TAKE THAT! Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney smashes the prosecution!

KirbyMonadoBoy

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I'm real curious (and sorry if this has been discussed before) but what did you guys think of SOJ? Like or dislike? I actually quite liked it but it seems a lot of AA spaces online weren't fans of it.
I'm more on team dislike to be honest, but that's mostly for the main plot and new characters, the series still delivers on good mysteries at the very least (well, somewhat).
Team dislike for reasons I've explained a lot, though case 2 is one of my favorites in the series, so it's complicated. I just think they did a lot of my favorite characters dirty and tried too hard to appeal to older fans but in really weak ways and at the expense of all the interesting things established in the previous two games, so they ended up pleasing nobody
It's easily my least favorite entry in the series, and I guess you could say that's not very surprising as, barring Investigations 2, I haven't really liked any of the post OG trilogy games.
Spirit of Justice's DLC case did wash the horrid taste out of my system, but it couldn't undo the damage.
To this today, SoJ is my least favorite main-series Ace Attorney game.
I hated spirit of justice, the concepts it introduced could have worked if they were in different games but with this game they tried doing to much at the same time, as a result nothing feels properly developed.
I think Spirit of Justice might be the only game I didn't get around to finishing. I beat the first half, was starting to lose interest, life got busy, and I just never picked it up again.
My heart....
It makes me sad to see so many people not liking SoJ :(

Proof of how much I (+ friends who also played it on my 3DS) loved the game:
IMG_20200130_230033.jpg


Did you see how 6-3 finished? Putting filler right after that sounds like a trope ripped straight out of a long running shonen. I can't say anything about the case felt special either, not the characters, not the twists, and especially not the defendant or antagonist. I can't say it did anything to show Athena growing as an attorney either, I really want the girl to be shown in a better light in court.
Yeah I agree that the timing of the case was not optimal – it felt a bit unrealistic how this case (iirc) happened just one day after 6-3 and that Nahyuta flew all the way back to America just for this case. But still, it's supposed to be a filler case - not every case has to be connected to every part of the story. The relationship between Athena and a certain recurring character was great and I enjoyed all the conversations (even though Athena felt a bit too helpless at times, I agree). Still better than not giving her spotlight at all imo. I definitely also want to see the next AA game with Athena as the main protagonist.
 
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My heart....
It makes me sad to see so many people not liking SoJ :(
Ok let me clarify. It was during a time I was playing all the Ace Attorney games back to back to back. And by the time I got to Spirit of Justice I was already feeling kinda burnt out. So when I got half way through the game and life got busy. I just never felt compelled to pick it up again with fears I would have to start the whole game over again.
 

Dukemon102

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Yes. SoJ did so many great things IMO.
6-1 has Rock Jesus.
6-2 felt like the Apollo Justice sequel we needed.
6-3 brung back some familiar faces, you can give us fanservice for one case, come on. It's been so long.... and the mistery and what actually happened got me hooked to my 3DS.
Even if 6-4 did certain character dirty. The other character in the defense bench was a blast to read and got me so many laughs, same with the witnesses.
And the first trial of 6-5 maybe felt a little forced narratively wise. But the trial itself was a blast to play. Now we know how the prosecutors felt all this time LMAO.
Actually I think SoJ is better than JFA. It isn't a game solely carried by one great case and three lackuster ones. But that's just my opinion.

Just like the Byleth reveal. Being dissapointed by certain aspects of a game doesn't mean that I hate it. But it certainly showed that they tried to do too many things at once. You either make a game located entirely on Khura'in or you just don't. Do it like DGS, which is always using the new mechanics (I never in my life even thought THAT system would actually come back) for the whole game.
 
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Overall I really liked the LA cases in SoJ, they didn't feel forced or like they had to have high stakes for the sake of it. Just Apollo and Athena solving cases, which IMO is what AA5 and 6 should have been. Even the first half of the last case was pretty epic, as it was really different from what we're used to and Atishon is just a very funny character.

By the way, am I the only one that thought that the terrorist guy (not Dhurke, the one that did the parachuting thing) was Larry in disguise for the entire duration of the game? His design just reminded me of Santa Butz.
 
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Overall I really liked the LA cases in SoJ, they didn't feel forced or like they had to have high stakes for the sake of it. Just Apollo and Athena solving cases, which IMO is what AA5 and 6 should have been. Even the first half of the last case was pretty epic, as it was really different from what we're used to and Atishon is just a very funny character.

By the way, am I the only one that thought that the terrorist guy (not Dhurke, the one that did the parachuting thing) was Larry in disguise for the entire duration of the game? His design just reminded me of Santa Butz.
I felt the same way about the astronaut guy in Dual Destinies. Their designs both resemble Larry, though vastly more competent.
 

Dukemon102

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really? i feel like weve got a fair amount from them
Companies like Bethesda or Ubisoft have been releasing their old games at mostly fair prices for their age or they do compilations which are a fair offer. Then there is Capcom putting individual Resident Evil ports at $30 (And why does RE4 STILL not have motion controls when REvelations 1/2, RE5, and RE6 got them?) or mostly unchanged Devil May Cry ports at $20 individually when the DMC HD collection existed.... I perfectly understand why people are upset with them.

However, I would take that over the cheap mobile ports of Square Enix. Dragon Quest 1-3 on the eShop pissed me off so much, such great games (Well, DQ3 at least) that most of the west never played, and they chose to show them to new audiences with horrible and embarassing ports, they never learn, that was just as bad as Chrono Trigger's initial PC release.
 

fogbadge

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Companies like Bethesda or Ubisoft have been releasing their old games at mostly fair prices for their age or they do compilations which are a fair offer. Then there is Capcom putting individual Resident Evil ports at $30 (And why does RE4 STILL not have motion controls when REvelations 1/2, RE5, and RE6 got them?) or mostly unchanged Devil May Cry ports at $20 individually when the DMC HD collection existed.... I perfectly understand why people are upset with them.

However, I would take that over the cheap mobile ports of Square Enix. Dragon Quest 1-3 on the eShop pissed me off so much, such great games (Well, DQ3 at least) that most of the west never played, and they chose to show them to new audiences with horrible and embarassing ports, they never learn, that was just as bad as Chrono Trigger's initial PC release.
i suppose you do miss a lot if you only play two capcom franchises
 

Leotsune

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(And why does RE4 STILL not have motion controls when REvelations 1/2, RE5, and RE6 got them?) or mostly unchanged Devil May Cry ports at $20 individually when the DMC HD collection existed.
Im still upset with RE4, the motion controls on the Wii made the game much better for me.
In regards of DMC, at least looks like DMC 3 SE will be worth the 20 bucks, I own the collection on PS4 so I don't think I'll get it just yet, I think they should've sold DMC 1 & 2 together, who on earth would pay $20 for DMC2?!?
Now imagine if they sell AJ, DD and SOJ for $20 each, even I would think twice before getting any of them.
 

zumaddy

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I dunno man, people often told me the same with Joker, and yet....
Still, I would like to hear your reasoning behind your statement, so if you could pleason elaborate a bit more.
I'm not any great leaker or speculator, I just think it's very unlikely.
 

Leotsune

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I'm not any great leaker or speculator, I just think it's very unlikely.
Fair enough, everyone has their own opinions, for one reason or another.
I think 2B falls into the Joker, so maybe she has a chance, at the end of the day the characters are already decided so what we (and everyone else on this site for that matter) thinks about a certian character doesn't really mean anything.
We're just here for the ride, don't we?
 

Dukemon102

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Joker feels like Atlus's most famous candidate because of how massive Persona 5 became. I think Sora would be chosen over 2B if we would have another Square Enix character (Yes I know, Disney yadda yadda but you still have to talk to Nomura). But that's what common sense tells me. And common sense doesn't apply to Sakurai.

Travis and Master Chief feel more like bandwagons because they only become popular when a new game of their franchise was announced / some supposed competition gets deconfirmed. Also... as much as it pains me... Dante too. That coincidence of announcement dates spiked his popularity for some reason.
 
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Joker feels like Atlus's most famous candidate because of how massive Persona 5 became. I think Sora would be chosen over 2B if we would have another Square Enix character (Yes I know, Disney yadda yadda but you still have to talk to Nomura). But that's what common sense tells me. And common sense doesn't apply to Sakurai.

Travis and Master Chief feel more like bandwagons because they only become popular when a new game of their franchise was announced / some supposed competition gets deconfirmed. Also... as much as it pains me... Dante too. That coincidence of announcement dates spiked his popularity for some reason.
I don't think we will get Sora and 2B at the same time, but not because 2 Square reps. Sakurai would talk with Nomura for Sora, for sure, but he's a Disney character so I think we could still get 2B, Geno or another Square character if double dipping in Volume 2 isn't a thing.

I would argue Travis isn't much of a bandwagon pick. Yeah, with Travis Strikes Again being released and the announcement of NMH3 people is talking more about him, of course. But he always had support for Smash even if it wasn't super huge.
Also, maybe it's just me but I think you can say that all characters are bandwagon picks at some point. People talking about a character makes other people interested in the character, and rumours, leaks and new games helps to boost the popularity of the fighter as well.

Speculation itself helps franchises and characters and gives them new fans. I'm a good example of that. I knew of Ace Attorney for years and while it seemed original, I was never interested in playing the games but at the same time I knew very little about the games. I started playing the franchise a few months ago mostly thanks to Smash speculation, which gave me a lot of curiosity for Phoenix and his games, a curiosity I never had all the last years even if I already knew of Ace Attorney.
 

Dukemon102

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I don't think we will get Sora and 2B at the same time, but not because 2 Square reps. Sakurai would talk with Nomura for Sora, for sure, but he's a Disney character so I think we could still get 2B, Geno or another Square character if double dipping in Volume 2 isn't a thing.

I would argue Travis isn't much of a bandwagon pick. Yeah, with Travis Strikes Again being released and the announcement of NMH3 people is talking more about him, of course. But he always had support for Smash even if it wasn't super huge.
Also, maybe it's just me but I think you can say that all characters are bandwagon picks at some point. People talking about a character makes other people interested in the character, and rumours, leaks and new games helps to boost the popularity of the fighter as well.

Speculation itself helps franchises and characters and gives them new fans. I'm a good example of that. I knew of Ace Attorney for years and while it seemed original, I was never interested in playing the games but at the same time I knew very little about the games. I started playing the franchise a few months ago mostly thanks to Smash speculation, which gave me a lot of curiosity for Phoenix and his games, a curiosity I never had all the last years even if I already knew of Ace Attorney.
I think my definition of character bandwagon would be "characters that weren't very popular getting a lot of fans suddenly, because of certain event". And I admit Phoenix filled that definition when the leaker madness before the VGAs was happening. Not that it's bad thing. But them becoming popular in speculation circles recently, at the end doesn't mean anything. Because the characters were already decided so the only thing we can do is wait and see.
Funnily enough, the only one that became true was Hero because that was a legit data mining. All the rest were unexpected or leaked before the reveal (Banjo and Kazooie didn't become popular of all sudden, they were already extremely requested before that).

About 2B, would she count as Square Enix or Platinum Games? I need to look up to Sakurai's words when Bayo was added. This may be same thing. I think they ask for the developers input more than the IP holder.
 
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I think my definition of character bandwagon would be "characters that weren't very popular getting a lot of fans suddenly, because of certain event". And I admit Phoenix filled that definition when the leaker madness before the VGAs was happening. Not that it's bad thing. But them becoming popular in speculation circles recently, at the end doesn't mean anything. Because the characters were already decided so the only thing we can do is wait and see.
Funnily enough, the only one that became true was Hero because that was a legit data mining. All the rest were unexpected or leaked before the reveal (Banjo and Kazooie didn't become popular of all sudden, they were already extremely requested before that).

About 2B, would she count as Square Enix or Platinum Games? I need to look up to Sakurai's words when Bayo was added. This may be same thing. I think they ask for the developers input more than the IP holder.
Oh, okay. I guess that when you're saying "characters that weren't very popular" you're talking about the popularity of a character inside the Smash community, because characters like Master Chief, Sora, Crash or Dante are well known even if a good amount of their support appeared in the last months.

About 2B, she would count as Square Enix, yeah. Square owns the IP. Platinum Games made the game or at least all that was action related, but in any case Yoko Taro, director of the game, created her, and he works at Square.
I guess you could count 2B as a Platinum character in a certain way, tho.
 
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Drakengard/Nier is 100% owned by SE, but I'm personally not counting on them getting anymore characters after Hero, whether it's Geno, any other FF characters, Crono, whoever from Bravely, Lara Croft or a Nier character, to give the main examples I see discussed every now and then. Sora is Disney and that's a minefield I simply don't think Nintendo will consider worth the risks to get into Smash (with the possibility of Disney pulling the plug over licensing the character and whatnot).
I was actually wondering about Travis, I think the violence wouldn't be an issue to tone down, but I wonder if Suda would be cool with removing all the swears he spouts left and right? A nitpick to be sure, but I find that to be kinda integral to the characters portrayal to at least think about.
 

Krankees

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I was actually wondering about Travis, I think the violence wouldn't be an issue to tone down, but I wonder if Suda would be cool with removing all the swears he spouts left and right? A nitpick to be sure, but I find that to be kinda integral to the characters portrayal to at least think about.
Well Suda does want the character in. I think he would be fine with it.

02/04/2019 EDIT: Has the Ace Attorney Trilogy always been on the eshop's featured section? I don't think it means anything as much as I want it to. I just found it interesting.
 
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Sabrewulf238

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I was wondering....for Megaman and Heros final smash they have 6 and 7 characters appearing alongside them respectively....

If Phoenix Wright got a Final Smash that involved 7 characters pointing and shouting "Objection!" alongside him, what characters would you choose?

Phoenix Wright (well...obviously)
Maya Fey
Miles Edgeworth
Gumshoe
Apollo Justice
Athena Cykes

So I think the above are "no brainers" for me. Phoenix, Maya, Edgeworth and Gumshoe are really the original Ace Attorney characters that were prominent for the whole Ace Attorney trilogy. Apollo represents his own game and alongside with Athena they've both been important members of Phoenix & Co law offices.

The last two spots are where things get confusing. I think I would consider all of these characters...

Mia Fey
Franziska Von Karma
Klavier Gavin
Ema Skye
Simon Blackwell
Pearl Fey
Trucy Wright

I think at this point it comes down to personal preference. I would probably add Mia Fey (they could have her being channeled through Pearl for two for the price of one) and Franziska. I can see the argument for Klavier, Ema, Simon and Trucy as well though. If they could push for it I'd like to see them included as well...but 12 characters showing up in a final smash is a lot.

Obviously it would great if there was room for more but I think something like 7 alongside Phoenix would be reasonable. (considering past final smashes and the number of cameos we got for SNK characters) Also it would make sense for these characters to show up in cameos on the courtroom stage so they could have multiple purposes.

P.S I'd love to have a Kay Faraday cameo for some Investigations love but I'm not sure if they'd do that, they'd probably have their hands full representing the main series.
 
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Krankees

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I was wondering....for Megaman and Heros final smash they have 6 and 7 characters appearing alongside them respectively....

If Phoenix Wright got a Final Smash that involved 7 characters pointing and shouting "Objection!" alongside him, what characters would you choose?

Phoenix Wright (well...obviously)
Maya Fey
Miles Edgeworth
Gumshoe
Apollo Justice
Athena Cykes

So I think the above are "no brainers" for me. Phoenix, Maya, Edgeworth and Gumshoe are really the original Ace Attorney characters that were prominent for the whole Ace Attorney trilogy. Apollo represents his own game and alongside with Athena they've both been important members of Phoenix & Co law offices.

The last two spots are where things get confusing. I think I would consider all of these characters...

Mia Fey
Franziska Von Karma
Klavier Gavin
Ema Skye
Simon Blackwell
Pearl Fey
Trucy Wright

I think at this point it comes down to personal preference. I would probably add Mia Fey (they could have her being channeled through Pearl for two for the price of one) and Franziska. I can see the argument for Klavier, Ema, Simon and Trucy as well though. If they could push for it I'd like to see them included as well...but 12 characters showing up in a final smash is a lot.

Obviously it would great if there was room for more but I think something like 7 alongside Phoenix would be reasonable. (considering past final smashes and the number of cameos we got for SNK characters) Also it would make sense for these characters to show up in cameos on the courtroom stage so they could have multiple purposes.

P.S I'd love to have a Kay Faraday cameo for some Investigations love but I'm not sure if they'd do that, they'd probably have their hands full representing the main series.
How about something similar to Joker's where the characters that show up alternate between each final smash.
 
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I recently started with Spirit of Justice, and I'm liking it so far. Yesterday I started case 3, and I have to say that
Maya's return gave me a lot of chills lol. I knew she was in this game and all that and I was expecting his return, but when it happened I felt very happy.
It's funny because I started playing AA a few months ago and now it's like I know all these characters for years. It's so hard to dislike the wonderful cast of characters that the series has.

Also. I didn't know that Ema was in this game. She's probably one of my favorite characters in Ace Attorney, idk very well why. And I LOVE her 3D incarnation. She looks so so good.

So far my only complain about this game is that Maya doesn't appear since the first case hahaha.
 
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Blankiturayman

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Hey all, I hope it's not too late to ask if I could be added to the supporter list. I've played most of the AA games, right now only missing SoJ, and I'd love to see Phoenix get in Smash sometime. I would also love it if Edgeworth could get in as an alt or echo but I figure that's fairly unlikely (I just really like Edgeworth lol). Anyways, good luck with the coming DLC!
 
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Give out my thoughts why our favorite attorney might have a chance.

-Strong history with Nintendo notably being on its consoles since its debut.
-Phoenix Wright is an honorary Nintendo character.
-Sakurai likes fun, wacky and unique characters which Wright easily fits into all three categories and given his statement of "Its more important for an character to be fun then recognizable" really helps given he's also an recognizable character.

Many people says Dante is more likely but remember how everyone thought Resident Evil were believed to get an rep and instead got an Spirit Board? The same could happen with Devil May Cry which if it happened would increase Wright's chances more of getting into Smash.
 
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Give out my thoughts why our favorite attorney might have a chance.

-Strong history with Nintendo notably being on its consoles since its debut.
-Phoenix Wright is an honorary Nintendo character.
-Sakurai likes fun, wacky and unique characters which Wright easily fits into all three categories and given his statement of "Its more important for an character to be fun then recognizable" really helps given he's also an recognizable character.

Many people says Dante is more likely but remember how everyone thought Resident Evil were believed to get an rep and instead got an Spirit Board? The same could happen with Devil May Cry which if it happened would increase Wright's chances more of getting into Smash.
There's also stuff out there saying that AA played a part in the smash reveal videos being as they are. There's a lot of reasons to think we could be celebrating
 

Mega Bidoof

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So the Capcom Publisher sale started, and this is their banner on Steam.

https://store.steampowered.com/sale/capcom

27D0F59D-7619-46D3-AAF7-FFB7E490AB64.jpeg


I think it’s worth noting how the three front and center series are Mega Man, Street Fighter, and Ace Attorney. They deliberately chose to not only represent Ace Attorney alongside their heavy hitters with more recent games, but put Phoenix and Miles closer to the middle than all of the ones that aren’t in Smash.

Look at how huge some of the other series are:
- DMC5 was a smash hit financially and critically, and the entire series is ready for sale on Steam. The ENTIRE SERIES (5 games and a reboot) are available on Steam to buy, and DMC3 is even getting special new additions for Switch.
- Monster Hunter World was MASSIVE, and it just got its Iceborne expansion a little while back.
- Resident Evil is back in the spotlight. The RE2 Remake was a huge success and a consistent Game of the Year choice, and now an RE3 Remake is coming soon. Not to mention you have a bunch of the original games available on Steam for this sale.

Yet Phoenix and Miles are closer to the middle, despite the last new Ace Attorney thing being the HD Trilogy re-release from nearly a year, which is the ONLY ACE ATTORNEY GAME ON STEAM, and the series having no confirmed future, with the last actual game having been released four years.

I might be looking too far into it, but at least it lets us know that Capcom didn’t forget about us yet.

Or maybe I’m not insane and they’re going to announce Phoenix as Fighter 6 on Thursday.
 
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Mega Bidoof

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Source on that?
I remember Sakurai praising about AA presentation, but nothing besides that.
It was a theory that I remember finding in this video. It seems possible because the time windows match up.
It’s a bit of a reach, but you do have Sakurai praising how AA used trailers utilizing the characters and their personalities in clever ways, then proceeded to have his series be known for its cinematic character reveals utilizing characters’ personalities.
 
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