Sure, you survive the night, however someone else (higher chance of a PR too, mind you) will die that that. You're hurting town more than helping.

I understand that i'm giving mafia a bit too much information with this post, but in the slim chance that you are not mafia. You need to know these things to help your gameplay.

 

[Purple]

when i say, you claiming townie means nothing, generally i'm meaning there's more townies than there are ANY other role. So when you claim townie, there's like, five other townies to choose from lol.

Also, i meant 'die that night' in the next to last line.

also, i edited 'you are not mafia' when it was originally 'you are or are not mafia' which doesn't make sense.

 

[ndayday]

Well really, you shouldn't be editing at all.
Just post again and fix your mistake.

But eh. I do think (and it is not ridiculous or silly to say this) that one or even two of the people on the Matt vote are scum.

 

[Purple]

I know ndayday, i usually would post like, four times in a row, but we're stil in the disco room, and we get post count for this.

 

[ohaiduhg]

But eh. I do think (and it is not ridiculous or silly to say this) that one or even two of the people on the Matt vote are scum.

My thoughts exactly.

 

[Mattnumbers]

Still don't currently have enough time for a player by player opinion post, but I'll post something for right now. Keep in mind Alaska is 4 hours earlier than East Coast so my afternoon is your evening.

I know that claiming townie means nothing, that's what I was trying to say. There's no evidence for OR against me being any sort of PR, and since a PR normally wouldn't reveal their role they would probably claim regular town, just as a regular town would since he/she has no reason to lie, the only thing you can base whether I'm regular or a PR off of is my word in a game of lies.

Also I'm thinking that there is a high chance one of the people I suspect as scum is just an innocent townie being played, so don't be too ruthless to my detractors if I get lynched, make sure you pick out the RIGHT ones.

Also Vrael where were you before you posted your vote for me? I hadn't seen you post anything important for a while iirc.

 

[Purple]

you can post bit by bit matt. you seem to be dodging the question by adding more information. give some insight.

So.. you claim townie because you might be PR? You see, you're making it too confusing Matt. We know full well that there aren't always just one people killing during the night, there's sometimes SK's, and obviously mafia. Even better, there's sometimes town-roled killers, please don't make this confusing for any of the potential third-party or town-aligned roles, you're just making things worse.

Who's the FoS matt, i'm quite interested in THAT more than just everyone. Let's hear what you got, and it better be good.