Social Swamp's Social Thread 3 - And now, the end is near, and so I face the final curtain...

[epicmartin7]

I'll honestly admit something. I'm not trying to get anyone's hopes at all, but I'm starting to think we'll get one final Third-Party character more iconic than Cloud. Mainly because it seems odd to me that they would reveal him first (although they could have just used him to hype up the upcoming Smash Presentation.)

I don't really know, we'll just have to wait and see I guess.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

Didn't the Japanese Fighter Ballot page say that some voted characters may get put in other roles?

 

[Starlight_Lily]

it's dependent on perspective
in the context of smash, halo is third party

He's owned directly by Microsoft, a console manufacturer, so he's 1st party, in terms of 3rd party its a character who isn't owned by Sony, Nintendo or Microsoft, so he can't can't be a 3rd party in terms of video-gaming.

 

[egaddmario]

So, because I only hop on during work and with the long weekend approaching, I thought I'd wish everyone a Happy Thanksgiving and long weekend! May your turkey be fat, your stuffing be tasty, and your potatoes be mashed! I'll catch up with you all on either Monday or Tuesday! Until then!

 

[Fenriraga]

Guys.





Literally every time I step away from my mail he hops into the basket.
This is like the 5th time.
What do you want from me, oh fluffy one.

 

[Deleted member]

Spazzy's Master Chief article made me want to ask this question:

Which first party Sony or Microsoft character(s) would you be interested in playing as in Smash (other than Banjo since I'm sure many of us here want him)?

Here's my personal top five in no particular order:

1. Master Chief - As of this post, I haven't played any of the Halo games (I do own a 360, but it's barely functional), but I do respect the series and recognize the fact that Chief is a gaming icon.
2. Nathan Drake - Another icon, but to a lesser extent than Chief. Unlike Halo, Uncharted is a series that I have played and enjoyed.
3. Jak - Probably not considered an icon, but I enjoyed most of his games and he could potentially have a fun moveset.
4. Ratchet - Most of what I said about Jak applies here. I've only played a few of his games, though.
5. Sackboy - I spent countless hours on LittleBigPlanet 1 and 2, and I think Sackboy could potentially have a creative moveset with the level creation tools from that series.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

I'll honestly admit something. I'm not trying to get anyone's hopes at all, but I'm starting to think we'll get one final Third-Party character more iconic than Cloud. Mainly because it seems odd to me that they would reveal him first (although they could have just used him to hype up the upcoming Smash Presentation.)

I don't really know, we'll just have to wait and see I guess.

Who's more iconic than the guy so iconic he defined the role and personality of the protagonist in an entire genre for the rest of time? Who's not already in the game that is.

 

[Substitution]

He's owned directly by Microsoft, a console manufacturer, so he's 1st party, in terms of 3rd party its a character who isn't owned by Sony, Nintendo or Microsoft, so he can't can't be a 3rd party in terms of video-gaming.

But we're not talking about Microsoft, we're talking about him in Smash. And unless Microsoft makes Smash Bros, then he's not a first-party.

 

[Deleted member]

Oh? E-Shope sales, uh?
Let's see
http://www.nintendo.com/games/detail/a0Mz5J6_kGJEFaGgmkF54u7tZ9OWkKmU
goddamnit Atlus, do you call this a "sale"? This is a standard 3DS price, wtf?
http://www.nintendo.com/games/detail/NHPsE8qy_d4vzz1hR3mLaKFXzeVwFm9l
10 bucks, now we're talking
Well, the first Untold game does have its problems but it's a good start point in the series
the classic portraits suck tho

 

[Luigi The President]

What? He isn't a 3rd party he's a 1st party Microsoft chraracter

He's a 3rd party in the context of the article so you are technically wrong.

3rd party in this definition here is "Not a Nintendo character".

 

[Z25]

What is this from?
Is that actually in a game or fanart?

http://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=358888
It's a hack of Fire Red where all the pokemon are fakemon. It's neat, as a lot of them are based on Nintendo characters.( mostly mario). Mercury and venus from golden sun are some of the others as well. There's over 250 pokemon in it!

 

[epicmartin7]

Who's more iconic than the guy so iconic he defined the role and personality of the protagonist in an entire genre for the rest of time? Who's not already in the game that is.

I think I've should have rephrased it lol. I meant not of iconic status, but hype status for Third-Party characters. My bad!

 

[Kenith]

I'll honestly admit something. I'm not trying to get anyone's hopes at all, but I'm starting to think we'll get one final Third-Party character more iconic than Cloud. Mainly because it seems odd to me that they would reveal him first (although they could have just used him to hype up the upcoming Smash Presentation.)

I don't really know, we'll just have to wait and see I guess.

I feel differently. I think Nintendo is using the hype from Cloud to keep people interested in the broadcast.
After all, Cloud was revealed at the end of presentation with no release window.

Afterwards, Sakurai mentioned he'd reveal more info about Cloud in the broadcast.
It definitely seems like they revealed Cloud because it would have brought a lot of hype, and because that hype would drive people to watch the broadcast in December.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

In Smash discussions...

1st Party means they character is wholy owned by Nintendo.
2nd party means the character is owned by a company that is itself wholly or partially owned by Nintendo
3rd Party are not owned by Nintendo in any way shape or form.
4th Party is an occasianal term for non-game characters

 

[KenboCalrissian]

So... I've seen some people predict that the most likely candidates we'll see are Inklings, Wolf and Shovel Knight.
Inkling and Wolf are self-explanatory as one is a very popular Nintendo character while the other is a missed veteran.

My question is, do people still have actual faith in the Shovel Knight rumor at all? In my opinion, all of this just seems like extreme bandwagoning to me.

I'm not looking for any more debates on the rumor nor criticizing other's opinion. I just want the clear truth from you guys on what you think. I've made a strawpoll for convenience sake, although I'd rather have someone explain themselves in the thread directly as It'd give some more insight on the matter and overall general opinions on it.

Spoiler

If it sounds like I'm against the rumor by the tone of this post, I'm not. I'm more in the wait and see approach. The presentation is almost here, so we'll see by then.

I'm with you and Kenith on the wait-and-see approach (and I'm only continuing to hold out because @PushDustIn, who does not want him in the game, still seems to believe it's happening more than I do).

As it stands, we as a group have not seen a whole lot of the evidence shared with the upper-echelons (when and why and how this happened is a bit frustrating, but whatever). Personal bias wanting him in keeps me clinging, but if I'm being brutally honest with myself, I have not seen enough to be convinced that it's really happening. That he's getting an amiibo is startling, to be sure; That he's the only third-party at present getting one, and at the same time someone like Shantae, who holds similar status, shows no signs of getting one any time soon, is also suspicious - but I can't help but feel like this line of thinking is straw-grasping. There's not enough to hold onto, so realistically I can only hope.

As far as outlandish theories go...

Spoiler

The part everybody knocks against Shovel Knight is his leak passed its deadline... but in my opinion, the sudden inclusion of a rock-star like freaking Cloud handily explains away that discrepancy. There are a few reasons why timelines can change; Giving Square the lion's share of the holiday hype qualifies as a big one.

That said, that would only buy a supposedly-complete character like Shovel Knight another month or two - so in my eyes, the December announcement is SK's drop-dead date.

 

[Starlight_Lily]

He's a 3rd party in the context of the article so you are technically wrong.

3rd party in this definition here is "Not a Nintendo character".

You know for what was meant to be a joke, people really are taking it to serious

 

[Luigi The President]

You know for what was meant to be a joke, people really are taking it to serious

You in literally no way made it clear at all you were joking. You said you were just nitpicking.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I feel differently. I think Nintendo is using the hype from Cloud to keep people interested in the broadcast.
After all, Cloud was revealed at the end of presentation with no release window.

Afterwards, Sakurai mentioned he'd reveal more info about Cloud in the broadcast.
It definitely seems like they revealed Cloud because it would have brought a lot of hype, and because that hype would drive people to watch the broadcast in December.

Indeed. Cloud is the biggie. They won't outdo him.

 

[cmbsfm]

Get Revengeance, it's a fraction of MGSV's price for a game that MGSV is only a fraction as good as.

Holy **** those are some good deals. If load up 60 bucks onto steam I could get both and have some money to spare for other games.

 

[Dravidian]

I think he means first party to microsoft.... Which would be true, but he's definitely third party to smash.

Yeah , but imo it's still ridiculous considering the context people were using. I mean technically every character is a 1st party to some company in some sense:

• Shovel Knight: 1st party YCG
• Shantae: 1st party Way Forward
• Commander Video: 1st party Gaijin Games

But people generally use 1st and 3rd party in the context whatever console happens to be the current topic, which in this case is a Nintendo console.

 

[KenboCalrissian]

I feel differently. I think Nintendo is using the hype from Cloud to keep people interested in the broadcast.
After all, Cloud was revealed at the end of presentation with no release window.

Afterwards, Sakurai mentioned he'd reveal more info about Cloud in the broadcast.
It definitely seems like they revealed Cloud because it would have brought a lot of hype, and because that hype would drive people to watch the broadcast in December.

Oh, for sure - Cloud is this season's bread-winner. The only character who could possibly outdo him is someone even farther out of left-field, which leaves us precisely Goku.

 

[SegaNintendoUbisoft]

In regards of Sega's comment on Sonic playing like in his heyday. While I do agree with everyone that they should show and not tell, I'm actually have a bit of hope for their next game. I'm on the side of the fanbase that liked Lost World and I'm interested to see what the A-Team has been doing since Generations.

Hey guys, I'll keep this brief since I should just be packing my stuff.

It's just a lot of trouble at home that's been going on for years, it's hit a breaking point many times before but now it's worse than it's ever been and none of my family want to take me in this time. Don't worry about me being on the streets or anything though, they've been telling me they'll call my dad and I'm sure he'll hunt me down. I'm more worried about that, though.

I probably won't be around here anymore though, since I won't have internet no matter where I go. I don't know how the news got all the way in here, but thank you all so much.

Good luck, dude. All of us will miss you.

 

[Deleted member]

Yeah , but imo it's still ridiculous considering the context people were using. I mean technically every character is a 1st party to some company in some sense:

• Shovel Knight: 1st party YCG
• Shantae: 1st party Way Forward
• Commander Video: 1st party Gaijin Games

But people generally use 1st and 3rd party in the context whatever console happens to be the current topic, which in this case is a Nintendo console.

Yes, I'm more than aware of that. I was just stating that that's the context he was using first party in.

 

[Starlight_Lily]

You in literally no way made it clear at all you were joking. You said you were just nitpicking.

Look and be amazed:

I know this is really nitpicky but I have do to it.

Master Chief isn't 3rd party, he's a 1st party.

And with that, my silly nitpick is done.

See the silly bit at the bottom, see, a silly nitpick

 

[LIQUID12A]

So... I've seen some people predict that the most likely candidates we'll see are Inklings, Wolf and Shovel Knight.
Inkling and Wolf are self-explanatory as one is a very popular Nintendo character while the other is a missed veteran.

My question is, do people still have actual faith in the Shovel Knight rumor at all? In my opinion, all of this just seems like extreme bandwagoning to me.

I agree on the wait-and-see approach but believe that the rumor is dead or at best outdated and that SK will be a Mii costume.

 

[Dravidian]

Oh, for sure - Cloud is this season's bread-winner. The only character who could possibly outdo him is someone even farther out of left-field, which leaves us precisely Goku.

In before the smash direct starts with cha-la head cha-la

Honestly, as I'm pretty sure I've stated in the past, the first animated character I'd expect is Mickey Mouse. I legit couldnt be mad if he appeared. That said I think they'd go with Steam Boat Willy Mickey. but his final smash would be either the Sorcerer's Apprentice Mickey or King Mickey......preferrablly the former, but King Mickey would still be sick.

I'd legit starts to question the roster choice if Goku got in, but I'd get over it as soon as I turn super saiyan god super saiyan super saiyan blue. But seriously, if Goku got in I'm sure they'd give him multiple transformations (with long start up and no skipping forms) that require certain levels of damage to use.

 

[Luigi The President]

Look and be amazed:



See the silly bit at the bottom, see, a silly nitpick

Silly nitpcik can be taken in quite a bit of was. You could've been insulting your own nitpick for all we know. But what's done is done.

 

[Dravidian]

Look and be amazed:



See the silly bit at the bottom, see, a silly nitpick

And we have no idea if that was sarcasm or just a filler word. Even if you were joking, people cant hear your context. A smiley would work significantly better.

 

[Z25]

I really doubt that Cloud was used to advertise this smash broadcast. They don't need any advertisement. It's freaking Smash Bros, the game sells itself. We could have gotten anyone, literally anyone instead of Cloud and tacking the announcement of it on at the end of their trailer would have already generated the same amount of hype, if not more( if it was an alright character or expected character like wolf). They could have just tweeted the broadcast's announcement and it would have become massively known. I think we are really over estimating the use of Cloud. I think he's going to sort of just be there in the direct, we will get another hugely popular 3rd party and some amazing 1st party newcomer.

Now as for the discussion of who you'd want as another big name sony rep, I've already said this but...

CRASH BANDICOOT! He is one of gaming's biggest icons and was leading the pack for awhile. It would be a geat way to reflect on the rivarly while adding a totally unique character at the same time. Plus if Sony is reviving Crash, then bam instant advertisement right there! " Want to prepare for the new Crash Bandicoot game? Buy him as DLC in Smash bros and support us and NIntendo! "

Also Spyro would be good. While not as massive, he still has a name in gaming today and was a pretty big 3rd party in the past, plus Sakurai could troll us and be like: " I head you wanted a purple dragon!" Probably wouldn't happen but be pretty funny. Spyro could be a good unique fighter to, a balance between land and air fighter.

And if we re going with the theme that they don't need to be on Nintendo Console, I'd choose sackboy as well. His cute style could fit nicely in smash. LBP has evolved into a huge name series, and they could do a lot of cool and unique elements for a Sackboy moveset that no one else could do.

 

[Kenith]

Okay, here's my theory: Shovel Knight was added as a replacement for a more iconic 3rd party who Nintendo didn't get the rights to.
Let me explain via timeline:

- December 2014: Nintendo decided the DLC plans for Super Smash Bros. Roy and Lucas were chosen. They decided on three third-parties, Cloud Strife, Ryu, and one other.
Capcom was already working with Nintendo on Smash Bros., so they started developing Ryu first.

- May 2015 - Pre-emptive files for Ryu and Roy were added to the game along with placeholder files for the other third-parties, and found by dataminers.

- June 2015 - Ryu, Roy, and Lucas finished development and were released mid-June. Cloud now started development. However, the last third-party couldn't be obtained, so Nintendo looked for a replacement.

- June 2015 - Nintendo looked at social media and the recently opened Fighter Ballot and saw demand for Shovel Knight. Since the game was a recent hit and was getting exclusive content on Nintendo, including amiibo compatibility, Sakurai approached Yacht Club Games, his creators, for permission to use the character.

Due to YCG being amicable with the use of Shovel Knight IP, being friendly with Nintendo, AND a small indie dev, they agreed to him instantly. Shovel Knight started development alongside Cloud.

- August 2015 - Inklings were selected to be DLC for Smash Bros. due to their immense popularity. Development begins.
Shovel Knight is leaked.

- September 2015 - Inklings placeholder file is added to Smash Bros.'s internal file, however none of the files are named due to the datamining of Ryu and Roy.

- November 2015 - Cloud is officially revealed.
With the bulk of DLC finished, Wolf starts development.

- December 2015 - Cloud and Shovel Knight are released.

- 2016 - Inklings and Wolf are released in the final patch of the game.

FYI, the replaced 3rd party I have in mind is Solid Snake. He would have been decided in December or January due to his popularity and status, but after the controversies surrounding Konami in 2015, including the rumoured departure of Hideo Kojima (Snake's creator) from the company, Nintendo decided not to get involved and choose someone else.

The only thing this theory doesn't address is why Nintendo didn't simply choose one of their own characters. What could have happened is, they looked at ALL the Ballot results, and of all the most voted, Shovel Knight was chosen due to Sakurai seeing value in adding an "indie" rep and due to his potential as a fighter.

This all seems crazy, but that's just a theory.
A Game Theory! Thanks for reading!

 

[epicmartin7]

Oh, for sure - Cloud is this season's bread-winner. The only character who could possibly outdo him is someone even farther out of left-field, which leaves us precisely Goku.

Well... wouldn't technically Banjo & Kazooie, Spyro and/or Crash be technically out of left field. It's up to debate and our opinions really, but these characters would seem to be ones you wouldn't expect due to certain factors.

Okay, here's my theory: Shovel Knight was added as a replacement for a more iconic 3rd party who Nintendo didn't get the rights to.
Let me explain via timeline:

- December 2014: Nintendo decided the DLC plans for Super Smash Bros. Roy and Lucas were chosen. They decided on three third-parties, Cloud Strife, Ryu, and one other.
Capcom was already working with Nintendo on Smash Bros., so they started developing Ryu first.

- May 2015 - Pre-emptive files for Ryu and Roy were added to the game along with placeholder files for the other third-parties, and found by dataminers.

- June 2015 - Ryu, Roy, and Lucas finished development and were released mid-June. Cloud now started development. However, the last third-party couldn't be obtained, so Nintendo looked for a replacement.

- June 2015 - Nintendo looked at social media and the recently opened Fighter Ballot and saw demand for Shovel Knight. Since the game was a recent hit and was getting exclusive content on Nintendo, including amiibo compatibility, Sakurai approached Yacht Club Games, his creators, for permission to use the character.

Due to YCG being amicable with the use of Shovel Knight IP, being friendly with Nintendo, AND a small indie dev, they agreed to him instantly. Shovel Knight started development alongside Cloud.

- August 2015 - Inklings were selected to be DLC for Smash Bros. due to their immense popularity. Development begins.
Shovel Knight is leaked.

- September 2015 - Inklings placeholder file is added to Smash Bros.'s internal file, however none of the files are named due to the datamining of Ryu and Roy.

- November 2015 - Cloud is officially revealed.
With the bulk of DLC finished, Wolf starts development.

- December 2015 - Cloud and Shovel Knight are released.

- 2016 - Inklings and Wolf are released in the final patch of the game.

FYI, the replaced 3rd party I have in mind is Solid Snake. He would have been decided in December or January due to his popularity and status, but after the controversies surrounding Konami in 2015, including the rumoured departure of Hideo Kojima (Snake's creator) from the company, Nintendo decided not to get involved and choose someone else.

The only thing this theory doesn't address is why Nintendo didn't simply choose one of their own characters. What could have happened is, they looked at ALL the Ballot results, and of all the most voted, Shovel Knight was chosen due to Sakurai seeing value in adding an "indie" rep and due to his potential as a fighter.

This all seems crazy, but that's just a theory.
A Game---aww nevermind.

Pretty good theory! We'll really have to see what happens though, but it does make sense nonetheless!

 

[Luigi The President]

Okay, here's my theory: Shovel Knight was added as a replacement for a more iconic 3rd party who Nintendo didn't get the rights to.
Let me explain via timeline:

- December 2014: Nintendo decided the DLC plans for Super Smash Bros. Roy and Lucas were chosen. They decided on three third-parties, Cloud Strife, Ryu, and one other.
Capcom was already working with Nintendo on Smash Bros., so they started developing Ryu first.

- May 2015 - Pre-emptive files for Ryu and Roy were added to the game along with placeholder files for the other third-parties, and found by dataminers.

- June 2015 - Ryu, Roy, and Lucas finished development and were released mid-June. Cloud now started development. However, the last third-party couldn't be obtained, so Nintendo looked for a replacement.

- June 2015 - Nintendo looked at social media and the recently opened Fighter Ballot and saw demand for Shovel Knight. Since the game was a recent hit and was getting exclusive content on Nintendo, including amiibo compatibility, Sakurai approached Yacht Club Games, his creators, for permission to use the character.

Due to YCG being amicable with the use of Shovel Knight IP, being friendly with Nintendo, AND a small indie dev, they agreed to him instantly. Shovel Knight started development alongside Cloud.

- August 2015 - Inklings were selected to be DLC for Smash Bros. due to their immense popularity. Development begins.
Shovel Knight is leaked.

- September 2015 - Inklings placeholder file is added to Smash Bros.'s internal file, however none of the files are named due to the datamining of Ryu and Roy.

- November 2015 - Cloud is officially revealed.
With the bulk of DLC finished, Wolf starts development.

- December 2015 - Cloud and Shovel Knight are released.

- 2016 - Inklings and Wolf are released in the final patch of the game.

FYI, the replaced 3rd party I have in mind is Solid Snake. He would have been decided in December or January due to his popularity and status, but after the controversies surrounding Konami in 2015, including the rumoured departure of Hideo Kojima (Snake's creator) from the company, Nintendo decided not to get involved and choose someone else.

The only thing this theory doesn't address is why Nintendo didn't simply choose one of their own characters. What could have happened is, they looked at ALL the Ballot results, and of all the most voted, Shovel Knight was chosen due to Sakurai seeing value in adding an "indie" rep and due to his potential as a fighter.

This all seems crazy, but that's just a theory.
A Game---aww nevermind.

The thing is, even if a 3rd party is removed, we don't need someone to replace them. That's never been said. And nothing says a 1st party can't replace them.

And also, you say SK was leaked, and I'm assuming that means Nintendo would react to it; Nintendo has never reacted to a leak except the ESRB leak which was actual, real, gameplay footage. Shovel Knight was a dismissable text leak that Nintendo did not need to address.

There are also more fighters with more social media attention then Shovel Knight. K. Rool, for one. Isaac, too. So why would he choose Shovel Knight based on social media and Ballot popularity instead of K. Rool?

And I'm pretty sure Shantae is really likely very close to SK in the running for the Ballot; If Sakurai wanted a valuable indie rep, he'd most likely chose Shantae. She could replace a 3rd party just as well as Shovel Knight could.

I can tell you put a lot of thought into this theory, I just cannot see it being real. But it's by no means a bad theory.

 

[Kenith]

The thing is, even if a 3rd party is removed, we don't need someone to replace them. That's never been said. And nothing says a 1st party can't replace them.

That's a good point...except I addressed it already.

And also, you say SK was leaked, and I'm assuming that means Nintendo would react to it; Nintendo has never reacted to a leak except the ESRB leak which was actual, real, gameplay footage. Shovel Knight was a dismissable text leak that Nintendo did not need to address.

When did I say Nintendo reacted to it anywhere?

There are also more fighters with more social media attention then Shovel Knight. K. Rool, for one. Isaac, too. So why would he choose Shovel Knight based on social media and Ballot popularity instead of K. Rool?

Because Shovel Knight got more media attention in the two months after the Ballot opened than anyone else.
There was a huge push for Shovel Knight right after the ballot opened.

Even popular YouTubers got in on the fun.

And I'm pretty sure Shantae is really likely very close to SK in the running for the Ballot; If Sakurai wanted a valuable indie rep, he'd most likely chose Shantae. She could replace a 3rd party just as well as Shovel Knight could.

Shantae has nowhere near the amount of notoriety Shovel Knight does right now.

 

[Fenriraga]

We have literally 2 arguments going on that have been done here time and time again.

This thread is like a frog with short term memory loss. It falls into a pit and breaks its legs, and even if it gets out, it can't jump over and it'll just fall right back in anyway.

 

[MasterofMonster]

So, how about this.

The final Third Party character is... Jibanyan.

Opinions? XD

 

[BandanaWaddleDee]

So, how about this.

The final Third Party character is... Jibanyan.

Opinions? XD

That'd be awesome. So much better than most of the garbage third parties like Shantae or Shovel Knight

 

[Kenith]

We have literally 2 arguments going on that have been done here time and time again.

This thread is like a frog with short term memory loss. It falls into a pit, and breaks its legs, and even if it gets out, it can't jump over and it'll just fall right back in anyway.

I shared my theory at your request.
If you're going to lament the fact an argument over it is happening, which was bound to happen because Shovel Knight, then I have no idea what to say.

 

[Z25]

So, how about this.

The final Third Party character is... Jibanyan.

Opinions? XD

Eh alright, wouldn't get me hyped but I'd understand the decision, and be happy for his supporters.

 

[MasterofMonster]

That'd be awesome. So much better than most of the garbage third parties like Shantae or Shovel Knight

Aw, I don't care much for Shantae, but don't hate on Shovel Knight. D: He is a knight. With a shovel. Automatically awesome!

But yes, Jibanyan would be pretty sweet. I like him now that I have started the anime. I'd be fine with him in, at this point.

Z25
That is a good state of mind. ^^

 

[LIQUID12A]

So, how about this.

The final Third Party character is... Jibanyan.

Opinions? XD

First character I would outright not buy.