Q&A Tactical Deployment - Roy Q&A Thread

[Oblivion129]

What are Roy's options to punish a ledge grab after a trump aside from Dtilt?

I'd like to know this as well. I think Sourspot Fsmash hits, but I'd like to know what the optimal punish is.

 

[ArikadoSD]

Down smash? Doesn't seem like there are many options. I normally ledge trump to bair instead of letting them regrab the ledge.

Edit: you could scare them into buffering a roll and punishing that.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Fsmash works well if you space it right.

 

[HerbSuperb]

I normally ledge trump to bair instead of letting them regrab the ledge.

Ledge trump to bair i think is one of the better trump options in the game; kills consistently

My breadnbutter combos/techs:

• Jab to side b at low percents (or grab)
• Jab to fair at mid percents
• Dtilt tech chase
• stringing bairs n fairs

• D throw mixups (nair/blazer) read airdodges for fsmash that kills stupid early
• pivot ftilts and retreating SH nairs to stop approaches
• neutral b frame traps

 

[JesseMcCloud]

Does anyone have any tips on how to consistently land his dair meteor?

 

[GenG]

Does anyone have any tips on how to consistently land his dair meteor?

There is no consistent way since it's really laggy, but for me jab or fthrow (depending on the character) to dair at the ledge at mid percentages works sometimes. If they airdodge you have to wait a bit.

 

[meleebrawler]

Sorry for the double post but this is actually completely unrelated to the first post:

How does diminishing returns work with DED?

I've never played Marth/Lucina so IDK how their's work. I understand the move hits multiple times but those hits aren't mandatory and they are also dynamic so I can't just assume it works like a multi-hit without any information.

Is it like every hit has it's own diminishing returns (which would mean that using the up finisher would keep my side finisher fresh and vice versa), or do the hits share the same diminishing returns just like a multi-hit? Or maybe it's something completely unique I have no idea about. I am really scratching my head on this.

Pretty sure each hit is separate when it comes to staling, if that's what you're talking about. If you're wondering why people say dancing blade is a good move refresher now you know why.

As far as deciding what final hit to use... up lets you trap landings and is generally what you'll want to use use if you're in range,
forward to knock them offstage or maybe kill at high percents, down causes the most damage if you don't care about followups
and gives great shield pressure if their shield has been softened beforehand.

Has there been any use for non tipper hits?

Sourspot nair and dtilt are safe on shield, so you'll be using those a lot against defensive opponents.

As for the question of what to do against opponents grabbing the ledge after a trump, try Flare Blade. Hitbox is big enough to get them, so you can either hit them the moment they grab for easy damage or try holding it to see what they'll do to avoid it. End lag is so low punishing is very likely.

 

[Perris6]

Having a little trouble incorporating side b into my game. I have a lot of success incorporating every other move, even up b out of shield successfully, but I Never use side b or neutral b. Are there any situations I could use it? Maybe after sourspot Nair, Fthrow or covering landings? Thank you in advance

 

[meleebrawler]

Having a little trouble incorporating side b into my game. I have a lot of success incorporating every other move, even up b out of shield successfully, but I Never use side b or neutral b. Are there any situations I could use it? Maybe after sourspot Nair, Fthrow or covering landings? Thank you in advance

One of the best ways to use double-edge dance is as a roll punish.

 

[ArikadoSD]

Having a little trouble incorporating side b into my game. I have a lot of success incorporating every other move, even up b out of shield successfully, but I Never use side b or neutral b. Are there any situations I could use it? Maybe after sourspot Nair, Fthrow or covering landings? Thank you in advance

Neutral b can cover landings in some cases. In other cases I use it to edgeguard high recoveries that were aiming to catch the ledge, it really puts them in a checkmate situation.

Other than that it's pretty situational and I usually just use it whenever I see a chance and thanks to the little lag it has I can usually walk out of it unpunished.

 

[metroidfan987]

Roy's Flare Blade (B) is crazy strong now. We can easily get a KO with a low-medium charge at <100%.

 

[Perris6]

Covering landings with neutral b works wonders

 

[metroidfan987]

Ok, how do I share replays? Because I KO'd a Mega Man in FG with Flare Blade at 30%. I measured the full charge time of Flare Blade, and it is between 4-5 seconds. The hit was at the edge of the stage, the charge time was 50%, and it wasn't even a base hit. The attack did 24% damage.

Edit: I uploaded the replay. It was vs Mega Man, I titled it "Flare Blade KO", stage was Living Room Omega Form, it was a 1v1 For Glory match, and my 3DS profile name is Navi.

 

[Snow Black]

What are some ways to pressure shields with Roy? I feel like whenever someone is shielding I have to respect it too much to prevent myself from being shield grabbed. Dtilt doesn't cover quite enough space to force an option, and jab isn't very safe either from my experience. Is downward angled DED the best option?

 

[Perris6]

What are some ways to pressure shields with Roy? I feel like whenever someone is shielding I have to respect it too much to prevent myself from being shield grabbed. Dtilt doesn't cover quite enough space to force an option, and jab isn't very safe either from my experience. Is downward angled DED the best option?

If you aren't a fan of Dtilt or jab then well spaced nairs and Downward angled DED should be your answer. I mostly convert damage off of grabs when I play, so If I do encounter a shield I grab. But I use jab and Dtilt the most for pressure.

 

[ArikadoSD]

Tomahawk. People like holding shield.

 

[Perris6]

Tomahawk. People like holding shield.

Tomahawk...... sweet sweet tomahawk

 

[BurstPanther]

Ok, how do I share replays? Because I KO'd a Mega Man in FG with Flare Blade at 30%. I measured the full charge time of Flare Blade, and it is between 4-5 seconds. The hit was at the edge of the stage, the charge time was 50%, and it wasn't even a base hit. The attack did 24% damage.

Edit: I uploaded the replay. It was vs Mega Man, I titled it "Flare Blade KO", stage was Living Room Omega Form, it was a 1v1 For Glory match, and my 3DS profile name is Navi.

A full charged flare blade kills from 0% from the middle and does 50% damage, at least it did before last patch.

 

[metroidfan987]

A full charged flare blade kills from 0% from the middle and does 50% damage, at least it did before last patch.

I tested this, and it looks like this only applies to Bowser. Even Ganon can still be OHKO'd from the center of the stage. Also, is the Flare Blade explosion affected by sweet/sour spot? Because I'm starting to think it's not.

 

[BurstPanther]

I tested this, and it looks like this only applies to Bowser. Even Ganon can still be OHKO'd from the center of the stage. Also, is the Flare Blade explosion affected by sweet/sour spot? Because I'm starting to think it's not.

I think full charged does the same damage the whole sword. Bowser & Shield Shulk are the only 2 who can survive at 0%.

 

[metroidfan987]

I think full charged does the same damage the whole sword. Bowser & Shield Shulk are the only 2 who can survive at 0%.

Lol, forgot about Shield Shulk. And, I think all percentages of Flare Blade explosion does equal damage across the blade. I'm thinking this is because the explosion does not actually register as a sword strike.

 

[BurstPanther]

Tomahawk. People like holding shield.

What's Tomahawk? Please forgive my cluelessness

 

[ArikadoSD]

What's Tomahawk? Please forgive my cluelessness

When you empty hop, force people to shield, then quickly drop and grab them.

 

[tconan]

Hey guys, I have trouble canceling sh fair with a jump/special and always get landing lag instead. What button inputs do you guys use to do this?

 

[Phill-Bot]

I notice that good players simply jump away after I d-throw them (not sure if this is mostly damage/character specific, but I've seen Ryu's jump away at low to mid range damage and I think he's considered a heavy fast faller). When I double jump and try to do an aerial, they have time to air dodge it. Is there any reliable way to hit them after they jump away from d-throw?

 

[ArikadoSD]

I notice that good players simply jump away after I d-throw them (not sure if this is mostly damage/character specific, but I've seen Ryu's jump away at low to mid range damage and I think he's considered a heavy fast faller). When I double jump and try to do an aerial, they have time to air dodge it. Is there any reliable way to hit them after they jump away from d-throw?

Well the window to hit them while they're still in hitstun from dthrow is quite small, so you have to buffer a jump and nair/fair. At least that's how I think it works, assuming you're trying it at mid-high percent.

 

[Phill-Bot]

Well the window to hit them while they're still in hitstun from dthrow is quite small, so you have to buffer a jump and nair/fair. At least that's how I think it works, assuming you're trying it at mid-high percent.

I think a bad habit of mine is instead of reading, I try to do a reactionary punish. Also, I don't like buffering a jump to catch them because if they only air dodge and not jump, I'm in a bad position. I'll just have to be more mindful of what they do and read them better.

 

[BurstPanther]

I notice that good players simply jump away after I d-throw them (not sure if this is mostly damage/character specific, but I've seen Ryu's jump away at low to mid range damage and I think he's considered a heavy fast faller). When I double jump and try to do an aerial, they have time to air dodge it. Is there any reliable way to hit them after they jump away from d-throw?

I like to try and condition them to air dodge straight away, then you can wait it out and punish, but once the get to the higher percents, i only try and throw them off the ledge and then go out and kill them, again, baiting the airdodge and normally spiking them into the stage with a bair. Also, i rarely chase them in the air after a D throw, i play more of a trap game, reading the landing into another grab, or shield fsmash/upsmash/up B.

 

[ArikadoSD]

I think a bad habit of mine is instead of reading, I try to do a reactionary punish. Also, I don't like buffering a jump to catch them because if they only air dodge and not jump, I'm in a bad position. I'll just have to be more mindful of what they do and read them better.

Normally they shouldn't have time to airodge because dthrow nair/fair is supposed to be a true combo, buffering just mkakes it a whole lot easier.

 

[AJL]

Any useful ways for getting the timing for Roy's SideB? I usually get the first 1 or 2 hits then screw up the timing and get punished. Also, when should I be using it?

 

[BurstPanther]

Any useful ways for getting the timing for Roy's SideB? I usually get the first 1 or 2 hits then screw up the timing and get punished. Also, when should I be using it?

It's not so much when you should be using it, more what you should do when using it. I'm a Link main, and one of the keys was to mix up jabs and FSmash, treat Roys Side B the same, throw out one hit, if it hits, you can easily throw the second. If it misses, just stop at one.
Side B is so versatile as you can throw it out quick or slow it down. Also, keep in mind the different combo's with it. SideB into Down performs the dancing blade. This is a great option for pressuring shields, many people don't hold shield long enough to avoid all the hits. It can also be used to cover rolls or dash ins. SideB to Up is a great leading tool into your landing trap game, especially if they have the momentum. Get them in the air and change the strategy up.
Side B to Side can lead into a dash attack or short hop nair/fair.

Sometimes i have used sideB from a reverse short hop to cover my landing. If they rush in for the grab, the lasting hit box will knock them away.

 

[tconan]

Any useful ways for getting the timing for Roy's SideB? I usually get the first 1 or 2 hits then screw up the timing and get punished. Also, when should I be using it?

You're most likely pressing b too fast. Try waiting a bit more between the hits and they should come out. Then just practice getting the rhythm down.
You should use it when you are punishing a whiffed attack, when you are reading a roll or spot dodge, or to combo out of forward throw (although down throw is usually better for setting up combos). If you hit a shield with side b, either stop immediately or finish it with a downwards variation on the 4th hit.

 

[AJL]

Thanks for the help!

 

[teluoborg]

I notice that good players simply jump away after I d-throw them (not sure if this is mostly damage/character specific, but I've seen Ryu's jump away at low to mid range damage and I think he's considered a heavy fast faller). When I double jump and try to do an aerial, they have time to air dodge it. Is there any reliable way to hit them after they jump away from d-throw?

Try Uair after Dthrow, it's faster than Nair and Fair and is guaranteed until 60-90% depending on the character

Any useful ways for getting the timing for Roy's SideB? I usually get the first 1 or 2 hits then screw up the timing and get punished. Also, when should I be using it?

The timing for side B is to press B again the moment you hit the opponent with it. If it whiffs you just have to have the good rhythm.

Hey guys, I have trouble canceling sh fair with a jump/special and always get landing lag instead. What button inputs do you guys use to do this?

If I want to jump after Fair I use the jump button ????? iirc not counting buffering you have 3 frames between the end of Fair and landing, so the timing is rather strict.

 

[Sonicninja115]

Can Nair Jab lock? I was wondering if the first hit only could do it because of it's low KB.

 

[Rango the Mercenary]

What are Roy's primary combos? Sometimes I see DThrow into jab, but it's not always true.

 

[BurstPanther]

What are Roy's primary combos? Sometimes I see DThrow into jab, but it's not always true.

All approx.

Jab to Grab
D throw to Uair (Guaranteed 40%-90%)
D throw to Up B (Semi-Guaranteed 10%-80%)
F throw to Nair
F throw to Fair
F throw to Dash attack?
Nair to Nair?
Jab to Up tilt
Jab, Jab to Fsmash (low %?)

and so on and so on

 

[Rango the Mercenary]

All approx.

Jab to Grab
D throw to Uair (Guaranteed 40%-90%)
D throw to Up B (Semi-Guaranteed 10%-80%)
F throw to Nair
F throw to Fair
F throw to Dash attack?
Nair to Nair?
Jab to Up tilt
Jab, Jab to Fsmash (low %?)

and so on and so on

I can't get the FThrow combos to work, or jab to UTilt. > <

 

[BurstPanther]

I can't get the FThrow combos to work, or jab to UTilt. > <

I didn't expect anyone to go to hardcore on them, I was simply throwing out some strings. Jab to up tilt will only work at low percents and gotta be close.

Also the fthrow ones are possible, D throw is easier though. Roy's aren't really true combos. More like strings.

 

[Sonicninja115]

Jab-DED true combos, or at the very least is inescapable. Also, there was a Roy video released recently detailing a bunch of true combos in the background as they explained Roy.
It is the smash and grab Roy breakdown.