Social Swamp's Social Thread 3 - And now, the end is near, and so I face the final curtain...

[Das Koopa]

Master Chief does have one vital factor in his favor that a lot of FPS characters don't have, an arsenal with a lot of lasers.

I still think Banjo would make it before he did though. Banjo is the icon of the 90's 3D platformer that Mario pioneered before slinking back to the linear power-up based thing of the old games.

Yeah, that's the thing- Sakurai had been adamant in Brawl over "No Guns" even though it was rated T, but Chief could easily make it in since his weapons and design are futuristic. Trophies (COUGHCORTANACOUGH) are probably where it'd get iffy.

 

[Chrono.]

So what date do we expect the Smash Broadcast to be?

Any guesses?

December 1st because I'm a greedy ****.

In all seriousness, before Christmas, like, around the 10th-20th mark.

 

[Strofirko]

Did someone bothered to search what happened with minecraft U?

 

[Guybrush20X6]

So what date do we expect the Smash Broadcast to be?

Any guesses?

December 1st is a Tuesday.... So I'm guessing anywhere between the 3rd and the 24th.

 

[Con0rrrr]

I realized something overnight.

I was contemplating why, of all characters, Cloud is now in Smash. I've been running through FF7 with Max Stats on my iPhone to relive the story.

And I realized this

Cloud is relevant to Smash, and Nintendo as a whole, in the same way Sonic is. It was a strike against Nintendo, but it made them who they are today.

FFVII was the first time a big RPG (in this case, the most popular RPG of all time) was not on Nintendo's console. It was a huge blow for them. But it was important. And that's why he, and Sonic are in Smash.

 

[Naoshi]

I'd rather our second SE rep being Dragon Quest. Perhaps the DQ8 guy? He's well known worldwide, moreso than Roto due to the familiarity of DQ8 in the west. Finally that damn game is getting localized for the 3DS lol

Then again Roto is the face of DQ I think


DQ pretty much made what JRPGs are today, it's the granddaddy of them, even predating Final Fantasy. Only few Traditional RPGs existed before DQ like Ultima I think

 

[Guybrush20X6]

I realized something overnight.

I was contemplating why, of all characters, Cloud is now in Smash. I've been running through FF7 with Max Stats on my iPhone to relive the story.

And I realized this

Cloud is relevant to Smash, and Nintendo as a whole, in the same way Sonic is. It was a strike against Nintendo, but it made them who they are today.

FFVII was the first time a big RPG (in this case, the most popular RPG of all time) was not on Nintendo's console. It was a huge blow for them. But it was important. And that's why he, and Sonic are in Smash.

So we got all the major players of the 5th Generation of Consoles.

 

[Deleted member]

Wait, are we seriously considering Master Chief now? Guys, there is a limit for everything inb4 Limit Break and Smash's is when you consider their rival company's mascot


Also, this is an interesting amd good analysis on the video

Basically, Cloud found his faker and now wants revenge

 

[Nirbion]

Quick question here since I like this place AND I COMPLETELY lost orientation thanks to the huge Direct-Hype:
Does anybody have a big-sized transparent Cloud-Artwork? I couldn't find anything and the NoE PressServer is only giving me the Cloud-Artwork with Green Backround. If not, then I need to cut out the green Background, yay...

 

[Naoshi]

So we got all the major players of the 5th Generation of Consoles.

We're just missing Banjo at this point.

 

[Con0rrrr]

The Game Awards just announced their GOTY nominees.

Full list of nominees: http://thegameawards.com/nominees/

Also lol MKX wins by default probably. (not complaining tho)

If you want proof that the fan vote is paid for by bigger companies. Look at most anticipated game.

4/5 of those games are PS4 Console Exclusive. No Overwatch. No Division. No Zelda U. No Recore.

Pretty obvious Sony paid to get the "'Most Anticipated Game of 2015" title.

 

[Kenith]

I'd rather our second SE rep being Dragon Quest. Perhaps the DQ8 guy? He's well known worldwide, moreso than Roto due to the familiarity of DQ8 in the west. Finally that damn game is getting localized for the 3DS lol

Then again Roto is the face of DQ I think


DQ pretty much made what JRPGs are today, it's the granddaddy of them, even predating Final Fantasy. Only few Traditional RPGs existed before DQ like Ultima I think

See, that's the problem. There's no clear, iconic character from Dragon Quest...at least that's feasible. (I don't really see Slime as a good fit for a DQ rep)
Even some non-gamers can recognize Cloud Strife and Final Fantasy.

Plus, IMO, it would rub me the wrong way if, between Tomb Raider and Dragon Quest...they choose another SE owned RPG protagonist. It would seem like a huge missed opportunity.
Since Enix has its own history it would be better to have a DQ rep in addition to the former, if anything.

 

[Spazzy_D]

Some impressions:

FFVII is one of the most well known JRPGs of all time, and an argument could probably be made in service of Cloud being the "face" of JRPGs in the same way that Ryu is the "face" of Fighting Games and Pac-Man is the "face" of Arcade games (or video gaming as a medium, even.)

I don't think Cloud breaks any "rules". He's just a little bit distanced from Pac-Man in terms of importance to Nintendo consoles, i.e, he has none. It's not a big deal to me personally, because a ton of gamers grew up with FFVII and FF as a franchise does have links with Nintendo consoles. Final Fantasy III/VI's popularity may have led a lot of Nintendo fans to grab a PS1 specifically to play FFVII - so I don't think Cloud is in any way too distanced from the Nintendo fandom.

So I don't think this makes something totally outlandish like, say, Master Chief very plausible. As one of the very few consistent single-faces of an FPS franchise, I could see an argument where he's the "Face" of FPSs, and he conveniently uses a ton of plasma and lasers, but Halo doesn't really have much overlap with the Nintendo fandom.

Then again, Snake didn't really have any either, but Metal Gear as a franchise is whacky enough until V that Snake still kinda fit with the cast in Brawl. I used to believe otherwise, but watching some playthroughs of the early games again made me realize... yeah, Snake fit pretty well.

We should probably make a list of third party characters and just adequately consider their merits at this point

Final Fantasy 1 on the NES/Famicom literally saved Square Soft.... If that game hadn't succeeded the company would have gone under. Square (and Enix) had some of the top selling and highest rated games on the SNES, and SE still has a very wtrong presense on Nintendo handhelds. Square, unlike Konami and Capcom, remained a Nintendo exclusive publisher during the 16 bit era.

Huge history between FF and Nintendo.

 

[Con0rrrr]

Wait, are we seriously considering Master Chief now? Guys, there is a limit for everything inb4 Limit Break and Smash's is when you consider their rival company's mascot


Also, this is an interesting amd good analysis on the video

Basically, Cloud found his faker and now wants revenge

Honestly, I can see the argumemt.

Cloud is in the game.

That's all I need to hear to know that Master Chief could have a chance way down the line (Not this Smash, and not the next one, but maybe the one after).

 

[A Distant Demon]

I just realized this is the second fan rule in a row to be broken by a 3rd party.
Ryu-no fighting game characters
Cloud- must appear on a nintendo console (even if he has, the misquote has come to light)

Hell we could throw "must be from a company that already has representation" and "no more than 1 per company" in there too.

What a time to be a smash fan.

 

[Kenith]

I honestly kinda want to see how Master Chief would play in Smash lol.
Contemplating adding Microsoft representation to my collage, but I wanted to stick with companies that have representation already. (except Konami)

 

[Chrono.]

Can I just say? I really hope none of the third parties get cut the next game lol

 

[FalKoopa]

Quick question here since I like this place AND I COMPLETELY lost orientation thanks to the huge Direct-Hype:
Does anybody have a big-sized transparent Cloud-Artwork? I couldn't find anything and the NoE PressServer is only giving me the Cloud-Artwork with Green Backround. If not, then I need to cut out the green Background, yay...

Spoiler

Here you go. Credit to @Warchamp7

 

[Naoshi]

See, that's the problem. There's no clear, iconic character from Dragon Quest...at least that's feasible. (I don't really see Slime as a good fit for a DQ rep)
Even some non-gamers can recognize Cloud Strife and Final Fantasy.

Plus, IMO, it would rub me the wrong way if, between Tomb Raider and Dragon Quest...they choose another SE owned RPG protagonist. It would seem like a huge missed opportunity.
Since Enix has its own history it would be better to have a DQ rep in addition to the former, if anything.

Roto is an iconic gaming character for Japan at least.

DQ is as big as Pokemon over there. Even to the point that they had to ban the DQ games from releasing at a certain day due to mass people skipping school just to play the latest DQ game.

 

[Frostwraith]

I think fans are more fickle with the whole console wars stuff than the companies themselves.

Cloud being in Smash had to be the result of a deal between Nintendo (publisher and copyright owner of the Smash Bros. series) and Square Enix (copyright owner of Cloud and the Final Fantasy series).

Did SquareSoft shift the development of Final Fantasy main titles since the N64/PS1 era? Sure, they did. They did it because they wanted to deliver a game that matched their vision for the game and the N64's specs didn't allow for it. Was it kinda stabbing in Nintendo's back? Sure, it was, but business is business.

As FF7 went to be a successful entry of the series, it makes sense that a lot of the PS crowd became the primary audience of the series' main titles.

Nowadays, Square Enix produces games for both Sony and Nintendo consoles. Some of Square Enix's important IPs are exclusive to Nintendo such as the Bravely series, which is pretty much classic FF in many ways and obviously caters to the FF fans that played the earlier titles on the NES and SNES.

Series such as Dragon Quest and Kingdom Hearts have presence on both Nintendo and Sony consoles.

There are also plenty of Final Fantasy spin-off titles and remakes/re-releases of the NES and SNES titles on Nintendo consoles, so it's not like the series left Nintendo consoles completely.

I'd say that Final Fantasy has as much ties with Nintendo as it does with Sony, though in different ways. Perhaps it can be argued that Cloud isn't the ideal character for a Nintendo-centric crossover and that another character, mainly from the NES/SNES titles, could've been picked instead. There are good choices such as Black Mage or Terra.

It's something I can agree on, but Cloud is possibly the most popular FF character, so him being chosen to represent the series as a whole isn't too far fetched, so it's a choice that has some merit in regards to standing next to characters such as Sonic, Pac-Man or Ryu.

Cloud, as an individual character, has about as much ties with Nintendo as Snake does, so they're both similar in that regard. However, there is one big difference between Cloud and Snake: the series Cloud comes from has far more ties with Nintendo than the MGS series does, so it can be argued Cloud has more merits to be in Smash than Snake does based on this principle.

To be honest, I think it's clear that Smash Bros. is more and more accepting of third party characters than before. I think it's a natural evolution for the series in order to keep it fresh and interesting. It's not just about Nintendo exclusively anymore, but also focusing a little bit on gaming as a whole. Of course, it is still going to be primarily Nintendo, as the grand majority of the content is still based on Nintendo franchises.

That makes sense: Smash Bros. is owned by Nintendo and it's always marketed and advertised as a Nintendo crossover. That's the primary draw of the series and something that will never change. I don't believe the series will be losing that focus anytime soon.

At 5 guest characters out of a 56-character roster, it's clear that third parties are still a minority. 5 out of 56 is 8.9% of the roster. It's not even a tenth of the total number of characters. Adding to that, there are only 5 third party series with content in Smash out of dozens Nintendo series.

Smash isn't losing its focus at all, but it is evolving, as every series does. The inclusion of third party characters is simply a part of that evolution. The Smash series still stays true to its roots all in all.

 

[Strofirko]

Can I just say? I really hope none of the third parties get cut the next game lol

I have bad news...

 

[Wario Bros.]

I just realized this is the second fan rule in a row to be broken by a 3rd party.
Ryu-no fighting game characters
Cloud- must appear on a nintendo console (even if he has the misquote has come to light)

Hell we could throw "must be from a company that already has representation" and "no more than 1 per company" in there too.

What a time to be a smash fan.

Cloud has appeared in a number of games on Nintendo platforms. However, most aren't worth noting unlike Sony platforms.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Getting the biggest icons in gaming including Master Chief would be incredible, more so than Mario vs. Sonic vs. Pac-Man vs. Mega Man.

 

[Solfiner]

So the X preload stuff is seemingly not available in Europe. :/

I mean, it's not too big of a deal but I don't feel like having to download 10 gigs on release day.

 

[Naoshi]

I just realized this is the second fan rule in a row to be broken by a 3rd party.
Ryu-no fighting game characters
Cloud- must appear on a nintendo console (even if he has the misquote has come to light)

Hell we could throw "must be from a company that already has representation" and "no more than 1 per company" in there too.

What a time to be a smash fan.

We just explained this over and over but Cloud has already appeared on Nintendo consoles for a long time!

 

[Soul.]

I still can't believe fan rules are being destroyed lol. It's kinda funny honestly.

With 56 characters as of now, Smash 4 is pulling an MvC2 haha.

 

[Solfiner]

On a brighter note, new X trailer from the German channel of all things:

I really like the voice cast.

 

[Wario Bros.]

I still can't believe fan rules are being destroyed lol. It's kinda funny honestly.

With 56 characters as of now, Smash 4 is pulling an MvC2 haha.

Still needs to beat Tobal 2: With a whopping 200 characters (which was made by Square funny enough)

 

[Strofirko]

I know is just a debate,but this "we need every genre represented on smash so let's get master chief just because" is LMAO.

Lets attempt Nathan Drake,Kratos and Marcus Phenix too.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Cloud has appeared in a number of games on Nintendo platforms. However, most aren't worth noting unlike Sony platforms.

We just explained this over and over but Cloud has already appeared on Nintendo consoles for a long time!

I said that already.

(even if he has, the misquote has come to light)

I've played REcoded and specifically loved the Olympus part.

But now with Cloud the quote that it's only a show of good faith and not a rule it's another fan rule gone.

EX Master Chief jokes.

 

[Soul.]

Still needs to beat Tobal 2: With a whopping 200 characters (which was made by Square funny enough)

M.U.G.E.N though. I don't think Smash can reach an infinite roster.

 

[Chrono.]

>They actually tell you who the voice actors are

Game of the Decade right here.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

I think the 3rd party characters should be really popular in all regions, all of them have been so far. Characters like Master Chief, Lara Croft, Scorpion and Rayman can't claim to be really popular in Japan.

 

[FalKoopa]

I think fans are more fickle with the whole console wars stuff than the companies themselves.

Cloud being in Smash had to be the result of a deal between Nintendo (publisher and copyright owner of the Smash Bros. series) and Square Enix (copyright owner of Cloud and the Final Fantasy series).

Did SquareSoft shift the development of Final Fantasy main titles since the N64/PS1 era? Sure, they did. They did it because they wanted to deliver a game that matched their vision for the game and the N64's specs didn't allow for it. Was it kinda stabbing in Nintendo's back? Sure, it was, but business is business.

As FF7 went to be a successful entry of the series, it makes sense that a lot of the PS crowd became the primary audience of the series' main titles.

Nowadays, Square Enix produces games for both Sony and Nintendo consoles. Some of Square Enix's important IPs are exclusive to Nintendo such as the Bravely series, which is pretty much classic FF in many ways and obviously caters to the FF fans that played the earlier titles on the NES and SNES.

Series such as Dragon Quest and Kingdom Hearts have presence on both Nintendo and Sony consoles.

There are also plenty of Final Fantasy spin-off titles and remakes/re-releases of the NES and SNES titles on Nintendo consoles, so it's not like the series left Nintendo consoles completely.

I'd say that Final Fantasy has as much ties with Nintendo as it does with Sony, though in different ways. Perhaps it can be argued that Cloud isn't the ideal character for a Nintendo-centric crossover and that another character, mainly from the NES/SNES titles, could've been picked instead. There are good choices such as Black Mage or Terra.

It's something I can agree on, but Cloud is possibly the most popular FF character, so him being chosen to represent the series as a whole isn't too far fetched, so it's a choice that has some merit in regards to standing next to characters such as Sonic, Pac-Man or Ryu.

Cloud, as an individual character, has about as much ties with Nintendo as Snake does, so they're both similar in that regard. However, there is one big difference between Cloud and Snake: the series Cloud comes from has far more ties with Nintendo than the MGS series does, so it can be argued Cloud has more merits to be in Smash than Snake does based on this principle.

To be honest, I think it's clear that Smash Bros. is more and more accepting of third party characters than before. I think it's a natural evolution for the series in order to keep it fresh and interesting. It's not just about Nintendo exclusively anymore, but also focusing a little bit on gaming as a whole. Of course, it is still going to be primarily Nintendo, as the grand majority of the content is still based on Nintendo franchises.

That makes sense: Smash Bros. is owned by Nintendo and it's always marketed and advertised as a Nintendo crossover. That's the primary draw of the series and something that will never change. I don't believe the series will be losing that focus anytime soon.

At 5 guest characters out of a 56-character roster, it's clear that third parties are still a minority. 5 out of 56 is 8.9% of the roster. It's not even a tenth of the total number of characters. Adding to that, there are only 5 third party series with content in Smash out of dozens Nintendo series.

Smash isn't losing its focus at all, but it is evolving, as every series does. The inclusion of third party characters is simply a part of that evolution. The Smash series still stays true to its roots all in all.

Cloud is kind of Sonic 2.0. A series that has mostly been on rival consoles is revealed and the news is pretty much earth-shattering.

Cloud himself has had little to no appearances on Nintendo consoles, so if you go by precedent set by the 3rd parties before him, he doesn't fit into the mould. I think his inclusion is proof that raw popularity is more important than following the precedent set by previous newcomers.

 

[DoodleDuck97]

Really warming up to Cloud being here
Not that I was ever against him in the past.
But here's two more Tracks I would love to see get into smash, Aside from Final Fantasy Iv Battle 2 music.
Fintal Fantasy X Battle theme.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C34BzC7rnos
Final Fantasy XIII Battle theme.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39Cg92jbc88

 

[Kenith]

Roto is an iconic gaming character for Japan at least.

DQ is as big as Pokemon over there. Even to the point that they had to ban the DQ games from releasing at a certain day due to mass people skipping school just to play the latest DQ game.

I know it's really big in Japan, but it isn't nearly as big here...and I have actually never heard of or seen Roto before.
Looking at sales, Dragon Quest has outsold Tomb Raider by about 30 million...
...But that's probably because it's been around longer and has always remained as a game series...whereas Tomb Raider has expanded way beyond games (it has movies) the main character's name bears a lot of weight behind it...and that last bit was a pretty important factor in my decision.

Overall...I just see more value in getting THE female adventure gaming hero into Smash alongside having the face of JRPGs already, if it even happened.

Neither will probably ever happen, though.

I know is just a debate,but this "we need every genre represented on smash so let's get master chief just because" is LMAO.

Lets attempt Nathan Drake,Kratos and Marcus Phenix too.

I'd genuinely enjoy having Nathan Drake.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

I wonder what the icon will be, the Meteor from Final Fantasy 7's logo or a more generic FF one?

 

[TheAnvil]

I realized something overnight.

I was contemplating why, of all characters, Cloud is now in Smash. I've been running through FF7 with Max Stats on my iPhone to relive the story.

And I realized this

Cloud is relevant to Smash, and Nintendo as a whole, in the same way Sonic is. It was a strike against Nintendo, but it made them who they are today.

FFVII was the first time a big RPG (in this case, the most popular RPG of all time) was not on Nintendo's console. It was a huge blow for them. But it was important. And that's why he, and Sonic are in Smash.

Sonic and Mario had the greatest rivalry in the history of video games. Cloud being in a big game that didn't hit Nintendo is absolutely nothing like Sonic's relationship to Nintendo.

Apples and Oranges example if there ever was one.

 

[Wario Bros.]

I wonder what the icon will be, the Meteor from Final Fantasy 7's logo or a more generic FF one?

Super Smash Flash 2 uses this:

But since I'm not a Final Fantasy fan I couldn't make a guess.

 

[Frostwraith]

>They actually tell you who the voice actors are

Game of the Decade right here.

English-language VAs being properly credited in the custom character builder? That's rare, indeed.

The "Classic" voices are Adam Howden and Carina Reeves, who are Shulk and Fiora in Xenoblade. Fittingly named.

All in all, that is a solid voice actor cast for the custom character. Seems they got more American VAs than British, which also makes sense given New LA.

With Lin bring voiced by Cassandra Lee and Bryce Papenbrook and Erin Fitzgerald being choices for the avatar, that's almost the entire voice cast for the party in Bravely Default. Respectively, they are Edea, Tiz and Agnès.