Tales of Brawl - Innerscope has released Lloyd 2.0!

[JetAurion]

If you're going to extract a model for Brawl that isn't in mdl0 format, why not use the model from Vesperia?

 

[GP&B]

Done (well, earlier actually). I'm hoping to get a response tomorrow or maybe even today.

 

[Fen__]

I am currently on a quest to extract Kratos's model and somehow convert it to .mld0 format.

Slow going, but Kratos in brawl will be worth it

I'm going to go ahead and let you know that you're not going to be able to do it. Just thought I'd save you the time.

 

[Holy Lance]

Why wouldn't it work?

Edit: Even if it didn't work, couldn't someone just make a model for Kratos? I hear someone's doing that for the Mewtwo project.

 

[Zephron]

Why wouldn't it work?

Edit: Even if it didn't work, couldn't someone just make a model for Kratos? I hear someone's doing that for the Mewtwo project.

Heh. hehe... heh....

You're funny. Making a correctly-scaled model that looks like Kratos would take a long time, unless one of us here is secretly working for Nintendo or some other gaming company, and knows how to do this stuff professional-like.

Mewtwo has a much simpler shape and plus even if they did make it perfectly, it won't work until they make a model importer. And by then why bother when you can import it from the GC when it comes out?

Not trying to be mean, but seriously. I think you'll have to just wait.
Help us with Lloyd and the rest of the characters that have models already.

 

[Holy Lance]

Heh. hehe... heh....

You're funny. Making a correctly-scaled model that looks like Kratos would take a long time, unless one of us here is secretly working for Nintendo or some other gaming company, and knows how to do this stuff professional-like.

Mewtwo has a much simpler shape and plus even if they did make it perfectly, it won't work until they make a model importer. And by then why bother when you can import it from the GC when it comes out?

Not trying to be mean, but seriously. I think you'll have to just wait.
Help us with Lloyd and the rest of the characters that have models already.

What do you mean when you say "when you can import it from the GC when it comes out"?

If they're already working on making GC models compatible or something, then I sure won't waste my time trying to convert the file.

Sorry if I'm a little stubborn. Kratos is my favorite character and putting him in Brawl would be the coolest thing to me. If I have to wait for upgrades to BrawlBox then I will.

Edit: Also excuse me if I seem like I am a novice, because I am. I'm just trying to help. Tales of Symphonia is my favorite game, and it would be awesome to play as the characters in Brawl.

 

[Zephron]

I meant why bother making a model if they are making a model importer? (I don't know if it will specifically work for GC, but either way it'll probably work for the model in ToV or GC.)

That's fine if you're a novice. Just offer your input as much as possible.

 

[Holy Lance]

They're making a model importer!? Wow awesome! I can certainly wait until there are easier ways to import models.

Is there a thread discussing this? It seems really interesting.

 

[GP&B]

Kryal is taking a long break from Brawl hacking and BrawlBox work. I don't believe there is anyone skilled enough in application programming (that's around anymore) to finish it off.

Look at the BrawlBox thread in the General Workshop forum.

 

[Fen__]

Why wouldn't it work?

Edit: Even if it didn't work, couldn't someone just make a model for Kratos? I hear someone's doing that for the Mewtwo project.

Better question: Why would it? There is no model being imported for the Mewtwo project. They're just using a Lucario model that's retextured with edited vertices to make it look like Mewtwo.

The only models that can be imported into brawl right now are models of the MDL0 filetype that are from Wii games. That's a single filetype, only when they appear on a single system (there are MDL0's in DS games that cannot be imported), and not even all of those work (at least not easily; Lloyd is actually a good example of this). There is no Kratos model that is featured in a Wii game, let alone one in MDL0. RandomTBush, who really pioneered MDL0 importing, has manually converted a couple of models that were not in MDL0 format to MDL0 and successfully placed them in Brawl. However, it's an extremely tedious process that takes a very long time, and, even then, it does not keep any rigging of the bones, so they can't be animated. At most, if you had a very long time and lots of dedication, you might could get a model of Kratos T-stanced in Brawl.

Your dedication is admirable, but it's simply misguided. Before you pursue something wholeheartedly, you should make sure you actually know the facts on the subject. If you go to this forum's parent forum (Smash Workshop General), there's a 300-or-so-page thread about importing MDL0's if you really want to see what it's all about and what has been accomplished first-hand. I urge you to invest this motivation here or elsewhere, though, as it's generally pretty hard to find in this community. Also, your good grammar's definitely a plus.

 

[SqLeon]

Would it be possible to take the mdl0 of the floating head and shoulders that Kratos has in the game and attach it to someone's body? Like Zelos, and make Zelos look more masculine.

 

[Fen__]

Would it be possible to take the mdl0 of the floating head and shoulders that Kratos has in the game and attach it to someone's body? Like Zelos, and make Zelos look more masculine.

You might could. I haven't actually looked at the model, so I don't know what it's like. Might have some funny problems like the character models had. It seems feasible that something could be done to the way BSZ animated Majora's Mask from Animal Crossing to move with Toon Link's face.

 

[Zephron]

You might could. I haven't actually looked at the model, so I don't know what it's like. Might have some funny problems like the character models had. It seems feasible that something could be done to the way BSZ animated Majora's Mask from Animal Crossing to move with Toon Link's face.

I really, unfortunately, don't think you can. BSZ replaced a part of TL and put that on there instead, and moved it up.

You' have to replace a part of Zelos (we don't even know if RTB can yet), and even then, it won't be animated at all. Zelos also will probably show underneath frequently.

The fact it was moving with TL's face doesn't mean it was actually animated.

 

[Fen__]

I really, unfortunately, don't think you can. BSZ replaced a part of TL and put that on there instead, and moved it up.

You' have to replace a part of Zelos (we don't even know if RTB can yet), and even then, it won't be animated at all. Zelos also will probably show underneath frequently.

The fact it was moving with TL's face doesn't mean it was actually animated.

I'm not entirely sure, but I think you misunderstand what I was proposing. This was in regards to the model of his head in ToS2, so it'd be an MDL0. The idea I think would be to vertex edit a character's model, shrink the head, then place the new head over it constantly.

EDIT: Also, I just realized that you were talking about Zelos whereas SqLeon was talking about Kratos.

 

[GP&B]

Kratos appears on a hologram screen in ToS2, sorry guys. He makes a cameo in that he's talking with Yuan while still on Derris-Kharlan like he was at the end of ToS1. Unless Namco left in a beta model for some reason, you won't be getting a compatible model any time soon.

 

[Zephron]

...Anyway.

Time for what we're working on.. teh Lloyd.

I am extremely close to getting sound effects to work.
I might have 12 or so sounds added by the end of today!
(Don't quote me but be optimistic!)

I trust Thanyou and SqLeon are making strides in their areas.
We're all really counting on them for me to release Lloyd on KCMM sometime this or next week.

EDIT: I've noticed we have all of Lloyd's sounds, but we don't have anything else.
We need the other sounds, aka:

* The beast roar when Lloyd uses Beast.
* Sword slashing sounds during Lloyd's moves.
* ...and more!

We need to find those!

 

[GP&B]

I might ask GuyGrandioso about that. Hopefully, he has general ToS1 battle sounds.

Wait, you know how to do sound effect replacement? Nice!

 

[Zephron]

I might ask GuyGrandioso about that. Hopefully, he has general ToS1 battle sounds.

Wait, you know how to do sound effect replacement? Nice!

Wow. You replied fast o.o

Yeah. Stickman and Jack Harvest are helping me, but I'm doing the manual labor

They gave me lots of tools and I am confident I can get some audible success soon.

 

[GP&B]

Ah, I see. I was wondering if they were still going to help out. It'll be awesome to get that out of the way.

No response from nerf yet.

@ds22; don't know if you got the chance or anything but

Another question: How do you run replaced SFX without Riivolution?

Because I know you have been doing this even before Riivolution was out.

 

[ds22]

Ah, I see. I was wondering if they were still going to help out. It'll be awesome to get that out of the way.

No response from nerf yet.

@ds22; don't know if you got the chance or anything but


Because I know you have been doing this even before Riivolution was out.

I replaced the .brsar file in the ISO itself and load it with USB-Loader.
*Sigh*
I almost had a fix for the throw glitch.
If only I could transfer the FrameMatrix and InverseBindMatrix data from Naruto's HipN to Lloyd's.

 

[GP&B]

Ok, I was wondering what other methods would work with that.

Dang, sounds like you're pretty close to the fix, but I feel that there is definitely a related solution perhaps. Keep up the good work, I can feel the featuring upon us!

 

[SqLeon]

How long should demon fang be in comparison to FD. And how long should it last.

 

[ds22]

Ok, I was wondering what other methods would work with that.

Dang, sounds like you're pretty close to the fix, but I feel that there is definitely a related solution perhaps. Keep up the good work, I can feel the featuring upon us!

Well, I need someone with a lot of hacking experience (RandomTBush) to fix this for me.
Because I now know that it is related to it in some way (or at least I think it is).

 

[GP&B]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gPj_dKdmFY

Look around 0:37 for a good speed and distance reference (although it might not go quite as far). About 2/3 of FD would be decent. Just calculate the time it takes the projectile at that speed to move that far and that'll settle the lifetime value. Are you modifying Wolf's blaster shot for this? I'm hoping that we can use that so we don't have to use pseudo-projectiles.

Also, if you're going to do any effects of some sort, use the ToS1 animation reference video as the effects are much more thorough and flashier than in ToS2. Thanyou has the Beast head model for that respective move, just so you know. It's just figuring out how to put out an mdl0 as a "projectile" (it's not really a projectile, but more like an extended hitbox close to the character without swords involved).

 

[Zephron]

I just had an idea.

Since we're working on sound effects, we'll need the announcer to say "Lloyd", and not "Wolf!".

Obviously we can't ask the announcer to do it for us, but maybe we can pull a clip from the game.

I remember when Kratos calls Lloyd's name several times during the game, it's clear and almost epic sounding.

Maybe we can use one of those for him. Unless we want to copy-paste Announcer sounds to say Lloyd. Which might be funny.

 

[GP&B]

I know ds22 has tried doing that with other characters. Perhaps he or someone else could try warping the voice as such? If we can get it to sound appropriate, I'll take it. Otherwise, your other solution might be good.

 

[Holy Lance]

I will try to find some good clips of people saying "Lloyd" in the game

Edit: I've been searching and I can't find any parts with Kratos shouting Lloyd's name (like the announcer). Perhaps someone can remind where in the game he does that?

 

[Fen__]

Kratos appears on a hologram screen in ToS2, sorry guys. He makes a cameo in that he's talking with Yuan while still on Derris-Kharlan like he was at the end of ToS1. Unless Namco left in a beta model for some reason, you won't be getting a compatible model any time soon.

Whoops. Wasn't aware (I haven't played ToS2). I thought I remembered someone saying much earlier that Kratos' head was in it as an MDL0 was all, so I was going off of that.

 

[Zephron]

Good news and bad news guys.

I always like ending with good news, so bad first.

The Bad:

Stickman can't put in the sounds until Sunday. He has a ton of crazy homework.
If anyone else knows how to do it, you two can work together and get it done earlier maybe?

The Good:

I organized a ton of sounds already, and if we DO have to wait until Sunday, that gives me more time to add even more.

All the placements are in according to Plaid's moveset, just because we're using that as our test PSA.

So far I have:

3 Victory Taunts:
"I was just warming up."
"You picked the wrong guy to mess with."
"Ha!" (It had to be extremely short, so this was all I count fit in.)

3 In-game taunts:
"This is going to be a piece of cake!"
"Come on.. bring it!"
"Like that?"

Specials:
-Psi Tempest (up b)
-Rising Falcon (Side B)
-Beast (Down B)
-Demon Fang!

Death sounds:
- Star KO: "I'm sorry.. dad..."
(I picked that instead of normal KO since I figured that would get kind of aggravating.)
- Other pain noises for normal deaths.

Etc:

- Jumping


Long list right? Well, there's a billion more sounds to go. Seriously.
But this alone makes Lloyd farther ahead than anyone else currently in the realm of imported characters!

@GD
please add Stickman as our Sound guy, and maybe give me a citation since I'm doing work too =_=.

Thanks for reading!

(If you wanted Lloyd to have different taunts, tell me which one. I have to make sure it fits to it's not always available to do whatever we want.)

 

[GP&B]

I looked over the featuring guidelines and we have a better chance if a download link is provided...
Well, "better chance" being the keyword. We'll probably still get featured as it is, but I'm wondering if we should package the CSPs, costumes, and partial moveset (not the whole placeholder moveset) or just not have a download.

 

[Zephron]

LOL, don't worry about that.

I can feature whatever I want since I'm on KCMM's team.
I was already planning a lot of that stuff already though.

Beta-Download is a necessity.
Once I'm done with a few more sounds, I'll make the CSPS, and finish up the Pirate costume.

This beta download will have in total:
- Beta PSA
- Beta Sound Effects
- 5/6 Costumes
- 5/6 CSP's
- Perhaps include CSS icon, and the text replacing wolf.

It's a beta-download. Don't worry about things not being done.
People love playing anything they can get their paws on if it's early.

I've been tinkering with the announcer's voice and I so far have a really good sounding "Ll - o - yd!"

The "O" sound needs some help so I'm searching for a better one to rip out.

 

[Holy Lance]

Good news and bad news guys.

I always like ending with good news, so bad first.

The Bad:

Stickman can't put in the sounds until Sunday. He has a ton of crazy homework.
If anyone else knows how to do it, you two can work together and get it done earlier maybe?

The Good:

I organized a ton of sounds already, and if we DO have to wait until Sunday, that gives me more time to add even more.

All the placements are in according to Plaid's moveset, just because we're using that as our test PSA.

So far I have:

3 Victory Taunts:
"I was just warming up."
"You picked the wrong guy to mess with."
"Ha!" (It had to be extremely short, so this was all I count fit in.)

3 In-game taunts:
"This is going to be a piece of cake!"
"Come on.. bring it!"
"Like that?"

Specials:
-Psi Tempest (up b)
-Rising Falcon (Side B)
-Beast (Down B)
-Demon Fang!

Death sounds:
- Star KO: "I'm sorry.. dad..."
(I picked that instead of normal KO since I figured that would get kind of aggravating.)
- Other pain noises for normal deaths.

Etc:

- Jumping


Long list right? Well, there's a billion more sounds to go. Seriously.
But this alone makes Lloyd farther ahead than anyone else currently in the realm of imported characters!

@GD
please add Stickman as our Sound guy, and maybe give me a citation since I'm doing work too =_=.

Thanks for reading!

(If you wanted Lloyd to have different taunts, tell me which one. I have to make sure it fits to it's not always available to do whatever we want.)

Perhaps a good victory taunt would be "Not bad am I?",

"That was easy",

"Never stood a chance against me" (my personal favorite), (not sure if they'll fit...

Good ingame taunts would be "Outta my sight", or "I'll show you!"

 

[GP&B]

Actually, "Outta my sight" is used alternatively with "Beast" and "I'll show you!" is used before Lloyd says "Divine Justice!".

"I was just warming up" is a keeper easily. It's probably the most common one you'll hear from Lloyd's victories in ToS1. That, and I think "Not bad, huh?" might've been the other I heard a bit. Don't remember though.

 

[Holy Lance]

I like "Never stood a chance against me" better...

The warming up one got really annoying, and I'm kinda sick of it :/

 

[Zephron]

If we want "Not bad, am I?", we'd have to remove: "You picked the wrong guy to mess with."

Which is my personal favorite. We're going to have to deal with the third one forever because there's no other sound I can think of that's less than a half second long.

"Outta my sight" is said too quickly to work as a taunt. It's better as a precursor to an attack. We can either have Lloyd say "Beast", or "Outta my sight!". Not both.

Personally I'd prefer the latter because everyone knows it's beast and it sounds cooler to say the other one.

I am going to have Lloyd say both "I'll show you!" and "Divine Justice!" in the same sound effect.

When wolf says: "We're gonna have fun with this thing." It's super long and I can fit both in.

BTW.... I liked the "warming up" one... : |

 

[GP&B]

"Beast" and "Outta my sight!" are alternated randomly. We'd just have the PSA choose randomly between either of those sounds. Almost every character (if not all) has this sort of random sound choice for some moves like Mario's 3rd jab.

Divine Justice in one entire piece works as long as you can space those two apart enough so it isn't awkward.

I agree on the "warming up" one too.

 

[Zephron]

School is almost over and I'd really like it if you were on Skype sometime today, GD.
I'll be on in more or less an hour.

Lots of things to do and talk about.

Wolf's down B doesn't have an alternate sound to play. If we can find one to discard and play that's long enough I suppose that'd be okay. But let's save those details for after the beta.

 

[GP&B]

You simply choose any other unused sound effect and we can choose that in PSA.

I'll keep Skype on so we can discuss this all in detail.

 

[fleish]

Hey y'all.

Re-watched the progress videos recently and thought of something.

Is Lloyd's current default "hand on hip" pose going to be his final idle stance? For a swordsman (especially Lloyd) that seems a little... arrogant, almost. Or flamboyant. Or both.

Would a more "battle-ready" stance be more appropriate?

 

[GP&B]

ds22 never got Lloyd's proper wait animation. Thanyou has it so don't worry.